OT: 2021 Baseball HOF Ballot Released.

[e5fdny]

I would take Cone over Schilling any day

I’ll go with the bloody guy.

 

[JDNB]

Being an East Coaster, I don’t follow the West Coast that much. But, looking at Kent’s stats, they look better then say Greg Biggio’s. Then again looking at the amount of votes Kent, and Helton got last year, I don’t think that many are going to vote for them this year. Schilling on the other hand, seems close to getting in.

 

[yesrutgers01]

disagree and the hof has already been diluted enough. 280 lifetime avg should never be considered unless hammering 600+ hrs. It's bad enough we got a guy with a 40yr career never hitting more than 40 a yr in simply because he leads the majors in hrs

hof is hof, no need to dilute

I am stumped

 

[e5fdny]

Being an East Coaster, I don’t follow the West Coast that much. But, looking at Kent’s stats, they look better then say Greg Biggio’s. Then again looking at the amount of votes Kent, and Helton got last year, I don’t think that many are going to vote for them this year. Schilling on the other hand, seems close to getting in.

That 3K hits checks a lot of boxes for the writers.

 

[yesrutgers01]

That 3K hits checks a lot of boxes for the writers.

Plus, Biggio was a good guy.

 

[Colbert17!]

That 3K hits checks a lot of boxes for the writers.

The same as 3K strikeouts like Schilling.

 

[JDNB]

That 3K hits checks a lot of boxes for the writers.

I didn’t mean to say that Biggio wasn’t deserving of the HOF. Biggio was probably a bad comparison, but Kent did have a higher average, and more HR. Biggio is a class act, and gave one of the better speeches, when he was inducted into the HOF..

 

[czxqa]

David Cone’s stats: 194-126 (60.6 win %) 3.46 ERA 1.256 WHIP years pitched 1986-2003
Curt Schilling stats: 216-146 (59.7 win %) 3.46 ERA 1.137 WHIP years pitched 1988-2007


Cone received HOF votes from 4% of voters, Schilling from 70%.

The other 66% are voting for the bloody sock.

 

[yesrutgers01]

The same as 3K strikeouts like Schilling.

Looked at Schilling’s career again...he is certainly very close even if you just look at regular season. His playoff/WS does put him over the top.
I had also forgotten how good of control he had as well.
Biggio- I guess we had him, Alomar, Kent as the big 3 at 2B. There was never a doubt about Alomar until he got to the Mets. Kent was the best hitter but besides being an AH...something always felt off about him(dirty?) but his numbers do belong.,,Biggio- Imteresting as most of the time Kent or Alomar had better years but he was just so damn consistent. You always did figure he would be HOF if he got to 3000. I think he doesn’t make it if he had 2800 hits but 3000 makes him a no brainer

 

[Colbert17!]

Kent vs. Biggio


Kent: .290 377 HR 1516 RBI

Biggio: .281 291 HR 1175 RBI

Gun to my head I would never had thought that Kent had a higher BA

 

[Colbert17!]

Todd Helton has a lifetime BA of .316.
In the past 50 years only the following players are higher.

Tony Gwynn (of course) - .338
Wade Boggs - .327
Rod Carew - .327
Kirby Puckett - .318
Vlad Guerrero - .317
Roberto Clemente - .317

Batting average is not a compiling stat. Matter of fact the longer you play the better chance your lifetime BA goes down. Mickey Mantle always said that one of his great regrets about hanging on those last few years was that his lifetime BA fell under .300 (.298).
Under rated player because he played in Colorado. Helton should be in.

 

[e5fdny]

I didn’t mean to say that Biggio wasn’t deserving of the HOF. Biggio was probably a bad comparison, but Kent did have a higher average, and more HR. Biggio is a class act, and gave one of the better speeches, when he was inducted into the HOF..

I didn’t think you were.

Just meant how the 3K # makes it much easier too vote yay than neigh.

 

[miket007]

Only individual I feel is worthy of the honor is Manny who I saw play numerous times while in high school. We both graduated in 1991. He may have not been the best teammate at times but no questioning his talent/accomplishments. 1991 was such a great year A-Rod won USA Today National Player of the year....

 

[Colbert17!]

Three guys no longer on the ballot that deserve to be in IMHO:

Dave Parker
Albert Belle
Fred McGriff

 

[tom1944]

Todd Helton has a lifetime BA of .316.
In the past 50 years only the following players are higher.

Tony Gwynn (of course) - .338
Wade Boggs - .327
Rod Carew - .327
Kirby Puckett - .318
Vlad Guerrero - .317
Roberto Clemente - .317

Batting average is not a compiling stat. Matter of fact the longer you play the better chance your lifetime BA goes down. Mickey Mantle always said that one of his great regrets about hanging on those last few years was that his lifetime BA fell under .300 (.298).
Under rated player because he played in Colorado. Helton should be in.

I never really watched Helton but I agree with your assessment

 

[Joey Bacala]

You can't put Helton in before Don Mattingly.

Vizquel is the only one on that list I would vote for.

 

[Colbert17!]

Waiting for that:

Helton - .316, 369 HR, 1406 RBI, 1401 Runs Scored, OBP .414 (17 years)
Mattingly - .307, 222 HR, 1099 RBI, 1007 Runs Scored, OBP .358 (14 years)

Gold Gloves - Mattingly 9, Helton 3
Silver Slugger - Mattingly 3, Helton 4
ASG - Mattingly 6, Helton 5
Top 10 MVP voting - Mattingly 4, Helton 3
Close but I give the slight nod to Helton. Health issues held back Donny but most people in the East don't realize how good Helton was.

 

[rutger80]

I think Helton is somewhat deserving of induction, but there's a debate due to the altitude splits.
At home: .332, 134 homers. On the road: .285, 79 homers.

At least with Helton, he was the guy you didn't want to have beat you.
I don't think anyone went into a series with the Giants and said, yeah, we can't let Kent beat us.
As above posters stated, if you have to think about it.......

 

[AntiG]

Kent vs. Biggio


Kent: .290 377 HR 1516 RBI

Biggio: .281 291 HR 1175 RBI

Gun to my head I would never had thought that Kent had a higher BA

like I said earlier in the thread, Kent is one of the GOAT infielders offensively. The guy consistently produced at All-Star level annually, competing for the batting title annually and I believe the most HRs ever for a career 2nd baseman (A-Rod spent the first half of his at SS)

 

[Colbert17!]

most HRs ever for a career 2nd baseman

I did not know that. I would have thought Joe Morgan or maybe even Rogers Hornsby.
Saw somewhere that Robinson Cano is the all time leader at 2B for AL ahead of Joe Gordon.

 

[brianoc]

Bonds
Clemens
Manny

 

[Colbert17!]

I think Helton is somewhat deserving of induction, but there's a debate due to the altitude splits.
At home: .332, 134 homers. On the road: .285, 79 homers.

At least with Helton, he was the guy you didn't want to have beat you.
I don't think anyone went into a series with the Giants and said, yeah, we can't let Kent beat us.
As above posters stated, if you have to think about it.......

I understand the splits issue but you can't penalize the guy because of where he plays.
How many Yankee HRs dropped into that right field porch? How many Rice fly balls hit off the Green Monster?

 

[tom1944]

Waiting for that:

Helton - .316, 369 HR, 1406 RBI, 1401 Runs Scored, OBP .414 (17 years)
Mattingly - .307, 222 HR, 1099 RBI, 1007 Runs Scored, OBP .358 (14 years)

Gold Gloves - Mattingly 9, Helton 3
Silver Slugger - Mattingly 3, Helton 4
ASG - Mattingly 6, Helton 5
Top 10 MVP voting - Mattingly 4, Helton 3
Close but I give the slight nod to Helton. Health issues held back Donny but most people in the East don't realize how good Helton was.

I watched Mattingly and for a period of time he was in the top 10 players in the league. If I was picking a team I would take him over many HOF.

I would also be happy to have Keith Hernandez and Will Clark

 

[Colbert17!]

I watched Mattingly and for a period of time he was in the top 10 players in the league. If I was picking a team I would take him over many HOF.

I would also be happy to have Keith Hernandez and Will Clark

Point well taken and you named another two very good first baseman. Never thought of Clark as a HOFer though.
Hernandez you can debate.

 

[Colbert17!]

Another guy who should be in the Hall. Hate to say it but he looks like a righthanded Barry Bonds.

 

[RUInsanityToo]

Agree

Manny is a HOF

Manny - PEDs

That being said, I vote in the PED guys ....Bonds, Clemens & Manny over the rest of the mediocre field.

 

[greenknight]

If Helton could have finished his last 6 yrs 25% better hed be a sure fire 1st ballot guy. For 10 yrs he was dominant

 

[tom1944]

Point well taken and you named another two very good first baseman. Never thought of Clark as a HOFer though.
Hernandez you can debate.

I am not sure any of them are HOF. I am sure they were better players than many who are.
As for Clark I did not see him enough but I do remember the arguments between Mike and the Mad Dog about who was better

 

[RUforJERSEY]

So no one gets your vote?

Jorge Posada probably does. And Paulie O'Neill

 

[RU76]

Must be some ridiculous methodology used to determine who goes on the ballot. If the voters want to have the system scrapped all they need to do is vote Swisher in. The powers that be will respond. Time to end the "participation trophy era."

 

[ponyfoot19]

I think one of the things left out of the equation with players like Helton and others, is who were his teammates? If you don't have good hitters around you, you're not going to see a lot of good pitches to hit. IIRC, I don't believe anyone would confuse his career as being surrounded by the 27 Yankee lineup..

 

[e5fdny]

Jorge Posada probably does. And Paulie O'Neill

Not even close.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Not even close.

not even in the ballpark...lol

 

[e5fdny]

not even in the ballpark...lol

Or a number retired either. Or a plaque.

 

[RUTGERS95]

I'd rather non one go to keep the inegrity of the hall. Bade enough Puckett is there

 

[tom1944]

To get in the HOF you need to play 10 Years?

 

[Colbert17!]

I think so.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

I will throw up if any player is named this year.

Maybe Jeff Kent was a very good hitter for his position. He played defense poorly at his position.

 

[e5fdny]

I will throw up if any player is named this year.

Maybe Jeff Kent was a very good hitter for his position. He played defense poorly at his position.

Attitude, like Bell will not help him here.

 

[RUforJERSEY]

Not even close.

I know but you know how those Yankee shills are.