...but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
It may be blasphemy...
- Thread starter HoggI74
- Start date
why is that blasphemy? Its 
true.
Edit: oh wait you said the best ever not the best since.
true.Edit: oh wait you said the best ever not the best since.
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I will play devil's advocate.
* Sometimes anointing someone "the best ever" has some recency bias.
* There was no 3 point shot when Lester played; it was a different game.
* Ronnie took Iowa to its last Final Four appearance. Had he not gotten injured in the national semi-final, Iowa might have won an @EvilMonkeyInTheCloset NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP.
* Didn't Magic Johnson say when Lester was healthy that Ronnie was the best PG he had ever played against?
* Imagine Ronnie's career if they could have repaired ACLs back then like they do now.
* Sometimes anointing someone "the best ever" has some recency bias.
* There was no 3 point shot when Lester played; it was a different game.
* Ronnie took Iowa to its last Final Four appearance. Had he not gotten injured in the national semi-final, Iowa might have won an @EvilMonkeyInTheCloset NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP.
* Didn't Magic Johnson say when Lester was healthy that Ronnie was the best PG he had ever played against?
* Imagine Ronnie's career if they could have repaired ACLs back then like they do now.
He’s definitely up there with some of the best. No way to argue against that. Ronnie and Bj were super special. Andre was great. Dean Oliver was a lot of fun to watch. Jeff Horner was awesome. But going further back, Down Town Freddie Brown was unbelievable to watch. There were a couple of other ones whose names escape me now.
* Ronnie took Iowa to its last Final Four appearance. Had he not gotten injured in the national semi-final, Iowa might have won an @EvilMonkeyInTheCloset NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP. I agree...
* Didn't Magic Johnson say when Lester was healthy that Ronnie was the best PG he had ever played against? Might have...
* Imagine Ronnie's career if they could have repaired ACLs back then like they do now. That's what I think about my football career...
Had Tom Davis not rested on his laurels, Iowa would've won the national title in 1987. We can play the "what if" game all day.
As for PG play, Stirtz is the best I've seen in my 49 years.
Ronnie took us to the final four. Andre led the league in points and assists. If Stirtz does one of those two things, then I will gladly annoint him as the best PG ever at Iowa. Until then… Those two are at the top for me…
Bennett is in a great groove right now .
I saw a mock had him rated about 20th.
Their comp was derrick white of Celtics, who is a great player...high praise,indeed.
Ronnie was special...one of one Saw him play at his peak while I was a student there
I saw a mock had him rated about 20th.
Their comp was derrick white of Celtics, who is a great player...high praise,indeed.
Ronnie was special...one of one Saw him play at his peak while I was a student there
Stirtz might be the best SCORING point guard I've seen in an Iowa jersey in my lifetime, but not sure about best overall. He's up there for sure.
As pointed out, Woolridge led the league in both scoring AND assists his senior year. I think I give AW the edge has a distributor.
Edit: Woolridge scored 20.2 ppg that year, and Stirtz is at 19.2, so not sure I don't also give AW the edge as a scorer. He was so, so good that year.
I'm too young to remember seeing Ronnie Lester play, but by all accounts, he was fantastic.
BJ was great, too.
As pointed out, Woolridge led the league in both scoring AND assists his senior year. I think I give AW the edge has a distributor.
Edit: Woolridge scored 20.2 ppg that year, and Stirtz is at 19.2, so not sure I don't also give AW the edge as a scorer. He was so, so good that year.
I'm too young to remember seeing Ronnie Lester play, but by all accounts, he was fantastic.
BJ was great, too.
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Pre knee injury Ronnie Lester was a Guy who You would be talking about in the same light as an Isiah Thomas type talent, Stirtz is skilled but He is now where the talent Ronnie Lester was . He was destined to be an NBA HOF type talent till that knee .
Recency bias.
Andre was amazing. And his senior year where he led the Big Ten in scoring and assists, the first time that had ever happened, was without Kingsbury(early NBA entry that wasn't drafted) or Settles(injured most of the season). He had Ryan Bowen as a junior, JR Koch as a sophomore, Kent McCausland as a sophomore, and "Life as a G" himself Guy Rucker as a freshman.
Some talent on that team, but not enough that it should have won the Big Ten that season(Minnesota vacated all victories that year and we had two wins against the team that we tied with so that means we won it). Andre willed that team to greatness.
Andre was amazing. And his senior year where he led the Big Ten in scoring and assists, the first time that had ever happened, was without Kingsbury(early NBA entry that wasn't drafted) or Settles(injured most of the season). He had Ryan Bowen as a junior, JR Koch as a sophomore, Kent McCausland as a sophomore, and "Life as a G" himself Guy Rucker as a freshman.
Some talent on that team, but not enough that it should have won the Big Ten that season(Minnesota vacated all victories that year and we had two wins against the team that we tied with so that means we won it). Andre willed that team to greatness.
Lot of recency bias here. How quickly we forget.
Seriously though. Without Ronnie Lester that Iowa team was literally a .500 group. With him they were national championship contenders that likely win it all if he stays healthy. Stirtz is an awesome point guard, but Iowa isn't a national championship contender this year.
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How old were you when Ronnie played? Offensively Stirtz reminds me of Fred Brown. Brown was much more skilled offensively than Stirtz. Stuart’s is a better defender. Fred Brown was butter. Very good shooter. A great passer. Never hurried and great BB instincts. Fred always knew where JJ was and knew when Calabria needed the ball. If Freddy had been there 3-4 years, Lester would have been the second best guard in Iowa BB history. Fred’s team when he was a senior was not very talented....but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
I was also thinking about those three and decided at this point to close to call....but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
It's not blasphemy. It's just premature, at best. Did you ever see Lester or Andre Woolridge play at Iowa? Downtown Freddie Brown? How about Murray Wier of Waterloo?...but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
Stirtz, especially recently, has been outstanding. Bennett is one of the best point guards Iowa has ever had. But the best ever? That might be a step too far. Let's revisit that when the season is over.
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You're entitled to your opinion. As good as Stirtz has been the last several games, Freddie Brown, BJ Armstrong, Andre Woolridge, Ronnie Lester . . . those are some pretty special players, and I saw them all. The "best ever" discussions are interesting, but it's pretty tough to compare players from different eras. I would be willing to say Stirtz is one of the best PGs Iowa's ever had, especially given his unique college career trajectory. And if he can help Iowa to its first Sweet Sixteen or beyond, then we can revisit the discussion.
Agreed. Ronnie also was a consensus All-American. In my 63 years I'd say 1. Lester 2. Woolridge. 3 Stirtz 4. Brown
It's Ronnie Lester, then fill in the blanks after him.
Andre helped Guy a lot that year. Back at Carver after dinner working on his low post game. Lots of nights, lots of extra work. Unfortunately Guy never had the same success with just Dr Tom.
Lester had the best handles of any Iowa guard I have ever seen weaving in and out of a defense to break it down. Lester came out a got in the starting lineup his freshman year. He wasnt a great jump shooter but very good. And the no shot clock and no 3 pt shot diminished his stats. Sometimes teams wouldnt shoot for minutes of clock time as some of you know. And there was a lot of zone defense played back then....but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
With no 3 pt line teams looked to get the ball into their big guys for short high percentage shots.
Freddie Brown, Lester, BJ, Oliver, Andre were all great and so is Stirtz who has very good handles and passing skills, a very good shooter, etc etc.
Very hard to compare players. Lester played against some very good competition from MSU, IU, PUrdue, Minny and Illinois were top teams, OSU with Kellogg and some very good guards were tough. Big 10 has always been tough. Brown played mainly against top teams in OSU and Purdue in his years.
Ronnie Lester played during my college years and I went to every game. Hard as it may seem to imagine back in those days you could watch practice in the Fieldhouse and I sat in the bleachers and watched regularly. I saw Ronnie Lester do things in practice I have never seen from another point guard.
I have never liked making comparisons of players to previous players especially from a totally different generation. Just enjoy the one season we have Stirtz and appreciate the skillset he brings to the table along with the outstanding coaching he has received from Ben for four years.
I have never liked making comparisons of players to previous players especially from a totally different generation. Just enjoy the one season we have Stirtz and appreciate the skillset he brings to the table along with the outstanding coaching he has received from Ben for four years.
Ronnie is the best player ever to wear an Iowa uniform.
I'm not sure he was the best ever. He was certainly close, but what made Ronnie easily the best Iowa point guard ever was his undeniable impact on the entire team. He lifted everyone around him to heights that nobody else could, and he nearly carried a slightly above average team to a national championship.
...but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
Usually I'd break this one out for something posted in the HROT political threads, but damn bruh, it's deserved here.
I was too young to remember Ronnie. The old boys get real mad if you talk about anybody over him and I respect that. He must have been that damn good.
When you get older you may have fans comparing point guards to Stirtz. You seem to get it. This comparison stuff starts to get silly.
It's not really about getting mad. It's just mad respect for a guy who nearly took a 10-8 Iowa team all the way to a national championship, and 45 years later Iowa hasn't reached that level again.
When I watched Ronnie with naked eye, it seemed like an optical illusion when did a cross- over..he was that quick.
Same when I'd see MJ at the United center in Chicago.
Heard an NBA analyst say today that mavs should maybe grab stirtz in draft to build around Cooper flag.
Same when I'd see MJ at the United center in Chicago.
Heard an NBA analyst say today that mavs should maybe grab stirtz in draft to build around Cooper flag.
Comparisons to players 30 and 40 years ago aren't really realistic. Different eras, different rules, different circumstances. I think it's enough to simply say, "Stirtz is up there with some of the great point guards that have come thru Iowa."
Andre W was one of the best, especially since he nearly always drove to his right, if I remember correctly .
Guy did get a little bit of run in the NBA with the Warriors though. Played 3 total games while being on a regular season roster for a couple weeks. Still more games than some other guys that we've had drafted.
Too soon and probably not quite right given Ronnie’s run to the final four...but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
If Ben can get Iowa a Big tourney crown and a sweet sixteen let’s talk.
...but there I said it. Bennett Stirtz is the best point guard ever to play at Iowa. Sorry Ronnie and Andre...
