Not from behind a microphone
The best part is, JP has been in the same room as Donte and never said a word to him.
Jason Peter is a piece of ****, regardless of his comments to Donte Williams.
Not from behind a microphone
How do you know he isn't the root cause? How do you know he isn't teaching poor fundamentals. I've seen our DBs playing the ball on many occasions, and that is poor fundamentals. Is it being supported by Diaco? Who knows. In the end it doesn't matter.
This is no different than any other program. If your program sucks, people are going to publicly criticize. If they don't like it, then improve.
The best part is, JP has been in the same room as Donte and never said a word to him.
Jason Peter is a piece of ****, regardless of his comments to Donte Williams.
Lol. Passion can be a combination of things.
Tuco has passion, he just doesn't want to admit it. I can see it in his posts. Passionate.
The vast majority of successful football players are passionate people and ready to wage war on the football field. TO and JP see it intrinsically in a player, and have my respect as former experts in the field of play. Jason may be an asshat but he is simply MOTO on this topic. GBR
I wonder, Tuco, if the player led excellence that the guys under Osborne strived for wasn't the result of those guys feeling like they were part of some bigger excellence than just their own development? What I mean is that they felt like Husker football was something special, something of excellence that was bigger than they were as individuals and that they wanted to be a part of. That is why I think your military analogy is so good here. Pardon my presumption (since I never served) but isn't it true that one of the biggest motivations for a serviceman or woman to push themselves to the breaking point and beyond is that they feel as if they are part of something of excellence, something bigger and more important than them as individuals, something that they want therefore to be a contributing part of?Bull ****. Jason Peter would have been the same crass ******* regardless of who coached him. He would have had the same fire in his belly. That is who he is.
I guess we have different definitions of passion, what you are describing is more derived from accountability. Jano was a beast in the weight room, there have been plenty of others. Guys with passion and fire in their belly don't care if you are requiring them to be there or if it is voluntary, they will be there working. Making a guy show up to the weight room isn't going to make him work harder or anything else. It's just going to make him go to the weight room. That is tough thing to fix. It wasn't like Pelini's guys were tearing it up in the weight room either and he forced them to go.
There were players in the hay day that didn't work hard and didn't have passion, but they fell behind. That is the biggest difference between then and now is the fact that today, the best players don't necessarily have the best work ethic or passion. In those days the best players were typically the hardest workers. But that goes back to who is holding them accountable. Osborne's teams were player lead, Pelini ruled with an iron fist, Riley want a player lead team but as I said, unfortunately the best players aren't always the leaders and don't have the fire that Osborne's teams had. But I know for a fact Osborne didn't interfere with "day to day discipline" of showing up for workouts or who worked and who didn't. That was 100 on the players. That is what is missing. IMHO
Absolutely right. Further, it was only a matter of time before the "racist" ******** came up on the radio. Whether you agreed or disagreed with content of the statements or the manner in which they were made, try and leave the psychoanalysis out of it.I don't want any political correctness mixed in with my football.
This feels like a political discussion more than a football discussion.
Like I said, Williams is part of this problem but hardly the root cause of it.
Singling out our D-back play and coaching is like coming home to find out that your house has burned down and going on a rant about the fact that your kid forgot to take out the garbage -- while you may be technically correct that it should have been taken out, it really serves no purpose and makes you look like an idiot.
Agree with JP on the issue that the current team, top to bottom, on both sides of the ball, plays soft. Just like a PAC-12 team.
I wonder, Tuco, if the player led excellence that the guys under Osborne strived for wasn't the result of those guys feeling like they were part of some bigger excellence than just their own development? What I mean is that they felt like Husker football was something special, something of excellence that was bigger than they were as individuals and that they wanted to be a part of. That is why I think your military analogy is so good here. Pardon my presumption (since I never served) but isn't it true that one of the biggest motivations for a serviceman or woman to push themselves to the breaking point and beyond is that they feel as if they are part of something of excellence, something bigger and more important than them as individuals, something that they want therefore to be a contributing part of?
If that is true, then perhaps what has been lacking at NU for some time now with regard to players motivating themselves, is precisely the lack of that overall sense of the excellence and specialness of Husker football? Doesn't that then lead to a break down of the chemistry of teamwork and the development of a room full of individuals instead? And as I said that has been going on for several years now at NU. So Riley is not to be completely blamed for this reality, and his failure may reside in an inability to reinstill that culture of excellence rather than in being a failure at the X's and O's.
In fact, I would argue that almost all experienced coaches at this level are probably excellent with the X's and O's. What separates the good coaches from the bad ones has little to do with the techniques of football. Rather, it has to do with their ability to create that self motivational culture of excellence. And that sometimes is just something a coach has or doesn't. A function of their gravitas and charisma as a person. Great leaders just have that "something" that can't be taught. Leadership is not a technique. It is the whole package.
People who know Riley greatly admire him. Look up to him. He is well thought of in the profession for a reason. I wonder if, had things not gone south this year and he was still going to be around, he would have been able to flip the culture in the locker room. Who knows? We will most likely never know now.
i was talking about this thread/discussion feeling more political than being about football.That's because JP probably doesn't really have a problem with any one given staff or player.
JP has problems with modern kids basically (and by extension modern parenting/coaching). And he's upset that very few, if any coaches, use methods he was used to in the 70's and 80's.
When Scott comes in here and wins a few games without running the team into the ground physically (pretty much every coach operates with a fairly tight set of NCAA prescriptions), he won't say two peeps about it because it won't matter anymore when the W's are there.
JP also doesn't point out that Bama doesn't have kids lifting 7000lbs without the safety belts either because it would deflate his soundbite.
This is spot-on I think. Great analysis of the Pelini to Riley dynamic.Absolutely true. But I think there are smaller issues that have bigger effects. I believe when you change leaders, especially coaches and managers, the type of leader you are replacing can be problematic and it’s not always the fault of the new manager.
When Bo Pelini took over, the team was in need of discinline, especially on the defensive side of the ball. In that aspect Pelini was a perfect fit. He took players that probably wanted to be held accountable and did so. Where he failed, in my opinion, is that he never transitioned to a player lead team. He required kids to go to class, he required attendance at events, he demanded things. The players never owned it. Then when he allowed players like Gregory to fail drug tests and still play, he really failed. Again in my opinion. Then SE hired a guy like Mike Riley that is 100% about player responsibility and ownership. A group of kids that have had their hand held to the fire for their entire time at Nebraska, we’re now told they had some freedom and they took advantage. See Nate Gerry. Had their been any sort of player leadership allowed by Pelini, the transition is probably much smoother.
As we have discussed on occasion. It is never just one issue. The Passion argument is low hanging fruit for fans because we all have passion for Nebraska football. So we can all get behind that. But the problems run deeper than fire in the belly.
Is the current state of Nebraska a “better look” than the Nebraska of the past?What's with people being proud of people having zero filter? From government to everyday life, self restraint is a far better look than flipping out all the time. I get the thought that people think things need to be said, but this isn't leadership. It is only divisive.
Is the current state of Nebraska a “better look” than the Nebraska of the past?
There were some mean *** motherf**kers on many past Nebraska teams, Jason just happens to be one of them. Many were outspoken and would beat the hell out of you for looking at them wrong. A side effect of that is that those teams won more games head to head than most any other program. I just love people who try to put “feelings“ into football. How long before the “feelings” police start going back and shaming the past accomplishments of the great Nebraska football teams because they were mean people who beat the sh*t out of their competition, talked sh*t, and hurt your feelings? God help Nebraska football.
You can play and have an immature attitude when you are young. No one cares about "feelings", it's about carrying yourself as an adult when you are one.Is the current state of Nebraska a “better look” than the Nebraska of the past?
There were some mean *** motherf**kers on many past Nebraska teams, Jason just happens to be one of them. Many were outspoken and would beat the hell out of you for looking at them wrong. A side effect of that is that those teams won more games head to head than most any other program. I just love people who try to put “feelings“ into football. How long before the “feelings” police start going back and shaming the past accomplishments of the great Nebraska football teams because they were mean people who beat the sh*t out of their competition, talked sh*t, and hurt your feelings? God help Nebraska football.
Being an adult is overrated!!! What i wouldnt give to be back in highschool. The only reason people "act" like an adult is because society puts pressure to move beyond our "childish" past. Reality is people dont change they just learn to control the beast withinYou can play and have an immature attitude when you are young. No one cares about "feelings", it's about carrying yourself as an adult when you are one.
People do change. Getting older and wiser is real. I was a real piece of work during my college age years. An immature, needy, selfish, and clueless little smartass twit. (Side note: maybe some on here think I still am. lol.) I too was unfiltered in my speech and thought it was sophisticated to be a vulgar loudmouth.Being an adult is overrated!!! What i wouldnt give to be back in highschool. The only reason people "act" like an adult is because society puts pressure to move beyond our "childish" past. Reality is people dont change they just learn to control the beast within![]()
Well of course we "change" but not at the core of who we are. I am still the same smart *** i was in highschool, marine corps, college and as a father of 3 but when it comes out and how has changed but not what i think, just whether or not i let it come out of my mouth when how and in front of whom.People do change. Getting older and wiser is real. I was a real piece of work during my college age years. An immature, needy, selfish, and clueless little smartass twit. (Side note: maybe some on here think I still am. lol.) I too was unfiltered in my speech and thought it was sophisticated to be a vulgar loudmouth.
But I matured. As most of us do. And the greatest impetus to that process is the growing realization that you don't know everything, you are often wrong, and that most people are trying to negotiate all kinds of **** in their lives that you have no idea exists. So you learn how important it is to be civil in your speech regarding other people.
are you a teacher? I'ld be in Leavenworth by now for murder if I had to teach 12 year olds everyday.I had a 12 year old tell me to go **** myself today...thats fun
are you a teacher? I'ld be in Leavenworth by now for murder if I had to teach 12 year olds everyday.
Yeah middle school ..The profanity is so bad....I mean I have a potty mouth but have NEVER uttered anything like that in front of the kids ...These kids just are so foul mouthed its just gross ..the slurs too....its a crutch because their vocabulary is so limited but man its toughare you a teacher? I'ld be in Leavenworth by now for murder if I had to teach 12 year olds everyday.
Why should we be surprised. They have access at home to crappy vulgar movies and music all day and all night and learn from their parents and culture that it's the way people talk. I wasn't exactly a model student but man some of the stuff I see kids do now just floors me. Keep up the good fight. You never know when something you do will hit a kid just right and make a difference to him or her and maybe their family. I can still remember a few choice words from teachers who I respected that made me stop and think and I'm really old.Yeah middle school ..The profanity is so bad....I mean I have a potty mouth but have NEVER uttered anything like that in front of the kids ...These kids just are so foul mouthed its just gross ..the slurs too....its a crutch because their vocabulary is so limited but man its tough
Maybe it's because his unit sucks. D Williams has been above criticism just because he can recruit, and it's time someone pointed out his actual performance as a coach.I guess I don't understand the need for personal attacks on a guy that has been here for 8 months. I am pretty sure, of all the coaches and players that have been through the program in the last 20 years, D. Williams probably isn't anywhere near the top of the list of problems. Peter knows no one on that staff or on that team is going to retaliate or defend themselves.
Why not single out the DB coach? The guy has been above criticism since he got here. All the other coaches have gotten plenty of criticism already.I've watched our dline get pushed around and blown back for weeks, months, years. There has been no comment by JP on them. And that is, you know, the position he actually played. Why not call out something he knows and experienced? Why single out the backfield as a problem? And further why single our our db coach and not the dc, you know the guy in charge of it all? I'm not giving any of the defensive coaches any slack, but where he points his finger makes no sense and has no positive impact at all
Osborne's teams were definitely not player lead. He may have created the illusion that it was, but Osborne led everything.Bull ****. Jason Peter would have been the same crass ******* regardless of who coached him. He would have had the same fire in his belly. That is who he is.
I guess we have different definitions of passion, what you are describing is more derived from accountability. Jano was a beast in the weight room, there have been plenty of others. Guys with passion and fire in their belly don't care if you are requiring them to be there or if it is voluntary, they will be there working. Making a guy show up to the weight room isn't going to make him work harder or anything else. It's just going to make him go to the weight room. That is tough thing to fix. It wasn't like Pelini's guys were tearing it up in the weight room either and he forced them to go.
There were players in the hay day that didn't work hard and didn't have passion, but they fell behind. That is the biggest difference between then and now is the fact that today, the best players don't necessarily have the best work ethic or passion. In those days the best players were typically the hardest workers. But that goes back to who is holding them accountable. Osborne's teams were player lead, Pelini ruled with an iron fist, Riley want a player lead team but as I said, unfortunately the best players aren't always the leaders and don't have the fire that Osborne's teams had. But I know for a fact Osborne didn't interfere with "day to day discipline" of showing up for workouts or who worked and who didn't. That was 100 on the players. That is what is missing. IMHO
Now you're starting to get it. Players need to have leadership from the top before they are able to police and lead themselves effectively. It's the same for any type of organization. It all starts at the top.Absolutely true. But I think there are smaller issues that have bigger effects. I believe when you change leaders, especially coaches and managers, the type of leader you are replacing can be problematic and it’s not always the fault of the new manager.
When Bo Pelini took over, the team was in need of discinline, especially on the defensive side of the ball. In that aspect Pelini was a perfect fit. He took players that probably wanted to be held accountable and did so. Where he failed, in my opinion, is that he never transitioned to a player lead team. He required kids to go to class, he required attendance at events, he demanded things. The players never owned it. Then when he allowed players like Gregory to fail drug tests and still play, he really failed. Again in my opinion. Then SE hired a guy like Mike Riley that is 100% about player responsibility and ownership. A group of kids that have had their hand held to the fire for their entire time at Nebraska, we’re now told they had some freedom and they took advantage. See Nate Gerry. Had their been any sort of player leadership allowed by Pelini, the transition is probably much smoother.
As we have discussed on occasion. It is never just one issue. The Passion argument is low hanging fruit for fans because we all have passion for Nebraska football. So we can all get behind that. But the problems run deeper than fire in the belly.
How? It argues that Riley was in over his head and has no clue to the reality of the situation he inherited. He should have known he was taking over a team that won at least 9 games the past 7 years and that the previous coach was still popular with a lot of the players. Riley needs to know that he needed to have a strong presence in holding players accountable, especially when things weren't going well that first year.This is spot-on I think. Great analysis of the Pelini to Riley dynamic.
It argues for giving Riley more time. But at this point I think it is too late
Would you trust the 2017 win/loss column and our standing in the B1G?i wouldnt trust JP to tell me what color the sky is.
Osborne's teams were NOT player lead. He had a strong culture of a winning program before he instated the Unity Council.I dunno, I go Tradition Coalition too much.
The analysis of the Husker Program being player led is spot-on, that's how TO did it (Unity Councils). It's a passion, and if it is player led, coaching led, however led, so be it. I am not into semantics. Here is my overall take post-Solich, who also sucked at recruiting, IMO (Tom's wife will argue he got his shite together too late...whatever...we'll never know)
Cally could recruit, couldn't develop, had an NFL mentality and went pro-style. Pelini was a good hard-nosed coach, could develop, couldn't recruit for shite. Smilin Mike is a 53% career win percentage Pac-12 coach and his teams exhibit the same...
GBR
That's what 12 year olds do. After all, I knew it all when I was 12 as well. And as I grew, my respect for my parents grew as well. Now onto reality.I had a 12 year old tell me to go **** myself today...thats fun
I have all the passion in the world for things that are important to me. But again, someone screaming at me to be more passionate about something isn't going to make me more passionate. I hate sitting behind a desk, I had to do it for 8 long years, I wasn't ever going to be passionate about sitting behind a desk simply because someone yelled at me and made me sit there.
I am not afraid to admit I am passionate about Husker football. I just don't see how publicly calling out Dante Williams and how he wears his clothes is going to make Nebraska football better. Ken Griffey Jr, my neighbor when I lived in Orlando, wore his hat backward and was very conscience of his appearance on the ball field. It had no affect on his ability to play baseball or his love of the game. People who ripped on him for wearing his hat backward were just looking for something to ***** about.
Would you trust the 2017 win/loss column and our standing in the B1G?
Bull ****. Jason Peter would have been the same crass ******* regardless of who coached him. He would have had the same fire in his belly. That is who he is.
I guess we have different definitions of passion, what you are describing is more derived from accountability. Jano was a beast in the weight room, there have been plenty of others. Guys with passion and fire in their belly don't care if you are requiring them to be there or if it is voluntary, they will be there working. Making a guy show up to the weight room isn't going to make him work harder or anything else. It's just going to make him go to the weight room. That is tough thing to fix. It wasn't like Pelini's guys were tearing it up in the weight room either and he forced them to go.
There were players in the hay day that didn't work hard and didn't have passion, but they fell behind. That is the biggest difference between then and now is the fact that today, the best players don't necessarily have the best work ethic or passion. In those days the best players were typically the hardest workers. But that goes back to who is holding them accountable. Osborne's teams were player lead, Pelini ruled with an iron fist, Riley want a player lead team but as I said, unfortunately the best players aren't always the leaders and don't have the fire that Osborne's teams had. But I know for a fact Osborne didn't interfere with "day to day discipline" of showing up for workouts or who worked and who didn't. That was 100 on the players. That is what is missing. IMHO
He also knew what gun belonged to which player etc etc. In my country it doesn't matter if you separate the bull from the ****. It still sticks to your boots and smells the same. Also in my country a hay day is a pretty damned good day.Tuco,
The word is ********, not bull **** and the word is heyday, not hay day. And Osborne knew everything that was going on in the football program including players who did or did not show up for workouts and players who did or did not show up for classes. He was also in charge of all discipline within the football program, either directly or indirectly.
I have all the passion in the world for things that are important to me. But again, someone screaming at me to be more passionate about something isn't going to make me more passionate. I hate sitting behind a desk, I had to do it for 8 long years, I wasn't ever going to be passionate about sitting behind a desk simply because someone yelled at me and made me sit there.
I am not afraid to admit I am passionate about Husker football. I just don't see how publicly calling out Dante Williams and how he wears his clothes is going to make Nebraska football better. Ken Griffey Jr, my neighbor when I lived in Orlando, wore his hat backward and was very conscience of his appearance on the ball field. It had no affect on his ability to play baseball or his love of the game. People who ripped on him for wearing his hat backward were just looking for something to ***** about.
He also knew what gun belonged to which player etc etc. In my country it doesn't matter if you separate the bull from the ****. It still sticks to your boots and smells the same. Also in my country a hay day is a pretty damned good day.