9 Big 10 teams are you kidding me talking about a conference that’s always over rated!
UK #2 in Kenpom
- Thread starter HerrosHeroes
- Start date
They were on yesterday, but Oats stayed with it too long, should have stopped trying to set 3 point shot attempt records.
I'm not a believer in this Gonzaga team, I liked their '17 and '21 teams, but the guards on this team, are not passing the eye test IMO.
They just flashed it on the screen at halftime of the Houston vs WSU game. Head shaker. That conference gets way too much respect. Haven't won a title in over 20 years.
Yup, it was weird watching it. Bama started out hot from 3 like they did yesterday and made 13 total. Add in that Gonzaga shot 13-25 from the foul line. Wasn't the Zag's best effort.
Yeah but only 13 of 34.
You'd think they would have had to shoot a high % from 3 to win that game.
The Zags certainly helped tho by missing 12 free throws.
Basketball is a funny game. IDK what to tell you. How did Kentucky lose to Notre Dame? Even St. Mary's beat Notre Dame.
Cal went with three bigs and Grady had not broke out. Notre Dame would get poleaxed now.
He went with three bigs yesterday as well but these guys are totally different than they were 2 months ago.
Exactly, some times it just happens. You can't win them all. I think in the Bama game, Gonzaga didn't look like the better team that night. Against Duke, you thought that both of those teams were really excellent top level teams. It was a fantastic game. And against Texas, UCLA, and to an extent Texas Tech, Gonzaga beat them like they do WCC teams.
The most impressive Gonzaga win, is Texas Tech by a mile. TT is a very good team.
Except we play games on the court not in kenpom ratings.
Kentucky has 5 losses still has more tough games against LSU, at Arkansas and at Florida while Gonzaga plays no one. Kentucky not even a #1 seed but you think Kentucky is #1 team ?
Sorry you nor I get a vote.
Except they just handed us the #6 seed overall yesterday..............so apparently it wasn't huge enough to matter.
I bet they drop UK 2 spots at least. UK shouldn't drop, but they will.
Gonzaga has played 4 true road games all year. How does that affect the ratings ? Things come easier when your not on the road plus the type of opp you play. How does the system factor playing vs Pacific vs playing Auburn ect.
Just not sure when you play mostly easy games all mostly at home of course you should be more effecient.
Just not sure when you play mostly easy games all mostly at home of course you should be more effecient.
I hate how so many analysts overlook/ignore the pathetic competition Gonzaga is playing.
I think it was Jimmy Dykes that was comparing Banchero and Jabari Smith. He said "but Chet Holmgren's numbers are a bit better". Well no **** Jimmy, he’s playing against high school kids. The other two are playing high level opponents every game.
I ran the numbers last night. Gonzaga has played 5 power 5 opponents, all on neutral courts. Chet averaged 10 and 8 in those games. Those are the numbers they should be looking at.
It’s like all these guys have been told not to talk negatively about the WCC. Sean Farnham is the worst. He pumps the WCC up so much, tries to make them seem equal to the power 5 conferences.
I think it was Jimmy Dykes that was comparing Banchero and Jabari Smith. He said "but Chet Holmgren's numbers are a bit better". Well no **** Jimmy, he’s playing against high school kids. The other two are playing high level opponents every game.
I ran the numbers last night. Gonzaga has played 5 power 5 opponents, all on neutral courts. Chet averaged 10 and 8 in those games. Those are the numbers they should be looking at.
It’s like all these guys have been told not to talk negatively about the WCC. Sean Farnham is the worst. He pumps the WCC up so much, tries to make them seem equal to the power 5 conferences.
I like how we are either #3 or #4 in either the AP / or Coaches Polls, whichever you look at it. And we are NOT a #1 seed? HAHAHA LOL ! Talk about SNUB !
I guess BOTH polls got it wrong. WTF NCAA selection committee ? What gives?
Looks to me like either Duke or Purdue stand between Kansas and Kentucky, not Baylor, so why did you scrub in favor of THEM ?
But you didn't SCRUB for them right, because the head to head doesn't matter?
Doesn't come into play?
HAHA why do we even bother playing the games if they don't mean anything when comparing teams head to head for overall seeding purposes.
Every year brings more head scratching.
I guess BOTH polls got it wrong. WTF NCAA selection committee ? What gives?
Looks to me like either Duke or Purdue stand between Kansas and Kentucky, not Baylor, so why did you scrub in favor of THEM ?
But you didn't SCRUB for them right, because the head to head doesn't matter?
Doesn't come into play?
HAHA why do we even bother playing the games if they don't mean anything when comparing teams head to head for overall seeding purposes.
Every year brings more head scratching.
Literally every metric and every poll has us top 4… except the seed list. Haha, unreal.
Yep. All these systems which are independent of each other mind you has us top 4. The composite rankings have us top 4.
here’s the thing tho.
The committee isn’t ranking the best teams in order of best to worst. It’s what they think they are doing when comparing resumes. But teams with the best resumes doesn’t necessarily mean the better teams. Sure there’s a lot of correlation between the two but it’s not exact.
the metrics are ranking teams based on what they feel is the best to worst. This is why Gonzaga can play a schedule like they do and still be 1 in KP.
it’s entirely possible that UK is better than both KU and Baylor. Heck we are 2 in KP. We are better than Arizona and Auburn as well. But it’s also entirely possible other teams have better resumes. And hence u get the difference in seeding between the two.
here’s the thing tho.
The committee isn’t ranking the best teams in order of best to worst. It’s what they think they are doing when comparing resumes. But teams with the best resumes doesn’t necessarily mean the better teams. Sure there’s a lot of correlation between the two but it’s not exact.
the metrics are ranking teams based on what they feel is the best to worst. This is why Gonzaga can play a schedule like they do and still be 1 in KP.
it’s entirely possible that UK is better than both KU and Baylor. Heck we are 2 in KP. We are better than Arizona and Auburn as well. But it’s also entirely possible other teams have better resumes. And hence u get the difference in seeding between the two.
I agree with you but I also love the Bracket reveal day and the surprises along with it so I would like it to stay as is.
I really wish we would’ve had another out of conference cancellation so we could’ve got a chance at Gonzaga! If what Cal said was true that he talked Few and they would’ve been our next game had there been another COVID cancellation.
No way you can justify UK at 22-5 with a top 40 SOS and a beatdown of the J-Hawks in Kansas not being a #1 seed at this moment.
the Number 1 seeds are:
Gonzaga
Kentucky
Arizona
Baylor
the Number 1 seeds are:
Gonzaga
Kentucky
Arizona
Baylor
It's simple
KU is 10-3 vs Quad 1
Auburn is 7-3 vs Quad 1
Baylor is 9-4 vs Quad 1
UK is 6-5 vs Quad 1.
We can completely ignore the fact that of UK's 11 Quad 1 games 9 of them have been on the road or neutral court games. Auburn on the other hand has had 4 Quad 1 home games. KU has had 3. Baylor 3. Or the fact KU and Baylor have had more opportunities than UK to record Quad 1 wins.
But yeah it's simply about this.
KU is 10-3 vs Quad 1
Auburn is 7-3 vs Quad 1
Baylor is 9-4 vs Quad 1
UK is 6-5 vs Quad 1.
We can completely ignore the fact that of UK's 11 Quad 1 games 9 of them have been on the road or neutral court games. Auburn on the other hand has had 4 Quad 1 home games. KU has had 3. Baylor 3. Or the fact KU and Baylor have had more opportunities than UK to record Quad 1 wins.
But yeah it's simply about this.
The kicker with all this is while the NET isn't a perfect metric, if they just used that to seed the teams, they'd have gotten it right.
All these messing with Quads and whatnot, the NET ranking has that figure out already baked into the formula. And it can accurate rank teams based on that instead of a bunch of humans sitting around trying to figure out which 9-3 Quad 1 team is better than the other.
The reason UK is 3rd in the NET and KU is 5th and Baylor 6th is because NET knows looking at the resume of these teams which one is more impressive. It can accurately reflect the difference between home/away. It can accurately reflect MOV which is important.
When teams don't get seeded according to their NET ranking it's most likely due to the committee not accurately weighing home vs away games and not taking into account MOV.
The NCAA makes no sense. You have a metric, just use it.
All these messing with Quads and whatnot, the NET ranking has that figure out already baked into the formula. And it can accurate rank teams based on that instead of a bunch of humans sitting around trying to figure out which 9-3 Quad 1 team is better than the other.
The reason UK is 3rd in the NET and KU is 5th and Baylor 6th is because NET knows looking at the resume of these teams which one is more impressive. It can accurately reflect the difference between home/away. It can accurately reflect MOV which is important.
When teams don't get seeded according to their NET ranking it's most likely due to the committee not accurately weighing home vs away games and not taking into account MOV.
The NCAA makes no sense. You have a metric, just use it.
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Okay, what are Gonzaga's quad 1 numbers?
We know St Mary's is a quad 1. So they're at least 5-2 (BYU, SMC, Duke, Tx, TT, Alabama and UCLA). Is snyone else in the WCC a quad 1?
And 2 of UKs last 3 Quad 1 games still to be played are of course on the road!
Thus, out of 14 quad 1 games (which is a heck of a lot) only 5 will be played in Rupp.
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The Zags are 6-2 in Quad 1 games.
Looks like home and road games vs St Marys will be Q1. Road games vs BYU, Santa Clara and San Fran will also be Q1.
Looks like they play San Fran on the road and St Marys on the road still so two opportunities for quad 1 games.
We all know tho the mid majors play by different rules.
TBH tho I'm not even thinking about Gonzaga. They will never have a resume as impressive as other teams. The committee will see 6-2 tho in the Q1 games they have played and just think oh it's an opportunity issue. Who's to say if they didn't play 14 games in Q1 like some other teams they aren't say 10-4 and looking similar to the other teams. But FWIW nearly every system has them at the top. So I'm okay with it. If we are going to use metrics to say UK deserves to be a 1 seed, then I'm good with using those same metrics to give the Zags a 1.
I'm thinking more about UK KU Baylor Auburn and Arizona and who else should be on the 1 line.
I'm thinking more about UK KU Baylor Auburn and Arizona and who else should be on the 1 line.
And that’s a big fat joke. The power 5 teams they played were neutral site games and the rest of their Q1 games are at mid major opponents and mid majors at home.
Meanwhile, we're @ Auburn, @ UT, @ KU. @ Alabama, @ LSU, LSU, UT, Bama, @ Arkansas.
This is what I have been saying, the quad system is flawed.
UK actually plays 5 of the 14 Quad 1 games in Rupp:
UT
Miss St
Florida
Bama
LSU
This is why not all Quad 1 games are equal.
It's like okay great expand the quad 1s to account that a win vs a top 40 away team is like winning a home game vs a top 10. That's great. That's a step in the right direction that was sorely missing from RPI.
But what if u beat someone on the road in the top 10. Way different than a top 40 win. But it's all bunch together.
Exactly, UKs 18 pt win at a top 5 KU may end up being the most impressive win in all of college basketball this season and should garner extra credit in the metrics/committee for such.
Yep.
At this point, we just have to hope UK keeps on winning and someone drops a game or two down the stretch. Entirely possible.
Kansas just picked up a quad 1 win at LAST PLACE W. Virginia!! You can't make this **** up...what a joke
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