GAME 10 MICHIGAN STATE: ABOMINATION

bac2therac

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Jul 30, 2001
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Already checked out of the game with 10 minutes left. I have seen enough. We as fans are truly underserving of what an abomination we had to endure on the court. A hot stinky rancid egg of epic size. The was truly THE worst basketball I have witnessed since sometime in Pike's second year when I think we got brutalized by Illinois by 30. I get it, teams can have bad days and you move on. Obviously the close loss to Iowa was an issue for this team. That is why you need to win those that you are in because basketball can be cruel in different ways the next game. I truly believe that this team has been caught up in the hype of being top 15 or top 20 and we as fans have and tend to overlook the weaknesses of this team. Unfortunately this game virtually all our weaknesses were exposed so its becoming apparent if the shots are not following from our stars Ron, Geo, and JY, the whole thing collapses. Its sort of a dangerous tightrope to walk.

You could see from the first minute that Rutgers was totally out of sync. Go back to the beginning of the game thread, we were in awe and not in a good way of what we were witnessing. It was as if the team was playing with ants in the underwear. Playing at 150 mph, standing and watching instead of hustling on defense, ill advised passes and even more unfortunate fruitless drives you could see would be blocked from a mile away. Only some futility on Sparty's end and some occasional sparks from Jacob Young on defense causing a bevy of turnovers kept the lead only 6 instead of 20 at halftime. I had no confidence or indication that the 2nd half would be any better and it wasnt, in fact as many said they couldnt play any worse, they actually did.

Credit Izzo and Sparty for taking charge and blowing it out in the 2nd half, their D was solid but overall they did nothing out of the ordinary and this isnt a very good Michigan State team at all. What you saw in prior losses you saw tonight. The unfortunate part tonight isnt that RU played poorly, it was that they really never competed. It appeared that they thought they were better than the Spartans without having to prove yet they also showed they were scared of the script on the jersey. Let's face it, Pikiell had one of his worst coaching performances as well. He could not push any buttons or lineups to get RU in any rhythm and perhaps some ill advised lineups. I just think Pike now opening the rotation to others isnt helping RU's chemistry. Truly I am shocked at the amount of minutes and role that Pike is asking Caleb McConnell of playing right now. True no one was playing well but I think his role is not being defined by Pike. I also saw some just ridiculous plays for Mulcahy that should not be happening. I saw how Myles has become a zero on the offensive end. When that happens it makes everything just crumble and RU becomes quite easy to defend. Geo Baker, the excuses need to stop, he is over his injury, tonight as a leader and a player he was AWOL. Jacob Young couldnt hit an ocean in the 2nd half and his points in the first half were fools gold. Another one trying to do too much. Lets also stop the Harper to NBA this year talk. Yes he is very very good and he will bounce back probably in the next game but he disappeared tonight when we needed shots. Did I leave anyone out of my critique tonight? Oh yeah Mathis, out of control, early and sat some and got one in rhythm 3 but was generally terrible on both ends otherwise. Reiber too, well no his performance was poor as well

As I type this the lead ballooned from 11 to 20 and RU isnt even going to hit 50. I hope this is a serious reality check to the players that they better looked inside themselves on what their goals are and what kind of team they want to be. I wrote in other recaps that I liked a whole bunch of things their swagger and confidence and pluck but tonight I liked exactly ZERO of what they showed me tonight. This was not Rutgers basketball. This was very similar to the Ohio State game where the team completely imploded and shattered when adversity hit. With this happening now both times on the road, I am officially concerned about the mental makeup going forward and they better start nipping this in the bud. Ohio State now becomes a must win...no doubt about it. Iowa was winnable easily and they could not do it, okay no harm there, it happens but tonight was just unacceptable and now puts pressure on certain games becoming must wins before some serious unravelling of the seasong goes on.

We can all hope this was just a one off bad game, every school has one but deep down we know our deficiencies getting exposed look brutal. The free throw shooting is shameful. Let us not sugar coat. Team probably wasnt winning tonight but gee I dont know maybe a tie game at half where a team is scrapping to hang in there could have sparked something. The lead is up to 26 now...this team quit and ended the game with zero pride, it was worse than I thought when I started this recap. Absolutely abysmal losing 68-45. I could go on and on with the negatives but its time to wrap things up. I hope the team falls out of the rankings because its not helping, RU likely might hang on around 23-24 if they can beat Ohio State which is no given right now. 7-3 and now 3-3 its back to the drawing board and this team and coaching staff better to start working again because the cracks are showing.
 
A

anon_xekqhstck0ygt

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I just posted to you not to bother. I’ll read it tomorrow. You deserve the time it took.
 

bac2therac

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I just posted to you not to bother. I’ll read it tomorrow. You deserve the time it took.


haha, its not a great or my best recap, its just a bunch of negativity thrown out there.

Look I totally understand the Ohio State loss and could forgive the collapse, I was okay with the Iowa loss because it was a play or two but tonight I am dumbfounded and makes me question what is going on and opens my eyes to the flaws that were being well covered up
 
A

anon_xekqhstck0ygt

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wondering how much an effect McConnell returning has had ? He’s not ready to get these minutes. Zero points and no d. He’s rusty so not blaming him. Too many minutes

haha, its not a great or my best recap, its just a bunch of negativity thrown out there.

Look I totally understand the Ohio State loss and could forgive the collapse, I was okay with the Iowa loss because it was a play or two but tonight I am dumbfounded and makes me question what is going on and opens my eyes to the flaws that were being well covered up
 

RU848789

Heisman
Jul 27, 2001
65,228
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Already checked out of the game with 10 minutes left. I have seen enough. We as fans are truly underserving of what an abomination we had to endure on the court. A hot stinky rancid egg of epic size. The was truly THE worst basketball I have witnessed since sometime in Pike's second year when I think we got brutalized by Illinois by 30. I get it, teams can have bad days and you move on. Obviously the close loss to Iowa was an issue for this team. That is why you need to win those that you are in because basketball can be cruel in different ways the next game. I truly believe that this team has been caught up in the hype of being top 15 or top 20 and we as fans have and tend to overlook the weaknesses of this team. Unfortunately this game virtually all our weaknesses were exposed so its becoming apparent if the shots are not following from our stars Ron, Geo, and JY, the whole thing collapses. Its sort of a dangerous tightrope to walk.

You could see from the first minute that Rutgers was totally out of sync. Go back to the beginning of the game thread, we were in awe and not in a good way of what we were witnessing. It was as if the team was playing with ants in the underwear. Playing at 150 mph, standing and watching instead of hustling on defense, ill advised passes and even more unfortunate fruitless drives you could see would be blocked from a mile away. Only some futility on Sparty's end and some occasional sparks from Jacob Young on defense causing a bevy of turnovers kept the lead only 6 instead of 20 at halftime. I had no confidence or indication that the 2nd half would be any better and it wasnt, in fact as many said they couldnt play any worse, they actually did.

Credit Izzo and Sparty for taking charge and blowing it out in the 2nd half, their D was solid but overall they did nothing out of the ordinary and this isnt a very good Michigan State team at all. What you saw in prior losses you saw tonight. The unfortunate part tonight isnt that RU played poorly, it was that they really never competed. It appeared that they thought they were better than the Spartans without having to prove yet they also showed they were scared of the script on the jersey. Let's face it, Pikiell had one of his worst coaching performances as well. He could not push any buttons or lineups to get RU in any rhythm and perhaps some ill advised lineups. I just think Pike now opening the rotation to others isnt helping RU's chemistry. Truly I am shocked at the amount of minutes and role that Pike is asking Caleb McConnell of playing right now. True no one was playing well but I think his role is not being defined by Pike. I also saw some just ridiculous plays for Mulcahy that should not be happening. I saw how Myles has become a zero on the offensive end. When that happens it makes everything just crumble and RU becomes quite easy to defend. Geo Baker, the excuses need to stop, he is over his injury, tonight as a leader and a player he was AWOL. Jacob Young couldnt hit an ocean in the 2nd half and his points in the first half were fools gold. Another one trying to do too much. Lets also stop the Harper to NBA this year talk. Yes he is very very good and he will bounce back probably in the next game but he disappeared tonight when we needed shots. Did I leave anyone out of my critique tonight? Oh yeah Mathis, out of control, early and sat some and got one in rhythm 3 but was generally terrible on both ends otherwise. Reiber too, well no his performance was poor as well

As I type this the lead ballooned from 11 to 20 and RU isnt even going to hit 50. I hope this is a serious reality check to the players that they better looked inside themselves on what their goals are and what kind of team they want to be. I wrote in other recaps that I liked a whole bunch of things their swagger and confidence and pluck but tonight I liked exactly ZERO of what they showed me tonight. This was not Rutgers basketball. This was very similar to the Ohio State game where the team completely imploded and shattered when adversity hit. With this happening now both times on the road, I am officially concerned about the mental makeup going forward and they better start nipping this in the bud. Ohio State now becomes a must win...no doubt about it. Iowa was winnable easily and they could not do it, okay no harm there, it happens but tonight was just unacceptable and now puts pressure on certain games becoming must wins before some serious unravelling of the seasong goes on.

We can all hope this was just a one off bad game, every school has one but deep down we know our deficiencies getting exposed look brutal. The free throw shooting is shameful. Let us not sugar coat. Team probably wasnt winning tonight but gee I dont know maybe a tie game at half where a team is scrapping to hang in there could have sparked something. The lead is up to 26 now...this team quit and ended the game with zero pride, it was worse than I thought when I started this recap. Absolutely abysmal losing 68-45. I could go on and on with the negatives but its time to wrap things up. I hope the team falls out of the rankings because its not helping, RU likely might hang on around 23-24 if they can beat Ohio State which is no given right now. 7-3 and now 3-3 its back to the drawing board and this team and coaching staff better to start working again because the cracks are showing.
If we can't get healthy (with Geo possibly now retweaking his ankle, Cliff out and who knows if Harper and Young are 100%) quickly and start playing better together, the season could go south (i.e., less than 10 B1G wins and maybe being left out of the tourney, which I didn't think was possible even 4 days ago). Did you notice near the end, Mathis imploring JY to throw him the damn ball? And Myles pouting? This team needs to get its **** together and quickly. I was thinking we were going to pay OSU back big time, but now who knows?
 

bac2therac

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it makes not want to excuse the Ohio State meltdown because I am starting to wonder if this team would rather curl into a ball then fight...at least on the road
 

BOGDANOVICH

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The team has been exposed. They are not a top 25 team. They bought into their own hype and thought all they needed to do was to show up. Well, they didn't even show up. Instead they brought back unpleasant memories of all the Eddie Jordan noncompetitive losses.

It was good while it lasted, and it generated a lot of irrational exhuberance, but it looks like we were fooled again.
 
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It's why I had said on Saturday that it was a bad loss. They were up by enough in the 2nd half to put Iowa away , but got complacent and let it slip away

This conference is brutal, you need a killer instinct, cuz you're going to have clunkers like tonight on the road.

But no excuses for this no show effort tonight.
 
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bac2therac

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As bad as we played, Pike did absolutely zero to wake them up. I'm more disappointed in him. I know Izzo is a HOF'er, but the difference between he and Pike in game is night and day.


yes and in a game like this with MSU not confident coming in, you want to get off to a good start and not let them get their confidence, It was over after they got up 10 because this is a team that just got their confidence back and got better as the game wore on and RU decided to quit in the end
 

Joey Bags

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Worst performance by a top 15 team I’ve ever seen.

Pike needs to straighten out the rotation or we will lose the next 10.
 
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RUsojo

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@bac2therac good recap

I agree with everything other than the thinking that Geo is more important to this team than Montez Mathis.

Dude is 10th in scoring in the conference, always gives you D, and he got yanked early by Pike (deservedly, but go back to him sooner) while Mulcahy had a long leash of unproductive possessions especially offensively tonight and while McConnell just took up space (agree about his role, don’t get it).

It also seems Cliff is way more important to this team than we realized.
 
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bac2therac

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the last Mulcahy miss came AFTER the 11 minute timeout which makes me think Pike WAS all for Mulcahy and those shots...just terrible coaching IMO

Pike needs to define Caleb's roll and he is failing, its not just plugging in for Geo or Tez because Caleb has no shot right now and brings nothing on offense

What he should concentrate on is defense and passing where he can help the team
 
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Duff366

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wondering how much an effect McConnell returning has had ? He’s not ready to get these minutes. Zero points and no d. He’s rusty so not blaming him. Too many minutes

I'll give you Caleb's offense has been poor but he played pretty good defense, 3 steals, and had a few of his good hustle plays
 
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bac2therac

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and sometimes after bad losses like this one some may say being so negative is an overreaction....I DO NOT THINK ANY OF THIS IS OVERREACTION, ITS ACTUALLY AN EYE OPENING REALITY TO WHO WE ARE
 
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RUsojo

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Also, did anyone notice Young and Mathis not seeing eye to eye late in the game? Might’ve been Young thinking he had to put it on his back when down big and at the same time Mathis frustrated he only had 4 shots when everyone else but McConnell and Reiber had more with Paul the lowest at 7.
 

brookdale-soda

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it makes not want to excuse the Ohio State meltdown because I am starting to wonder if this team would rather curl into a ball then fight...at least on the road
I am also afraid the meltdown against Ohio st was the canary in the coal mine. I saw the same surrender halfway through the 2nd half. In this game. And no one could lead them out of it.
 
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bac2therac

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I am also afraid the meltdown against Ohio st was the canary in the coal mine. I saw the same surrender halfway through the 2nd half. In this game. And no one could lead them out of it.


I know there were tough circumstances in that game but I was shocked at absolutely no leadership and not one ounce of fight, look sometimes you have dig deep and in that game and in this game I saw the same things
 

RUsojo

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Unfortunate for us that Izzo moved off of Loyer for the first time this season with other options back at his disposal.
 
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IL Lusciato

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The team has been exposed. They are not a top 25 team. They bought into their own hype and thought all they needed to do was to show up. Well, they didn't even show up. Instead they brought back unpleasant memories of all the Eddie Jordan noncompetitive losses.

It was good while it lasted, and it generated a lot of irrational exhuberance, but it looks like we were fooled again.

BINGO.
 

winfield102

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Their star played well. No one on our team played well tonight. They had better athletes than us and we have no inside game. They suffocated us. In the 30 minutes I watched, we had no dunks. It just looked like everyone was trying to create their own shot and most of the shots were low percentage.

It's been 2-3 years since I've turned off a Rutgers game that early. Last year was impressive in that even when we lost everything was close. You would see other B1G teams get blown out occasionally.
 

RUsojo

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28 minutes for Mulcahy! and 22 for McConnell! 24 for Geo.

24 for Mathis 25 for Young smh

THIS IS VERY CONCERNING because this is more in line with Pikes minutes distribution at guard for the majority of last year when he had everyone at his disposal where he did not give Young and Mathis as many minutes as they have been gettting this year.

This cannot become a trend.
 
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Mr. Magoo1

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The team has been exposed. They are not a top 25 team. They bought into their own hype and thought all they needed to do was to show up. Well, they didn't even show up. Instead they brought back unpleasant memories of all the Eddie Jordan noncompetitive losses.

It was good while it lasted, and it generated a lot of irrational exhuberance, but it looks like we were fooled again.

you are correct. However, the talent is Top 25. The chemistry and coaching are sub-par right now.
 
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RUJMM78

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The flaws on this team with missed foul shots and unable to finish around the basket are demoralizing and not easy to correct.The morale of the team was down as shown on the faces of players.Basic execution of fundamentals was lacking and seemed the team wasn't prepared to play.Maybe it was the 9 pm start or just the fact that Rutgers can't defeat Michigan State.There is no question that Rutgers will fall in the rankings and my concern all along was winning enough games to earn a NCAA bid.A week ago there was no concern but now there better be with the coaching staff and players.The prior press clippings should be shredded .Its gut check time and there are no easy games when the offense is so inept.Hopefully,Baker has a quick recovery from another ankle sprain.
 

Scarlet Blind_rivals

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Sometimes Sh*t happens and nothing goes right. Doesn't mean Rutgers is a bad team or the season is over, Clunkers happen to everybody and players check out making it worse. #3 Kansas lost 84-59 AT HOME to #8 Texas. Does that make Kansas bad or season lost, NO. #15 RU 7-3 lost 68-45 @ #23 MSU 8-3

#3 Kansas 20-65 30.8% 3-23 3pt. 16-22 FT outrebounded 43-33, 6 ast to 11 TOs
#15 Rutgers 18-59 30.5% 3-12 3pt 6-17 FT outrebounded 46-25, 10 ast to 9 TOs

I think they are relying too much on their offensive identity and forgot what brought them to a top 25 level, Defense and Rebounding the last 4 games. Illinois score 91-88 should have been the first warning sign and the last time we out rebounded an opponent 35-34, Cliff hurt. Getting out rebounded by OSU 45-25, Purdue 33-31, Iowa 40-39 and MSU tonight, maybe JUST MAYBE Coach Pikiell wanted to teach them that lesson to get back to what got them there because the upperclassmen players were tuning him out last couple weeks about D and Rebounding which happens at all levels of basketball HS, College and NBA and this kind of game refocused them. The Cliff injury is hurting us more than we even know.
 
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PSAL_Hoops

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Mathis picked up a 3rd foul at the 17:25 mark of the second half. That’s why he played less minutes.

The bottom line is we stunk in half court offense no matter who played. The rebounding and defense was better with Caleb in there and that’s why he got those minutes. I agree that he should’ve played more with Young on the floor. And maybe Mathis too. Caleb needs to mostly play the 3 and hopefully once he can get one shot to fall down he’ll start to build confidence. He has a pretty nice mid range jumper. Needed to have our transition weapons in the game when we finally got some defensive stops.

Caleb, Paul and Geo should only be on the floor together at the end of a game we’re winning togo to the FT line.
 
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Shell21

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Mar 23, 2004
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Mathis picked up a 3rd foul at the 17:25 mark of the second half. That’s why he played less minutes.

The bottom line is we stunk in half court offense no matter who played. The rebounding and defense was better with Caleb in there and that’s why he got those minutes. I agree that he should’ve played more with Young on the floor. And maybe Mathis too. Caleb needs to mostly play the 3 and hopefully once he can get one shot to fall down he’ll start to build confidence. He has a pretty nice mid range jumper. Needed to have our transition weapons in the game when we finally got some defensive stops.

Caleb, Paul and Geo should only be on the floor together at the end of a game we’re winning togo to the FT line.
Agreed , Caleb needs to be on the floor with our better offensive players right now because he’s no threat yet. Defensively he’s been very good an active
 

JavaDunk18

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Tonight’s loss was by twice as many points as we lost by all of last year. Team/Fans ate not used to this, but a Revenge/Bounceback Is imperative. OSU is a must win! A victory at PennSt. a place where RU plays well, will put them back on track.
i think the subs played better than the starters. Even ‘Douc& Mag in closing minutes looked more confident.
Biggest problem of the team is missed free throws AND layups..
We will get MSU again at home. Fix these problems and we can win that one.
Unfortunately will Probably not be on prime time ESPN for country to see
Back to underdog roll, which should serve this team better in the long run..
 

NewJerseyHawk

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I want to laugh at the lengthy list of bad posts here, without any mention of what the stark reality is.....Michigan State has better players AND RU and it's entire staff decided to run it's offense into a team with better athletes in half court.

Bac....your recap is overwhelming bad, irrational and frankly, you and a bunch of fans saw Michigan State get beat in transition, miss a bunch of shots at Northwestern and Minnesota and immediately decided that those 2 games was the new normal of Michigan State.

You can only be so wrong. I don't have the time and energy to explain that Tom Izzo and Michigan State have done this to elite, good and a lot of teams in between on their own court. And yes, while Cassius Winston and Xavier Tillman moved on to the next level, many fans were fooled by the Northwestern and Minnesota games, thinking MSU would be somehow a sub .500 team.

They have 4* players or higher at almost every position and if it's not a 4* player, it a player specifically designed for the role in their system on either offense or defense. It's not a great MSU team that just overwhelmed teams with shooting and sheer power at the basket. But it's terrifying to see everyone saying this is a bunch of reasons all that are RUs fault....suddenly Caleb, a player we clearly need for the next 2 months, is the problem....or whatever else others mentioned here about minutes being distributed.....??

Here is the game summary for you and everyone else. RU does not have player for player the ability or athletic ability to decide to put their head down, take off with the ball and try to beat a Tom Izzo led defense, when they are already set on defense in the half court.

Steve Pikiell and the staff have now been scouted....and scouted again....and scouted some more as a ranked opponent....teams now know exactly what you run on offense and when teams are prepared, desperate and have success stopping what you want to run, it is up to the staff not the players to place new items, new plays run and RU for the 1st time, was forced to run it's half court offense for 40 minutes. And when the defense was there to take away the 1st or 2nd shot that was usually there against Cuse, Illinois, Ohio State or Iowa, the team needed to continue to run it's offense.

What you saw was a bunch of screens that were prepared for. And Pike needs to go back into the film room, into the breakdowns and convince this team that it has to actually run it's offense for all 25 or 20 seconds once they get across half court.

So when the team didn't see any success running their offense because Sparty was VERY prepared, the players knew it and decided to pressure the defense and had a LOT of success....RU forced so many turnovers but then panicked because they weren't having half court success and tried to make crazy down court passes to get a quick layup and got a couple, but either then went 1 on 2 or had others going faster to try and beat the defense....

When you have played a game like this, it happens......But it wasn't at Nebraska or at some other team that doesn't play tough defense. MSU smothered everything in half court and it is up to the staff, to break down the film, correct the mistakes and to change their sets or run their offense throughout whatever new sets they didn't run.

Sparty and Izzo were completely dialed in on defense. Pike will have to fix the offensive sets or go beyond whatever has been running and working.

Move onto Ohio State and correct the mistakes. Ohio State lost by 17 to Minnesota last week....is that what you expect them to do on Saturday at the RAC....their game at Penn State on Wednesday was postponed for covid19 either with them or Penn State. I assume they're going to play Saturday but don't overreact to this insanity that MSU was suddenly a bad team based on 2 games. Maybe RU came in overconfident watching those two games on tape...in any event, lesson learned and RU is still a Top 20 program....and despite many basketball fans trying to tell me MSU was done or wasn't a NCAA tournament team, nothing could be more wrong. RU played bad, but there’s no panic on my part, just strange and irrational fans believing Sparty was done based on 2 bad losses. RU now has 2 bad looking losses too....so I guess having 2 to 4 bad losses is the new panic button for fanbases.....

Welcome to the B1G folks, when you play a good or elite coaching staff almost every night and where the players on the other end of the court, are all able to beat you, if you don't play well.
 

biazza38

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I want to laugh at the lengthy list of bad posts here, without any mention of what the stark reality is.....Michigan State has better players AND RU and it's entire staff decided to run it's offense into a team with better athletes in half court.

Bac....your recap is overwhelming bad, irrational and frankly, you and a bunch of fans saw Michigan State get beat in transition, miss a bunch of shots at Northwestern and Minnesota and immediately decided that those 2 games was the new normal of Michigan State.

You can only be so wrong. I don't have the time and energy to explain that Tom Izzo and Michigan State have done this to elite, good and a lot of teams in between on their own court. And yes, while Cassius Winston and Xavier Tillman moved on to the next level, many fans were fooled by the Northwestern and Minnesota games, thinking MSU would be somehow a sub .500 team.

They have 4* players or higher at almost every position and if it's not a 4* player, it a player specifically designed for the role in their system on either offense or defense. It's not a great MSU team that just overwhelmed teams with shooting and sheer power at the basket. But it's terrifying to see everyone saying this is a bunch of reasons all that are RUs fault....suddenly Caleb, a player we clearly need for the next 2 months, is the problem....or whatever else others mentioned here about minutes being distributed.....??

Here is the game summary for you and everyone else. RU does not have player for player the ability or athletic ability to decide to put their head down, take off with the ball and try to beat a Tom Izzo led defense, when they are already set on defense in the half court.

Steve Pikiell and the staff have now been scouted....and scouted again....and scouted some more as a ranked opponent....teams now know exactly what you run on offense and when teams are prepared, desperate and have success stopping what you want to run, it is up to the staff not the players to place new items, new plays run and RU for the 1st time, was forced to run it's half court offense for 40 minutes. And when the defense was there to take away the 1st or 2nd shot that was usually there against Cuse, Illinois, Ohio State or Iowa, the team needed to continue to run it's offense.

What you saw was a bunch of screens that were prepared for. And Pike needs to go back into the film room, into the breakdowns and convince this team that it has to actually run it's offense for all 25 or 20 seconds once they get across half court.

So when the team didn't see any success running their offense because Sparty was VERY prepared, the players knew it and decided to pressure the defense and had a LOT of success....RU forced so many turnovers but then panicked because they weren't having half court success and tried to make crazy down court passes to get a quick layup and got a couple, but either then went 1 on 2 or had others going faster to try and beat the defense....

When you have played a game like this, it happens......But it wasn't at Nebraska or at some other team that doesn't play tough defense. MSU smothered everything in half court and it is up to the staff, to break down the film, correct the mistakes and to change their sets or run their offense throughout whatever new sets they didn't run.

Sparty and Izzo were completely dialed in on defense. Pike will have to fix the offensive sets or go beyond whatever has been running and working.

Move onto Ohio State and correct the mistakes. Ohio State lost by 17 to Minnesota last week....is that what you expect them to do on Saturday at the RAC....their game at Penn State on Wednesday was postponed for covid19 either with them or Penn State. I assume they're going to play Saturday but don't overreact to this insanity that MSU was suddenly a bad team based on 2 games. Maybe RU came in overconfident watching those two games on tape...in any event, lesson learned and RU is still a Top 20 program....and despite many basketball fans trying to tell me MSU was done or wasn't a NCAA tournament team, nothing could be more wrong. RU played bad, but there’s no panic on my part, just strange and irrational fans believing Sparty was done based on 2 bad losses. RU now has 2 bad looking losses too....so I guess having 2 to 4 bad losses is the new panic button for fanbases.....

Welcome to the B1G folks, when you play a good or elite coaching staff almost every night and where the players on the other end of the court, are all able to beat you, if you don't play well.
Tonight was an abomination. There’s no reason to look like that. Totally unacceptable. Players quit. They have gotten hot head from their ranking. They played like crap the last couple minutes against Iowa when they couldn’t get a stop. Myles checked out after the first two missed free throws. Ron takes plays off on D. Someone tell him to box out. MSU had a billion turnovers and we lost by 20+. That’s embarrassing that we had nothing to answer on o. Is anyone going to teach Myles to score down low? No reason why he shouldn’t score 20+ against a team like that. Go up strong and not losing the ball every time you get fouled. He should be mismatch nightmare. Anyway, we need Cliff back. Caleb is also getting way too many minutes. But then again, we’re thin off the bench.
 

Shell21

Heisman
Mar 23, 2004
35,657
25,189
113
I want to laugh at the lengthy list of bad posts here, without any mention of what the stark reality is.....Michigan State has better players AND RU and it's entire staff decided to run it's offense into a team with better athletes in half court.

Bac....your recap is overwhelming bad, irrational and frankly, you and a bunch of fans saw Michigan State get beat in transition, miss a bunch of shots at Northwestern and Minnesota and immediately decided that those 2 games was the new normal of Michigan State.

You can only be so wrong. I don't have the time and energy to explain that Tom Izzo and Michigan State have done this to elite, good and a lot of teams in between on their own court. And yes, while Cassius Winston and Xavier Tillman moved on to the next level, many fans were fooled by the Northwestern and Minnesota games, thinking MSU would be somehow a sub .500 team.

They have 4* players or higher at almost every position and if it's not a 4* player, it a player specifically designed for the role in their system on either offense or defense. It's not a great MSU team that just overwhelmed teams with shooting and sheer power at the basket. But it's terrifying to see everyone saying this is a bunch of reasons all that are RUs fault....suddenly Caleb, a player we clearly need for the next 2 months, is the problem....or whatever else others mentioned here about minutes being distributed.....??

Here is the game summary for you and everyone else. RU does not have player for player the ability or athletic ability to decide to put their head down, take off with the ball and try to beat a Tom Izzo led defense, when they are already set on defense in the half court.

Steve Pikiell and the staff have now been scouted....and scouted again....and scouted some more as a ranked opponent....teams now know exactly what you run on offense and when teams are prepared, desperate and have success stopping what you want to run, it is up to the staff not the players to place new items, new plays run and RU for the 1st time, was forced to run it's half court offense for 40 minutes. And when the defense was there to take away the 1st or 2nd shot that was usually there against Cuse, Illinois, Ohio State or Iowa, the team needed to continue to run it's offense.

What you saw was a bunch of screens that were prepared for. And Pike needs to go back into the film room, into the breakdowns and convince this team that it has to actually run it's offense for all 25 or 20 seconds once they get across half court.

So when the team didn't see any success running their offense because Sparty was VERY prepared, the players knew it and decided to pressure the defense and had a LOT of success....RU forced so many turnovers but then panicked because they weren't having half court success and tried to make crazy down court passes to get a quick layup and got a couple, but either then went 1 on 2 or had others going faster to try and beat the defense....

When you have played a game like this, it happens......But it wasn't at Nebraska or at some other team that doesn't play tough defense. MSU smothered everything in half court and it is up to the staff, to break down the film, correct the mistakes and to change their sets or run their offense throughout whatever new sets they didn't run.

Sparty and Izzo were completely dialed in on defense. Pike will have to fix the offensive sets or go beyond whatever has been running and working.

Move onto Ohio State and correct the mistakes. Ohio State lost by 17 to Minnesota last week....is that what you expect them to do on Saturday at the RAC....their game at Penn State on Wednesday was postponed for covid19 either with them or Penn State. I assume they're going to play Saturday but don't overreact to this insanity that MSU was suddenly a bad team based on 2 games. Maybe RU came in overconfident watching those two games on tape...in any event, lesson learned and RU is still a Top 20 program....and despite many basketball fans trying to tell me MSU was done or wasn't a NCAA tournament team, nothing could be more wrong. RU played bad, but there’s no panic on my part, just strange and irrational fans believing Sparty was done based on 2 bad losses. RU now has 2 bad looking losses too....so I guess having 2 to 4 bad losses is the new panic button for fanbases.....

Welcome to the B1G folks, when you play a good or elite coaching staff almost every night and where the players on the other end of the court, are all able to beat you, if you don't play well.
Hawk,
Your post is consistent with what I said about our offense in some of the other threads . Izzo has us scouted to death and took away our initial options . Instead of countering those with how they were playing us or keep going through our offense and actions , we stopped and held the ball , which played right into their hands . No way you are going to beat any defense let alone there’s when they are set and waiting for you.

Pike better fo to town on this tape and either put some different counters in to what we do, or emphasize moving the ball quicker and not holding it on every catch . I also thought we needed to screen for the ball screener more since they were physical and riding our screener into every balls screen that we made .

it was an epic breakdown from the coach down to every last player on offense last night .
 

bethlehemfan

Heisman
Sep 6, 2003
15,134
16,464
113
Hawk,
Your post is consistent with what I said about our offense in some of the other threads . Izzo has us scouted to death and took away our initial options . Instead of countering those with how they were playing us or keep going through our offense and actions , we stopped and held the ball , which played right into their hands . No way you are going to beat any defense let alone there’s when they are set and waiting for you.

Pike better fo to town on this tape and either put some different counters in to what we do, or emphasize moving the ball quicker and not holding it on every catch . I also thought we needed to screen for the ball screener more since they were physical and riding our screener into every balls screen that we made .

it was an epic breakdown from the coach down to every last player on offense last night .
We got stagnant against iowa too at times. While I like that we are shooting a higher percentage this year sometimes it can hurt you a bit if guys get lulled into thinking they don’t have to run their offense properly and can get away with jumpshooting and one on one ball.
 

rufeelinit

All-Conference
May 16, 2010
12,647
4,351
0
Just skimmed the other posts in this thread and most were as expected. I stayed with the game until about 10 minutes left in the second half when the outcome was obvious. I like of few of Hawk's takes although I am not sure MSU has better athletes/players across the board. I will say that rumors of MSU's demise are premature or exaggerated. The only reason the game was close into the second half was MSU's turnovers in the first half. The picked it up on both ends in the second half and throttled us. Make the team watch the tape, learn from it and burn it.

Our known shortcomings were prominent when combined with our poor overall play. Three areas that we are going to have to live with to some extent are the lack of rebounding strength, certain guys being unable to play man to man defense against quick opponents and erratic foul shooting. As Hawk said we have been scouted and we need to make some adjustments. If the other team has a couple of bigs, then going inside to Myles will result in him being muscled and forcing him to make FT's if a foul is called. He is just a terrible FT shooter. We seem to want to praise him if he hits 50%. He also seems unable to catch, gather and go up strong consistently.

Not sure if we panicked or just lost all semblance of our floor balance but I could not believe the amount hero/iso ball plays guys were trying to make. It got worse as the game progressed as all of them got the disease. I think teams are not afraid of our drives to the basket (except for Young) thus can guard certain guys close when in the triple threat position and dare them to beat their opponent off the dribble. We need to try at times but need to be smarter and do it off a pick or a pass rather five seconds of dribble then drive.

We shot poorly overall and second chance opportunities were far and few between. I am not satisfied with our team effort on the boards. Too many guys either allowing their guy to get in position for a second rebound on the defensive end and not enough effort on the offensive end. Myles can grab all the rebounds himself particularly when we are asking to hedge far from the basket. Other will snap rebounds with authority if they are in position for a fortunate bounce but fixing this is going to require more emphasis. Having Cliff back will help but I don't see him and Myles playing a lot together and so others need to do more.

Finally minutes allocation will take a couple more games to get sorted out. I mentioned that it is nice that Caleb is back but finding his minutes requires some one else to sit. I can't imagine working Jaden Jones in at this point unless he is really special.

Last night was as ugly as it has been in awhile. We need to come out breathing fire on Saturday.
 

NewJerseyHawk

Heisman
Jan 11, 2007
24,566
38,967
113
I post this every single season and the only argument is "where is the normal performance ".....if you just look at the first 4 to 6 game scores in the B1G and saw the wide differences in scores, last night's game looks like these scores.

NW over MSU 79-65
Minnesota over MSU 81-56
Minnesota over Ohio State 77-60
Wisconsin over Minnesota 82-69
Michigan over Northwestern 85-66
Iowa over Northwestern 87-72
Rutgers over Maryland 74-60
Maryland over Wisconsin 70-64
Michigan over Maryland 84-73
Penn State over ranked VTech 75-55

Every week, there are 2 games that in the B1G that are going to fit into the WTF category in either direction depending on your viewpoint.

Here is the track record year in and year out when you play 18 to 20+ conference games.

3 to 4 games....a team plays OVER their talent or skill level....it doesn't mean a team is necessarily guaranteed to win if they do play very well, just an observation

3 to 4 games.....a team plays WELL BELOW their talent or skill level....they miss shots, they have breakdowns on both ends of the court....they just don't play well....maybe you have one of these games and still win....maybe you have one of these games and lose by 15 to 20+.

The other 12 to 14 games, most teams usually play to "sea level".... that means probably a normal effort on both ends, shoot a normal percentage etc.

RU has played 6 B1G games....I think RU has played one game above their usual level @ Maryland....4 games at their talent level (Illinois, Ohio State, Iowa and Purdue) and one bad game (Sparty)

If you looked at last year's results and the 20 game schedule, it is pretty clear which games fit into the above or below category and which ones were standard.

There will be another 2 clunkers in there the rest of this schedule and 2 or 3 where RU looks like a Top 5 to 10 program.

Right now, the league's teams are really so closely bunched together, that we think we see one or 2 good or bad games by an opponent and it's somehow finalized in early January that everyone has it figured out.

Let me remind the somehow either spoiled or entitled RU fans who believe it is easy, that 2 years ago, RU started 1-6 in the B1G and was in last place.....by the time early February came around and ranked Iowa came to the RAC, it took a miracle 3 to beat RU.....

Then a couple of weeks later at Iowa, RU played it's best game of that season, blowing out Iowa on their own home court.

If and when those roles are reversed and RU is ranked in mid to late February 2021 and someone possobly comes into the RAC and shoots the lights out, or RU goes on the road and loses badly or gets upset by a team lower in the standings,, will it be unacceptable for RU to lose to a bottom feeder...????

Did Iowa bounce back after that "bad loss", or was it RU was significantly better in late February 2019 than early January 2019?? I think Iowa went on as a 10 seed and upset 7th seeded Cincinnati and had #2 seed Tennessee on the ropes but lost in OT.....they played better and recovered from what many from an Iowa perspective was an "unacceptable loss to lowly Rutgers at home".

With new fans following basketball or just a lack of awareness of the bigger picture or only looking at things in a vacuum, you get lost in the forest. It is a long season folks....don't panic or think RU is somehow immune from having bad games during a long season.
 
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