Article: Why Duke Will (Not) Win It All
- Thread starter JasonSarnosky
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Duke has a ton of experience coming back and a perimeter loaded with shooters (Jones, Allen, Kennard, Jackson) and a scorer in Tatum. If their post players do nothing but rebound and defend and set screens, they are still going to be a title contender. That said, they are going to get production out of the post in Giles, Jefferson, Jeter and Bolden. I think this year is the deepest pool of top teams that could win it all (and that's before thinking of any sleepers out there).
Duke, Kentucky, Villanova, UNC, Arizona, Michigan State, Oregon, Wisconsin, Kansas are all going to be deep and talented with various mixes of experience. It's going to be a fun year.
Duke, Kentucky, Villanova, UNC, Arizona, Michigan State, Oregon, Wisconsin, Kansas are all going to be deep and talented with various mixes of experience. It's going to be a fun year.
This is what I think as well.
It improves Allen's stock to let him run the point, but it helps the team more to have him as a scorer on the wing.
It's similar situation with Jackson.
By letting them share PG duties, along with Jones, K can have his cake and eat it too.
Tatum is a scorer, but not a great shooter, so by putting him at the 4 they can exploit his quickness.
That gives them three shooters (Allen, Jackson, Jones) plus an elite scorer at the 4, and a post threat in Giles.
Then they can bring Kennard in off the bench in the backcourt, giving him lots of minutes.
Then K can start Giles, but limit his minutes, to keep him fresh and effective. They have Jefferson and Bolden on the bench inside so they don't have to worry about foul trouble or fatigue.
Look at it this way.
They lost Ingram and replaced him with Tatum. Slight downgrade in my opinion, but I'm sure they will say even.
We lost Ulis/Murray and replaced it with Fox/Monk. Similar, in that I expect that to be an even trade by March. Will feel like a downgrade in November.
They added Giles. We added Bam. Pretty even, imo. Especially considering Giles' injuries.
They traded Thornton for Jackson. Probable upgrade.
We traded Skal/Lee/Poy for Wenyen/SKJ. Hopefully upgrade.
Considering how we waxed them last season, and looking piece for piece at the changes, I'm not seeing the gap.
Oh yeah. Unless Bolden is the key.
My bad, I didn't see it.
But yeah, trying to get a freshman combo guard to transform into a pg and be a coach on the floor like a senior is a tremendous feat. It's much harder than it looks from the couch.
Yeah, Duke has some issues to work out but they certainly have the horses to get it done. Some guys are going to have to step out of their comfort zones at times and stay disciplined.
This is also further complicated by the fact that this will not be a down year.
Yeah but if Allen is going to run point they are going to need to get him fitted for a HANS device. That's going to be a heck of a lot more head snapping than playing the 2 guard spot.
The Duke Boys had their day in the sun in 2015 (which should've been our year if we hadn't blew it against Wisconsin 
)...2017, with four seniors (not bad for a coach who allegedly is all about "one year wonders") who were with us for both 2014 and 2015, when we were so, so, so close. 2017 has just got to be the year for the UndeNINEables!
The only Duke Boys I like are the ones in an orange car with an 01 and a confederate flag
)...2017, with four seniors (not bad for a coach who allegedly is all about "one year wonders") who were with us for both 2014 and 2015, when we were so, so, so close. 2017 has just got to be the year for the UndeNINEables! The only Duke Boys I like are the ones in an orange car with an 01 and a confederate flag
Jayson Tatum, Harry Giles and Grayson Allen are better then any player on UK imo. Tatum and Giles are rated above every UK recruit and while you are free to disagree I defer to those who have seen them more than me. Regarding Giles health, he came back after the first injury and won eybl MVP and played great his junior year in HS before hurtING his other knee but this is why I think it's reasonableto expect Giles to return a d be really good.
And this doesn't account for Bolden who is rated very closely with Bam or Jefferson who is rs senior that averaged a double double or Jones,Jackson and Kennard. UltimatEly thiugh, Duke having the three best players is why I think there is a big gap.
UK definitely upgraded, IMHO:
Fox won't be as good as Ulis at the start of the season, but by March, he will likely be close.
Monk won't be the shooter Murray was, but is a little more athletic and a better all around scorer.
Bam will be a whole lot better than a less than 100% Poy was last year. Major upgrade.
Gabriel has a better motor and has better perimeter skills than Labissiere. Also should easily out rebound Skal (3rpg).
SKJ replaces Lee. It should be an upgrade on offense for sure, and by season's end, SKJ will be just as good or better defensively. Rebounding should be about a push.
Briscoe, Willis, Humphries, and Hawkins will be a year more experienced. That's an upgrade.
Anything Wynyard gives us is bonus, but I don't expect him to play much. Same with Mulder.
I would be surprised if we were not markedly better next season with the upgrade inside.
Fox won't be as good as Ulis at the start of the season, but by March, he will likely be close.
Monk won't be the shooter Murray was, but is a little more athletic and a better all around scorer.
Bam will be a whole lot better than a less than 100% Poy was last year. Major upgrade.
Gabriel has a better motor and has better perimeter skills than Labissiere. Also should easily out rebound Skal (3rpg).
SKJ replaces Lee. It should be an upgrade on offense for sure, and by season's end, SKJ will be just as good or better defensively. Rebounding should be about a push.
Briscoe, Willis, Humphries, and Hawkins will be a year more experienced. That's an upgrade.
Anything Wynyard gives us is bonus, but I don't expect him to play much. Same with Mulder.
I would be surprised if we were not markedly better next season with the upgrade inside.
Well I'm shocked that you would have that opinion
My opinion about Duke v UK is shared by most. Just read essentially any article written about next season.
08 Kansas Mario Chalmers was their leading scorer
07 Florida Taurean Green was the PG
03 Syracuse Gerry McNamara was the PG
Also Kimba Walker and Shabazz Napier where score first guards so you can win without a true PG.
07 Florida Taurean Green was the PG
03 Syracuse Gerry McNamara was the PG
Also Kimba Walker and Shabazz Napier where score first guards so you can win without a true PG.
Tatum is overrated as you'll see and Giles might not be anywhere close to 100%. Comparing Bolden to Bam is like comparing Obama to Reagan. Give me a break.
Total homer post.
For Duke:
Jackson for Thornton is probably a slight upgrade even though Jackson is not a true PG.
Tatum for Ingram is probably a slight downgrade (Ingram is possibly the number 1 pick in the draft), but they should be fine.
Giles replaces Plumlee, major upgrade.
Bolden pushes Jeter down the bench. Upgrade.
Allen, Jones, Kennard, and a finally healthy Jefferson are all upgrades.
Jeter will be a year better, but probably doesn't play as much with Jefferson healthy and Bolden coming in.
DeLaurier, Vrankovic, Obi, and White probably won't play much except for mop up time.
They should be markedly better as well.
Jackson for Thornton is probably a slight upgrade even though Jackson is not a true PG.
Tatum for Ingram is probably a slight downgrade (Ingram is possibly the number 1 pick in the draft), but they should be fine.
Giles replaces Plumlee, major upgrade.
Bolden pushes Jeter down the bench. Upgrade.
Allen, Jones, Kennard, and a finally healthy Jefferson are all upgrades.
Jeter will be a year better, but probably doesn't play as much with Jefferson healthy and Bolden coming in.
DeLaurier, Vrankovic, Obi, and White probably won't play much except for mop up time.
They should be markedly better as well.
Bam is rsci 8 and Bolden is rsci 11, that is pretty close. And then thinking Giles and Tatum are top 15 players and better then anyone on UK is not really a homer statement, just look at the rankings and also remember that the quality of this class is Very high compared to many of the other re ent classes. We are all entitled to our own opinions though.
Calling Allen, Jones, Kennard, and Jeffferson upgrades is like calling Briscoe, Hawkins, Willis, and Humphries upgrades.
I suppose you could look at it that way if you want.
You won't find anyone on this board who thinks Bolden is remotely close to Bam. Nobody thought that even when we were recruiting him. We thought he was a low motor, solid post-up guy with a chance to contribute.
We all know Giles is good. We all wonder how healthy he will be and how quickly. Understandably, Duke fans see a glass half full.
Most of us don't care for Tatum. I think he's overrated. A lot of us do. You can scoff at that all you want. Doesn't matter. Season will play out how it does.
But it is cute how y'all flock here for validation year after year.
In a three on three tourney, you might have a point, but in a five on five game, it's not a wide gap, IMHO.
Starters
G Fox > Jackson- by the rankings.
G Briscoe = Allen- Briscoe is better on D, Allen is better on O. Briscoe won the head to head last year.
G Monk < Tatum- by the rankings.
F Willis < Giles- Giles is a better athlete, even with the injury.
F Adebayo > Bolden- by the rankings.
Bench
G Hawkins < *Kennard
G Mulder < *Jones
F Gabriel* > DeLaurier
F Killeya-Jones* > Jeter
F Humphries* < *Jefferson
*Top reserves.
Starters are fairly even, IMHO. I give Duke an edge in depth. If they match up, it will be in March and by then both coaches will be down to a 7-8 man rotation which will negate some of that advantage.
My gosh, how did we ever beat Mighty Duke last year? We just barely squeaked by, 74-63. Of course, we had the huge advantage of our All-American Lottery pick Skal, and I guess winning on a neutral court probably shouldn't even be considered. With the refs in our hip pocket to boot! We were just lucky I guess. Juuust lucky.
But they did get Grayson Allen back to trip and flop his way across the south.
I said both were upgrades. A year more experience. Another offseason to work on their games. Players in college tend to get better as they get older. Some make big jumps (Willis), some make minimum improvement (Lee), but most tend to get better barring injuries.
How did Allen do when we played you guys last? As for rankings, UK fans know all too well that where someone is ranked means next to nothing. You are looking through ultra-thick blue lenses dude.
Ok so...
I wanted Bolden badly and thought we really needed him. So I'm not posting homer **** in the least.
I couldn't give more of a rats a** about rankings. All you need is a good pair of eyes and borderline intelligence to see Bolden isn't close to Bam. Even though I wanted Bolden I still think he's 15-30 range. Bam could easily end up the best college player in the class. Bolden has no shot at that.
Homer posting Duke fans.
I wanted Bolden badly and thought we really needed him. So I'm not posting homer **** in the least.
I couldn't give more of a rats a** about rankings. All you need is a good pair of eyes and borderline intelligence to see Bolden isn't close to Bam. Even though I wanted Bolden I still think he's 15-30 range. Bam could easily end up the best college player in the class. Bolden has no shot at that.
Homer posting Duke fans.
The main reason most of us wanted Bolden was so Bam would have some help inside. That and to keep him away from Duke. LOL!
Bam vs. Bolden head to head, I have to give Bam the advantage.
It doesn't take an expert to see all the players that have had its careers turn for the worse due to MULTIPLE MAJOR KNEE INJURIES. If you can't see that. Then you're as dumb as all the UNC BB players of the last 20+ years. Which is saying a lot.
Both teams wanted Bolden for the same reason. To be able to play a true 5 beside their lottery pick 4 when they wanted to.
However, both teams appear most suited to have their 4s play the 5, play a stretch 4, and 3 guards.
It appears that Duke has a little more flexibility than we do. That may or may not matter come March.
We also may get more out of Humphries or SKJ than they get out of Bolden. Wouldn't be much of a stretch.
However, both teams appear most suited to have their 4s play the 5, play a stretch 4, and 3 guards.
It appears that Duke has a little more flexibility than we do. That may or may not matter come March.
We also may get more out of Humphries or SKJ than they get out of Bolden. Wouldn't be much of a stretch.
I wanted Bolden for that very reason, but that was when I thought Bam was 6'9, 240.
If he is now 6'10, 260+, then I can't see him playing anywhere but at the 5. He has the bulk to handle it on the defensive end and creates mismatches on the offensive end with his face up game.
His athleticism will be killer in the pick and roll. He can step out and hit the short jumper. He can get it in the high post and drive against slower big men.
He will develop a low post game and be able to post up four or five times a game and get baskets. He will get fouled a lot, but he is strong enough to finish through the fouls.
Many opponents will be forced to play zone to try and stop him from scoring at will inside. That will open things up for easy shots for the guards. While they aren't great shooters, in general, they will get a lot of wide open shots, which will help their percentages.
I would have liked to have had Bolden as well, don't get me wrong, just to have another option inside. We will be fine without him, just means more minutes for Humphries.
It's become cliché at this point, but no big guy wants to be a center. Not Giles, not Bam, not anybody.
So no coach sells a big guy on being a traditional 5. They sell them on being able to face up, shoot jumpers, etc.
But the best 5s do all of that AND stick their butts on the block for easy buckets.
It's like Wenyen being sold on being a 3. If he's playing on the wing, does it matter what you call it?
Trey Lyles played the "3" and Derek Willis plays the "4."
Positionless basketball.
So no coach sells a big guy on being a traditional 5. They sell them on being able to face up, shoot jumpers, etc.
But the best 5s do all of that AND stick their butts on the block for easy buckets.
It's like Wenyen being sold on being a 3. If he's playing on the wing, does it matter what you call it?
Trey Lyles played the "3" and Derek Willis plays the "4."
Positionless basketball.
Duke has never started the season with a lineup like that terrible post
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This is rich. A Duke fan pretending to be a UNC fans calling a UK fans a UL fan.
Bolden commitment. UK actually has scoreboard (last win head to head) and all time stats, but for some reason Duke fans are selling themselves to UK fans in a large number since Bolden.
Started with their title in 15. Subsided slightly when we abused them last year.
Now they're high on their press clippings. There are a couple of decent Duke posters. Unfortunately we've attracted the idiots.
There's no such think as a decent dook posters. They're all nut hugging little gheyboys, which is just an extension of their cry baby "angry beaver"coach. Everyone that shows his pansy a$$ on here is just an effing troll.