The Nazis are Shooting People

hopefultiger13

Heisman
Aug 20, 2008
10,801
16,962
113
Well, most of you know how I feel about Trump and his folks. But I'm a moderate in spite of that and here's my two cents:

It's pretty obvious to me that this woman was breaking the law. Whether it was as a peaceful protest or something else is beside the point. Her car was crossways in the road and she was impeding federal law enforcement officials. Just as above with the peace protest part, whether you agree with ICE methods or not is beside the point. They were conducting a Federal operation and she was intentionally in their way. That's grounds to arrest her right there.

And it appears to me that that is what was going to happen. The officer told her to step out of the car and she refused, she then attempted to drive off. That's resisting arrest... I think there's little doubt about any of that.

I've also heard that it is not standard operating procedure to stand in front of a car with a suspect in it. Again, I can't see that there's any bearing in the matter whether it was procedure or not. She either tried to run him over or not.

I've heard that this officer was dragged by a car in a previous incident and that he may have been affected by that. And again, I don't see that there's any bearing in the matter at hand. He either acted properly or not.

I've heard this woman referred to as a domestic terrorist or a simple mom of three kids depending on who's doing the talking. Do we know these things for sure? Certainly I have trouble believing the officers knew any of that in that moment, so I don't see that having any bearing in the case.

I heard Vance say that this officer had blanket immunity. That is TOTAL ********. Officers certainly DO NOT have blanket immunity and in fact are bound by what they may do in given situations. There are many cases to this point where officers acted outside the bounds of the law and were jailed for it. No bearing here, but I needed to say that.

In the end this boils down to whether the use of deadly force was justified or not given what happened in the moment.

Given that, there are several things that are NOT obvious to me:

While I see the officer in front of the car, I also see her wheels cut hard to turn the car away from him and frankly it didn't look like he got more than brushed by the car. So when I hear she tried to "run down the officer", that doesn't seem cut and dried to me (as Vance and others in the Admin are saying).

That being the case, I do see that at least two shots were fired by the officer while he was beside the car and was in no danger of being run down. Does the use of deadly force continue to be OK when the situation that justified it has passed? I honestly don't know the answer to that and obviously the situation was ongoing at the time.

As usual, I take the moderate view that we simply don't have all the facts of the case in front of us and until we do, we can't know what the right thing to do is. I say let the courts decide. So I think both the feds and the state should investigate and let the cards fall where they may.

In general, I support law enforcement and although I really, really don't like the way ICE is doing things, that opinion has nothing to do with this particular case. In this case we see a woman clearly in violation of the law. The officers attempted to take her into custody and she attempted to escape by doing what she did. The only question here is whether the officer genuinely felt his life (and those of his fellow officers and the general public) was in danger and the use of lethal force was justified. Again, we don't have all the facts here, but given what we saw I'd have difficulty finding the officer guilty.
And speaking of not knowing all the details, now we are getting witnesses that say some officers were telling her to move her car while some were telling her to step out. If they were yelling for her to move AND step out. IF that's true that changes things a lot, at this point we don't know. Again, we need all the facts before condemning either side. That's what a jury is for.

Vance is correct in blaming the media for calling this murder immediately. But Vance is also off base for calling this woman a domestic terrorist that tried to run down an officer when no one knows all the facts.
 

tigres88

All-American
Aug 7, 2022
2,233
5,826
113
And speaking of not knowing all the details, now we are getting witnesses that say some officers were telling her to move her car while some were telling her to step out. If they were yelling for her to move AND step out. IF that's true that changes things a lot, at this point we don't know. Again, we need all the facts before condemning either side. That's what a jury is for.

Vance is correct in blaming the media for calling this murder immediately. But Vance is also off base for calling this woman a domestic terrorist that tried to run down an officer when no one knows all the facts.
I appreciate being moderate in most situations.

Both sidesing here is ridiculous and absurd. Drop it

This woman was murdered
 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
F man, being brown while doing your job at Target is now enough to be arrested.



"Border Patrol just illegally arrested a U.S. citizen… a TEENAGER… in Richfield, Minnesota.

The teen was working at Target when agents tackled him and arrested him, while his passport was in his pocket, fully identifying himself as a U.S. citizen.

None of it mattered.

Why? Because he looked Latino.

When a coworker asked who to call, he said, heartbreakingly: “my mom.”

Think about that. Your teenage son goes to work, and Border Patrol kidnaps him.

This isn’t an isolated incident. ICE and Border Patrol have repeatedly illegally arrested U.S. citizens, especially in Minnesota. And after agents murdered a U.S. citizen who tried to drive away from illegal detention, this should outrage every single American.

U.S. citizens do not have to prove their citizenship. Yet, ICE and Border Patrol agents are routinely violating the Constitution, demanding proof anyway… and even refusing to accept drivers licenses or real IDs.

And now? Even a passport doesn’t matter.

This isn’t enforcement… it’s targeting Americans based on fear and appearance, treating citizens like criminals in their own country.

When will this end? When will the government stop stripping citizens of their rights and labeling them terrorists for simply existing?"
 

leetp

Heisman
Dec 6, 2021
15,219
20,912
113
Sorry Lee, you gave up the right to a reasonable discussion with this line.


A couple of thoughts:

- I saw a clip on tv that showed the shooter walking behind her car and around the passenger side until he walked in front at the exact same moment as the officer who was running to grab the driver's side door, so it's clear she wouldn't have seen him. Not to mention he was breaking protocol by walking in front of a vehicle. And as @tigres88 pointed out, one of the officers told her to move so she likely thought she was following orders.

- If it was your wife or daughter in that car, how much restraint would you hope the agents used in that scenario?
You are right. The lunatic left remark was an emotional misstep. I take it back.

First and foremost, this event was tragic. I feel terrible for the deceased, her wife and her young child. This is just awful.

To your point, with the car not only being in reverse, but backing up, the guy leaking out to the front is an unreasonable move. With the one guy moving into the car, he's got to position himself for a clean sight line to the individual in the car. He also can't keep his back to the crowd of angry protesters further behind the car. As for when the car lurched forward, the danger was not just the the guy in front. If you assume she is not actually trying to hit him, he probably could have dove out of the way. But with the other guy reaching inside the vehicle as it starts moving forward, he could have been in danger of getting run over or being dragged by the car.. Recall, the guy that shot was just significantly injured by being dragged buy someone they were attempting to arrest (a convicted sex offender with an order of regional, if that matters). I can see him reacting out of instinct to protect both himself and his partner.

I'd like to think my wife or daughters wouldn't be in that position. My children know that if a law enforced officer gives you an order, you are to obey--especially in a charged situation such as that.

The lady in the car was in the act of committing a crime in a very tense situation. She endangered not only herself, but those law enforcement officers and the crowd of protesters. Still, she didn't deserve to pay for that mistake with her life.
 

leetp

Heisman
Dec 6, 2021
15,219
20,912
113
What we're saying here is that ice agents pulled up in an umarked vehicle with masks on, and tried to forcefully enter an unarmed woman's car with no warrant. She was terrified and tried to leave.

Then she left they shot and murdered her in cold blood.

Be better
Be better? Are you really implying that the protesters screaming at the ICE agents in ICE agent uniforms didn't know they were ICE agents? And you are telling me to be better?

There's no reasonable discussion to be had here. I knew better, and yet I dropped in to see what the was being said. That's my fault. You guys can have this cesspool of a message board. I'm out.
 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
You are right. The lunatic left remark was an emotional misstep. I take it back.

First and foremost, this event was tragic. I feel terrible for the deceased, her wife and her young child. This is just awful.

To your point, with the car not only being in reverse, but backing up, the guy leaking out to the front is an unreasonable move. With the one guy moving into the car, he's got to position himself for a clean sight line to the individual in the car. He also can't keep his back to the crowd of angry protesters further behind the car. As for when the car lurched forward, the danger was not just the the guy in front. If you assume she is not actually trying to hit him, he probably could have dove out of the way. But with the other guy reaching inside the vehicle as it starts moving forward, he could have been in danger of getting run over or being dragged by the car.. Recall, the guy that shot was just significantly injured by being dragged buy someone they were attempting to arrest (a convicted sex offender with an order of regional, if that matters). I can see him reacting out of instinct to protect both himself and his partner.

I'd like to think my wife or daughters wouldn't be in that position. My children know that if a law enforced officer gives you an order, you are to obey--especially in a charged situation such as that.

The lady in the car was in the act of committing a crime in a very tense situation. She endangered not only herself, but those law enforcement officers and the crowd of protesters. Still, she didn't deserve to pay for that mistake with her life.
She was given two orders, one told her to move and the other asked her to get out. Her wife wasn't in the car so I believe she was moving the car out of the way as instructed unless you believe she would have left her wife there and drove away. I don't.

I don't see how this can be seen as anything other than an extreme over-reaction to a situation that didn't call for a shot through the windshield and an additional two shots three feet from the drivers side door.

It was murder in my opinion and if the feds weren't concerned about what the investigation would show, they wouldn't have abruptly cancelled the joint investigation with state authorities.

JMO
 
  • Like
Reactions: tigres88

TigerGrowls

Heisman
Dec 21, 2001
44,323
33,430
113

Cool it libs and stay home. No further obstruction of ICE. If any dem governor decides to resist in the streets then Trump will quickly declare an insurrection and squash it fast. No options libs but to be peaceful and stop obstructing ICE.
 

tigres88

All-American
Aug 7, 2022
2,233
5,826
113
Be better? Are you really implying that the protesters screaming at the ICE agents in ICE agent uniforms didn't know they were ICE agents? And you are telling me to be better?

There's no reasonable discussion to be had here. I knew better, and yet I dropped in to see what the was being said. That's my fault. You guys can have this cesspool of a message board. I'm out.
Good. Bye
 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
Cool it libs and stay home. No further obstruction of ICE. If any dem governor decides to resist in the streets then Trump will quickly declare an insurrection and squash it fast. No options libs but to be peaceful and stop obstructing ICE.
What about breaking into federal buildings. Can we do that?
 
  • Haha
Reactions: TigerGrowls

ClemsonInAtlanta

All-Conference
Jan 20, 2019
735
1,022
93
Cool it libs and stay home. No further obstruction of ICE. If any dem governor decides to resist in the streets then Trump will quickly declare an insurrection and squash it fast. No options libs but to be peaceful and stop obstructing ICE.
Gestapo supporter in the name of freedoms. Tyrannical unamerican traitor. You have no concept of reality
 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
Cool it libs and stay home. No further obstruction of ICE. If any dem governor decides to resist in the streets then Trump will quickly declare an insurrection and squash it fast. No options libs but to be peaceful and stop obstructing ICE.
What if we are legal but haven't memorized our SSNs? Would you allow us to go with you peacefully instead of slamming us to the ground face first and traumatizing our child waiting inside the car?

 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
 

JohnHughsPartner

All-American
Nov 19, 2016
4,317
6,615
113
Be better? Are you really implying that the protesters screaming at the ICE agents in ICE agent uniforms didn't know they were ICE agents? And you are telling me to be better?

There's no reasonable discussion to be had here. I knew better, and yet I dropped in to see what the was being said. That's my fault. You guys can have this cesspool of a message board. I'm out.

Good. Bye
Cmon back. If you know how to treat these Kweers it can be a really fun place. Just accept the FACT that all maga men are racist nazis and that all lib men can have babies and play women sports.
you’ll be fine
 

LafayetteBear

All-American
Nov 30, 2009
33,428
8,595
113
ok help me out here. To me iCE agents were sent to Minneapolis to find and arrest illegal migrants,

Is there another reason? you said it seems clear..is this the same clear reason in your mind or is there another?
Ned: Immigrants, both legal and illegal, can be found in every city and town of this country. Yet Trump has been sending his ICE agents exclusively to Blue cities and states. You honestly want to continue maintaining that there is nothing political in Trump's decisions on where to send ICE agents? That simply does not pass the smell test.

And BTW, these ICE agents are thugs, plain and simple. They are largely ex-military with NO training on actual policing or, in particular, dealing with crowd control. Their impulse is to shoot first and ask questions later. They compounded it by refusing to allow a doctor to render medical assistance to the woman who was shot. One of the ICE agents, when asked by said doctor to allow him to provide such care, said no. And when said doctor noted the urgency of the woman's situation, the ICE agent said "I don't care." It's all on videotape.
 
  • Like
Reactions: UrHuckleberry

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
Ned: Immigrants, both legal and illegal, can be found in every city and town of this country. Yet Trump has been sending his ICE agents exclusively to Blue cities and states. You honestly want to continue maintaining that there is nothing political in Trump's decisions on where to send ICE agents? That simply does not pass the smell test.

And BTW, these ICE agents are thugs, plain and simple. They are largely ex-military with NO training on actual policing or, in particular, dealing with crowd control. Their impulse is to shoot first and ask questions later. They compounded it by refusing to allow a doctor to render medical assistance to the woman who was shot. One of the ICE agents, when asked by said doctor to allow him to provide such care, said no. And when said doctor noted the urgency of the woman's situation, the ICE agent said "I don't care." It's all on videotape.
 

TigerGrowls

Heisman
Dec 21, 2001
44,323
33,430
113
What if we are legal but haven't memorized our SSNs? Would you allow us to go with you peacefully instead of slamming us to the ground face first and traumatizing our child waiting inside the car?


Biden issued ss numbers to millions of illegals so that doesn't help.
 

tboonpickens

Heisman
Sep 19, 2001
20,066
35,572
113
Wow look Ned and other board chuds...more ******** exposed involving the cold blooded murder of an innocent American citizen by unlawful thugs who had no authority to detain her...

 

baltimorened

All-Conference
May 29, 2001
5,534
4,025
113
Ned: Immigrants, both legal and illegal, can be found in every city and town of this country. Yet Trump has been sending his ICE agents exclusively to Blue cities and states. You honestly want to continue maintaining that there is nothing political in Trump's decisions on where to send ICE agents? That simply does not pass the smell test.

And BTW, these ICE agents are thugs, plain and simple. They are largely ex-military with NO training on actual policing or, in particular, dealing with crowd control. Their impulse is to shoot first and ask questions later. They compounded it by refusing to allow a doctor to render medical assistance to the woman who was shot. One of the ICE agents, when asked by said doctor to allow him to provide such care, said no. And when said doctor noted the urgency of the woman's situation, the ICE agent said "I don't care." It's all on videotape.
first of all, I have never commented on a blue state only strategy from ICE, so there's that. But, what difference does that make? ICE charter is to find and arrest people in the country illegally. If they are only in blue cities, that's suspect. But according to AI:

The question of where ICE operates is currently a subject of intense political debate:
  • Targeting "Democrat-run" cities: The current administration has publicly directed and prioritized a "flood" of ICE agents and aggressive enforcement actions in Democratic-led cities and "sanctuary" jurisdictions due to local law enforcement's refusal to fully cooperate with federal immigration detainer requests.
  • Higher Visibility Operations: In these non-cooperative jurisdictions, ICE often conducts highly visible "at-large" or "community" arrests (worksite, street, and home operations) because they cannot easily arrest individuals in local jails. Recent high-profile operations have occurred in Los Angeles, Chicago, Charlotte, New Orleans, and Minneapolis, sparking significant media coverage and protests.
  • Cooperation in "Republican-led" states: In Republican-leaning states, a higher percentage of ICE arrests occur quietly within prisons and jails, where local authorities routinely transfer individuals to federal custody, often out of public sight. Texas, a Republican-led state, has the highest overall number of ICE arrests.
  • Legal Landscape: Federal law generally allows ICE agents to make arrests in public areas across the country. However, the level of cooperation from local authorities and the existence of "sanctuary" policies in some areas create a "patchwork system" of enforcement, leading to varied outcomes for immigrants based on where they live.
In short, ICE has a national presence, but enforcement looks different in various locations depending on local political and legal environments.

So it seems as if cooperation with ICE by law enforcement is a factor in the discussion which is not discussed.

I don't profess to know exactly what happened in Minneapolis. And apparently neither do most people. I've seen arguments by seemingly intelligent people, who have watched the same videos, who are diametrically opposed in their opinion of what happened.

I accept what you say about the doctor. I have neither seen nor heard the videos you referenced. But while I find you often opinionated, I believe you post with honesty, so I accept your statement. And ICE should have let the doctor help.

But, while we're on the subject, as I posted yesterday, we have immigration laws, and we created an agency to enforce those laws. Yet we have elected leaders actively opposing the ability of those LE agents to enforce those laws. makes no sense. Same with MS Good, actively engaged in an organization to limit ICE ability and, depending on who you believe, put her car in position it was specifically to block ICE. I don't think that officer should have fired his gun, but I also understand the fight or flight concept. But, neither he nor Ms Good should have been in that circumstance in the first place.

What's happened to us? It used to be everybody, or at least most, obeyed our laws. Now we have active groups and even elected officials doing all they can to obstruct. Some might not like the laws, heck, I don't like all the laws, but we're supposed to obey. People who are in the country illegally are violating our laws. if we don't like the law, change it but in the interim aren't we all supposed to comply?
 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
What's happened to us? It used to be everybody, or at least most, obeyed our laws. Now we have active groups and even elected officials doing all they can to obstruct. Some might not like the laws, heck, I don't like all the laws, but we're supposed to obey. People who are in the country illegally are violating our laws. if we don't like the law, change it but in the interim aren't we all supposed to comply?
Here's Ned, the same guy who openly stated that he doesn't care that Trump committed high crimes and voted to let the inmates run the asylum anyway, wants to know why people aren't obeying the law.
 

UrHuckleberry

Heisman
Jun 2, 2024
9,465
19,354
113
while no one has accurate data - a problem in itself - it is estimated that there are between 78,000 and 130,000 illegal migrants in Minneapolis. I don't know any more than you what the actual reason for ICE to be there, but seems as if it's a "target rich environment" if your stated purpose is immigration enforcement.
Oh look, another walks like a duck, quacks like a duck situation that you don’t want to say is a duck because you can’t be 100% sure.

it’s the winter. In Minneapolis. There are like 50+ other cities with equal or greater number of undocumented but sure, sending a large show of force immediately after they’re in the news isn’t political. Nailed it.
 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113


Do you kweers get anything right m? Like , seriously,.


She wasn't part of ICE Watch disability boy but are you saying that watching someone is a crime worthy of murder? That's where you've landed?

"Renee Nicole Good was involved with groups that observe Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) activities in Minneapolis, acting as a legal observer to ensure rights were protected, though she wasn't part of an "ICE Watch" organization but rather a citizen monitoring ICE, and her death has ignited controversy over ICE actions. She was shot and killed by an ICE agent in Minneapolis, sparking protests and debate, with officials differing on whether the agent was justified, notes MPR News.
Key Details:
  • Role: Renee Good was a prize-winning poet, mother, and legal observer for ICE activities, documenting the agency's enforcement actions.
  • Incident: She was shot by an ICE agent in Minneapolis while present during an ICE operation, leading to clashes between federal and local officials over the use of force, say BBC and PBS.
  • Controversy: Her death has led to significant protests and differing narratives, with some calling her a terrorist and others highlighting her peaceful role as an observer." https://share.google/aimode/QPnWfFiv5YXy5qW8Z

1767964611031.png
 
  • Haha
Reactions: JohnHughsPartner

JohnHughsPartner

All-American
Nov 19, 2016
4,317
6,615
113
Were there people trying to say it was justified?
Let me help out your retardation

Piece of sh!!t activist tries to run over a cop with her vehicle(considered a deadly weapon) gets shot in the face and dies

Black man with criminal history attacks young lady from behind and slits her throat for absolutely no reason. She dies

Pretty much the same thing, no ?
 

JohnHughsPartner

All-American
Nov 19, 2016
4,317
6,615
113
She wasn't part of ICE Watch disability boy but are you saying that watching someone is a crime worthy of murder? That's where you've landed?

"Renee Nicole Good was involved with groups that observe Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) activities in Minneapolis, acting as a legal observer to ensure rights were protected, though she wasn't part of an "ICE Watch" organization but rather a citizen monitoring ICE, and her death has ignited controversy over ICE actions. She was shot and killed by an ICE agent in Minneapolis, sparking protests and debate, with officials differing on whether the agent was justified, notes MPR News.
Key Details:
  • Role: Renee Good was a prize-winning poet, mother, and legal observer for ICE activities, documenting the agency's enforcement actions.
  • Incident: She was shot by an ICE agent in Minneapolis while present during an ICE operation, leading to clashes between federal and local officials over the use of force, say BBC and PBS.
  • Controversy: Her death has led to significant protests and differing narratives, with some calling her a terrorist and others highlighting her peaceful role as an observer." https://share.google/aimode/QPnWfFiv5YXy5qW8Z

View attachment 1128479
No I’m saying trying to run over a cop is worthy of that , b!!tch
 

JohnHughsPartner

All-American
Nov 19, 2016
4,317
6,615
113
She wasn't part of ICE Watch disability boy but are you saying that watching someone is a crime worthy of murder? That's where you've landed?

"Renee Nicole Good was involved with groups that observe Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) activities in Minneapolis, acting as a legal observer to ensure rights were protected, though she wasn't part of an "ICE Watch" organization but rather a citizen monitoring ICE, and her death has ignited controversy over ICE actions. She was shot and killed by an ICE agent in Minneapolis, sparking protests and debate, with officials differing on whether the agent was justified, notes MPR News.
Key Details:
  • Role: Renee Good was a prize-winning poet, mother, and legal observer for ICE activities, documenting the agency's enforcement actions.
  • Incident: She was shot by an ICE agent in Minneapolis while present during an ICE operation, leading to clashes between federal and local officials over the use of force, say BBC and PBS.
  • Controversy: Her death has led to significant protests and differing narratives, with some calling her a terrorist and others highlighting her peaceful role as an observer." https://share.google/aimode/QPnWfFiv5YXy5qW8Z

View attachment 1128479
“She wasn’t part of ice watch “

how do you know this ? Don’t know her personally ?
 

dpic73

Heisman
Jul 27, 2005
29,770
21,962
113
No I’m saying trying to run over a cop is worthy of that , b!!tch
One of the cops to her left told her to move and when the agents started moving towards her she said she was "pulling out" when a cop not following protocol walked in front of her car that she didn't see. Her wife wasn't in the car so she was obviously moving out of the way and not trying to harm the agent and drive away unless you really believe she planned to leave her wife on the side of the road.



You magats are of the devil