yup. Don’t think many people truly believed they wouldn’t be able to play this years majors.
next years majors are a different story
OT: Phil Mickelson
- Thread starter Knightmoves
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yup. Don’t think many people truly believed they wouldn’t be able to play this years majors.
next years majors are a different story
I think for Phil, Justin and Brooks nothing changes. They are all qualified to play.
agree. I don’t think qualification changes At all
only thing that will (could) change is LIV golfers won’t have OWGR points…hence making it very tough to qualify.
they likely will all allow liv players if qualified.
All going to make it hard for LiV players to qualify though
Actually Augusta has more avenues to qualify outside the PGA/DP Tour then any other major
But they could easily change those avenues as they see fit. I agree it would be hard to ban past champs, but they could start curbing other avenues. I have no idea if they will or won't, but Augusta beats to its own drum so who really knows what they will decide to do.
Any link or reference to this.
It boggles the mind they would throw away billions with no financial return in the near horizon.
Only the haters are predicting no financial return. Who really they have no plan??
Yes, I have worked with these Middle East sovereign wealth funds before. They go all in at the beginning. But once they realize it can’t stand on its own two feet, they pull the plug. Seen them walk away from mid 9 figure investments.
It’s good for players that are exempt for majors. Otherwise, Players need to go through the qualifiers rout.
Do you think they can sell enough tickets to cover the expenses? TV money….or internet money? Show me how they generate the revenues.
With the backing of the PIF, LIV has the luxury of operating at a loss for as long as it needs to in order to build the product. Being backed by a $600 billion war chest that plans to grow to $1 trillion by 2030 not only changes the playing field but alters the rules of the game.
Reading up on Saudi 2030 Vision is also an interesting read in relation to LIV
The entire Saudi fund is $600 billion hoping to grow to $1 trillion. They don't have $600 billion "set aside" for LIV golf. LIV golf is but one very small portion of that $600 billion. And as it says, they want to grow that fund to $1 trillion.
That is the risky part for these golfers. They could at any point decide to pull the plug. Looking at balance sheets might make that happen sooner rather than later.
I haven't seen anything on how the bonuses are paid. So apparently Mickelson got $200 million to sign onto the tour. Was that a lump sum signing bonus or paid out over time?
That's what I was wondering myself.
If I was dealing with the Saudi's, I'd make sure that was paid in full and the check cleared before I tee'd off.
Right, they have $600 billion set aside for fill-in-the-blank-washing through their Saudi 2030 vision -- it's not $600 billion specific set aside only for LIV but it shows they have a crap ton of money to spend regardless of how frivolous their plans may seem. In regards to hoping to grow the fund to $1 trillion, looking at oil prices/profits lately, I don't think they'll have any trouble hitting that number.
The fund is invested in all kinds of things. It's not all money to just throw at projects to wash their reputation.
If LIV is floundering, say 5-7 years from now, don't be surprised if the Saudi's alter the situation. But by that point, guys like Mickelson and Johnson and Norman will have milked them for hunreds of millions combined.
They will definitely find a TV home. ESPN televises cornhole, Sky Sports in Europe darts. They aren't worried about a landing spot for TV home. Most of the Golf equipment guys are still in. I think Callaway is out on Phil only so far. He wasn't dropped either. Sponsors won't be an issue.
I don't think it will last that long.
It's simply not based on economics. At some point, even Saudi's are going to want to an ROI, which I don't think that tour will deliver. The things that make it attractive now are also the things that make it unstable.
Too few tournaments, 3 rounds, no points for winning. Once the initial money grab flows through, what are you left with? They are either going to have to alter it to better monetize it, which will make it less attractive or they are going to have to be willing to lose lots of money to keep it going.
I doubt the latter will be that attractive an option at some point.
It's simply not based on economics. At some point, even Saudi's are going to want to an ROI, which I don't think that tour will deliver. The things that make it attractive now are also the things that make it unstable.
Too few tournaments, 3 rounds, no points for winning. Once the initial money grab flows through, what are you left with? They are either going to have to alter it to better monetize it, which will make it less attractive or they are going to have to be willing to lose lots of money to keep it going.
I doubt the latter will be that attractive an option at some point.
Can't say milked if the Saudis feel the players they sign up and play to be in the LIV tour are not only for tour PR but to put a kinder gentler image of that country to the world though backing golf and other sports entertainment venues.
It's the PR part that makes me feel Saudi Arabia will put bookoo bucks in the LIV and consider it a sucess if the world starts looking at the Sudies in a better light and have better interactions with it, even if tour fails to become a successful venture
That's why they are doing this. It's PR for their state. The question is how much are they willing to pay for that and will there be better ways to spend that money than on golf. This tour will not turn a profit for a very long time if ever.
Money good. They will never default on a payment. But the leash is shorter than people think for the league.
You don't think they get a TV contract?? You think the only sponsors in the world are the ones on the PGA??
No chance they get real sponsors. No upside for coronating to be in bed with Saudi.
They will get real sponsors. And plenty of them. Foreign companies don't care. Most Americans don't care either. Phil was still the most popular guy at the open. Nobody cares about Nike. Nobody cares where the NBA gets money from. No body care that the DP Tour gets money from the Saudis.
Nike or the NBA aren’t sponsored. They have a strong connection to China but that’s different than sponsorship. If you were right, why did the sponsors drop Dustin and Phil? Maybe the other Saudi can fill in but that’s left pocket to right pocket.
From a players perspective, 100%. But from a sponsor/LIV perspective, it matters.
How?? As I said no one cares, except you and Chamblee I guess. Europeans certainly don't care. The DP Tour is sponsored by the UAE which is another human rights issue country run by Arabs. FIFA is locked in step with Qarter who has enslaved workers to finish building the Stadiums for the World Cup. Yet no one is going bonkers as much as you are.
I don't buy this view. The Saudi's must think there are economics behind this or they wouldn't do it. All the LIV tour has done is shine a light on Saudi Arabia. They are better off investing in things outside the limelight and building their wealth on the down-low. No one is sitting here saying 'Phil Mickelson and Brooks Koepka think the Saudi's are A-OK...therefore they must be nice.
The Saudi's will want a return on their investment and the best way for the PGA to turn the tables on them is to make this a moral question which they have done. I fully expect LIV Golf to struggle for sponsorship money and fan money and eventually it'll wither away when the Saudi's think it isn't worth throwing more money at it.
You bring up a good issue. Can LIV get sponsors going forward, like next season? They need sponsors and TV, otherwise they are just a minor league carnival in professional golf.
I watched the tournament from London online, maybe due to the novelty of it. But I doubt I’ll watch the next one from Portland next week. It seems more like an exhibition rather than a golf tournament.
Does anyone care if Bryson or Koepka win the next LIV tournament by 3 strokes? I’d say No.
People ask can if they get sponsors. Of course they can. Those that don't must think only the current US companies are interested in golf. The LIV is a world tour. The PGA is a US Tour.
The Brits care. They didn't want the Saudi's bid to buy Newcastle in the Premier League to go thru, but Boris made it happen and how they are sportswashing there as well.
Could offer prize money and then let players to wager that prize money on head to head matchups, on a particular hole, etc., just like the rest of us weekend duffers would.