Duval Declares for Draft

[BlueDevilWildcat]

What’s funny is there’s a chance that Tatum goes down as the greatest basketball player to come out of Duke yet.
Calling him out for a couple bad games in January when it was obvious he was coming off injury, had zero lift, and was playing his first games ever where he wasn’t by far the most superior athlete means that 1. You’re an idiot. 2. You should choose another sport to try to understand. 3. You should root for Uk because that’s how their fans act.

Before I choose one of the options from your list, can you clarify how your first sentence is in any way relevant to the rest of your post?

Also, are you saying that Tatum's future greatness is due to the 9 months he spent in Durham? Now that's a UK thing to say.

It's funny, other than Tyus and Winslow, Tatum today is probably my favorite player based on the last couple of months of his Duke career (agree with you that late January was his low point) as well as his approach in the NBA. But yeah, back in Jan 2017, like a lot of alums I wasn't a fan.

 

[MyDudeG_rivals]

What’s funny is there’s a chance that Tatum goes down as the greatest basketball player to come out of Duke yet.
Calling him out for a couple bad games in January when it was obvious he was coming off injury, had zero lift, and was playing his first games ever where he wasn’t by far the most superior athlete means that 1. You’re an idiot. 2. You should choose another sport to try to understand. 3. You should root for Uk because that’s how their fans act.

This is the biggest thing for me. Instead of looking at the situation rationally and realizing Tatum’s skill set was needed for that team to have a championship ceiling, he was continuously bashed as he tried to find his role coming off injury. The goal should always be about preparing for March instead of January. I’ll take some hiccups earlier in the season all day if that means we’re playing our best ball in March. January isn’t the right time to abandon your most skilled players, it’s the time to let them work through their mistakes and learn before the home stretch of the season.

 

[pisgah101]

Truck wreck. Woke up tubes and needles and wires and casts freakin catheter just everything you can possible put on a person to keep alive in coma. Nightmare. Miracle also I lived after I died . What makes it worse I JUST!!! bought the truck and only had liability only because I took loan out from the bank for (home improvement )(and was being cheap careless) so I got to pay for a truck that’s sitting like a crushed beer can totaled. Guess that what I get for trying trick the bank..10 k ...down toilet ..nice truck too..whole point was Trying to get out of having to have full coverage with my insurance high and I did....yet bit me right in ash...got to have FC if a vehicle is not payed off in VA . Idk is it different in other states or how that works ... but screwed me .

Wow I'm sorry to hear that! When was it was

 

[sgrooms]

Speaking of which, here's a classic from BlueDevilWildcat dated 1/28/17 (emphasis added):

"What is your obsession with not seeing Jason for what he is? After today's game he has the worst +/- on the entire team. Coaches should tell him to focus on D and rebounding and never to pass half court when we're on O. Of course, he'd take that for the coaches wanting him to take half-court shots all game, lol."

If that's the best you can come up with, that's pretty weak. He states a statistic and then makes a joke. Not sure that warrants bringing up a post a year later.

 

[TheDude1]

What’s funny is there’s a chance that Tatum goes down as the greatest basketball player to come out of Duke yet.
Calling him out for a couple bad games in January when it was obvious he was coming off injury, had zero lift, and was playing his first games ever where he wasn’t by far the most superior athlete means that 1. You’re an idiot. 2. You should choose another sport to try to understand. 3. You should root for Uk because that’s how their fans act.

As long as Grant Hill exists, that’s unlikely

 

[nets on nets on nets]

As long as Grant Hill exists, that’s unlikely

Gonna be impossible to compare to Grant, because of injuries. If he had stayed healthy, than he's a top 10 all-time basketball player, he's right there with Magic and Bird IMO. But he didn't stay healthy....

Kyrie could get there, he's still getting better, and everything I read about him, he's a complete alpha who wants to lead the Celtics to titles.
I'd also say Tatum and Bagley have great chances to become hall-of-fame level players, and with some injury luck, can become top 20 basketball players ever, far surpassing Grant.

 

[Ioliva]

He was ranked the top PG and 6th best overall player. He didn't come close to living up to those rankings. If he had been ranked more in the 15 - 25 range, expectations would have been tempered.

I think the other reasons he attracted more than his share of criticism were his poor shooting and just poor decision making, especially in crunch time.

In hindsight we got a PG who wasn't a natural passer, couldn't shoot, and played with poor awareness. I think the criticism was justified.

Lmao wasn't a natural passer? I guess those 5.6 assists per game came out of nowhere right? He would've had more too if he didn't have that slip up in the middle of the season. Yes he had his times where he was a basket case but the hate duval gets is unreal. You do know he led the ACC in assists for a majority of the season right? He even matched Tyus jones for assists per game.

 

[IPSYCHOSIS]

Wow I'm sorry to hear that! When was it was

Thanks it’s all good. Nov 20

 

[DukeRulesBasketball]

Truck wreck. Woke up tubes and needles and wires and casts freakin catheter just everything you can possible put on a person to keep alive in coma. Nightmare. Miracle also I lived after I died . What makes it worse I JUST!!! bought the truck and only had liability only because I took loan out from the bank for (home improvement )(and was being cheap careless) so I got to pay for a truck that’s sitting like a crushed beer can totaled. Guess that what I get for trying trick the bank..10 k ...down toilet ..nice truck too..whole point was Trying to get out of having to have full coverage with my insurance high and I did....yet bit me right in ash...got to have FC if a vehicle is not payed off in VA . Idk is it different in other states or how that works ... but screwed me .

Sorry to hear this! Glad you are okay.

 

[christophero]

Sorry to hear this! Glad you are okay.

Yes me too!

 

[skysdad]

Truck wreck. Woke up tubes and needles and wires and casts freakin catheter just everything you can possible put on a person to keep alive in coma. Nightmare. Miracle also I lived after I died . What makes it worse I JUST!!! bought the truck and only had liability only because I took loan out from the bank for (home improvement )(and was being cheap careless) so I got to pay for a truck that’s sitting like a crushed beer can totaled. Guess that what I get for trying trick the bank..10 k ...down toilet ..nice truck too..whole point was Trying to get out of having to have full coverage with my insurance high and I did....yet bit me right in ash...got to have FC if a vehicle is not payed off in VA . Idk is it different in other states or how that works ... but screwed me .

I am sorry to hear about that. OFC

 

[PatrickYates]

If he ball hogs and plays like crap you'll hear it as you should

If he ball hogs and plays like crap you'll hear it as you should

Tatum's problem was that he wasn't enough of a ball hog. If he'd gotten 25 percent of Allen's shots, and a few of Luke's shots, Duke would have gone to the FF last year.
.
Sometimes, you have to let the best player take over games and dominate, because the other side can't stop him. If LeBron wasn't so concerned with getting his teammates involved, he'd have more titles than MJ. Tatum, vs what MCBB has become, could have dominated down the stretch for Duke. That is pretty much what he did in the ACCT, and we were filthy that week.

 

[PatrickYates]

What’s funny is there’s a chance that Tatum goes down as the greatest basketball player to come out of Duke yet.
Calling him out for a couple bad games in January when it was obvious he was coming off injury, had zero lift, and was playing his first games ever where he wasn’t by far the most superior athlete means that 1. You’re an idiot. 2. You should choose another sport to try to understand. 3. You should root for Uk because that’s how their fans act.

Exactly. People who didn't realize that Tatum was our best chance to win just don't understand basketball.

 

[PatrickYates]

Now Liftee, there you go trying to talk sensible. How dare you. It was all Allen and K's fault. I'm appalled at your attitude sir.

But we knew the frosh were going to have ups and downs. Every frosh does that. But their struggles were within the realm of expectations.
.
Who thought Allen would be a low 30s shooter from 3? If he'd been low 40s, we are a number 1 seed instead of Xavier, and playing Nova for the title. I still think we lose that game, but I'd have liked our chances vs Nova on short rest.

 

[youngman42]

Duval is not ready for the NBA but he has great potential. Westbrook is the comp, imo (though he's not near there, yet, of course). He has that Westbrook type body and physicality. If he can develop an outside shot, and grow as a passer, he'll be a great pro. He has a lot of work to do, though.

 

[GillJET]

Tatum's problem was that he wasn't enough of a ball hog. If he'd gotten 25 percent of Allen's shots, and a few of Luke's shots, Duke would have gone to the FF last year.
.
Sometimes, you have to let the best player take over games and dominate, because the other side can't stop him. If LeBron wasn't so concerned with getting his teammates involved, he'd have more titles than MJ. Tatum, vs what MCBB has become, could have dominated down the stretch for Duke. That is pretty much what he did in the ACCT, and we were filthy that week.

We were “filthy” during that ACC Tournament? All 4 games were extremely close. It was impressive we won 4 in 4 days, but we could have very easily lost any of those 4 games.

 

[Mac9192]

Tatum's problem was that he wasn't enough of a ball hog. If he'd gotten 25 percent of Allen's shots, and a few of Luke's shots, Duke would have gone to the FF last year.
.
Sometimes, you have to let the best player take over games and dominate, because the other side can't stop him. If LeBron wasn't so concerned with getting his teammates involved, he'd have more titles than MJ. Tatum, vs what MCBB has become, could have dominated down the stretch for Duke. That is pretty much what he did in the ACCT, and we were filthy that week.

It's called team ball. We're Duke and we have plenty of scoring options. Relying too much on one guy is a big part of the problem.

I never knew though that a few less shots by Allen and Kennard would have sent Duke to the final four last season. Maybe a more realistic thing to say, which happens to be a fact, is in that SC game Tatum fouled out but only had 3 rebounds. It's also a fact that Kennard was really bad.

 

[PatrickYates]

It's called team ball. We're Duke and we have plenty of scoring options. Relying too much on one guy is a big part of the problem.

I never knew though that a few less shots by Allen and Kennard would have sent Duke to the final four last season. Maybe a more realistic thing to say, which happens to be a fact, is in that SC game Tatum fouled out but only had 3 rebounds. It's also a fact that Kennard was really bad.

Allen was god awful last year. Kennard was very good, but he'd have been more efficient as the secondary option.
.
There are no certainties in sports, but I firmly believe that featuring Tatum would have lead to a better result than 5th in the ACC regular season and getting housed by SC.
.
This year was a decent year. 2nd in the ACC reg season, and a close game in the elite 8. The season was "lost" during the inexplicable losses to BC and VT, because those losses cost us the 1 seed that would have seen us waltz into the national title game fairly easily.
.
The previous two years were awful for Duke as a team. They were great for Allen and Luke individually, but the team had very little success. Excepting only the week where Tatum was the primary option and we won the ACCT. When we reverted back to the Allen and Kennard show the next weekend, we got shellacked.
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The real saving grace for last year would have been if K refused to play Kennard and Allen together. The two worst defenders in Duke history, and I'm not sure there is a number 3 on the list.
.
Honestly, combined with his patent refusal to play any semblance of man D for 3 years now, Allen was a real disappointment for 2 straight years. I'm not sure any healthy player has fallen that short of expectations.

 

[PatrickYates]

We were “filthy” during that ACC Tournament? All 4 games were extremely close. It was impressive we won 4 in 4 days, but we could have very easily lost any of those 4 games.

Compared to the 5th place regular season finish we limped too, the ACCT run was great.

 

[nets on nets on nets]

SC punked us. They played like 22 year old men and Duke played like kids. They completely destroyed Kennard, and the rest of the team faulted as well. We lost that game in the 1st half when we should have been up 20 and failed to take total control. Obviously didn't help that the game was played in SC and also the refs allowed the game to by physical.

The '17 team is just a sad story, no other way around it. But I do believe that Tatum should have been clear-cut #1 option by February, the dude was just at another level by then, he also became our best defender by March. Grayson should have came off the bench that whole season, believe Duke made it's run once Grayson became 6th man, he excelled in that role. Shouldn't have started both Luke and Grayson, it made our perimeter defense as slow as some guys at the YMCA.

 

[GillJET]

Compared to the 5th place regular season finish we limped too, the ACCT run was great.

Yes of course winning the ACC Tournament was a much more desirable result than our 5th place regular season finish.

How many times are you going to go back on these past seasons and try and point out that if we “just did this”, the results would have been better? There is no guarantee at all that if we had done things “your way” that it would have succeeded. Let it go. It’s over. Time to look to the future.

 

[LouisiAaron]

SC punked us. They played like 22 year old men and Duke played like kids. They completely destroyed Kennard, and the rest of the team faulted as well. We lost that game in the 1st half when we should have been up 20 and failed to take total control. Obviously didn't help that the game was played in SC and also the refs allowed the game to by physical.

The '17 team is just a sad story, no other way around it. But I do believe that Tatum should have been clear-cut #1 option by February, the dude was just at another level by then, he also became our best defender by March. Grayson should have came off the bench that whole season, believe Duke made it's run once Grayson became 6th man, he excelled in that role. Shouldn't have started both Luke and Grayson, it made our perimeter defense as slow as some guys at the YMCA.

Hell this year he would've been better as a 6th man. I would've started all of the freshmen. We really would've saw Gary Trent shine then. Alex was almost automatic from 3 this year. Grayson could've been our DiVincenzo type

 

[nets on nets on nets]

Hell this year he would've been better as a 6th man. I would've started all of the freshmen. We really would've saw Gary Trent shine then. Alex was almost automatic from 3 this year. Grayson could've been our DiVincenzo type

No, Grayson deserved to and should have started this year. He had a fine year, just wish it ended better.

 

[nets on nets on nets]

This is random but Tatum’s performance @ UVA is one of the greatest individual performances a Duke player has had that never gets talked about on here.
Makes sense because I too try to completely remove that season from my memory.

 

[Mac9192]

Hell this year he would've been better as a 6th man. I would've started all of the freshmen. We really would've saw Gary Trent shine then. Alex was almost automatic from 3 this year. Grayson could've been our DiVincenzo type

I'm not kidding, you need to be drug tested.

 

[dukiejay]

I'm not kidding, you need to be drug tested.

I often chuckle at posts....for this one I'm just glad I wasn't drinking anything. Very well done.

 

[PatrickYates]

No, Grayson deserved to and should have started this year. He had a fine year, just wish it ended better.

Eh. Saying that Grayson should have come off the bench this year is taking things too far. Similarly, saying he had a "fine" year may be going too far the other direction. The "fine year" assessment is closer to being accurate than the "off the bench" opinion, but still.
.
Allen had a decent year if you take his performance and measure it in a vacuum. Relative to expectations, "fine" is a big stretch.

 

[LouisiAaron]

I'm not kidding, you need to be drug tested.

You’re right. How dare I compare him to DiVincenzo? He’s not that good. He could’ve been a spark off the bench like last year. Just because you come off the bench it doesn’t mean you can’t play 30 minutes. Some people are just better when they can analyze the start of the game and see the flow

 

[LouisiAaron]

No, Grayson deserved to and should have started this year. He had a fine year, just wish it ended better.

Starting the 5 freshmen wouldn’t have hurt. The Fab Five started and they actually had returning starters that started the year off in the lineup. It was all about the boost they got from all of the freshmen starting and then they took off

 

[PatrickYates]

Starting the 5 freshmen wouldn’t have hurt. The Fab Five started and they actually had returning starters that started the year off in the lineup. It was all about the boost they got from all of the freshmen starting and then they took off

Too much has been made of AOC's contributions in limited minutes. For starters, we had to play a zone D. I can, have, and will throw rocks at Allen's defensive effectiveness, but Bagley was the primary reason we had to switch to a zone. And Allen was reasonably effective in the zone defense. AOC was better in M2M than Allen, but AOC was lost in the zone. Worse, he didn't communicate well in the zone leaving some shooters wide open. Further, AOC got really timid down the stretch, passing up decent looks and not shooting as well as he did early in the season. Allen definitely deserved to start over AOC (who I think will be a lottery pick out of Duke before he's done in 2 years). AOC should have played more, getting some of GT and GA's minutes, if only two rest our starters. But AOC didn't deserve to start.

 

[Alaskan_Assassin_21]

The last play I remember by AOC was him going up timid on a breakaway layup. He was clearly not mentally prepared for Sweet 16 and beyond for the NCAA Tourney. That is Coach K's "fault" for not playing him more down the stretch of the ACC season and ACC tournament. But it seemed Coach K doubled down on the starters late and based on Duval's improvement - it was the right decision. Our bench ultimately did not make the difference against Kansas but it might have against Nova/Michigan etc

The idea of AOC starting this past season is kind of laughable to me.