These 2 Doctors sound like they know their stuff .- WATCH

[ckDOG]

Could be

I have a co-worker who died at home in NYC 2 weeks ago. Sudden heart attack. 50s and in good health. Likely unrelated, but with the stuff coming out about strokes and heart attacks in covid patients, it makes me wonder.

 

[fishwater99]

Good points here.

Okay to go to COSTCO but not Church, okay to got to Home Depot but not work.


If you are young and healthy why quarantine, if you are old and sick stay home.

Isolate the sick, not the healthy.

Herd immunity is needed, don't shut down the economy.

 

[Hubcitydog]

Could be. I suspect some heart attack deaths may be attributable to undiagnosed COVID. We will never know. We also won’t know how many die from avoiding the hospital and dying of unrelated issues or having their care delayed for cancer, etc because of healthcare shutdown- but that’s a significant number.

 

[ckDOG]

Yeah there is a ton of hypocrisy out there

View attachment 16005

 

[DoggieDaddy13]

These guys own a private clinic. They are not microbiologists, immunologists, nor epidemiologists. They've haven't published scholarly research in any of those areas. They have only tested patients at their clinics. They are using partial data to help paint their own narrative. Their concept of herd immunity came straight from Alex Jones's Infowars. They're quacks.

They're also gay as 17 if you couldn't figure it out yourself....But you guys are welcome to keep on slobbering over folks pumping sunshine up your ***. It's still a free country.

 

[ckDOG]

And the 2 docs have now been officially reprimanded

https://www.acep.org/corona/COVID-1...-joint-statement-on-physician-misinformation/

Sad, they probably had a decent point or two, but when you cherry pick data to support your desired conclusion, you get called out for it. They didn't make bad assumptions in a complex model. They made a stats 101 error intentionally. Better luck, next time.

 

[LandsurveyorDawg]

This completely went over your head. The people that do publish scholarly research in Microbiology, Immunology and Epidemiology told us that 2.2 Million Americans would die from Covid-19. These "research experts" have failed so massively bad that I would be embarrassed to publicly support them. Then you attack their sexuality..... terrible.

 

[DoggieDaddy13]

Attack. How? Just pointed out the obvious.

Funny how the homophobes are taking their word as Gospel. Politics indeed makes strange bedfellows.

The people who publish scholarly research vary - scholarship tends to allow for that -, but they told us 2.2 million was possible without taking any action. We did take action and so far we are at 55K dead within two months. Hopefully we won't go much higher, but without a cure or vaccine more people will die.

You do realize that it's not a matter of "if" they'll die at this point, but "when" they die.

 

[Hubcitydog]

1-why the hell would you point that out? Who cares? Why do you assume anyone is a homophobe?
2-outright lie. Those numbers were with distancing. They got it wrong, nothing wrong with that. They had to come up with a plan and numbers quickly with limited information.
3-oh yes people are dying and more are going to die. What exactly are you getting at here. Do you have some point? Talk is shifting towards trying to develop herd immunity in those under 60 in an effort to make exposure in those over 60 less likely in a few months, or at least lessen the chance of a devastating fall.

 

[Dawgg]

Lets do a little math lesson shall we. Which number is closest to the true value: A) 20k fatalities. B) 2.2 Million fatalities? You can think about that as you are 17'ing yourself.

You said the flu was worse and that this would kill maybe 5,000 as you were arguing AGAINST social distancing measures a month ago. If decision-makers would have followed your line of thinking, it would have gotten more people killed. That is 100% without debate.

That means you have no credibility to call out “the usual suspects”

Own your 17ing ********, dumbass.

 

[LandsurveyorDawg]

Sweden says your line of thinking is trash.

 

[Hubcitydog]

Trump encouraged a return to school today. Why do you think he said that? Do you think he came up with it on his own?
Now Newsome is as well. I’ll spoil it for you. It’s to get the disease spread amongst kids and their 30 year old parents where it does less than the flu so that they can get back to visiting grandma at some point down the road.

 

[J-Dawg]

Uhhhhh.....

Herd immunity isn't some tinfoil hat conspiracy, it's science. Science from the immunologists and epidemiologists you alluded to.

 

[DoomSlayer]

Attack. How? Just pointed out the obvious.

Funny how the homophobes are taking their word as Gospel. Politics indeed makes strange bedfellows.

The people who publish scholarly research vary - scholarship tends to allow for that -, but they told us 2.2 million was possible without taking any action. We did take action and so far we are at 55K dead within two months. Hopefully we won't go much higher, but without a cure or vaccine more people will die.

You do realize that it's not a matter of "if" they'll die at this point, but "when" they die.

Make homophobic comments and then accuse everyone else of being the homophobes. Classic homophobic behavior. Maybe you should seek treatment for your hatred towards gay people.

 

[J-Dawg]

Attack. How? Just pointed out the obvious.

Funny how the homophobes are taking their word as Gospel. Politics indeed makes strange bedfellows.

The people who publish scholarly research vary - scholarship tends to allow for that -, but they told us 2.2 million was possible without taking any action. We did take action and so far we are at 55K dead within two months. Hopefully we won't go much higher, but without a cure or vaccine more people will die.

You do realize that it's not a matter of "if" they'll die at this point, but "when" they die.

Wrong. The models have always had a variable of social distancing/containment measures built in. Starting with the initial Imperial College model.

Of course more people will die. People die every day. And please, for your sake, don't continue to hold your breath on the cure/vaccine. If we can't find a cure/vaccine for the coronavirus that causes the common cold, or an actual working vaccine for influenza, then I have high doubts we'll find a working one for this one.

 

[Dawgology]

I think theses guys made some good points and I don’t necessarily disagree with them, but I think they omitted an important detail which biases their whole case.


650,000 tested in NY State 250,000 tested positive 37,000 have died.


The numbers that he used are from a few days ago but we can still use them.


He said the number is 39% of tested actually 38.4 have the virus which is correct.


250,000 / 650,000 = 38.4%


20,000,000 X 39 % = 7.8 million NY Population tested positive.


My only problem with what he said, is for all his talk about data and extrapolating... he extrapolated the cases but didn’t extrapolate the deaths. If these are the numbers he wants to hang his argument on, then take it all the way out...


Deaths would not be 19,000 if 7.8 million people were positive.


650,000 people tested 19,000 have died that is 19,000/650,000 = 2.9%


7,8000,000 X 2.9% = 226,200 deaths of those who contract the virus.


In the U.S that number would be 320,000,000 X 39% =124,000,000positive


124,000,000 X 2.9% is 3,619,200... deaths nationwide.
I’m sure he is smart enough to have figured these numbers, yet he failed to point it out. Why?

Depends on the variables in your extrapolation. The assumption is that the worst cases (which lead to death) end up in the hospital and are coded correctly. Thus...the majority of Covid-19 related deaths are tallied (not all...but most) whereas the asymptomatic or mild symptom cases (which appear to be the majority) are not officially tallied because they don't require doctor visits or hospital stays.

 

[Drebin]

It's a reality-based statement, so of course we have some who don't like that sort of thing. Long-winded posts on covid from orthopedic surgeons are a hoot.

Your observations on covid are about as solid as your takes on basketball.

 

[Bcash2]

False. The 2.2 Million estimate was in regards to an "unmitigated" scenario. Read for yourself:

In the (unlikely) absence of any control measures or spontaneous changes in individual behaviour, we would expect a peak in mortality (daily deaths) to occur after approximately 3 months (Figure 1A). In such scenarios, given an estimated R0 of 2.4, we predict 81% of the GB and US populations would be infected over the course of the epidemic. Epidemic timings are approximate given the limitations of surveillance data in both countries: The epidemic is predicted to be broader in the US than in GB and to peak slightly later. This is due to the larger geographic scale of the US, resulting in more distinct localised epidemics across states (Figure 1B) than seen across GB. The higher peak in mortality in GB 16 March 2020 Imperial College COVID-19 Response Team is due to the smaller size of the country and its older population compared with the US. In total, in an unmitigated epidemic, we would predict approximately 510,000 deaths in GB and 2.2 million in the US, not accounting for the potential negative effects of health systems being overwhelmed on mortality.


cHere is a nice article from conservative publication Reason.com ​https://reason.com/2020/03/31/2-2-million-american-deaths-from-covid-19/

 

[Bcash2]

2.2 Million was in an 'unmitigated scenario'.

Lets do a little math lesson shall we. Which number is closest to the true value: A) 20k fatalities. B) 2.2 Million fatalities? You can think about that as you are 17'ing yourself.

From the Imperial report you're referencing...

In the (unlikely) absence of any control measures or spontaneous changes in individual behaviour, we would expect a peak in mortality (daily deaths) to occur after approximately 3 months (Figure 1A). In such scenarios, given an estimated R0 of 2.4, we predict 81% of the GB and US populations would be infected over the course of the epidemic. Epidemic timings are approximate given the limitations of surveillance data in both countries: The epidemic is predicted to be broader in the US than in GB and to peak slightly later. This is due to the larger geographic scale of the US, resulting in more distinct localised epidemics across states (Figure 1B) than seen across GB. The higher peak in mortality in GB 16 March 2020 Imperial College COVID-19 Response Team is due to the smaller size of the country and its older population compared with the US. In total, in an unmitigated epidemic, we would predict approximately 510,000 deaths in GB and 2.2 million in the US, not accounting for the potential negative effects of health systems being overwhelmed on mortality.

 

[Jeffreauxdawg]

Let's discuss this 2.2 million death toll projected by the "experts." I am going to get you all to help me because I am not sure if I am missing anything or not.

I will start with the "experts"... I think we are really talking about Neil Ferguson from the London School of Economics and his model that popped up in March for the UK and US.

If that's the case, he did project that we could reach 2.2 million deaths by June... "In the (unlikely) absence of any control measures" That means taking absolutely no measures to slow the spread... Open kimono if you will. Measures to slow the spread include:

1- Isolating known infected people at home
2- Voluntary quarantine for 7 days of any family members of infected individuals.
3-Social distancing of 70+ year old population. And only 75% complied.
4-Social distancing of the entire population... Not a lockdown, but social distancing... School and work still allowed.
5-Closing schools, but 25% of universities remain open.

All of these facts can be verified by the snip I took from his original model here.

View attachment 16007

So, obviously we didn't fall into the do nothing scenario. In fact we have not only adopted the measures he suggested, we have gone beyond. Even Sweden adopted 3 or 4 of the measures. To my knowledge, no country on Earth has gone open kimono. Maybe North Korea... We could all hope.

So, what was the death total if we adopted the measures. Well he didn't really say. He just went into the overload the healthcare system scenario. In the following graph you will see two big humps... One in May... Well that's the do nothing line. I have to say, it sure seems like we may have had a huge spike had we not done **** but let it spread... Sick people not Isolating, schools open, theatres, basketball arenas... Everything as normal.

The next two humps come in November... You know peak flu season. The tall one is a scenario where you close schools and social distance, but not a strict quarantine on the infected. I have highlight the final scenario he modeled, because it is closest to what we have done, but still does not cover all of the steps we have taken.

View attachment 16008

Now, here's where I need help. Where has this guy been wrong so far.... For the love of God do not say he predicted 2.2 million deaths and we are not close (That was the do nothing scenario... Simply quarantining sick people destroyed that projection.)

So far we have stayed below the critical bed capacity everywhere as was projected if you took the measures. Sweden is doing so as well, again they implemented 3-4 of the 5 possible measures.

So what I am taking from this is we have stayed close to the path projected if you take all of the measures. Nothing in his model incorporated antiviral meds or possible antibody testing. My thoughts are we beat the big curve... Let's be smart and make sure we don't spike back up on the second curve... Because in his projection, we are not having baby problems until November... Let's go be Sweden for a while and if ares start to spike up, lock down that area as appropriate. He kept numbers down in the summer because the virus was always going to have a hard time spreading in the summer.

Was this thing misrepresented in the media.. Probably. Misunderstood by politicians... Probably. Maybe I am the idiot, I have been before, but so far all I can see is we have proven him correct. Let's make sure he's wrong come November by just using some common sense until we either reach herd immunity or find a vaccine.

ETA link to original paper.

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imperial-college/medicine/sph/ide/gida-fellowships/Imperial-College-COVID19-NPI-modelling-16-03-2020.pdf

 

[Misfit]

Don't know where you are getting the idea that deaths from Covid19 are being overstated. Everything I am reading says it is actually the opposite. Many areas of the country are reporting deaths from pneumonia in March and April that are hundreds more than normal for that time period. There were 21,000 more deaths in New York State from 3/11 to 4/25 than is normal for that time period, only 16,700 of which were attributed to Covid 19. This is happening in many areas of the country. Certainly some of those excess deaths resulted from people having heart attack or stroke symptoms and not going to the emergency room out of fear of the virus, but there is no reason to believe all of the deaths were due to that. Here is one article that looks just at the month of March: https://thehill.com/policy/healthca...tal-death-rate-spiked-above-coronavirus-death

 

[Villagedawg]

This guy gets it.

 

[Bcash2]

Thank you . Great post. But don't expect anyone to actually read facts.

So what I am taking from this is we have stayed close to the path projected if you take all of the measures. Nothing in his model incorporated antiviral meds or possible antibody testing. My thoughts are we beat the big curve... Let's be smart and make sure we don't spike back up on the second curve... Because in his projection, we are not having baby problems until November... Let's go be Sweden for a while and if ares start to spike up, lock down that area as appropriate. He kept numbers down in the summer because the virus was always going to have a hard time spreading in the summer.

Was this thing misrepresented in the media.. Probably. Misunderstood by politicians... Probably. Maybe I am the idiot, I have been before, but so far all I can see is we have proven him correct. Let's make sure he's wrong come November by just using some common sense until we either reach herd immunity or find a vaccine.

ETA link to original paper.

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/im...-College-COVID19-NPI-modelling-16-03-2020.pdf

Yes it was absolutely misrepresented in the media. Folks like Alex Berenson and the Daily Wire made a huge deal about them "revising their calculations" claiming they were somehow "wrong" initially as evidenced in this thread https://forums.sixpackspeak.com/sho...yone-has-been-running-with&highlight=Berenson ...


Here is an equally dumbass scenario that these folks seem to be following:

Doctor: Sir you have cancer. If you do nothing, there is a 90% chance you will die. If you go through chemo, your chances of death will go down drastically.
Patient: ok I'll do the chemo.
... 6 months later
Doctor: There is now only a 30% you are going to die.
[enter Alex Berenson]
Alex Berenson: The doctor was wrong!! He said 90%, now he says 30%!


See how dumb that is? FWIW I'm totally in favor of measured re-opening and voluntary social-distancing a'la Sweden.

 

[Villagedawg]

Result of politicians trying to coddle the “this ain’t nuthin’ but the flu” and “grandma would sacrifice herself for the stock market” crowd while also half listening to the experts. Gets you policy that makes this kind of sense. Like Tate saying he can’t tell churches not to meet. Complete Political BS that plays well with his base.

 

[Jacknut1]

https://nypost.com/2020/04/27/ive-w...art-opening-up/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

 

[Jeffreauxdawg]

See how dumb that is? FWIW I'm totally in favor of measured re-opening and voluntary social-distancing a'la Sweden.

I am with you 100%. All I want is for people to understand A: This was serious. B: It could become serious again. We were forced to over react because of the unknown... Now we have a lot more information.... We even know when the danger zone might happen... If it doesn't, great. If it does let's have a better plan.

 

[J-Dawg]

I am with you 100%. All I want is for people to understand A: This was serious. B: It could become serious again. We were forced to over react because of the unknown... Now we have a lot more information.... We even know when the danger zone might happen... If it doesn't, great. If it does let's have a better plan.

I understand all of that. And I’ll admit I was under the impression they always accounted for some measure of mitigation. For some reason I thought Fauci cited that when discussing the models originally. Anyway....

What is ridiculous is that large segments of (uneducated) people are largely against ANY reopening. Scroll through any news article and people are STILL overreacting like they did in the beginning, as if it’s the only reaction to have. People are refusing to see that we can and must ease restrictions in a measured manor.

 

[Jeffreauxdawg]

I understand all of that. And I’ll admit I was under the impression they always accounted for some measure of mitigation. For some reason I thought Fauci cited that when discussing the models originally. Anyway....

What is ridiculous is that large segments of (uneducated) people are largely against ANY reopening. Scroll through any news article and people are STILL overreacting like they did in the beginning, as if it’s the only reaction to have. People are refusing to see that we can and must ease restrictions in a measured manor.

People are scared. That's probably from media exaggerations and local leaders being over zealous. New York, Jersey, NOLA, and a few other places have been hit hard... I won't throw stones. Same for any huge population center. I imagine mayor's and Governors thinking the bodies are on them, but the economic problems can be blamed on higher levels.... But the data is a lot more clear now.

This should be a local issue at this point. My wife works for a massive publicly traded company out of NYC. Thousands of doctors on the payroll worldwide, they have been on this since January. NYC is not ready to open. When it is they have to be real careful. Lots of testing, because it can get out of hand quick. Same with other high density population areas.

Noxapater can let er rip. Everywhere else is probably somewhere in between. My biggest fear is elementary age kids and daycare. Those places are petri dishes and most kids are asymptomatic. Herd immunity takes time, if you do it real fast, it gets dangerous. Summer weather is a good time to get it going though.

So, I am ready to go let's see if we can't spend the 4th hearing someone yell.. let's play ball.

 

[ChupacabraDawg]

Apparently these guys have been reprimanded.

https://twitter.com/i/events/1255143480784871424

 

[Len2003]

You got a link to any facts to support this statement?

Candace Owens' Twitter feed

 

[Coledawg]

Hell, if we were testing at 99% and the other 1% were hobos/homeless unable to be located, our informative, diligent “news people “ would opine, “what about the other 1% Mr.President? And “explain yourself on more time about just how chugging chlorox is helpful...you know it’s true..

 

[ChupacabraDawg]

This statement is false. Why? Because we don't know the ACTUAL death numbers due to Covid. Ever wonder why cancer and all other deaths have gone down since the pandemic?? It's because they are coding all deaths as covid if they die in a hospital. CARES act actually pays 20% more for Medicaid for all all covid deaths. So they aren't gonna waste a test on the dead just codes them as covid
This is a big reason why we have so many deaths. Until we get actual numbers of those that passed due to covid you can not compare

I’m sure you are smart enough to know this works in both ways right? We didn’t test for months after this started to become a thing. I’m sure the numbers would go up if we had tests in January/February. Additionally, the number of “other” deaths has gone up.

 

[Bulldawg77]

You got a link to any facts to support this statement?

https://www.dailywire.com/news/yes-...oded-patients-even-if-they-havent-been-tested

CDC, an estimated 24,000 Americans have died from the flu this season—down from 80,000 flu deaths in 2018. Hmmm

These are facts the CoronaBros don't want you to know

 

[ckDOG]

Here is what the CDC actually says

https://www.dailywire.com/news/yes-...oded-patients-even-if-they-havent-been-tested

CDC, an estimated 24,000 Americans have died from the flu this season—down from 80,000 flu deaths in 2018. Hmmm

These are facts the CoronaBros don't want you to know

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/past-seasons.html

1) Last season they estimated 34k deaths.

2) The most deaths in the last 9 seasons was 62k

3) It stands to reason that flu deaths are down this year, assuming that is true, BECAUSE WE HAVE ISOLATED FROM EACH OTHER

 

[Bulldawg77]

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/past-seasons.html

1) Last season they estimated 34k deaths.

2) The most deaths in the last 9 seasons was 62k

3) It stands to reason that flu deaths are down this year, assuming that is true, BECAUSE WE HAVE ISOLATED FROM EACH OTHER

Orrr.... they are coded as COVID!???

And I referenced 2018 which was a record for flue case deaths not 19-20.
So it stands to reason that since hospitals are getting more money for COVID patients they don't report influenza cases as flue.

But that won't fit narratives

 

[ckDOG]

Orrr.... they are coded as COVID!???

And I referenced 2018 which was a record for flue case deaths not 19-20.
So it stands to reason that since hospitals are getting more money for COVID patients they don't report influenza cases as flue.

But that won't fit narratives

You are cherry picking and aren't even cherry picking correctly.

Last season, the death range was 26-53

This season, the death range is estimated to be 24-62.

Here is their chart for hospitalizations:
View attachment 16010

How is this season a flu outlier?

Okay detective. If Covid has a higher reimbursement, you found a motivator. The CDC isn't corroborating lower flu. Now go find out the Billings for cases at hospitals. It should be public for a lot of places. Pretty sure there was linked data in this topic that showed that was bunk as well.

 

[Dawgg]

Wow. 50 posts in and not a single mention of commie YouTube taking down this video. God forbid there be any kind of rebuttal to what the WHO and CCP are propagating. Wake up people. 1A rights are being squashed right now & it seems no one is even paying attention or noticing.

What First Amendment rights are being squashed? The government did not imprison these two men for this video.
Right to free speech does NOT equal the right to a platform.

 

[Dawgg]

I noticed Youtube removed the video. They are all the time removing videos or de-monitizing conservative viewpoints. But whats funny is this shouldn't even be about politics but about statistics. If you differ from the liberal stance people like Dawgg will come tell you that you have no credibility and to 17 off.

Fact remains. You, a blowhard that doesn't deserve to have Wilford Brimley as his avatar, were here at the beginning of the Covid outbreak arguing against social distancing measures and stay at home orders by saying:
""People that claim this is the flu are idiots." Yes they are. The flu is way worse than this Corona Virus. The Corona Virus may kill about 5k Americans this year. The flu will kill 10 times that."

Statistically, you were wrong 11X over then. What happened in the past month that makes you correct now?
You don't even have the integrity to admit that this was worse than you originally thought.

 

[Bulldawg77]

You are cherry picking and aren't even cherry picking correctly.

Last season, the death range was 26-53

This season, the death range is estimated to be 24-62.

Here is their chart for hospitalizations:
View attachment 16010

How is this season a flu outlier?

Okay detective. If Covid has a higher reimbursement, you found a motivator. The CDC isn't corroborating lower flu. Now go find out the Billings for cases at hospitals. It should be public for a lot of places. Pretty sure there was linked data in this topic that showed that was bunk as well.

Look CoronaBro. I'm sorry to interrupt your socialist party but did you even read the article?

“Hospital administrators might well want to see COVID-19 attached to a discharge summary or a death certificate. Why? Because if it’s a straightforward, garden-variety pneumonia that a person is admitted to the hospital for – if they’re Medicare – typically, the diagnosis-related group lump sum payment would be $5,000,” he added on April 19. “But if it’s COVID-19 pneumonia, then it’s $13,000, and if that COVID-19 pneumonia patient ends up on a ventilator, it goes up to $39,000.”

This right here is why deaths from all other diseases are down as well as deaths numbers are inadequate.

 

[Jeffreauxdawg]

Orrr.... they are coded as COVID!???

And I referenced 2018 which was a record for flue case deaths not 19-20.
So it stands to reason that since hospitals are getting more money for COVID patients they don't report influenza cases as flue.

But that won't fit narratives

You are all bs, with no data. Let's get to facts.

Where you are right... The Cares ACT ( which was signed by President Trump on 3-27.. this date is important for later) pays an additional 20% for Medicare patients treated for Covid19.

Now let's talk about the flu. First, flu deaths are estimated. The vast majority of flu deaths are not confirmed, but are instead extrapolated by using a model. I will insist the link, but I am sure you won't read it.. so I copied a line that would make it easy for you.

From prior analyses, the number of deaths associated with influenza may be two to four times higher than the number of deaths related to influenza that have pneumonia or influenza listed on the death certificate.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/irv.12486

Flu cases that are confirmed by testing are reported to the CDC. They publish the data. I grabbed it for you, because you don't seem to be much on digging for facts.

The first image is of 2018-19 cases. We will focus on weeks 11-16 which roughly correlates to March 1- Mid April of 2019... That is relative to the same time frame as we have been really dealing with Covid19 in 2020.

In weeks 11-16 of 2019 a total of 239k flu tests were given and 44k were confirmed positive. About 18%. In weeks 11-12 a total of 106k tests were given and 25k were positive. About 24%. I will get to weeks 11-12's importance soon.

View attachment 16012

In weeks 11-16 of 2020 a total of 242k flu tests were given and 18k were confirmed positive. About 7%. In weeks 11-12 a total of 141k tests were given and 16k were positive. About 11%.

View attachment 16013

So the data suggests that even though more tests were given in weeks of 2020, less than half as many cases were positive. We don't give flu tests to healthy people so either they were sick with something else or like you suggest... The medical professionals that swear oathes to do no harm are committing fraud.

The silver bullet is the week 11-12 data. The Cares ACT was signed at the end of week 13. Time travel would have to be involved for anyone to skew that data.

The reality is that people started getting sick with flu like illnesses and it wasn't the flu. We locked down the country and within a few weeks the flu was nearly eliminated for the season because it's a lot less contagious due to vaccines and antibodies we have for it.

There is no conspiracy. It's made up. From someone's ***.