There is no point anymore NIL
- Thread starter RUdepressed
- Start date
It’s already here plenty of players getting paid or free tuition at private schools.
I remember back even in my day- late 70's highschool- we had a kid in my neighborhood that was by far the best baseball player in town. Jewish kid and our HS was excited about this kid coming to play for us. He was also my best friend in the neighborhood. Our school just had one kid make it to MLB as a pitcher and was thinking they would have another one right behind him. This was up in the Poughkeepsie/Hyde Park area of NY. Next thing we know, he isn't coming to school with us but living with a family 15 miles away and this Jewish kid is pitching for Our Lady's of Lourdes HS...tuition free. Though, he did always invite us to all the house parties students would have when their parents went away on vacation.
With us- many years later- DBP offered full scholarship for Kevin to come play for them. He decided he wanted to keep playing ball with his friends instead of with a bunch of kids he didn't know. Plus, he said he liked girls too much...lol
Have to say for a program/University that was hands down the biggest winner in the expansion sweepstakes.We have a lot of complainters.
Before the Mulcahy/Schiano team got here. We were a perpetual bottom feeder in the Big East.
After we were admitted to the BIG in 2014.
We had to compete in the Big Ten on a Big East budget for years. We still are not operating with a full share because we are paying back loans.
If we grow in the next 11 years like we have since 2014 (when we joined) the sky is the limit.
We have people on this board that think we should hire a coach for half the price, ( Kyle flood 2.0) how did that workout for us?
Others think we should go to the FCS?
All this in a thread started by a guy who has been pumping up NIL every chance he gets and now apparently has thrown in the towel.
Forget about a new coach or a new conference. What I think we need is a new message board with a new message.
This board right now is the whiner board.
Jersey strong my a##.
We finally have a president, an AD and a university in alignment. The results will be there.
Rutgers is in the best conference hands down!
It’s the rest of college athletics that is truly on the brink of collapse. If the powers to be don’t figure it out soon. College sports as we know it will go the way of the phone booth.
Before the Mulcahy/Schiano team got here. We were a perpetual bottom feeder in the Big East.
After we were admitted to the BIG in 2014.
We had to compete in the Big Ten on a Big East budget for years. We still are not operating with a full share because we are paying back loans.
If we grow in the next 11 years like we have since 2014 (when we joined) the sky is the limit.
We have people on this board that think we should hire a coach for half the price, ( Kyle flood 2.0) how did that workout for us?
Others think we should go to the FCS?
All this in a thread started by a guy who has been pumping up NIL every chance he gets and now apparently has thrown in the towel.
Forget about a new coach or a new conference. What I think we need is a new message board with a new message.
This board right now is the whiner board.
Jersey strong my a##.
We finally have a president, an AD and a university in alignment. The results will be there.
Rutgers is in the best conference hands down!
It’s the rest of college athletics that is truly on the brink of collapse. If the powers to be don’t figure it out soon. College sports as we know it will go the way of the phone booth.
A ton of great points- and it is funny- I have moved to being ok- to let GS 2.0 go at anytime unless he runs the table against everyone not named OSU.
And I see the same thing- Replace Schiano but offer them half....WTF - Greg's contract may seem like a lot to us but he is in the bottom half of the B1G...
And I am sorry about all of the accounting maneuvering but the football team is responsible for taking in tons of cash- I really give 2 ***** about the costs of stadium expansions a decade and a half ago- So- if anyone wants to replace Greg with a coach that is going to do better... It is not going to be a guy for half the price. It will be with someone equal or more than the cost.
And if anyone thinks we should go half- then just STFU...You all really cant be that dumb to worry about 3-5 mil per year at this point. That is the cost for a couple of OL, a WR and a DT...
I don't agree. That's part of the problem, not worry about 3-5M annually as if it's monopoly money. 3-5M can be thrown to assistants or revenue share. 5M would be around 33% of the cap, that's not insignificant. 5-6M is about all LSU had last year in NIL before revenue sharing. People complain we don't have money but then are fine with inefficiently using millions of dollars that can be put to other uses. Fans act the same way as ADs...other people's money so what's a few million (or 10s of millions more)....but when crap hits the fan then everyone complains. These things should be thought out before that and in case that happens.
Matt Campbell makes 5M now and it just got bumped recently. His first contract was 4M some odd. Willie Fritz 4.5M. Brent Key 4.5M. Bielema's first deal at Illinois was 4.2M. Cignetti's first deal at IU was 4M. Clark Lea is under 4M now. Chris Klieman's first deal was really low and is making just over 5M now. If you look at some of these first contracts that area is common. It's the unnecessary renegotiation that drives them up. GS' first deal was even 4M.
I'm not against paying big salaries. I'm against paying big salaries for poor return. Spending more money guarantees you nothing and doesn't increase the odds of success of a coaching hire either. Highly incentivized contracts (with no outs except NFL) that handsomely reward above average to high level results is much more sensible than throwing out long term largely or fully guaranteed deals regardless of the results that follow. Highly incentivized deals can get a coach anywhere from the high singles to mid teens in salary in a given year and that's perfectly fine with me and fair to both sides. It'll be happily paid by the school too. But if the performance isn't there then stay down at a reasonable base salary which is still millions of dollars.
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Folks don’t seem to understand how few Cernetti’s there are compared to other mid major success stories that fail miserably at the next level. The Indiana story is the exception not the rule.
PS - we heard all last season how badly we missed on Leipold the next rising star. Can’t resist pointing out how he just got smacked by 4-4 K-State at home. The grass isn’t always greener.
PS - we heard all last season how badly we missed on Leipold the next rising star. Can’t resist pointing out how he just got smacked by 4-4 K-State at home. The grass isn’t always greener.
Yes and other high level mid major and P4 HCs and coordinators also fail miserably. Any pool you choose from can fail and I don’t see any discernible difference in probabilities between the pools.
More reason to be conservative and not to bet the farm on anyone knowing that.
You can even say the same about CC too. How do we know what he’s going to do for the next 10 years. No one knows but his new contract assumes he’ll keep on performing annually at the level he has these last two.
That too. The point is, the grass isn’t always greener and even if you find a “good deal”, after one good year, they negotiate a new contract that is no longer a bargain anyway.
That’s the thing, you have to make the effort to change the paradigm. Get rid of this idea of having outs to go for other jobs in the P4, only allow outs for the NFL.
NFL coaches can’t move around and neither can other professional coaches. They have to honor their deals and wait til the end of their deals.
Also my point isn’t about getting bargains. It’s about avoiding overpaying for poor returns. Under a highly incentivized structure CC could’ve made as much last year and this year as he does in the new deal he just got. It just avoids overpaying in the years he may not perform at that level and adjusts the pay accordingly for a given year.
Compensation is flexible depending on the results of a given year and you can add a clause to add 1-2 yrs automatically based on high level results in a given year if there are 3 or less years left on the contract. So you’d never have more than 5 years left on a deal. Create a structure that “lives and breathes” and adjusts to the circumstances of the moment. It’s a structure that is fair to both sides.
Agents changed the paradigm to sort of normalize these long deals 7-10yr deals. Everyone just went along following this “bad example.” So why can’t some of the schools change the paradigm and set a “good example” and structure smarter flexible deals that compensate according to performance and don’t encourage constant renegotiation based on just 1-2 years of performance.
The groundwork has to be laid when a coach is first hired. You’ll unlikely be able to do it with a sitting head coach.
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The problem is this. A program like Rutgers flat out cannot afford (long term) to be pulled back down to the “Ashes” with a massive strike out right now. in the current conference merry go round of an environment that is moving more and more in the direction of professional ball each day, we would no doubt be punted from our big boy league.
Realignment is going to hit a crossroad eventually at which point the haves and have nots will be more settled, but we’re not there. Not by a long shot. Purdue is an elite BB program. They can more afford to be a laughing stock of football than us. A year or two of 2-10 seasons right now would put us at major long term risk. And yes, not only could it happen, it’s more likely to happen than the chance of us hitting a home run (even a minor one).
That doesn’t mean we should never make a change. When a time comes where a year or two of disaster seasons won’t feel like this major risk of getting shoved out entirely - that’s when a move should be considered in my opinion. Just too risky right now.
I haven't mentioned making a change or not in any of my posts. I have no control over it, what will be will be if/when the time comes.
My point was about the whole deal with regards to the way coaching contracts are structured. But if we do ever make a change, I hope we're smarter about it along the lines of what I suggested.
This is in relation to 3rd party NIL deals that can go over the cap and validating their veracity through the clearinghouse. They are undermanned and there is a backlog so some reports of athletes just not bothering and take the deals around it.
I am holding hope that having a President and AD that are aligned in making our sport relevant, will make the difference.
Finding the right coach won’t mean a damn thing without their full support.
Think about when Greg came back and before that when Day was named Ohio State’s HC.
Do you really think there would be a huge difference? Would Day have us going to the Playoffs and Greg would have OSU at 6-8 wins max each year if they had switched places.
would Cignette be this successful at Indiana if they didn’t provide so much support and Mark Cuban’s money?
Finding the right coach won’t mean a damn thing without their full support.
Think about when Greg came back and before that when Day was named Ohio State’s HC.
Do you really think there would be a huge difference? Would Day have us going to the Playoffs and Greg would have OSU at 6-8 wins max each year if they had switched places.
would Cignette be this successful at Indiana if they didn’t provide so much support and Mark Cuban’s money?
Sure having the full support of the president and AD helps but if you don't have the right coach, that won't mean anything either. A&M all these years didn't have alignment? Nebraska all those years out int the wilderness? FSU and PSU struggling recently? They both went all in big time this year. USC all these years since Carroll? Everything matters.
I can think of a more recent example where the admin wanted the coach out and he went out and won the conference lol....Charles Huff. I heard a few more details recently on a pod and they knew they were moving on from him around week 3 of last year but he just kept on winning games and the Sun Belt eventually at Marshall lol. Obviously not a good situation, and weird one at that. No alignment there (not that you don't want support from top to bottom), so coaching matters a lot. He's gone to Southern Miss now and brought 21 Marshall players with him (not all due to money as I've posted quotes here) and a team that was 1-11 last year is currently 6-2/4-0.
Also Cuban only donated to athletics for the first time to IU at the end of CC's first season there not before it. This year, I can potentially believe any number. Last year before revenue sharing not as much. We now know LSU has 18M this year for NIL (thanks to revenue sharing) which Kelly said was more than 3 times what they had last year, which means 5-6M probably. So if LSU had 5-6M in 3rd party NIL last year I'm not going to believe that most average everyday programs were swimming in it.
It looks like some common sense is being used in player contracts, why not coaching contracts in the way I suggested as well....reasonable base compensation and performance based incentives to take it up much higher. Also goes to show not every NIL deal headline is factual. It can be misleading. Some are real but not all.
From the article:
While universities have no problem throwing millions in buyouts at coaches who can't win, they're increasing performance-based deals for players in case they don't meet expectations.
There's the fine print few see, and all will soon realize. While many players are making significant financial gains, the majority aren't.
For everyone else, it's a crapshoot of sorts. Those who perform at a high level are paid, those who don't, aren't paid for long.
There was a time when the idea of player accountability in the new era of pay-for-play meant dealing with unruly fans stalking them with social media muscles. But the more impactful consequence is universities and boosters clawing back money in performance-based NIL deals.
Nearly all revenue sharing deals with schools, and private NIL deals, are one-year contracts.
Or as one college football general manager told USA Today Sports: “Do you realize how much lost money is in the transfer portal every single season?”
Produce and get paid another season. Struggle, and your number decreases through clawbacks.
One final dose of fiscal reality: more than 3,400 FBS players entered the 2024-25 transfer portal.
That’s a lot of dead money.
From the article:
While universities have no problem throwing millions in buyouts at coaches who can't win, they're increasing performance-based deals for players in case they don't meet expectations.
There's the fine print few see, and all will soon realize. While many players are making significant financial gains, the majority aren't.
For everyone else, it's a crapshoot of sorts. Those who perform at a high level are paid, those who don't, aren't paid for long.
There was a time when the idea of player accountability in the new era of pay-for-play meant dealing with unruly fans stalking them with social media muscles. But the more impactful consequence is universities and boosters clawing back money in performance-based NIL deals.
Nearly all revenue sharing deals with schools, and private NIL deals, are one-year contracts.
Or as one college football general manager told USA Today Sports: “Do you realize how much lost money is in the transfer portal every single season?”
Produce and get paid another season. Struggle, and your number decreases through clawbacks.
One final dose of fiscal reality: more than 3,400 FBS players entered the 2024-25 transfer portal.
That’s a lot of dead money.