OT: MLB 2020 Season Proposal
- Thread starter Tango Two
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Actually a terrible propsal by MLPA. Dumbest thing I have seen.
Agree with @mikebal9, this proposal is a nonstarter. Players are demanding prorated salaries. Play 114 games, get paid 114/162 of your contract. Owners are demanding players accept a 50% share of a greatly decreased revenue pool. Players view this as the first step to a salary cap. They will die on that hill.
If they can’t start the season before late July, a large amount of sports fans won’t care because high school, college, and NFL camps and season are on the way.
The most interesting part about this entire debate, to me, is that these people are clearly too stupid or too arrogant to realize that they are about to kill their sport. People are in a very unique position right now where they're learning they don't need sports to survive. Baseball, an already dying sport, had a chance to be the first back to remind them how great sports can be, and instead has chosen to fight over money in the short term instead of seeing the lasting effects of missing a season. If they don't play this year, millions of fans will be lost. This could very well be the beginning of the end for baseball.
You do have to wonder if their heads are in the sand. TV ratings for the playoffs are nothing compared to what they used to be. It used to be if a fans team didn’t make the World Series, everyone would still watch. Now once their team is out, they just switch to football, basketball, or hockey. Have had three nephews play youth baseball the last 15 or so years. The number of teams and the number of kids on youth teams has gone down in staggering numbers. You used to see kids just playing by themselves with six or seven kids. Now you drive by beautiful fields completely empty all Summer. Kids have poured into sports like lacrosse and hockey or they just sit home getting fat eating potato chips playing stupid video games. I won’t say the sport is dead , but they just don’t seem to get what is going on. It really started to hit me a while back, but you would think the empty seats in playoff games and the declining TV numbers would be enough for the owners and players. At some point, the advertisers and TV networks are going to turn the faucet off.
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I love baseball but I've learned I don't need it. There's plenty of other things to do that are more rewarding or meaningful. The owners that are playing games with minor leaguers are the worst to me. Cutting a percentage of what they are currently getting just to save thousands of dollars is ridiculous. And the players need to get their heads out of the sand with their ridiculous financial demands.
They all can take a leap as far as I'm concerned.
They all can take a leap as far as I'm concerned.
IDK. I remember hearing that same argument 26 years ago, when the 1994 WS was cancelled due to a players strike. Baseball came back stronger than ever. Of course the steroid-enhanced performances of the likes of McGwire, Sosa, and later Bonds had something to do with that.
I think baseball is in a very different, and much more precarious, position than it was 26 years ago.
In these instances, my bias is always in favor of the players. They reached agreement with the owners in March that when baseball was resumed, their salaries would be prorated. The players believe that the owners are reneging on this agreement. The owners claim that the agreement contains an exception clause in the event of games being played in closed stadiums. Not sure anyone other than the involved parties have actually seen this March agreement, so who knows.
The fact is that revenue sharing = salary cap. As I mentioned previously, the players will die on that hill. Or at least they say they will. I guess we'll all know soon enough.
The fact is that revenue sharing = salary cap. As I mentioned previously, the players will die on that hill. Or at least they say they will. I guess we'll all know soon enough.
I don't know if I'm in the minority here, but I think the players need to give on this for one season. I get the 50/50 revenue split wasn't going to fly and am not in favor of a salary cap, but if the owners are losing ~40% of their revenue, there needs to be some understanding that you can't keep your largest expense on a per game basis the same. Obviously some game day expenses are reduced as will the cost of traveling with the fewer number of games. Maybe they can figure out the savings from those things and then split the difference so each side is sacrificing something.
The thing is that in labor negotiations, there's no such thing as "we'll give in just this once". Once a precedent is established, the negotiating landscape is changed permanently.
Owners are in the right on this one. I believe the public (via social media) has already made this decision. Players look really bad so far.
Something that was really surprising to me is that many of the kids, outside of playing, don’t follow the sport. They might go to one or two Phillies, Yankees, or Mets games a year with their family, but they don’t read about, watch many games on TV, collect cards, etc. The MLB players better wake up about this, along with the owners. As I said before, they just don’t seem to get what is very obvious about the sport in general.
The other problem is that the owners refuse to be transparent and open their books to see what the true revenue impact is.
As much as I love baseball, I do not give a crap about how much millionaires and billionaires will lose and would rather stick the dagger in themselves rather than compromise.
No, you're not. It's driving me crazy not having baseball.
I absolutely loved baseball growing up. It was my first true love and the only bond I had with my father. We spent hours every day watching, talking, and playing baseball. But now, not so much.
1. The game has changed. Launch angle and starting pitchers going 5 or 6 innings has completely ruined the strategy of the game for me. It's all strikeout or homerun. There is no action.
2. The prices are getting out of control. I have two boys. For the four of us to go to a game and sit where they can see, it's really not realistic. We used to go to over 10 games a year.
3. Minor leaguers and game day staff are being cut completely and millionaires aren't willing to take a pay cut.
4. Billionaire owners are saying they're losing money? Open your books and prove it.
5. It's time for a reset like in 07 when the housing market burst. Get ticket prices back to affordable levels and stop paying these guys $20mil a year. Should they make a mil? Sure. 10 mil? Maybe the best players. But 20-30mil a year? That's why we can't afford to attend.
A
anon_ivydyf0amkzay
Guest
I’m sure you’re not the only one but many of us would not lose a nanosecond of sleep if 2020 was completely canceled. My only reminder of baseball is this thread and mostly visited for its entertainment value! The ONLY sport I’d miss would be college football...the rest can simply go away if it must.
I’d like to see it come back but the two sides appear far apart.
Owners will never open the books. Why should they? Are players willing to absorb any financial losses?
If not then this may not be easy.
Owners will never open the books. Why should they? Are players willing to absorb any financial losses?
If not then this may not be easy.
What a great post, Mike. I have always loved baseball, but never less than I do now.
The baseball I enjoy most now is local high schools when they are playing "speed it up" rules (I don't know the real name for it). Less batting glove tightening, crotch-grabbing, lengthy rituals between every pitch, and a wider array of skills on display than homers and Ks. They're just amateurs, but it's good enough for me...
My somewhat contrarian thoughts:
- Yes, over the last few years the game has changed - a lot. Whether those changes are for better or worse is a matter of personal taste. But there's no evidence that the popularity of the game has suffered at all. By and large, I think fans like scoring and they like the long ball. I believe strongly that it was the steroid-induced long ball that saved baseball after the 1994 strike.
- Major league baseball is not overpriced. The seats you want may be overpriced, but the cost of getting into the stadium is very reasonable. You can get into many Met games for $15. You can get into some for $10. And then they run promotions which make it even cheaper. You're not going to get into a football, hockey, or basketball game at anything close to that price. TBH, if you want to take your kids to a game and sit close to the action, I suggest you become a fan of the Somerset Patriots or whomever. Don't mean to sound snarky, that's just how it is.
- The millionaires are very willing to take a pay cut. They've already agreed to it. They're only going to get paid for games played. If half the season is gone, half their salary is gone. They're unwilling to take a bigger cut than that - especially since it will set precedent for future negotiations.
- As a customer of a privately-held business, what right have I to see that business's financial statements? Maybe the Players Association will be able to negotiate that right for themselves. Maybe they won't. But I don't expect them to include me.
- I don't believe that cost is the primary driver of the price of MLB tickets. I think demand is. Lowering payroll will not IMO lower ticket prices as long as people (or businesses) are willing to pay the current prices.
To quote the late great Jim Bouton, "For 100 years, the owners have screwed the players. For 25 years, the players have screwed the owners. They still have 75 years to go."
Agree and I'm starting to think the idiots owning and playing MLB are going to F up playing this season.
The IF defensive shift has really hurt the game too. No one wants to see a guy thrown out at first from shallow RF by a 2B or up from up the middle by a 3B.
Tell that to the fans in St. Louis, Boston, NY, LA....baseball fans still exist and love the game.
Baseball players should think long and hard (as well as the Union leaders) before drawing lines in the sand that further erode our National Passtime!
MO
Interesting counterproposal from an Atlanta Braves site. Not sure how legitimate it is since I haven't seen it anywhere else. Reportedly, the owners will accept the players demand for prorated salary and no revenue sharing. BUT they want to limit the season to 50 games.
This makes sense from the owners standpoint. (Well duh, that's why they proposed it.) They limit their salary expense with relatively little impact on game revenues since the stadiums won't be full. The postseason is where they make their TV money anyway.
Whether the players will go along with it remains to be seen. Whether the fans will accept it is another question. Is a 50 game season even legitimate? TBH I'd just as soon see them scrap it and come back in 2021.
And as mentioned, who knows if the report is even real.
https://www.talkingchop.com/2020/6/...op-labor-negotiations-gaining-traction-braves
This makes sense from the owners standpoint. (Well duh, that's why they proposed it.) They limit their salary expense with relatively little impact on game revenues since the stadiums won't be full. The postseason is where they make their TV money anyway.
Whether the players will go along with it remains to be seen. Whether the fans will accept it is another question. Is a 50 game season even legitimate? TBH I'd just as soon see them scrap it and come back in 2021.
And as mentioned, who knows if the report is even real.
https://www.talkingchop.com/2020/6/...op-labor-negotiations-gaining-traction-braves
I get that it's a good defensive strategy, but it is annoying to watch a perfectly hit ball be an out because a player is stationed in short RF. Seeing a bunt to counteract it is fun once in a while, but not multiple times a game. I wouldn't mind a rule that you can't have more than two guys on either side of second base, or if you did have more than two, they would all need to stay on the infield dirt.
Exactly, only two guys on one side of 2B on the IF. For this rule P and C don't count. Heck only two on one side in the OF too.
The IF shift is a major driver of the hitters only trying to hit a HR driving launch angle and exit velo. No one hits for hits anymore. Get rid of the IF shift and this boring swing for the fences will diminish and I'd expect we get back to guys hitting up the middle and in the gaps. (I hope)
All this offense in football is so boring.
Nobody cares about defense anymore.
Teams shouldn’t be allowed to overload the defense and put 3 WRs one side of the LOS.
Or teams shouldn’t be allowed to have 4 or 5 WRs on the field at the same point.
On the other side, defenses shouldn’t be allowed to play 8-9 men in the box.
It makes it too hard to run the ball and forces teams to pass.
Nobody cares about defense anymore.
Teams shouldn’t be allowed to overload the defense and put 3 WRs one side of the LOS.
Or teams shouldn’t be allowed to have 4 or 5 WRs on the field at the same point.
On the other side, defenses shouldn’t be allowed to play 8-9 men in the box.
It makes it too hard to run the ball and forces teams to pass.
It is annoying to watch a perfectly hit ball to the wall be caught because the OF was playing deep.
Or a perfectly hit ball up the middle turn into a double play because the SS was shading up the middle.
Or a perfectly hit ball down the line turned into an out because the 1st or 3rd baseman was protecting the line.
All players in the field should have to start in a designated box and not be allowed to move pre-pitch.
Sounds like a great approach to the game.....
The shift can disappear altogether if batters just hit or bunt the other way. It's an easy base. But everyone wants to hit the homer.
No better bang for your buck than high school sports. Most of the sports don’t even charge, and even then, you are looking at five dollars for football, hockey, wrestling, and basketball for regular season.
For me, 90 games is the minimum. Like I said before, they better start the season very soon because after all this Chinese corona lock down ends, I think people will welcome football back in a big way.
I know you are being sarcastic but there used to be more to football than watching WRs catch balls unmolested (or awarded the catch via a PI call) and then dance in the endzone. But you do you.
You're really knocking your straw men out of the park today.
Perhaps you'll understand the subtleties of our arguments sometime in the future. I'm not betting on it.
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