UK Cheerleading Cleaning House

[cat_in_the_hat]

As they should. These aren't minors we are talking about when dealing with college kids. And if they are in college, there definitely exist a mental capacity to know right from wrong. At a certain point, they have to be held responsible for their own actions. Just because 1 adult is older than the others doesn't mean they have to be the babysitter.

I don't think that's true for school sponsored activities. If someone dies and gets badly hurt, you better believe a parent will hold the school accountable, whether they are adults or not. Not to mention, why would a school want to be associated with that kind of behavior during school sponsored events or other events that student representatives of the school travel to? I'm not saying everyone should have been fired. Maybe it could have been handled differently, maybe not. It's hard to judge if you don't work with the people every day. But something should have been done to put a stop to that kind of behavior at events attended by that team, or any other team that acts like that.

 

[BlueVelvetFog]

Have you ever watched Joey Chestnut or Kobayashi? That takes athleticism too.

You feel threatened by cheerleading. Got it

 

[Mojocat_rivals48469]

Seriously, college students, drinking, going half naked, chanting lewd phrases during off campus activities and Mitch opts to take the harshest form of discipline possible against the coaches?... Mitch taints all of this with a knee jerk overreaction which is disproportionate to the alleged transgressions...These coaches are now forced to wear a “Scarlett Letter” because of Mitch Barnhart’s outrageous over reprimand. There were certainly other less drastic disciplinary options to be employed besides firing these coaches which Mitch knew would be made public along with the “investigative report.”. Despite the fact that UK cheerleaders have been behaving just like other UK students have for decades, Mitch chooses to publicly shame the team and the coaches with this outrageous over discipline. Shame on Mitch for his gross abuse of discretion and his holier than thou, intolerant attitude about college life.

and

Mitch gonna Mitch

but the report says

"UK released the report of the investigation by the Office of Student Conduct and Office of Institution Equity and Equal Opportunity, which found that Head Coach Jomo Thompson, Assistant Coaches Ben Head, Spencer Clan and Kelsey LaCroix, and longtime program advisor T. Lynn Williamson failed to provide reasonable oversight during these events, which put team members at risk."

and Jones says:

"Besides losing the Coach, the biggest change to UK Cheerleading will be how it is administered They used to be their own thing and their own supervision...now they will be under UK Athletics and Mitch Barnhart/Sandy Bell. That will be a MAJOR change."

EDIT: So I'm seeing below that Barnhart did play a role in this - which means my point above is both out of line and wrong. Apologies to the two posters I quote.

 

[Blueaz]

and

but the report says

"UK released the report of the investigation by the Office of Student Conduct and Office of Institution Equity and Equal Opportunity, which found that Head Coach Jomo Thompson, Assistant Coaches Ben Head, Spencer Clan and Kelsey LaCroix, and longtime program advisor T. Lynn Williamson failed to provide reasonable oversight during these events, which put team members at risk."

and Jones says:

"Besides losing the Coach, the biggest change to UK Cheerleading will be how it is administered They used to be their own thing and their own supervision...now they will be under UK Athletics and Mitch Barnhart/Sandy Bell. That will be a MAJOR change."

Sum: I'm having a hard time seeing Barnhart's fingerprints on this anywhere. It's almost like people have a particular rant, and just hit play every once in a while.....

yep...
but he did play a part, but after....
"Athletics Director Mitch Barnhart made the decision to discharge the cheerleading head coach and remove the assistant coaches from any association with the program consistent with the conclusions of multiple reports, including those by the Office of Institutional Equity and Equal Opportunity, by the Office of Student Conduct, and a jointly authored report that included input from an expert outside UK with expertise in employment law."

 

[Lead Belly]

I don't think that's true for school sponsored activities. If someone dies and gets badly hurt, you better believe a parent will hold the school accountable, whether they are adults or not. Not to mention, why would a school want to be associated with that kind of behavior during school sponsored events or other events that student representatives of the school travel to? I'm not saying everyone should have been fired. Maybe it could have been handled differently, maybe not. It's hard to judge if you don't work with the people every day. But something should have been done to put a stop to that kind of behavior at events attended by that team, or any other team that acts like that.

Once any prosecutor realizes the alcohol wasn't provided by the school or representative of the school, it's going to be really hard to hold them accountable. Not to mention the student-athlete was a legal adult who voluntarily consumed the alcohol, aware of the risks. And they were actually told not to consume it by the coaches. They admitted that in their statements.

I am not saying the school wants to be associated with it, but think there are many more actions that could have been taken to curb the inappropriate activites while also keeping the staff. Let's not act like this was some major scandal of events outside of normal college behavior. I've seen worse **** on State st after a big UK win.

 

[ok-cats-computer]

as well they should be...in fact they should be trying to find video evidence.

seriously, and not you...
but man...some posters love to run with one point of view, because they read an article. and they will die on that hill defending their pov.

Agreed! If no video evidence can be found, perhaps an extremely accurate reenactment with the exact same level of clothing could be staged by the cheerleaders to make sure we all have a good understanding of the relevant facts. Of course, this would be done exclusively to gauge the integrity of the investigative report. I'd be willing to generously donate my time by watching the reenactment and any video evidence, because I care and am a charitable person.

 

[Blueaz]

Agreed! If no video evidence can be found, perhaps an extremely accurate reenactment with the exact same level of clothing could be staged by the cheerleaders to make sure we all have a good understanding of the relevant facts. Of course, this would be done exclusively to gauge the integrity of the investigative report. I'd be willing to generously donate my time by watching the reenactment and any video evidence, because I care and am a charitable person.

could you take some video evidence of the reenactment?

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

Once any prosecutor realizes the alcohol wasn't provided by the school or representative of the school, it's going to be really hard to hold them accountable. Not to mention the student-athlete was a legal adult who voluntarily consumed the alcohol, aware of the risks. And they were actually told not to consume it by the coaches. They admitted that in their statements.

I am not saying the school wants to be associated with it, but think there are many more actions that could have been taken to curb the inappropriate activites while also keeping the staff. Let's not act like this was some major scandal of events outside of normal college behavior. I've seen worse **** on State st after a big UK win.

I'm not completely disagreeing with you, but it doesn't matter whether it's normal college behavior or what goes on on State Street after a win. This is no different than the basketball team, debate team, etc, when they travel. There is a certain standard of behavior that is expected from any team representing UK, or any school, at an event, or school sponsored activity. Coaches are expected to make sure those standards of behavior are met and enforced. When they don't, there has to be consequences. This reaction may have been too severe, but since we don't know the history with these coaches and internal discussions over the years, it's hard to say one way or the other. But I get why you say this could be an over reaction and could have been handled less severely. Perhaps this has been an on-going problem though and this was the straw that broke the camel's back. We just don't know.

 

[ok-cats-computer]

could you take some video evidence of the reenactment?

Absolutely. For historical purposes only. [laughing]

 

[L]

Lol, no, according to the article some of it has been going on since the 70's. Some of the incidents they were fired for occured back in 2017 and 2018. Outrage culture at its finest on display.

So, it has been going on since the 70's and they just now found out?

 

[Lead Belly]

So, it has been going on since the 70's and they just now found out?

Not all of it, but they said the hazing cheer they were doing originated in the 70's, but the lake retreat activities had evidently being going on for several years as well. So it has been going on a while for UK to suddenly be so up in arms over it.

 

[Lead Belly]

I'm not completely disagreeing with you, but it doesn't matter whether it's normal college behavior or what goes on on State Street after a win. This is no different than the basketball team, debate team, etc, when they travel. There is a certain standard of behavior that is expected from any team representing UK, or any school, at an event, or school sponsored activity. Coaches are expected to make sure those standards of behavior are met and enforced. When they don't, there has to be consequences. This reaction may have been too severe, but since we don't know the history with these coaches and internal discussions over the years, it's hard to say one way or the other. But I get why you say this could be an over reaction and could have been handled less severely. Perhaps this has been an on-going problem though and this was the straw that broke the camel's back. We just don't know.

That is why I think you reprimand the players and obviously voice concerns to the coach to clean it up. The players are the rule breakers though, even by their own admissions the coaches told them no alcohol and not to consume any from other people while on the trips. The students snuck it in.

From what I know, which isn't a ton, the cheer staff had a really good reputation. It seems out of character to just up and fire them all over this. Maybe there is more to it, but if so, no one is corroborating it so far.

 

[LadyCaytIL]

congrats SJW society.. you are ruining college. 20 years ago we just referred to this stuff as the weekend... lol

 

[Monroe Claxton]

Pics or it didn't happen.

Every time Mitch and Doctor Capilouto look at the pictures they get more disgusted

 

[FrankUnderwood]

Yawn

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

congrats SJW society.. you are ruining college. 20 years ago we just referred to this stuff as the weekend... lol

I'm not buying that. I was in college in the 80s and if you didn't meet the behavior standards on a team trip, you were in trouble and so was the coach who was responsible for maintaining those standards.

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

That is why I think you reprimand the players and obviously voice concerns to the coach to clean it up. The players are the rule breakers though, even by their own admissions the coaches told them no alcohol and not to consume any from other people while on the trips. The students snuck it in.

From what I know, which isn't a ton, the cheer staff had a really good reputation. It seems out of character to just up and fire them all over this. Maybe there is more to it, but if so, no one is corroborating it so far.

I agree that the team members should also be reprimanded. It's not all on the coaches.

 

[LadyCaytIL]

I'm not buying that. I was in college in the 80s and if you didn't meet the behavior standards on a team trip, you were in trouble and so was the coach who was responsible for maintaining those standards.

its always been that way.......... but here's the thing...... people didnt snitch unless there were rapes or serious harm. because kids are gonna be kids and often that involves sex and booze

 

[bigblueinsanity_rivals250340]

Judging by some of their tweets, seems like they contest any notion there was hazing.

Did the investigation ever reveal where the information came from? What source(s) were strong enough to warrant this type of action? Seems it would need nearly undisputable evidence.

 

[bbnkat02]

What was the conflict of interest though? They hired D1 cheerleaders from their team to help coach cheer and gymnastics in their gyms. Why would you not hire them when they are among the most qualified and able?

Who gives a **** who you hire to mow your yard and paint. As long as they were being given the option and compensated fairly, I fail to see the conflict of interest issue.

Doesn’t matter if you fail to see the COI. Doesn’t matter if we all fail to see it. I’m somewhat inclined to agree with you, but we aren’t the employer here. UK is.

Each company/entity determines its own. I’m sure whenever they were hired they signed a contract and I’m sure they were told what the terms were.

And I’m sure each violation on its own would’ve been probably no fuss. But together? It’s a bad look for the university. And as I said earlier. It’s all about optics.

 

[bbnkat02]

You make a persuasive argument. However, I don't think it is realistic to expect coaches to tell alumni that they can't drink on a private boat at the lake. I wouldn't expect Coach Stoops to patrol the parking lot at Commonwealth Stadium and confront any tailgaters that he saw drinking a beer on game day. Arguably, it's a bigger problem that we all know some alumni are drinking in the parking lot of Commonwealth Stadium on game day, because that happens on school property as opposed to a privately owned boat at the lake.

I'm also not sure that it is an impermissible conflict of interest for the cheerleading coaches to pay students to work with kids at a cheerleading business. Seems similar to Coach Cal hiring basketball players to work at the Father/Son Camps every summer. I think UK gets a cut of the money generated by Coach Cal's Father/Son Camps. I wonder if the biggest "sin" committed by the cheerleading coaches was not giving a portion of the money from the cheerleading business to UKAA/Mitch.

Again, I’m playing Devil’s Advocate. The employer here is UK. What they say goes.

And obviously anyone would have trouble telling the alumni, especially former group alumni, what they can and can’t do on their own property and in public.

I’m sure Mitch is getting an earful from the cheerleading alum and financial supporters.
Not saying he’s right or wrong in this situation.

 

[Dr. H Lecter]

You feel threatened by cheerleading. Got it

Interesting take. Not a very bright one but interesting none the less.

 

[USMC Cat_rivals309254]

Agreed! If no video evidence can be found, perhaps an extremely accurate reenactment with the exact same level of clothing could be staged by the cheerleaders to make sure we all have a good understanding of the relevant facts. Of course, this would be done exclusively to gauge the integrity of the investigative report. I'd be willing to generously donate my time by watching the reenactment and any video evidence, because I care and am a charitable person.

I for one will be upset if no video evidence is found of this naked tomfoolery.

 

[JBHolmesfan]

I haven’t read the full report, but in the age where sexual assault has been a problem on campuses and with some schools trying to cover it up (MSU) I’m glad UK took a harder stance.

I don’t know how bad what happened was. I don’t think anyone should be going to jail based on what I’ve read, but I’m sure UK is doing everything they can to put their foot down and make sure nothing worse happens than what happened.

 

[Poetax]

That’s some UL level stuff there

They didn't rent a dorm room and do it. What kids do at the Lake, should stay at the Lake.

 

[Rupp'sRunt]

As long as the cheerleaders are attractive thats all that really counts in my book anyways.

 

[Beatle Bum]

Are they going to take our banners down?

 

[anon_q409idbs5m40a]

Is this supposed to be news? Anyone that knew any cheerleaders knows the co-ed squads all just bang out. The cheerleaders were doing this when I was there back in 2006. And from I understand this is the regular culture within cheerleading everywhere.

Happened when I was in school in the late '70's-early '80's. I had a friend that was an alternate on the squad and he had some very interesting stories about their "training sessions".

 

[Beatle Bum]

Does this open the door for Rick Pitino to return to UK?

 

[IHATEUAVEL]

Does this open the door for Rick Pitino to return to UK?

HELL NO

 

[Mojocat_rivals48469]

yep...
but he did play a part, but after....
"Athletics Director Mitch Barnhart made the decision to discharge the cheerleading head coach and remove the assistant coaches from any association with the program consistent with the conclusions of multiple reports, including those by the Office of Institutional Equity and Equal Opportunity, by the Office of Student Conduct, and a jointly authored report that included input from an expert outside UK with expertise in employment law."

Didn't see that - so my response was out of line. I'll edit it. Thanks for the info.

 

[L]

According to KSR "a family member of a UK cheerleader contacted a faculty member". I find that odd. Why didn't the family member go to Mitch Barnhartt? Why a faculty member? If this has been going on since the 70's, no member of cheer team or no parent of cheer team brought this to the attention of UK administration? Something seems "off" about this story.

 

[Blueaz]

Didn't see that - so my response was out of line. I'll edit it. Thanks for the info.

No not out of line. It’s looks like MB was last in line and followed the findings and recommended actions of those groups. I doesn’t seem like he was police, DA, judge, jury and just the executioner

 

[drawing_dead]

Judging by some of their tweets, seems like they contest any notion there was hazing.

Did the investigation ever reveal where the information came from? What source(s) were strong enough to warrant this type of action? Seems it would need nearly undisputable evidence.

while not confirmed, i have it on good authority that their name is Karen...

 

[RunninRichie]

ok

 

[notFromhere]

you should change your avatar, please.

..whyyyy....?

 

[WGtripod69]

Several from the squad are speaking out against the decision.

 

[notFromhere]

. I get it but ill be honest I expected to read much worse.

UL has had that effect on everyone.

 

[notFromhere]

OP is the KING of starting threads on stuff that already exists. At this point, I think he is doing it on purpose.

Well, until somebody does it better

 

[notFromhere]

The cheerleaders for our school, which have been the most dominate for 2 decades, have a major situation come up during a time when there is basically nothing else to discuss sports related and you don't understand why?

Some don't understand the level of athleticism cheerleading requires because they still think of them as the cheerleaders of the 50s