Game Thread. Cats vs Southern

[PasadenaCat]

So then by your definition of a good season Bennet has had one in the last decade at UVA. The title season. That's it.

Of course the standards are different here. No sh*t. But we are comparing two coaches and what they have done.

You can't be like well one coach got to an Elite 8 at UVA and the other coach got to the Elite at UK but since at UK Elite 8s don't matter we'll just say that doesn't count. I mean that's just dumb.

Bennett has 1 title. That's all. That's one good season by your definition.

For UVA, they have had a 3 or 4 really good seasons under Bennett. Their standards are quite a bit different than UK.

But the coaches are going to be judged by different standards if they are at such different institutions, with huge resource discrepancies and historical advantages. Getting UVA to an E8 is much harder than getting UK there. Getting them to a F4 and NC was practically unthinkable for them.

Cal is at UK, the standards of a good season are significantly higher. We had around 32 E8's before Cal ever got here. That is an expectation in our program most years. UVA on the other hand had been to 5 pre Bennett. He has already added 2 more plus their first NC. If you don't see the difference, I don't know what to tell you.

That's the same amount as Cal with a lot less talent and resources at his disposal. Significantly less pay as well. Are you sure that is the argument you want to go with?

 

[track42]

Right. I mean I'm just comparing the two coaches.

That isn't to say that Cal hasn't had a bad last 6 years by UK standards.

It's just I hear people saying that we should go after Bennett after Cal leaves and I'm of the mindset is do we really believe that's a better option.

Those built in advantages and resources didn't seem to help BCG. I don't believe the fact that a coach coming here would automatically be any better than they currently were at a different school. I think it could go either way IMO.

God I hope we don't go after Bennett after Cal leaves.He's a good coach but I really want an offensive minded coach.Cal's offense is painful enough to watch but with Bennett I would jump off the ledge.

 

[PasadenaCat]

Talking about coaches here don't see how you see the obvious difference. Also it was 95 bub

Right, so I am showing why one coach has a historical advanatge to be successful vs the other who doesn't. Lol, it's sad that had to be explained to an adult.

Well ****, being in 95 practically changes everything!

 

[The_Answer1313_rivals]

For UVA, they have had a 3 or 4 really good seasons under Bennett. Their standards are quite a bit different than UK.

But the coaches are going to be judged by different standards if they are at such different institutions, with huge resource discrepancies and historical advantages. Getting UVA to an E8 is much harder than getting UK there. Getting them to a F4 and NC was practically unthinkable for them.

Cal is at UK, the standards of a good season are significantly higher. We had around 32 E8's before Cal ever got here. That is an expectation in our program most years. UVA on the other hand had been to 5 pre Bennett. He has already added 2 more plus their first NC. If you don't see the difference, I don't know what to tell you.

That's the same amount as Cal with a lot less talent and resources at his disposal. Significantly less pay as well. Are you sure that is the argument you want to go with?

I think you are vastly overstating the "amount of resources" we have and it's benefit to Cal.

It's like you are saying that if roles were reversed and Bennett was at UK and Cal was at UVA, Bennett would automatically be better and Cal would automatically be worse.

Do people just forget that Cal took Umass to a final four. That he took Memphis to a final four. Places with clearly less "resources" than UK.

I'm sorry. Cal doesn't get penalized in my head because UK has a better history than UVA. That's just ridiculous. Of course Bennett has done more when you look at it like that. He had way more room than Cal. Bennett in that situation literally could have gone to a final four one year and do nothing else the next 10 years.

 

[The_Answer1313_rivals]

God I hope we don't go after Bennett after Cal leaves.He's a good coach but I really want an offensive minded coach.Cal's offense is painful enough to watch but with Bennett I would jump off the ledge.

Yeah give me someone that runs a good and exciting offense. Maybe Few or Wright.

 

[RunninRichie]

Yeah give me someone that runs a good and exciting offense. Maybe Few or Wright.

Oats

 

[PasadenaCat]

I think you are vastly overstating the "amount of resources" we have and it's benefit to Cal.

It's like you are saying that if roles were reversed and Bennett was at UK and Cal was at UVA, Bennett would automatically be better and Cal would automatically be worse.

Do people just forget that Cal took Umass to a final four. That he took Memphis to a final four. Places with clearly less "resources" than UK.

I'm sorry. Cal doesn't get penalized in my head because UK has a better history than UVA. That's just ridiculous. Of course Bennett has done more when you look at it like that. He had way more room than Cal. Bennett in that situation literally could have gone to a final four one year and do nothing else the next 10 years.

We have more resources than any progam maybe sans Duke in basketball. We pay our coach 9mil for goodness sake. Our assistants make more than most head coaches. We provide a limitless recruiting budget, start of the art facilities, 1 of the best venues and fanbases as well. We destroy UVA in every possible advantage except academics.

Yea, considering Bennett actually coaches x's and o's and understands the game, I would say he probably could do better bow that he has experience. He's been doing better the last 6 years at UVA. Not sure why he wouldn't be able to do that here.

No doubt! He was also in hins prime then! Can we get that guy back?!?!


Except he went on to win it and has turned UVA into a respected program that is routinely competitive in the ACC and ranked high most seasons. He's done damn well with far less to work with. He's literally what you're saying Cal was at Memphis and Umass and the first 5 years here. That sounds damn good to me!

 

[RunninRichie]

We have more resources than any progam maybe sans Duke in basketball. We pay our coach 9mil for goodness sake. Our assistants make more than most head coaches. We provide a limitless recruiting budget, start of the art facilities, 1 of the best venues and fanbases as well. We destroy UVA in every possible advantage except academics.

Yea, considering Bennett actually coaches x's and o's and understands the game, I would say he probably could do better bow that he has experience. He's been doing better the last 6 years at UVA. Not sure why he wouldn't be able to do that here.

No doubt! He was also in hins prime then! Can we get that guy back?!?!


Except he went on to win it and has turned UVA into a respected program that is routinely competitive in the ACC and ranked high most seasons. He's done damn well with far less to work with. He's literally what you're saying Cal was at Memphis and Umass and the first 5 years here. That sounds damn good to me!

Duke does not have better resources. Well, maybe if you count NCAA protection.

 

[PasadenaCat]

Duke does not have better resources. Well, maybe if you count NCAA protection.

That's why I said maybe. They do have some nice *** houses they are handing out to recruits.

 

[The_Answer1313_rivals]

We have more resources than any progam maybe sans Duke in basketball. We pay our coach 9mil for goodness sake. Our assistants make more than most head coaches. We provide a limitless recruiting budget, start of the art facilities, 1 of the best venues and fanbases as well. We destroy UVA in every possible advantage except academics.

Yea, considering Bennett actually coaches x's and o's and understands the game, I would say he probably could do better bow that he has experience. He's been doing better the last 6 years at UVA. Not sure why he wouldn't be able to do that here.

No doubt! He was also in hins prime then! Can we get that guy back?!?!


Except he went on to win it and has turned UVA into a respected program that is routinely competitive in the ACC and ranked high most seasons. He's done damn well with far less to work with. He's literally what you're saying Cal was at Memphis and Umass and the first 5 years here. That sounds damn good to me!

And yet..........you have teams like Gonzaga and Baylor making finals. So I don't agree that this is some end all be all here.

All those resources and at the end of the day, the kids get to decide where they want to play basketball. The reason we haven't been as good the last five years as we have the previous 5 was because the top talent is going other places now.

It's great for Cal that UK can afford to give him 9 mil a year. It's great that we have state of the art facilities and a great fanbase. But at the end of the day, I'm not really sure that matters all that much to a young kid as evident of the top talent going other places. Sometimes going to schools completely off the map.

 

[lexwildcat859]

Right, so I am showing why one coach has a historical advanatge to be successful vs the other who doesn't. Lol, it's sad that had to be explained to an adult.

Well ****, being in 95 practically changes everything!

theres no such thing as a historical advantage in college sports, no one goes to UK because we won chips in the 40s thats just the reality.

If that were the case then we wouldve had top recruiting classes every single year but we all know we had severe droughts where we couldnt sniff the top recruits no one cares about what you did 100 years ago its all about what have you done for me lately

 

[PasadenaCat]

And yet..........you have teams like Gonzaga and Baylor making finals. So I don't agree that this is some end all be all here.

All those resources and at the end of the day, the kids get to decide where they want to play basketball. The reason we haven't been as good the last five years as we have the previous 5 was because the top talent is going other places now.

It's great for Cal that UK can afford to give him 9 mil a year. It's great that we have state of the art facilities and a great fanbase. But at the end of the day, I'm not really sure that matters all that much to a young kid as evident of the top talent going other places. Sometimes going to schools completely off the map.

They are doing this because they have real coaches that can do more with less talent. They actually out coach instead of out talent!

It's like you're seeing the issue but just not comprehending what you're seeing quite yet.

You act as though we have been talent deprived. We've had more talent most seasons than BAYLOR, UVA, Nova, Gonzaga, UNC, LOYOLA Chicago, HOUSTON, Ttech, UCLA and so on, yet they made final 4's and won titles while we failed to make any final fours and even mangaded to miss a tournament. None of those teams were great because of top rated recruits. Yet, we still landed highly rated recruits and weren't as good.

 

[lexwildcat859]

They are doing this because they have real coaches that can do more with less talent. They actually out coach instead of out talent!

It's like you're seeing the issue but just not comprehending what you're seeing quite yet.

You act as though we have been talent deprived. We've had more talent most seasons than BAYLOR, UVA, Nova, Gonzaga, UNC, LOYOLA Chicago, HOUSTON, Ttech, UCLA and so on, yet they made final 4's and won titles while we failed to make any final fours and even mangaded to miss a tournament. None of those teams were great because of top rated recruits. Yet, we still landed highly rated recruits and weren't as good.

other than those 2 chips Nova has made it past the second round of the tourney once in the past 12 years and missed the tourney altogether with a 13-19 record one year, idk why you hold them up as some standard we have to meet our past 12 years is better than theirs

 

[PasadenaCat]

theres no such thing as a historical advantage in college sports, no one goes to UK because we won chips in the 40s thats just the reality.

If that were the case then we wouldve had top recruiting classes every single year but we all know we had severe droughts where we couldnt sniff the top recruits no one cares about what you did 100 years ago its all about what have you done for me lately

Yea, being historically good doesn't give you greater fan support and financial resources. It doesn't help aid recruits in knowing a lot about your program nd wanting to be recruited by you because you are among the best. It doesn't help get you a lot of air time for games and national broadcast to promote your brand and get noticed by NBA scouts. It doesn't help get bigger name coaches. What the hell am I thinking...

 

[PasadenaCat]

other than those 2 chips Nova has made it past the second round of the tourney once in the past 12 years and missed the tourney altogether with a 13-19 record one year, idk why you hold them up as some standard we have to meet our past 12 years is better than theirs

How many championships do we have in that span again? What was our record when we missed last year, btw?

 

[bbnkat02]

the year is 2056, UK has not won a title in 40 years. Cals corpse is the coach. "GUYS IM SICK OF THIS ****, FIRE CAL"

some of these guys on rafters
"REMEMBER 2009-2015??"

And yet somehow IU will still manage to be irrelevant. lol.

 

[lexwildcat859]

How many championships do we have in that span again? What was our record when we missed last year, btw?

the past 12 years we've gone to the same number of championship games as nova, they just so happened to win one on a buzzer beating three pointer.

But other than those 2 appearances nova has barely made it to the second round they struggle whereas UK has 7 elite eights we always have a chance to win it, they are one of the teams most likely to be upset in the first two rounds, big difference between the two programs bub

 

[RunninRichie]

And yet somehow IU will still manage to be irrelevant. lol.

Damn. he's good.

 

[The_Answer1313_rivals]

They are doing this because they have real coaches that can do more with less talent. They actually out coach instead of out talent!

It's like you're seeing the issue but just not comprehending what you're seeing quite yet.

You act as though we have been talent deprived. We've had more talent most seasons than BAYLOR, UVA, Nova, Gonzaga, UNC, LOYOLA Chicago, HOUSTON, Ttech, UCLA and so on, yet they made final 4's and won titles while we failed to make any final fours and even mangaded to miss a tournament. None of those teams were great because of top rated recruits. Yet, we still landed highly rated recruits and weren't as good.

But Cal has already won with less talent. It's not as if he forgot how to coach.

 

[lexwildcat859]

Yea, being historically good doesn't give you greater fan support and financial resources. It doesn't help aid recruits in knowing a lot about your program nd wanting to be recruited by you because you are among the best. It doesn't help get you a lot of air time for games and national broadcast to promote your brand and get noticed by NBA scouts. It doesn't help get bigger name coaches. What the hell am I thinking...

Bro its 2021 not 1981, every team plays on tv, every team has modern facilities, and recruits dont give a **** about fan support, again if what you say is true then why has UK struggled for recruits ever? maybe because all the things you list have no bearing on recruiting....

 

[RunninRichie]

But Cal has already won with less talent. It's not as if he forgot how to coach.

When?

 

[bbnkat02]

Damn. he's good.

I bleed blue. Even if everything else goes to crap, we’re still better than those candy stripped idiots.

 

[RunninRichie]

Bro its 2021 not 1981, every team plays on tv, every team has modern facilities, and recruits dont give a **** about fan support, again if what you say is true then why has UK struggled for recruits ever? maybe because all the things you list have no bearing on recruiting....

every team plays in primetime slots on national tv like UK and is included in weekly wrap ups on sports center? Every team has state of the art facilities like UK? Recruits don't care about fan support? Can I get some sources on that? Because many UK players say they loved the fans and crowd while at UK. Then again, your avatar is cal in MLG sunglasses so you'll be a fan of the next team he coaches and leave UK behind anyway....

 

[RunninRichie]

I bleed blue. Even if everything else goes to crap, we’re still better than those candy stripped idiots.

100 percent brother.

 

[PasadenaCat]

the past 12 years we've gone to the same number of championship games as nova, they just so happened to win one on a buzzer beating three pointer.

But other than those 2 appearances nova has barely made it to the second round they struggle whereas UK has 7 elite eights we always have a chance to win it, they are one of the teams most likely to be upset in the first two rounds, big difference between the two programs bub

Lol, Nova has won 2. Why is it so hard to say? They also won those 2 in the last 5 years. That’s incredible. Plus they did it with less talented recruiting classes and resources. Just better coaching.

UK hasn't contended for **** since 2015. Always had a chance to win? Lol, what chance have we had in the last few years? Hell, you have to make the tournament to have a chance.

Yea, their program is on an upward trajectory, ours in on a downward.

 

[PasadenaCat]

But Cal has already won with less talent. It's not as if he forgot how to coach.

Then wtf happened? Cal won with less like 25 years ago. He sure had a lot of talent at Memphis and UK.

 

[lexwildcat859]

every team plays in primetime slots on national tv like UK and is included in weekly wrap ups on sports center? Every team has state of the art facilities like UK? Recruits don't care about fan support? Can I get some sources on that? Because many UK players say they loved the fans and crowd while at UK. Then again, your avatar is cal in MLG sunglasses so you'll be a fan of the next team he coaches and leave UK behind anyway....

The only source you need is to look at where recruits go to school, Anthony Edwards went number one overall, he went to GA, last time I checked their basketball program is trash and means nothing statewide or even nationally...I guess it was all that fan support that swayed him right????? Lamelo Ball played in Australia, RJ Hampton played in Australia, Jalen Green went to the G league, Jalen Suggs and Chet Holmgren went to Gonzaga, so many primetime games playing on the west coast right???? Boogie Ellis, DJ Jeffries and James Wiseman went to Memphis, so many historical advantages there right?

It takes barely any brain cells to figure this out so why is it so hard for you?

 

[RunninRichie]

Then wtf happened? Cal won with less like 25 years ago. He sure had a lot of talent at Memphis and UK.

He had 5 stars Donta Bright and Camby at UMASS

 

[PasadenaCat]

Bro its 2021 not 1981, every team plays on tv, every team has modern facilities, and recruits dont give a **** about fan support, again if what you say is true then why has UK struggled for recruits ever? maybe because all the things you list have no bearing on recruiting....

No, they really don't. Their aren't even enough sports channels for all that. Most athletic departments have very little resources and have ****** facilities. And recruits do give a **** about fan support, particularly since they can now make money from them genius.

Some of you clearly have no knowledge of what you're talking about. You're just here for the Cal nut sampler.

 

[lexwildcat859]

Lol, Nova has won 2. Why is it so hard to say? They also won those 2 in the last 5 years. That’s incredible. Plus they did it with less talented recruiting classes and resources. Just better coaching.

UK hasn't contended for **** since 2015. Always had a chance to win? Lol, what chance have we had in the last few years? Hell, you have to make the tournament to have a chance.

Yea, their program is on an upward trajectory, ours in on a downward.

Id rather have 7 chances to make the final four than 2 but if you love 2nd round finishes so much then go root for nova

 

[RunninRichie]

The only source you need is to look at where recruits go to school, Anthony Edwards went number one overall, he went to GA, last time I checked their basketball program is trash and means nothing statewide or even nationally...I guess it was all that fan support that swayed him right????? Lamelo Ball played in Australia, RJ Hampton played in Australia, Jalen Green went to the G league, Jalen Suggs and Chet Holmgren went to Gonzaga, so many primetime games playing on the west coast right???? Boogie Ellis, DJ Jeffries and James Wiseman went to Memphis, so many historical advantages there right?

It takes barely any brain cells to figure this out so why is it so hard for you?

Edwards-Chose to stay home
Jalen and Chet- Handlers refused to let coach K and Cal recruit them pushed them to zaga
Ball-Eligibility issues
Hampton-didn't want to play college
Wiseman-Penny was his AAU coach
Ellis and DJ- Followed Wiseman


It takes barely any brain cells to figure this out so why is it so hard for you?

 

[PasadenaCat]

Id rather have 7 chances to make the final four than 2 but if you love 2nd round finishes so much then go root for nova

You would rather not win 7 times than win twice?

Good Lord, no wonder this country is going to ****.

 

[lexwildcat859]

No, they really don't. Their aren't even enough sports channels for all that. Most athletic departments have very little resources and have ****** facilities. And recruits do give a **** about fan support, particularly since they can now make money from them genius.

Some of you clearly have no knowledge of what you're talking about. You're just here for the Cal nut sampler.

THis is the same over inflated sense of self worth that lead to UK hiring billy clyde, you think because kentucky accomplished some **** 100 years ago that every recruit should bend the knee but you cant explain why they dont

 

[blackcat714]

the past 12 years we've gone to the same number of championship games as nova, they just so happened to win one on a buzzer beating three pointer.

But other than those 2 appearances nova has barely made it to the second round they struggle whereas UK has 7 elite eights we always have a chance to win it, they are one of the teams most likely to be upset in the first two rounds, big difference between the two programs bub

So what they just got twice as many championships.They just got lucky

 

[RunninRichie]

THis is the same over inflated sense of self worth that lead to UK hiring billy clyde, you think because kentucky accomplished some **** 100 years ago that every recruit should bend the knee but you cant explain why they dont

What the **** are you talking about? You want some numbers as to why your boy is slipping or you gonna keep pimping for him? We know you're not a UK fan. You're just here defending your favorite coach until he leaves then you will follow him.

 

[lexwildcat859]

Edwards-Chose to stay home
Jalen and Chet- Handlers refused to let coach K and Cal recruit them pushed them to zaga
Ball-Eligibility issues
Hampton-didn't want to play college
Wiseman-Penny was his AAU coach
Ellis and DJ- Followed Wiseman


It takes barely any brain cells to figure this out so why is it so hard for you?

everything you listed is a excuse, according to the OP all the "historical advantages" that UK has should negate what you listed, if anything your list furthers my point, historical advantages dont matter and dont exist

 

[RunninRichie]

everything you listed is a excuse, according to the OP all the "historical advantages" that UK has should negate what you listed, if anything your list furthers my point, historical advantages dont matter and dont exist

Is that right? Is that why Cal came to UK?

 

[PasadenaCat]

THis is the same over inflated sense of self worth that lead to UK hiring billy clyde, you think because kentucky accomplished some **** 100 years ago that every recruit should bend the knee but you cant explain why they dont

We have had a top 2 recruiting class forn11 years straight. We have it again next year. WTF are you talking about with recruiting?!?!

We've never had issues with getting good players. Well, except for BCG. Even Tubby got good players without much effort.

 

[RunninRichie]

everything you listed is a excuse, according to the OP all the "historical advantages" that UK has should negate what you listed, if anything your list furthers my point, historical advantages dont matter and dont exist

how are these excuses? These are legit the reasons as to why those guys went where they did.

 

[PasadenaCat]

everything you listed is a excuse, according to the OP all the "historical advantages" that UK has should negate what you listed, if anything your list furthers my point, historical advantages dont matter and dont exist

Did I say our advantage guaranteed us every recruit or just that we shouldn't struggle to recruit good players? You're manufacturing your own arguments to fit your agenda. Don't be that weak.