We need shooters
- Thread starter MuEvans
- Start date
Indeed, the results are awesome no argument there. Though, i think we can all agree that at least one more chip would have been nice. We will always be in the hunt. I am not complaining. Though i have no idea what you are talking about with Wiltjer. He was a great piece on that team. Mulder you can not compare. obviously on a total game level he was just not up to par to be in the game. Though with the culture and style cal has created it is tough for him to build a balanced team and sometimes you just have to wing it. There are so many unknowns every year. The rate we lose borderline players NBA players to the draft is redunk compared to other programs. I am not complaining. It is what it is. i wouldn't want it any other way.
I actually think that grabbing a grad transfer every year is a great idea. No one on here wants to give in to that mode of thinking because UL has done it therefore they deem it below us, but think about it; there are so many positives to it. The biggest is that you get an experienced player. 5 star freshmen are great but they have zero experience. It's flipping a coin to see if they will sink or swim under the big lights. 5th year players have experienced 4 years of preparation. 4 years of playing against college aged mature players. 4 years of weight-lifting, practice, maturing, routine, life etc. Honestly, 5th year players are a great idea.
Mu Evans you are right, here's the thing over time we are going to have more tourney wins than everyone, and we can tell everyone that we were this close, its the nature of the tournament. Though i would argue, when we do get knocked out it's due to us having a glaring deficiency in some part of our game as opposed to our guys just having an off night. This is due to cals system and the difficulty to build a cohesive team. His reaction to that is that i am just going to ask out more girls than you and beat you over time with the top players, and it will most likely happen. just a different approach. its very interesting.
It was when Willis went out. Briscoe ineptness allow more pack it in (inside) reducing the effectiveness of an already very average front line.
too bad willis sucks at defense and rebounding and all he wants to do is camp at the 3 point line. if he wasnt so inept at so many other areas of the game...he would play more
Getting a bit liberal here with the definition of shooter if Teague, who averaged less than one three a game, is now a shooter.
Willis' lack of good defense was a problem. (So was Murray's) But back to the subject. Without Willis to spread the floor, the inside scoring was much worse. Willis missed 2 weeks with the injury (and never fully recovered)
P.S. Willis a top 3 rebounder several times. Willis lack of defense was not the cause of Briscoe's poor shooting.....all in all, this year's team was just not that good.
I heard the opposite, that he shot a ton of threes this year and only made about 15. I'm not sure how reliable this info is though. Anyone know Wenyan's shooting percentage last year?
As long as I have been reading this board, you are the most rude and arrogant poster here. It seems you are always a smartass. This is a message board, that people post thoughts and opinions on, to discuss. Your responses show just how insecure you are by putting people down to make yourself feel better. Then you have the nerve to tell them to "get a life". LOL What a loser.
I did forget Wiltjer. He hit about 1 three a game in the NCAA Tourney. Teague hit a few key ones, but was no shooter.
I agree 3 point shooting could be an issue next year but we'll have to see when the games start. The front court will compensate a lot for that.
First off, every team he's had except his first one has had a great shooter on it. 2..the way he coaches? Willis will play if he deserves it. His defense needs to get better and he was pretty useless inside the arc.
A) I don't know why people are acting like you're crazy for thinking this and also acting like great shooters are some sort of liability.
B) I too think we need another proven shooter with Willis to better our chances at a national title. Now, monk can be a solid three point shooter as he showed by winning the McDonald's 3 point contest, but on the college level, he's unproven at this point. So we do need one more, although he could be the guy.
Now here's why. To the people saying "shooters get cold and then you lose", you are being very short sighted. When you have a couple shooters that defenses have to respect, it changes how they play you, even in games where the shooters and/or shooter is cold. When you DONT have 2-3 guys that threaten to step out and hit 3's on you, defenses sag, get deep in the paint and force you to drive on them and shoot contested shots on 2-3 defenders in the paint. THAT is how you lose MORE games, not just a game you "go cold" because even on the tough shooting nights, lanes are open as briscoe proved many times this year.
Lastly, Cal HAS recruited these type of guys. Booker was amazing (and I don't think people expected him to be a lottery pick out of 1 year of college) and obviously so was Murray. I don't think there was a player in this class that shot like those two. So, I don't think it's because Cal doesn't go after those guys. There wasn't one to get, or he didn't get that type of guy this year. But in sure he wanted one and tried. So I'll take whatever he can get us because we'll be solid any way you look t it.
back when Briscoe was still included as a potential draft selection (46th or so), his height to weight ratio was the heaviest in both rounds. He was listed at 6-3, 218. Personally, I don't think Briscoe is actually that tall. He always appears shorter compared to players listed at that height. Murray is listed at 6-4, 205 and he looks a lot more than just one inch taller than Briscoe.
I was really worried about this at first, and I still would LOVE to add a grad transfer who can light it up, but I think we'll have a pretty decent 3pt shooting team next year. Derrick Willis will be our knock down 3pt shooter like we had with Doron Lamb. Willis will be improved his SR season and will have a great year. He'll shoot around 44% or maybe even better and average like 7-8pts a game. I could even see him around the top 10 in the nation in 3pt shooting % next year and close to 50%. (48 or so) Kid's just a lights out shooter man. Then Malik Monk. Ok he's underrated as holy hell when it comes to shooting. He will give us what Murray did as a 3pt shooter. A high volume 40% 3pt shooter. So that's 2 really good shooters, so at the very least we'll be about like we were this year. But Fox is a better shooter than he's given credit as well. Now he's not a great shooter or nothing, but he'll probably shoot like 34-35% from 3 similar to Ulis this year. He's got a good looking shot actually, and I could see him shooting better than that but that's just what I'd guess. And I think he'll be a little streaky. I could see him making 4 3's one game then going 0-5 or something the next game. And if Briscoe could improve on his shooting just enough just to be a 30% shooter from 3 that'd be wonderful. If he could just go something like 21 out of 70 LOL. That'd be great. He would at least be a threat that defenders couldn't just ignore you know. Gabriel's a guy who I don't really know what to expect. If he can give us 35-36% from downtown then we wont have any worries at all when it comes to 3pt shooting. But as it is now. We'll mist likely have 2 40plus % shooters, one of which being in the mid-high 40's. What's the most important thing right now, and the missing link to us being a juggernaut next season is a big low post scorer.....Marques Bolden. A guy who can give us 10 and 7 every night, and be a reliable high percentage low post scorer and good rebounder. That's the key to 9 IMO.
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lol...and you spend half your time on here ridiculing anyone who dares not post what you deem as positive stuff.
what a hypocrit
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No he wasn't. He hit some shots in the tournament but he was a mediocre shooter for the vast majority of the year. So was Jones, who was also a mediocre ft shooter.
Well, the OP doesn't know what he's talking about...another name for the ever expanding ignore list.
If Briscoe is shooting bricks his playing time will decrease and Willis will play more. Whether Briscoe starts might also depend on the opponent. I see Gabriel getting a lot of minutes and possibly starting and same for Willis. Bottom line - I have doubts Briscoe ever finds his shot as a college sophomore; maybe he will give us a third year.
mostly because of defense
entered the tournament as the #1 offense in the country i believe
briscoe is good. willis isn't
We had three decent shooters last season:
Murray- 40%
Willis- 44%
Ulis- 34%
Hopefully, Willis is the same shooter next season.
Hopefully, Monk can shoot as well as Murray.
Hopefully, Fox shoots as well as Ulis.
Now, it won't take much for Briscoe to improve his shooting. It can't get much worse than 13%. If he ups it to 25-30%, that is just bonus.
Now if Gabriel adds another threat from the perimeter, that's bonus as well.
So, I could see us being successful with:
G Briscoe- 25-30%.
G Monk- 38-40%.
G Fox- 32-35%.
F Willis- 42-45%.
F Adebayo- demanding attention in the post.
That would make us just as efficient as last year from 3, plus we should have a consistent post option in Bam that we did not have last year.
Murray- 40%
Willis- 44%
Ulis- 34%
Hopefully, Willis is the same shooter next season.
Hopefully, Monk can shoot as well as Murray.
Hopefully, Fox shoots as well as Ulis.
Now, it won't take much for Briscoe to improve his shooting. It can't get much worse than 13%. If he ups it to 25-30%, that is just bonus.
Now if Gabriel adds another threat from the perimeter, that's bonus as well.
So, I could see us being successful with:
G Briscoe- 25-30%.
G Monk- 38-40%.
G Fox- 32-35%.
F Willis- 42-45%.
F Adebayo- demanding attention in the post.
That would make us just as efficient as last year from 3, plus we should have a consistent post option in Bam that we did not have last year.
I don't that this is as "delusion"al as it seems. He's not asking Zay to suddenly get %22 better. He is more predicting a return to previously displayed form. This is much more possible. I could easily see %30 plus and %70 plus from the FT stripe.
Something else to keep in mind, shooting does not happen in a vacuum. Post play affects shooting.
Our shooters had to shoot a lot of contested 3's last season, because the defense did not have to honor our post game.
Remember how teams hugged Murray at the end of the season? He had to run guys off screen after screen to try to get open.
Having an offensive post threat like Bam should help our shooting.
So, while having shooters will help open up the paint, having a consistent post threat will give our perimeter players more wide open shots.
Our shooters had to shoot a lot of contested 3's last season, because the defense did not have to honor our post game.
Remember how teams hugged Murray at the end of the season? He had to run guys off screen after screen to try to get open.
Having an offensive post threat like Bam should help our shooting.
So, while having shooters will help open up the paint, having a consistent post threat will give our perimeter players more wide open shots.
I am about done with this thread. No one seems to be understanding what I am saying. The overwhelming trend, which I more than explained throug stats, show that championship teams deploy about 120 minutes out of a possible 200 minutes in a game with resources that are offensive threats outside of the paint. No this doesn't necessarily mean 3 point shots. This does not allow the opposing defense to sag in. I just don't see where those roughly 120 minutes on average are going to come from this year. No doubt we will win a ton of games and most likely go far in tournament, though I think not having that correct balance will make it very difficult to close it out with a chip.
Fox- 35mpg- decent jumper (mid-range jumpers, 3 point threat).
Monk- 35mpg- good jumper (3 point threat, mid-range jumper).
Gabriel- 25mpg- good jumper (mainly mid-range jumpers, maybe some 3's).
Willis- 25mpg- good jumper (3 point threat).
Total- 120mpg.
Also, SKJ looks to have a decent jumper. If he can shoot the 12-15 foot jumper, then that's even better.
Monk- 35mpg- good jumper (3 point threat, mid-range jumper).
Gabriel- 25mpg- good jumper (mainly mid-range jumpers, maybe some 3's).
Willis- 25mpg- good jumper (3 point threat).
Total- 120mpg.
Also, SKJ looks to have a decent jumper. If he can shoot the 12-15 foot jumper, then that's even better.
First off I hope you are right, though I don't think we will be able to call Gabriel a consistent outside the paint threat. If he is he will get tons of pt. Also that's not a whole lot of minutes for every one else especially if we get bolden. Where are mins for bam, Briscoe, fourth guard, bolden?
Im curious if the ever-so-wise @MuEvans would consider a player like poythress an outside threat.
Considering our options for next year and your 'interesting' take on what we need, i think we'll be fine. By your considering teague as an 'offensive threat' ill go ahead and call Fox, Monk, Hawkins, Gabriel, Mulder, Willis, SKJ as offensive threats... Ill also group briscoe in that category bc he has shown the ability, although sporatically, that he can hit a mid range jumper. Humphries as well can hit a jumper...
That leaves our predominantly inside guys as Matthews, Tai, Bam... But bam has also shown he can shoot mid range in HS. It seems to me we have more outside guys than inside guys if you consider outside as anything outside the lane.
Considering our options for next year and your 'interesting' take on what we need, i think we'll be fine. By your considering teague as an 'offensive threat' ill go ahead and call Fox, Monk, Hawkins, Gabriel, Mulder, Willis, SKJ as offensive threats... Ill also group briscoe in that category bc he has shown the ability, although sporatically, that he can hit a mid range jumper. Humphries as well can hit a jumper...
That leaves our predominantly inside guys as Matthews, Tai, Bam... But bam has also shown he can shoot mid range in HS. It seems to me we have more outside guys than inside guys if you consider outside as anything outside the lane.
8-man rotation:
G Fox(35)/Hawkins(5)
G Monk(35)/Hawkins(5)
G Briscoe(30)/Gabriel(10)
F Willis(25)/Gabriel(15)
F Adebayo(25)/Killeya-Jones(15)