***CC22 and the Fever mega thread***

[BCRoss89]

Does anyone know if there is a Referee video explaination of what different fouls are in the WNBA? You would think the WNBA PA would insist on this.

I have a copy of the offical rule book and would love to have a library of video examples of each foul type.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

The Fever are AVERAGING 15.5 TO's per game! And the Big 3 are AVERAGING 9.7 per game. Ugh.

Need to see how many points off turnovers they're giving up.

 

[The Big Z]

Without CC. The 3some obviously doesn’t work or fit. For whatever reason, they become a worse team.

Making AB the highest paid player in the league will prove to be a mistake IMO.

Again, the results are what they are.

The results are they were a game away from the finals last year. And who is/was available for the Fever to get that’s actually better than her? The facts are she was great last year in the playoffs. She’s also not been 100% healthy this year. And saying she’s not athletic is also ridiculous. It’s the W. The game is played below the rim. How many so called rim protectors are even in the league?

 

[IowaCityLit]

The results are they were a game away from the finals last year. And who is/was available for the Fever to get that’s actually better than her? The facts are she was great last year in the playoffs. She’s also not been 100% healthy this year. And saying she’s not athletic is also ridiculous. It’s the W. The game is played below the rim. How many so called rim protectors are even in the league?

She’s the hugest paid player in the league and 9th in rebounds and 9th in blocks. If you’re attributing it to her health, okay, but that’s called a terrible return on investment. She plays below other post players who play below the rim.

AB is a really good player. Just like KM. But they’re both overrated relative to their limitations and certainty relative to salary.

 

[Randon]

The Fever's starting 3 & 4 yesterday (Hull & Billings) had a combined two field goals and one rebound between them. You're just not going to win many games with that kind of production from two of your starters.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

In other news, the Lynx choked against the Mystics and proved they're not infallible.

Guess Olivia Miles must be overrated because she couldn't lead her team to a win at home over an average opponent. Only 1-4 from 3? 4 turnovers? Bum.

 

[Manfredi]

Mystics in back to back games beat the Liberty and the Lynx...both on the road

 

[Hawksfor3]

The Fever are AVERAGING 15.5 TO's per game! And the Big 3 are AVERAGING 9.7 per game. Ugh.

Found it interesting that 10 of those 19 TO's from yesterday's game were steals!

 

[IowaCityLit]

I haven’t looked at the stats so I don’t know where the Fever rank in generating steals, but seems like they don’t offer much disruption at all defensively. Maybe it’s a fear of fouling, but individually they seem hesitant and slow and unable to cause many deflections.

 

[Legend12]

I haven’t looked at the stats so I don’t know where the Fever rank in generating steals, but seems like they don’t offer much disruption at all defensively. Maybe it’s a fear of fouling, but individually they seem hesitant and slow and unable to cause many deflections.

Fever: 6.1 SPG

Tied w/ 2 others (NY and Wash) for last in the league.

 

[Ludd]

She’s also played in fewer games.

Funny how you don’t understand how numbers work.

She had a whopping two free throws last night…how do those numbers work?

 

[TJ8869]

They took the Fever to the conference finals.

There are no “conference finals”. It’s just the semifinals. Playoff seeding is irrespective of conference alignment.

Basically the Fever won a best-of-3 series with Atlanta and then took Las Vegas to the limit. They were 4-4 in the playoffs. And I think a lot more gets made of that than it really was, especially by people who want to argue that the Fever are better without CC.

First of all, the Fever were 8-5 (.615) during the regular season with CC. They were 16-15 (.516) without her. Without their record in games CC played, they might not have even made the playoffs.

Second, it’s important to note that the WNBA changed the playoff format in 2025. It used to be that the higher seed got Games 1 and 2 at home. The league decided to make sure every playoff team got at least one home game, so they switched the format from 2-1 to 1-1-1. Every coach of every higher seeded team in the first round was furious about the change because it gave the lower seeded team a better chance to completely change the momentum of the series and force an anything-can-happen Game 3.

Case in point - Vegas entered the playoffs on a rampage, winning their final 16 games in a row. They drew 7-seed Seattle, who finished one game behind the Fever. Vegas pummeled the Storm by 25 in Game 1, but then had to go to Seattle for Game 2. The Storm broke the Aces’ 17 game winning streak and forced a Game 3 back in Vegas and nearly stole the series. The Aces needed a tip-in by Jackie Young with 12 seconds left in Game 3 to take a 1-point lead and then avoided disaster when Erica Wheeler missed the potential game winning shot for Seattle with 4 seconds left.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

I haven’t looked at the stats so I don’t know where the Fever rank in generating steals, but seems like they don’t offer much disruption at all defensively. Maybe it’s a fear of fouling, but individually they seem hesitant and slow and unable to cause many deflections.

Like I said, Fran's defenses.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

There are no “conference finals”. It’s just the semifinals. Playoff seeding is irrespective of conference alignment.

Basically the Fever won a best-of-3 series with Atlanta and then took Las Vegas to the limit. They were 4-4 in the playoffs. And I think a lot more gets made of that than it really was, especially by people who want to argue that the Fever are better without CC.

First of all, the Fever were 8-5 (.615) during the regular season with CC. They were 16-15 (.516) without her. Without their record in games CC played, they might not have even made the playoffs.

Second, it’s important to note that the WNBA changed the playoff format in 2025. It used to be that the higher seed got Games 1 and 2 at home. The league decided to make sure every playoff team got at least one home game, so they switched the format from 2-1 to 1-1-1. Every coach of every higher seeded team in the first round was furious about the change because it gave the lower seeded team a better chance to completely change the momentum of the series and force an anything-can-happen Game 3.

Case in point - Vegas entered the playoffs on a rampage, winning their final 16 games in a row. They drew 7-seed Seattle, who finished one game behind the Fever. Vegas pummeled the Storm by 25 in Game 1, but then had to go to Seattle for Game 2. The Storm broke the Aces’ 17 game winning streak and forced a Game 3 back in Vegas and nearly stole the series. The Aces needed a tip-in by Jackie Young with 12 seconds left in Game 3 to take a 1-point lead and then avoided disaster when Erica Wheeler missed the potential game winning shot for Seattle with 4 seconds left.

 

[Legend12]

There are no “conference finals”. It’s just the semifinals. Playoff seeding is irrespective of conference alignment.

Basically the Fever won a best-of-3 series with Atlanta and then took Las Vegas to the limit. They were 4-4 in the playoffs. And I think a lot more gets made of that than it really was, especially by people who want to argue that the Fever are better without CC.

First of all, the Fever were 8-5 (.615) during the regular season with CC. They were 16-15 (.516) without her. Without their record in games CC played, they might not have even made the playoffs.

Second, it’s important to note that the WNBA changed the playoff format in 2025. It used to be that the higher seed got Games 1 and 2 at home. The league decided to make sure every playoff team got at least one home game, so they switched the format from 2-1 to 1-1-1. Every coach of every higher seeded team in the first round was furious about the change because it gave the lower seeded team a better chance to completely change the momentum of the series and force an anything-can-happen Game 3.

Case in point - Vegas entered the playoffs on a rampage, winning their final 16 games in a row. They drew 7-seed Seattle, who finished one game behind the Fever. Vegas pummeled the Storm by 25 in Game 1, but then had to go to Seattle for Game 2. The Storm broke the Aces’ 17 game winning streak and forced a Game 3 back in Vegas and nearly stole the series. The Aces needed a tip-in by Jackie Young with 12 seconds left in Game 3 to take a 1-point lead and then avoided disaster when Erica Wheeler missed the potential game winning shot for Seattle with 4 seconds left.

I agree that the Fever were just as good (if not better) with CC as without her last year, but so many people are eager to get rid of Mitchell (and some seem to be tired of Boston) w/ out having any idea who they may be able to get to replace her. I'm of the belief that the trio of CC/KM/AB can be very successful if they can convince enough quality 2nd level players to join them, but I don't think that is going to be easy to do.

 

[AFM22]

The Fever are AVERAGING 15.5 TO's per game! And the Big 3 are AVERAGING 9.7 per game. Ugh.

Clark has had 5 or more turnovers in 70% of the games she’s played in.

It’s more of a Clark problem than a big 3 problem.

 

[BunchofAholes]

I have a buddy who sends me highlights (usually bad ones) periodically. Seriously. How do you guys watch this crap?

 

[AFM22]

In other news, the Lynx choked against the Mystics and proved they're not infallible.

Guess Olivia Miles must be overrated because she couldn't lead her team to a win at home over an average opponent. Only 1-4 from 3? 4 turnovers? Bum.

4 turnovers would be a good game for Clark

 

[WDSMHawk]

I have a buddy who sends me highlights (usually bad ones) periodically. Seriously. How do you guys watch this crap?

So the only WNBA you consume is mostly low-light compilations sent by a friend and you think that the product is bad?

 

[AFM22]

So the only WNBA you consume is mostly low-light compilations sent to by a friend and think that the product is bad?

I wasn’t going to say anything

 

[Hawk_4shur]

Clark has had 5 or more turnovers in 70% of the games she’s played in.

It’s more of a Clark problem than a big 3 problem.

Yup. CC makes a lot of high risk passes, and a few "no chance" passes.

 

[AFM22]

Yup. CC makes a lot of high risk passes, and a few "no chance" passes.

The turnovers that bother me most is when she’s driving, hits a wall of defenders, flops, and the other team is fast breaking the other way while she’s shrugging at the refs for a foul.

Some of the turnovers can be cleaned up.

It should be noted in the flip side her best offensive games are usually high turnover games.

 

[Ludd]

I’ve come around to this team just being average. The 4 is just a huge hole on offense, and lack of
Depth depth at the 5 and a lack of rebounding is just not good enough. This is a failure of the front office. R

Isn’t it funny that all these other teams can make adjustments, but White can’t? Yes, the Fever gave up a lot of points, but the Dream gave up 96 and 101 in the last two games yet found a way to win. They gave up 59 points at halftime, but made adjustments, only gave up 37 in the second half, and won. That’s what coaching does.

 

[Tenacious E_rivals41982]

I agree that the Fever were just as good (if not better) with CC as without her last year, but so many people are eager to get rid of Mitchell (and some seem to be tired of Boston) w/ out having any idea who they may be able to get to replace her. I'm of the belief that the trio of CC/KM/AB can be very successful if they can convince enough quality 2nd level players to join them, but I don't think that is going to be easy to do.

The problem I see with with CC and KM is that most of the game for most games, it seems like they just take turns being "the man". With that being said, when the team sets screens and KM does that backdoor cut and CC or AB hit her on it - poetry. It could work like you say, if they can get the right second level players at the 4 and 5 positions. I was so very high on Billings and thought she would be that person, but the production has not been there, as of yet. Still hoping she can turn it up.

 

[IowaCityLit]

I agree that the Fever were just as good (if not better) with CC as without her last year, but so many people are eager to get rid of Mitchell (and some seem to be tired of Boston) w/ out having any idea who they may be able to get to replace her. I'm of the belief that the trio of CC/KM/AB can be very successful if they can convince enough quality 2nd level players to join them, but I don't think that is going to be easy to do.

Yeah I actually think this makes sense. But the risk in not being able to sign those quality 2nd level players is then having (or choosing) to overpay for players like Lexi and Billings.

It’s why at the end of the day rather than attracting the right players around CC, she may have to join another roster where she would be embraced and maybe the missing piece to a championship.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

I have a buddy who sends me highlights (usually bad ones) periodically. Seriously. How do you guys watch this crap?

How, you ask?........

Spoiler

https://media.tenor.com/ZtJrGHkFW0YAAAAd/hellsing-****-you.gif

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

4 turnovers would be a good game for Clark

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Yeah I actually think this makes sense. But the risk in not being able to sign those quality 2nd level players is then having (or choosing) to overpay for players like Lexi and Billings.

It’s why at the end of the day rather than attracting the right players around CC, she may have to join another roster where she would be embraced and maybe the missing piece to a championship.

Makes you wonder why those kind of players wouldn't want to go to Indiana to try to help them win a championship, and would rather be on some other struggle bus floundering in mediocrity women's professional basketball team...............................

 

[IowaCityLit]

The problem I see with with CC and KM is that most of the game for most games, it seems like they just take turns being "the man". With that being said, when the team sets screens and KM does that backdoor cut and CC or AB hit her on it - poetry. It could work like you say, if they can get the right second level players at the 4 and 5 positions. I was so very high on Billings and thought she would be that person, but he production has not been there, as of yet. Still hoping she can turn it up.

The bigger problem is defense. KM really struggles in transition D. CC can at times. In the halfcourt KM can be exploited because of her size just as much as CC can. It’s just not a backcourt that can win a title if only because of the defensive limitations. Especially in a league that feels like a rugby league at times.

 

[IowaCityLit]

Makes you wonder why those kind of players wouldn't want to go to Indiana to try to help them win a championship, and would rather be on some other struggle bus floundering in mediocrity women's professional basketball team...............................

Well I think you and others have alluded to or pointed out (correctly) that the league is, in general, petty and territorial…and that many players would rather see CC “fail” than actually see themselves succeed.

CC going to a team in need of a PG to elevate to a title contender would be ideal. Where she can focus on playmaking. With versatile players who can finish much more consistently than she has around her now.

 

[IowaCityLit]

And where that might be? Hard to know what the league will look like after next year when CC becomes a free agent. You will see JuJu and other top college stars enter the league, other rosters aging (Liberty), etc. Hard to know where the best fit might be.

 

[Legend12]

Makes you wonder why those kind of players wouldn't want to go to Indiana to try to help them win a championship, and would rather be on some other struggle bus floundering in mediocrity women's professional basketball team...............................

I think CC is going to have to change quite a bit to attract the kind of players needed to win a title.

 

[Tom Paris]

So the only WNBA you consume is mostly low-light compilations sent by a friend and you think that the product is bad?

Good thing they didn’t send him clips of NFL WRs dropping passes.

 

[Tom Paris]

The turnovers that bother me most is when she’s driving, hits a wall of defenders, flops, and the other team is fast breaking the other way while she’s shrugging at the refs for a foul.

Some of the turnovers can be cleaned up.

It should be noted in the flip side her best offensive games are usually high turnover games.

I’m still waiting for someone to find me a clip of Caitlin stepping in and taking a charge.

 

[Hawk_4shur]

The turnovers that bother me most is when she’s driving, hits a wall of defenders, flops, and the other team is fast breaking the other way while she’s shrugging at the refs for a foul.

Some of the turnovers can be cleaned up.

It should be noted in the flip side her best offensive games are usually high turnover games.

I agree.

Also, I wonder about this - if CC makes 4 high risk passes and two of them are successful and two are TO's, is that "good"? Or at least acceptable?

In that scenario you get 4 points, but you have two empty possessions. One of the TO's will likely lead to a fast break for the opponent. (Obviously her Assist/TO ratio is much better than 50/50, but the bulk of her assists are "low risk")

She is an amazing passer - but she gets reckless at times.

 

[Hawksfor3]

Clark has had 5 or more turnovers in 70% of the games she’s played in.

It’s more of a Clark problem than a big 3 problem.

And, TBF, if others would catch passes that are catchable, finish at the rim, and hit a fairly good amount of perimeter shots, by crackie we'd have something!

 

[BunchofAholes]

So the only WNBA you consume is mostly low-light compilations sent by a friend and you think that the product is bad?

No, I've seen plenty of "highlights" too. It's pretty weak.

 

[Hawksfor3]

I have a buddy who sends me highlights (usually bad ones) periodically. Seriously. How do you guys watch this crap?

I watch if M*A*S*H or Gilligan's Island isn't on.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Well I think you and others have alluded to or pointed out (correctly) that the league is, in general, petty and territorial…and that many players would rather see CC “fail” than actually see themselves succeed.

CC going to a team in need of a PG to elevate to a title contender would be ideal. Where she can focus on playmaking. With versatile players who can finish much more consistently than she has around her now.

If there's a team out there willing to take her.........

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

I think CC is going to have to change quite a bit to attract the kind of players needed to win a title.

Or maybe the stubborn vets of the league could change instead, since they're a main part of the problem to begin with................