Bamba to Texas
- Thread starter christian28
- Start date
And there it is, Cal putting the NBA and another league ahead of his own job description.
It appears now many are running from this, and calling it merely coach speak. Somehow, almost 4 years later, sending everyone ASAP hasn’t helped us one bit. It’s helped everyone else trying to catch us.
Love ya Aike but didn’t age well.
I’m just messing around. Had some time, found the thread and thought it interesting. I don’t ever pull up old threads but this one.....
couldn’t resist.
I don't know how someone can say this hasn't helped us one bit.
This sales pitch he's giving to players is the very reason we have gotten guys like John Wall and Anthony Davis. Smh.
Ha ... maybe you haven’t noticed, but Wall was over a decade ago now and Davis has been damn near a decade himself.
Oh that's right. I forgot we weren't counting those years from some reason.
That sales pitch of getting players to the NBA has clearly not helped us in recruiting one bit since then.
Either way, it doesn't matter because at the end of the day, going forward either Cal is going to be able to land those superstar players again or he isn't. One group on this board thinks he can and the other doesn't believe he can. At the end of the day, no one is going to change their mind on this.
Bumping old threads trying to prove a point really isn't doing anything tho.
I didn’t say they didn’t count. I said it was a very, very long time ago. Things have changed.
That class was interesting
Green and Richards weren't good as freshman
Vanderbilt & Baker were not healthy
SGA actually turned out to be one of the best that played here
Diallo was good...not up to his ranking though
PJ ended up peaking late in the year.
Knox was good, not a superstar
I still wonder how well that team would've performed had Baker and Vanderbilt been healthy the entire year.
Green and Richards weren't good as freshman
Vanderbilt & Baker were not healthy
SGA actually turned out to be one of the best that played here
Diallo was good...not up to his ranking though
PJ ended up peaking late in the year.
Knox was good, not a superstar
I still wonder how well that team would've performed had Baker and Vanderbilt been healthy the entire year.
But the good news is, with Davis’ newly signed extension, Cal can add that to the list of total contract dollars signed by his former players.
That, and a placebo mask, will keep you warm this winter.
Pretty much anyone that we got in his entire tenure here lol
Listen I get when people rail on Cal for his coaching ability. But I think it's kinda silly to assume that the man can no longer recruit the best of the best just because he's had a period in time where he hasn't.
It's been five years of missing out on his top targets.I don't see what will change it now.
Eeerrrrrr hold on. I think you're missing the point, or maybe intentionally f'n with us.
You said in 2017 if it continues to work then stick with the system. I said in 2017 we need to adjust now because Cal can't get the much needed top crop players.
So we're 1-4, looking at a possible 2 NIT's in 8 years, no final fours......
So it hasn't continued to work, should we continue?
I don't think the man has suddenly forgot how to recruit top talent tho.
I think recruiting goes in cycles.
The difference Is I believe that in 2017 and 2019 the system DID WORK. Unfortunately we didn't make a final four in either of those years. But we were nearly a 1 seed in both of those years (I think in 2017 we were overall 5th).
It goes back to what I've been saying all along with all of this.
Tournament best team doesn't always win. We all know this. Best way to win titles is to be in that top tier as many years as possible. I feel we had enough talent in both those years to win titles.
That's 2 of the past 3 tournaments.
When we start having more years like 16, 18 and maybe this season..........well yeah I would say this thing has stopped working. But when 17 and 19 happen, I start to think maybe you could still indeed win this way.
FWIW this isn't much different than Cal's first few years that everyone was okay with.
I mean 10, 12 and 15 we all agree were our best teams. We had talent in each of those years to win titles.
But 13 we made an NIT. And 11 and 14 despite the end result being final fours, those seasons weren't great and as a result we had poor seeds in those years.
So IMO I look at this entire thing and think well some years we have had title contending teams and other teams we have not.
Not too dissimilar from the last four years.
I mean 10, 12 and 15 we all agree were our best teams. We had talent in each of those years to win titles.
But 13 we made an NIT. And 11 and 14 despite the end result being final fours, those seasons weren't great and as a result we had poor seeds in those years.
So IMO I look at this entire thing and think well some years we have had title contending teams and other teams we have not.
Not too dissimilar from the last four years.
I argued forever nearly 4 years ago that if we do not stop chasing this model we are going to suffer for it. We have a final four drought in that timespan, we're looking at the NIT, we might have one of the worst teams here in UK history, bro we cannot even beat Bill Self.
It does not work. And the sooner we accept that, the sooner UK can win again.
This has to be a joke, right?
Cannot tell if you're trolling now. First few years here, Cal was elite 8 (best team all season), final four, title.
We had players like Wall, Cousins, Davis....lol
In what world is that even comparable to where we are today?
Just because in 11 and 14 we made last second shots to make a final four doesn't make them any vastly different from 17 and 19 where we lost on one possession to make a final four.
I'm not talking about from a talent level stand point.
We aren't 2012 not because Cal stopped recruiting..........we aren't 2012 because there were no Anthony Davis players to begin with.
I'm strictly talking about our talent level in those years compared to the rest of the college baseketball and whether or not we had the ability to win titles.
We aren't 2012 not because Cal stopped recruiting..........we aren't 2012 because there were no Anthony Davis players to begin with.
I'm strictly talking about our talent level in those years compared to the rest of the college baseketball and whether or not we had the ability to win titles.
In other words yeah 2019 UK isn't remotely on the level of 2015 UK or 2012 UK. But it doesn't have to be. They just need to be more talented than the current teams playing. And we were. We were no doubt in that conversation that year. As we were 2017.
Even the most negative people on this board felt we were capable of winning those years.
Even the most negative people on this board felt we were capable of winning those years.
Okay, but what about 10 and 12. You want to compare those years to 16 and 18?
I've learned quite a few things during the Tubby years spending time on these kind of message boards.
Everyone has a line that can be crossed, its just different for everyone. There is no unconditional support. Maybe a loss to UCLA and UL will push a handful of people being vocal in their support of Cal at the moment to switch.
Usually the guys defending the coach become just as vocal going after the coach, once they decide he isn't going to ever be the guy he once was. The other option is they just stop posting for awhile waiting on everyone to forget how belligerent they were in the earlier positions.
My experience is once the downward momentum starts, it keeps gaining speed. Cal can't just have a good year to change the momentum. He has to have an outstanding year and then follow it up with another year just as good to reverse "the trend".
Its unlikely for Cal to have a team like 2012 or 2015, and honestly, most supporters are banking on Cal trying to turn each team he has now into 2014. Its a high risk, high reward proposition to say the least, and its coming in at the moment at about 30:1 odds. It takes more than a Bamba or Young. Coach K couldn't pull it off with more first year talent than we've had.
With each loss, each failed recruit, each comment by swaggy Cal who comes off looking like an *** to the disgruntled - the mountain he has to climb gets a bit bigger. He's probably at Mt. Hood levels now. Miss the tournament and he in the Alps. Start off with a **** team next year and complaining about actually having to play good teams early on? Everest.
Everyone has a line that can be crossed, its just different for everyone. There is no unconditional support. Maybe a loss to UCLA and UL will push a handful of people being vocal in their support of Cal at the moment to switch.
Usually the guys defending the coach become just as vocal going after the coach, once they decide he isn't going to ever be the guy he once was. The other option is they just stop posting for awhile waiting on everyone to forget how belligerent they were in the earlier positions.
My experience is once the downward momentum starts, it keeps gaining speed. Cal can't just have a good year to change the momentum. He has to have an outstanding year and then follow it up with another year just as good to reverse "the trend".
Its unlikely for Cal to have a team like 2012 or 2015, and honestly, most supporters are banking on Cal trying to turn each team he has now into 2014. Its a high risk, high reward proposition to say the least, and its coming in at the moment at about 30:1 odds. It takes more than a Bamba or Young. Coach K couldn't pull it off with more first year talent than we've had.
With each loss, each failed recruit, each comment by swaggy Cal who comes off looking like an *** to the disgruntled - the mountain he has to climb gets a bit bigger. He's probably at Mt. Hood levels now. Miss the tournament and he in the Alps. Start off with a **** team next year and complaining about actually having to play good teams early on? Everest.
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I mean I could easily say what about 13. Where 16 and 18 were vastly better than that year.
I mean 10-15 was 6 years.
16,17,18,19 = 4 years.
Obviously sitting at 1-4 it's hard to make a claim but what if we just haven't had our 10 or 12 yet this stretch?
But the bottom line with all of this is, when I think of Cal's system I look at it in terms of the process and not just the end result. My personal opinion is that our teams in 17 and 19 were BETTER than the one in 11. And although 14 had a ton of talent, again our seasons in those years were no doubt better. When we dropped three conference games of 4 in 14, people were questioning whether that team would even make the tournament.
But I'm not going to lie here, if we have more seasons like 16 and 18 going forward, then yeah I totally would feel something would have to change.
I guess the main difference here is some people are at that point yet where I'm not entirely there yet. 19 wasn't that long ago and I felt that team had the pieces to compete. If u earn a 1 seed or 2 seed, you've had a pretty good season and IMO could compete for a title.
I know Cal well enough that I no longer talk about NITs or missing the tournament based on the first 2 months of the season.
That said, its perfectly acceptable to state that **** basketball the first two months of the season isn't acceptable at UK and if this is the norm then that is what we call in my field of work - a resume updating event.
And Cal pretty much states its the norm now with his complaints on scheduling.
That said, its perfectly acceptable to state that **** basketball the first two months of the season isn't acceptable at UK and if this is the norm then that is what we call in my field of work - a resume updating event.
And Cal pretty much states its the norm now with his complaints on scheduling.
Fireable? Hmmm...
-Pitino NIT in 2001 & 2006. First Round Exits in 2010 & 2011...
-Billy Donovan NIT in 2008 & 2009, wasn't even good enough to make the NIT in 2015
-Roy Williams 2010 NIT and 5 games under .500 in 2020
And I believe 2013 was the only time we didn't advance past the 1st round...and only once have we not made the 2nd weekend. I could give you the numbers of the other coaches in comparison...but as we all know it won't matter as minds are made up.
I know, I know "THIS IS KENTUCKY DAMMMMITTTT I EXPECT MORE"
But if you look out and see that...well....who is doing better among the competition...can't find much...so you're chasing a level of success that does not exist.
Only a reincarnated John Wooden would satisfy many people here...or a Nick Saban of basketball.
Did any coach go to the NIT (in its current form) twice at UK? I honestly don't know.
Just because you exceeded some accomplishments of your predecessors doesn't mean you get to have lower lows.
gold standard and all that. Hell I thought Cal *was* the Nick Saban of basketball. $9m, he better be.
Nick Saban
According to a USA Today report that was released on Wednesday morning, University of Alabama coach Nick Saban is once again college football's highest-paid coach with a salary of $9.3 million. Saban made $8.7 million in compensation in 2019.
Just because you exceeded some accomplishments of your predecessors doesn't mean you get to have lower lows.
gold standard and all that. Hell I thought Cal *was* the Nick Saban of basketball. $9m, he better be.
Nick Saban
According to a USA Today report that was released on Wednesday morning, University of Alabama coach Nick Saban is once again college football's highest-paid coach with a salary of $9.3 million. Saban made $8.7 million in compensation in 2019.
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well, in all fairness...we are playing Self in the season and not as a low seed in the NCAAT.
which, could happen... Then if we lose to him, eeek.
that’s the entire point. Cal was tagged as a Saban type when we began and started paying him one of the highest salaries of any coach in sports.
People are now lowering the bar to make up for the shortcomings.
Didn't he have 2 final 4's after that injury that caused 2013?
Since 2013 he has been to 4 elite 8's in 6 seasons.
2 free throws away from 4 final 4's in that 6 year span. I'd say that is pretty successful
Have we gone to the NIT twice during the Cal era?
I mean people are literally looking at 5 games into a season and chalking it up to NIT to try and make their point better.
I mean people are literally looking at 5 games into a season and chalking it up to NIT to try and make their point better.