You Leftists can't win

[MountaineerWV]

Hahahahaha they were talking about ISIS, Iranian exportation of terror, Israeli relations with the US, a stable, robust, and diverse economy across every sector of business, and rising wages for minorities specifically but everyone in general? Care to link some articles or can we just assume once again you’re a fvcking maroon?

Also, just to be clear, you’re predicting another Great Depression to occur within this first term or shortly thereafter into his second? And when it occurs, it will be because of....(fill in the specific Trump policy or policies).

I’ll wait for this gem.

Wow.......

1. Supply-side economics introduced by Harding and unregulated economy........

2. Washington Conference.......later, after Harding....Kellogg-Briand.......(yeah, that worked)

Again, learn your history and stop defending the man you claim you detest.........

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

Wow.......

1. Supply-side economics introduced by Harding and unregulated economy........

2. Washington Conference.......later, after Harding....Kellogg-Briand.......(yeah, that worked)

Again, learn your history and stop defending the man you claim you detest.........

I know my history very well.

You’re contending we’re operating in an unregulated economy? That’s what you’re going with. As I said, if you knew **** all about economics, this might be a decent discussion.

And I’m waiting on your claim about which specific Trump policy or policies is going to lead to the next Great Depression/recession.

 

[atlkvb]

just to be clear, you’re predicting another Great Depression to occur within this first term or shortly thereafter into his second? And when it occurs, it will be because of....(fill in the specific Trump policy or policies).

I’ll wait for this gem

Hell will freeze over before you get to hold any type of rational, intelligent, understandable conversation on economics with a Socialist Leftist. You'd be better off trying to be an interpreter between two folks who speak Chinese and Creole.

 

[Bulya]

And I'm going to show you how to prove it to yourselves.

Here's how:

Let's pretend you have control over who gets my vote this Fall.(I said pretend) Let's say for the sake of this experiment I'm a neutral non conforming totally open minded issues voter. I'm simply voting for whoever has the best plan or agenda, regardless of any personality quirks OK?

So convince me using your best arguments of your better plan to win my vote. Give me issues, & policies which better address them as opposed to what I'm hearing from the Republicans.

Now either one of you will accept this open challenge and use the very issues and policies addressing them which are going to lead to your "big Blue Wave" victory this fall, or none of you will step forward with a legitimate answer because you simply don't have one...thereby proving my point why you're going to get your clocks cleaned come November. If you don't have the solid reasons why voters should cast a ballot for your side, how can you be so sure of your victory?

The Republicans have already put out their plan. Now what's yours on the Democrat Left? This is your chance to prove that your sure victory is on the way!

Any evidence?

I'm a leftist and I'm winning! Own 2 small businesses soon to be 3 which will have over $5 Million in revenue combined and a nice net profit. And yes I'll use some of that net to help the poor and indigent on top of my taxes I pay the government. The American Dream isn't just Greed it is also helping fellow citizens who need it not all are "leeches" as your side loves to claim.

 

[atlkvb]

I'm a leftist and I'm winning! Own 2 small businesses soon to be 3 which will have over $5 Million in revenue combined and a nice net profit. And yes I'll use some of that net to help the poor and indigent on top of my taxes I pay the government. The American Dream isn't just Greed it is also helping fellow citizens who need it not all are "leeches" as your side loves to claim.

What's "greed"? Sounds like you're doing OK and you feel Blessed enough to share your success with others! Great.

No one is "forcing" you do that though are they? There is no debt involved, no bureaucracy, and no one is "dependent" on your charity.

Exactly as it should be for all of us. Trickle down like Niagara Falls! Run it Bulya my Man!

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

I'm a leftist and I'm winning! Own 2 small businesses soon to be 3 which will have over $5 Million in revenue combined and a nice net profit. And yes I'll use some of that net to help the poor and indigent on top of my taxes I pay the government. The American Dream isn't just Greed it is also helping fellow citizens who need it not all are "leeches" as your side loves to claim.

You’re a small business and you don’t support Trump’s economy and economic policies? Correlation, check it out, it comes after confused in the dictionary.

 

[atlkvb]

You’re a small business and you don’t support Trump’s economy and economic policies? Correlation, check it out, it comes after confused in the dictionary.

Word! Bulya is benefiting from the improved economic climate and not asking anyone to do it for him. He did build that!

 

[Bulya]

What's "greed"? Sounds like you're doing OK and you feel Blessed enough to share your success with others! Great.

No one is "forcing" you do that though are they? There is no debt involved, no bureaucracy, and no one is "dependent" on your charity.

Exactly as it should be for all of us. Trickle down working like Niagara Falls! Run it Bulya my Man!

Question everyone harkens to the good ole days I’m down with 1954 when Ike was President and the rich paid a hell of a lot more in taxes as a percentage and that money was used for the GI Bill and building the Interstate system. Now “we don’t have the money” to fix infrastructure maybe if taxes were where they were in 1954 we would but the Rich keep getting non term limited assfucks doing their biddings and burying the middle and lower classes. Now socially we don’t want 1954 cause you would be treated like a 2nd class citizen. Fortunately we went the right way on those issues but financially have all got tilted to reward and maintain the rich.

 

[atlkvb]

Question everyone harkens to the good ole days I’m down with 1954 when Ike was President and the rich paid a hell of a lot more in taxes as a percentage and that money was used for the GI Bill and building the Interstate system. Now “we don’t have the money” to fix infrastructure maybe if taxes were where they were in 1954 we would but the Rich keep getting non term limited *******s doing their biddings and burying the middle and lower classes. Now socially we don’t want 1954 cause you would be treated like a 2nd class citizen. Fortunately we went the right way on those issues but financially have all got tilted to reward and maintain the rich.

Bulya my man, do you know what the Federal budget was '54? Know what it is today? We don't have a revenue problem my friend from us being taxed too little. No! What we have here is a spending problem where 3 trillion dollars is still not enough. Why not?

I'd settle for the size of 1954 Government as compared to the monstrosity we have today. If we can compromise on that, Brother, you got yourself a deal! (cap taxes @ no more than 16% of your AGI, too...that was the effective Federal tax rate minus all of the deductions allowed back in good 'ol '54 for the highest earning taxpayers) [winking]

source: https://taxfoundation.org/taxes-rich-1950-not-high/

excerpt:
When we look at income taxes specifically, the top 1 percent of taxpayers paid an average effective rate of only 16.9 percent in income taxes during the 1950s.[4]

 

[atlkvb]

financially have all got tilted to reward and maintain the rich.

Rich folks Bulya (like yourself) deserve to keep what they earn. Look how you reward others with your wealth. Providing jobs, offering free aid, helping to expand economic GDP. All good things because you got a tax cut and favorable tax treatment in the current tax law.

The money belongs to those who earn it like you Bulya, not Government! We "reward" folks who earn their own money by allowing them to keep it, not forcing them to turn it all over to Uncle Sam to waste.

 

[Bulya]

Bulya my man, do you know what the Federal budget was '54? Know what it is today? We don't have a revenue problem my friend from us being taxed too little. No! What we have here is a spending problem where 3 trillion dollars is still not enough. Why not?

I'd settle for the size of 1954 Government as compared to the monstrosity we have today. If we can compromise on that, Brother, you got yourself a deal! (cap taxes @ no more than 25% of your AGI, too...that was the effective Federal tax rate minus all of the deductions allowed back in good 'ol '54) [winking]

You’re neglecting a few components between then and now. The population of the US including the amount of senior citizens on social security and Medicare, the amount of poor people on Medicaid and the size of the military budget Those items are 90% of the US Budget. Top rate in 54 was 91% vs 37% today. Slight tilt toward the rich.

 

[atlkvb]

You’re neglecting a few components between then and now. The population of the US including the amount of senior citizens on social security and Medicare, the amount of poor people on Medicaid and the size of the military budget Those items are 90% of the US Budget. Top rate in 54 was 91% vs 37% today. Slight tilt toward the rich.

Hey Bulya, if we didn't have rich people such as yourself earning millions and giving it away through philanthropy or investing it to create jobs & expand the economy where would the money to give away, hire & grow, or invest come from?

 

[atlkvb]

Top rate in 54 was 91% vs 37% today. Slight tilt toward the rich.

No one in '54 paid 91 % of their AGI in taxes Bulya. Just as no one today pays 37%. Those were the rates for sure, but what actually did wage earners pay?The tax code with its built in loopholes, deductions, and set asides, is the biggest shakedown invented by Man. It is manipulated depending on how much (or little) those who manipulate it through their lobbying and/or donations to their favorite politicos are willing to pay.

Fact.

 

[Bulya]

No one '54 paid 91 % of their AGI in taxes Bulya. Just as no one today pays 37%. Those were the rates for sure, but what actually did wage earners pay?The tax code with its built in loopholes, deductions, and set asides, is the biggest shakedown invented by Man. It is manipulated depending on how much (or little) those who manipulate it through their lobbying and/or donations to their favorite politicos are willing to pay.

Fact.

I’m pretty sure 91% is greater than 37% regardless of loopholes which are far worse now than back then when Congress was not completely for sale yet. Philanthropy cuts the rich’s income taxes but at least it is noble and not a pure tax avoidance. I commend those who are going to give away most of their fortunes to help eradicate disease and famine and help educate the underprivileged.

 

[atlkvb]

I’m pretty sure 91% is greater than 37% regardless of loopholes which are far worse now than back then when Congress was not completely for sale yet.

So Bulya my Man, I gather from your comments you do not think "the rich" are paying enough in taxes, right? OK fair enough. Let's see what you think they should be paying?

Do you know of the amount of current taxes collected, how much or what percentage of that total tax bill "the rich" currently pay? (since you're arguing for a 91% rate) What percentage of the current tax bill (ie all taxes collected) do the top 50% of U.S. wage earners pay? Got that?

OK, so of that percentage, how much more of that total tax burden should they be carrying? Give me a number above the current percentage they're already paying? (I could could provide these answers for you but I want you to look it up to make my point)

If the current percentage of all the total taxes paid by the top half of all wage earners in this country is not enough, how much more of that total tax bill should they be paying and what should that rate be?

Got it Bulya my Man? Good.

Now, post your answers for me please?

 

[Bulya]

So Bulya my Man, I gather from your comments you do not think "the rich" are paying enough in taxes, right? OK fair enough. Let's see what you think they should be paying?

Do you know of the amount of current taxes collected, how much or what percentage of that total tax bill "the rich" currently pay? (since you're arguing for a 91% rate) What percentage of the current tax bill (ie all taxes collected) do the top 50% of U.S. wage earners pay? Got that?

OK, so of that percentage, how much more of that total tax burden should they be carrying? Give me a number above the current percentage they're already paying? (I could could provide these answers for you but I want you to look it up to make my point)

If the current percentage of all the total taxes paid by the top half of all wage earners in this country is not enough, how much more of that total tax bill should they be paying and what should that rate be?

Got it Bulya my Man? Good.

Now, post your answers for me please?

Why don’t you publish the numbers for 1954 and 2017 since you seem to know the answers. It’s a college football Saturday and I’m off an enjoying it! Not a big NFL guy so maybe tomorrow when I’m working at my desk I’ll look it up or you could just save me time.

 

[atlkvb]

Why don’t you publish the numbers for 1954 and 2017 since you seem to know the answers. It’s a college football Saturday and I’m off an enjoying it! Not a big NFL guy so maybe tomorrow when I’m working at my desk I’ll look it up or you could just save me time.

From post # 55 atlkvb said: (I could could provide these answers for you but I want you to look it up to make my point)

Just post your answers for me please whenever you get the time OK my Man?

Thanks.

(btw you also avoided answering me in post #52) [winking]

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

You’re neglecting a few components between then and now. The population of the US including the amount of senior citizens on social security and Medicare, the amount of poor people on Medicaid and the size of the military budget Those items are 90% of the US Budget. Top rate in 54 was 91% vs 37% today. Slight tilt toward the rich.

And you’re not taking into account the effective tax rate and the write offs available in those days.

 

[BombadEER]

You underestimate the hatred for Trump, about half of which is deserved because he’s a vile piece of **** lacking any semblance of humility. Some can divorce his behavior from his policies and others cannot.

Don't come on here and demean the Prersident and call yourself DevilDog. If it wasn't for Trump our military would look like the Cuban army. Vets would still be dying in the streets. Food stanps and welfare would be double and Obama and Hillary would have sold us out to the highest bidder. You liberals are sick. And your no DevilDog

 

[Bulya]

Don't come on here and demean the Prersident and call yourself DevilDog. If it wasn't for Trump our military would look like the Cuban army. Vets would still be dying in the streets. Food stanps and welfare would be double and Obama and Hillary would have sold us out to the highest bidder. You liberals are sick. And your no DevilDog

Demean the guy that f*cked a porn star bareback with a 4 month old son at home with his wife? Demean the guy who had an affair with a Playmate after that? Demean the good Christian with 5 kids by 3 women trying for NBA player status? Demean the guy who filed bankruptcy 3 times and f*cked over MANY small businesses in the process? Demean the guy who is a pathological liar? Crawl back under your rock dumbass. :flush:

 

[atlkvb]

Demean the guy that f*cked a porn star bareback with a 4 month old son at home with his wife? Demean the guy who had an affair with a Playmate after that? Demean the good Christian with 5 kids by 3 women trying for NBA player status? Demean the guy who filed bankruptcy 3 times and f*cked over MANY small businesses in the process? Demean the guy who is a pathological liar? Crawl back under your rock dumbass. :flush:

Hey we get it Bulya...Trump's a reprobate and a sexual pervert and a creep. Got it. Now as far as policy goes, what's the Left's alternative to his tax cuts and business deregulation that's produced 4.2%GDP for us, and record low unemployment? Why are you avoiding answering my questions?

"Cmon Man, state your case!

 

[atlkvb]

Hey @Bulya! Dude I have no idea if you're ever going to answer me in posts #52, #55, or #61 of this thread and that's cool. But if you read the header in my OP, I said "you Leftists can't win", and I'm trying to prove that point with you guy's help. You're doing a fine job helping me because the point I'm making is you guys on the Left really have no agenda, and no policy alternatives superior to Trump's and are banking your expected "Blue Wave" victory this Fall on nothing else but raw hatred for the Man.

You may win with that strategy and you may also get your clocks cleaned (my point) but your inability to answer me I think makes my point loud and clear. Your diatribe against Trump also in post # 60 is proof of how much hatred you harbor against him, and you actually think most folks agree with you about him or at least that's your sincere hope and desire. In reality you have nothing else to defeat him with, so your irrational , deranged & uncontrollable hatred and rage against him simply boils over while your ineffective policy alternatives to his policy record of success remain as dry as an Arabian desert on a warm midsummer night.

I'm still waiting for those answers to the questions I asked you my Man, or you can serenade us with more vicious vile and hatred for Trump's unacceptable immoral behavior and rampant sexual promiscuity in this age of moral purity and sexual virginity among our elected leaders.

Anyway, thanks for helping me make my point! Carry on @Bulya

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

Don't come on here and demean the Prersident and call yourself DevilDog. If it wasn't for Trump our military would look like the Cuban army. Vets would still be dying in the streets. Food stanps and welfare would be double and Obama and Hillary would have sold us out to the highest bidder. You liberals are sick. And your no DevilDog

Haha, good lord. I’m one of the ones that can separate the man from the policy, doofus. I do th have to like him to like his policies. I don’t like him, I love a lot of his policies.

 

[atlkvb]

Haha, good lord. I’m one of the ones that can separate the man from the policy, doofus. I do th have to like him to like his policies. I don’t like him, I love a lot of his policies.

DvlDog, I'm trying to make a point in this thread that the Left can't win these midterms simply on pure hatred of Trump. My point is they're using hatred of him to try and defeat his effective policies (which is their main objective) because they are incapable of offering voters this Fall superior or more effective policy alternatives.

I understand you disagree with my hypothesis, but explain to me why I'm wrong?

Case in point: The Left believes Obama was rejected by voters because of their racial hatred of him, when I'd submit his failed policies were the main reason he was ultimately rejected. Same with Hillary. She was intensely disliked no doubt about that, but she also failed to match Trump's legislative agenda...so despite the fact voters weren't all that enamored with Trump's personality and moral shortcomings such as yourself, they nevertheless still voted for him due to his superior policy objectives over Hillary's and the Left. They're now judging him based on the results of those policies, and the Left has nothing better to offer which I why I'm predicting they're going to get wiped out in these midterms.

So again, where am I wrong in my analysis of why they (Leftist Democrats) will face another demoralizing defeat this Fall?

 

[atlkvb]

To @Bulya (I shouldn't do this because I wanted you to see for yourself) but I'm more anxious to make my point. So, I've linked here to the latest data on who's paying the taxes? My question to you in post #55 still stands, (you can at least look through the data and answer me) but more importantly I want you to tell me how much more of this tax burden should the so called "rich" be paying? Especially the 'super rich' (top 1%) which if you look at the data I'm providing for you here shows they pay as a percentage much higher rates than everyone else!

So how much more do we tax them? Is that a winning formula for voters? Income redistribution? Does that prove your point they aren't taxed enough, aren't paying enough? Should be paying more? How much more?

I know you're on the Left, and doing things for yourself is anathema to your "MO" but instead of being a whinny little complainer about Trump grabbing a little ***** on the side why don't you engage me and make your case for higher taxation of the rich? Let's see who can convince voters what's better for them?

Stop being such a wimp and answer these Damn questions OK Dude?

Here's the link 'ya lazy Leftist
https://taxfoundation.org/summary-federal-income-tax-data-2017/

excerpt:
In 2015, the top 50 percent of all taxpayers paid 97.2 percent of all individual income taxes while the bottom 50 percent paid the remaining 2.8 percent.

 

[Bulya]

To @Bulya (I shouldn't do this because I wanted you to see for yourself) but I'm more anxious to make my point. So, I've linked here to the latest data on who's paying the taxes? My question to you in post #55 still stands, (you can at least look through the data and answer me) but more importantly I want you to tell me how much more of this tax burden should the so called "rich" be paying? Especially the 'super rich' (top 1%) which if you look at the data I'm providing for you here shows they pay as a percentage much higher rates than everyone else!

So how much more do we tax them? Is that a winning formula for voters? Income redistribution? Does that prove your point they aren't taxed enough, aren't paying enough? Should be paying more? How much more?

I know you're on the Left, and doing things for yourself is anathema to your "MO" but instead of being a whinny little complainer about Trump grabbing a little ***** on the side why don't you engage me and make your case for higher taxation of the rich? Let's see who can convince voters what's better for them?

Stop being such a wimp and answer these Damn questions OK Dude?

Here's the link 'ya lazy Leftist
https://taxfoundation.org/summary-federal-income-tax-data-2017/

excerpt:
In 2015, the top 50 percent of all taxpayers paid 97.2 percent of all individual income taxes while the bottom 50 percent paid the remaining 2.8 percent.

Man you got WAY too much free time I wake up and get online and you've fired away countless responses since I told you I was taking the rest of the day off. I applaud your energy and enthusiasm however you lost me on the numbered post thing I guess I never noticed this number thing the only numbers I watch are revenue, expenses and gross profit. Speaking of numbers how's that tax cut doing for government revenues? Add to that a massive budget increase(what happened to Repubs small government) and Trumpster is piling on the debt faster than Obama did when he had to bail out Wall Street, Banking and Insurance groups when he took over. Everyone seems to forget we were in the middle of a very nice recovery in Jan 2017 when Dotard walked in so the credit needs shared he was handed the keys to a smooth running economy and has kept it going though his trade wars will bite certain industries in the ***. I'm all in for a trade war with China but not Europe and Mexico/Canada who are actually our allies which he has yet to grasp preferring to love on dictators like Vlad and Little Rocket Man. F*ck China and if he had balls he'd have recognized Taiwan and he'd stop China's illegal expansion in the South China Seas but none of our Presidents have had the balls to do it.

Back to economics I read your link one issue it doesn't say what the income line is for "the top 50%" show me that number is it 30K or 75K or 100K then we can actually judge who is paying what. I look forward to your Encyclopedia Britannica amount of replies!

 

[Bulya]

To @Bulya (I shouldn't do this because I wanted you to see for yourself) but I'm more anxious to make my point. So, I've linked here to the latest data on who's paying the taxes? My question to you in post #55 still stands, (you can at least look through the data and answer me) but more importantly I want you to tell me how much more of this tax burden should the so called "rich" be paying? Especially the 'super rich' (top 1%) which if you look at the data I'm providing for you here shows they pay as a percentage much higher rates than everyone else!

So how much more do we tax them? Is that a winning formula for voters? Income redistribution? Does that prove your point they aren't taxed enough, aren't paying enough? Should be paying more? How much more?

I know you're on the Left, and doing things for yourself is anathema to your "MO" but instead of being a whinny little complainer about Trump grabbing a little ***** on the side why don't you engage me and make your case for higher taxation of the rich? Let's see who can convince voters what's better for them?

Stop being such a wimp and answer these Damn questions OK Dude?

Here's the link 'ya lazy Leftist
https://taxfoundation.org/summary-federal-income-tax-data-2017/

excerpt:
In 2015, the top 50 percent of all taxpayers paid 97.2 percent of all individual income taxes while the bottom 50 percent paid the remaining 2.8 percent.

I found the number I was looking for the the Top 50% comprise people earning over $39,275! Wow those people making $40K are "rich" in your eyes? You're on crack if you think anyone is "Rich" in 2017 earning $40K especially if they got mouths to feed. Instead of you driving yourself nuts trying to teach me something GIVE UP I'll be 53 in a few weeks my mind ain't changing you have your beliefs and I have reality. Banging heads with you guys on the off topic board is a huge waste of my time so I'm sticking to the Blue Lot save your rebuttals I won't be reading them! Last thing I'm not "Rich" me and my family live comfortably but also live below our means my only goals are to educate my kids so they succeed in life and that I can retire one day and travel and enjoy life including WVU sports. Now go make your quota and finish the year strong!

 

[dave]

I'm a leftist and I'm winning! Own 2 small businesses soon to be 3 which will have over $5 Million in revenue combined and a nice net profit. And yes I'll use some of that net to help the poor and indigent on top of my taxes I pay the government. The American Dream isn't just Greed it is also helping fellow citizens who need it not all are "leeches" as your side loves to claim.

If you were not a moro....I mean leftist....youd make 10 million.

 

[atlkvb]

I found the number I was looking for the the Top 50% comprise people earning over $39,275! Wow those people making $40K are "rich" in your eyes? You're on crack if you think anyone is "Rich" in 2017 earning $40K especially if they got mouths to feed. Instead of you driving yourself nuts trying to teach me something GIVE UP I'll be 53 in a few weeks my mind ain't changing you have your beliefs and I have reality. Banging heads with you guys on the off topic board is a huge waste of my time so I'm sticking to the Blue Lot save your rebuttals I won't be reading them! Last thing I'm not "Rich" me and my family live comfortably but also live below our means my only goals are to educate my kids so they succeed in life and that I can retire one day and travel and enjoy life including WVU sports. Now go make your quota and finish the year strong!

I'm not picking on you @Bulya , but didn't you say in one of the other posts with me that you made like a million dollars? It doesn't matter. I went the extra step and provided the numbers I asked you to look up hoping to guide you and you still don't see it?

That's fine. You said something that is so true that my very wise and late Father once told me and I never forgot it.

Instead of you driving yourself nuts trying to teach me something GIVE UP I'll be 53 in a few weeks my mind ain't changing

Pop's exact words were "Son, you can't talk grown folks out of anything once their mind on it is made up, so don't even try" The longer I live @Bulya the more true Dad's advice was and you just gave me further proof of his timeless wisdom and your own myopia when it comes to taxes who pays them. I'll honor your request and drop the conversation, you can't teach an "old dog" new tricks.

 

[TarHeelEer]

 

[atlkvb]

Why not everything else Socialists offer is?

 

[Keyser76]

No we can't, it is the beginning of Karl Roves vision, lol.

 

[JWG66]

You make up about 5% of the actual voter.

Funny, I was thinking the same thing. Many simply decide to vote on like ability. Which is why I wish our Prez was less bombastic/sarcastic. And had never met Karen or Stormy.