Cohen and Keenum MUST try to fight this

[MSUDC11]

If they are outnumbered and can’t change it on their own, so be it.

But if it comes out that they voted yes to cancelling fall sports, just consider it a big middle finger to all of our coaches, student athletes, fans, students, alums, and the local community. And I would not be opposed to either of their removals if they support this.

 

[Willow Grove Dawg]

Tony Barnhart is a lot more credible & has better sources reporting on the SEC leadership than Forde, Wolken, & Dellenger. This entire fall will be a political ****-show if the ACC, SEC, & Big 12 play football while the Big Ten & Pac-12 sit it out but I think that is where we end up.

 

[missouridawg]

Tony Barnhart is a lot more credible & has better sources reporting on the SEC leadership than Forde, Wolken, & Dellenger. This entire fall will be a political ****-show if the ACC, SEC, & Big 12 play football while the Big Ten & Pac-12 sit it out but I think that is where we end up.

You must not follow Ross much, cause he’s extremely well connected in the SEC and covers it as good as anyone.

 

[patdog]

Cohen & Keenum have not choice but to go with majority. It will be a unanimous vote one way of the other.

 

[Willow Grove Dawg]

There is no doubt that Ross is connected & does a damned good job. I just think Barnhart has better SEC specific sources. It is a mistake for me to group him with Forde & Wolken.

 

[MSUDC11]

Cohen & Keenum have not choice but to go with majority. It will be a unanimous vote one way of the other.

Not that it would matter, but why would they have to go with the flow? The decision to go conference only was not unanimous, South Carolina’s president voted no to that if I’m not mistaken. MSU and Starkville have a lot more to lose than many of our SEC peers in all of this.

 

[Leeshouldveflanked]

This will be a cancellation of the whole 2020-2021 athletic season.... not just football. Starkville and MSU Athletics will revert to 1987.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

Nope. We aren’t going to be Ole Miss and fight a Lost Cause.

 

[57stratdawg]

If multiple Power-5 leagues do not play this fall, that seems like a ton of leverage for future plaintiff representation against a SEC school. Especially given the case trends in some of these states.

 

[mstateglfr]

If they are outnumbered and can’t change it on their own, so be it.

But if it comes out that they voted yes to cancelling fall sports, just consider it a big middle finger to all of our coaches, student athletes, fans, students, alums, and the local community. And I would not be opposed to either of their removals if they support this.

Is it a big middle finger to all them?
Or is it them wanting to try and reduce the odds of an outbreak on campus spreading across the state?
Or is it them reading the room and deciding a unanimous vote is better optics than publicized division?

 

[Kojak.sixpack]

Liability

If multiple Power-5 leagues do not play this fall, that seems like a ton of leverage for future plaintiff representation against a SEC school. Especially given the case trends in some of these states.

I am seeing a lot of this but just take it from a lawyer this can be worked out with minimal exposure to the school or conference. Football is voluntary.

 

[Shamoan]

These two clowns are going to be the first in line to fold. Count on it

 

[Philly Dawg]

It won’t be that simple. They will have recommendations from doctors and lawyers that it’s hard for a school president to ignore. They will also have consulted with their insurers to determine what kind of coverage they may have.

 

[yakalot2]

It won’t be that simple. They will have recommendations from doctors and lawyers that it’s hard for a school president to ignore. They will also have consulted with their insurers to determine what kind of coverage they may have.

Will the doctors be Facebook and Twitter approved?

 

[engie]

Especially given the case trends in some of these states.

Case trends in which states, specifically?

Also -- is the liability exposure of potentially millions of dollars greater than the guaranteed loss of the entire $110 million+ at MSU over the course of this ONE YEAR? Nevermind the reverberation of all of that.

Millions in potential loss vs hundreds of millions in guaranteed loss doesn't seem like the no brainer liability write off to me that some of you seem to imply. Maybe I'm just stupid.

 

[MSUDC11]

Is it a big middle finger to all them?
Or is it them wanting to try and reduce the odds of an outbreak on campus spreading across the state?
Or is it them reading the room and deciding a unanimous vote is better optics than publicized division?

It's a big middle finger. I believe our stakeholders would rather see them fight for our programs even if it's a lost cause than cower in fear and vote yes. Reportedly the Big 10 vote was not unanimous, there are at least two schools who voted no to cancelling the season.

If our leaders aren't gong to take a stand for all of the people who have an investment in MSU athletics, which is a very wide net, then what are they even doing? If you vote yes to killing football season, be ready to live with the consequences of setting MSU and the Starkville area back 20-30 years. And people will remember if they didn't take a stand against it.

 

[Drebin]

If multiple Power-5 leagues do not play this fall, that seems like a ton of leverage for future plaintiff representation against a SEC school. Especially given the case trends in some of these states.

Case trends mean nothing. Death and hospitalization trends are what to watch.

 

[L4Dawg]

I am seeing a lot of this but just take it from a lawyer this can be worked out with minimal exposure to the school or conference. Football is voluntary.

It's also not essential. I hope they play but I have thought all along it was a forlorn hope.

 

[L4Dawg]

Case trends mean nothing. Death and hospitalization trends are what to watch.

Case trends are a pretty good predictor of where those two will head. We have a decent idea of the %s now. What deaths and hospitalizations give you is good picture of where the epidemic was a few weeks ago.

 

[Drebin]

Case trends are a pretty good predictor of where those two will head. We have a decent idea of the %s now. What deaths and hospitalizations give you is good picture of where the epidemic was a few weeks ago.

Nah, case trends are nothing but panic porn. It's time that we stop being stupid about this.

 

[DawgNsuds]

It's also not essential. I hope they play but I have thought all along it was a forlorn hope.

Tell that to the business owners and property owners in small college towns. Spruill has already announced that she will look to raise millage rates to make up sales tax shortfalls. That may keep the City going, but won't do diddly for the numerous business's holding on in anticipation of sports resuming. That's not even accounting for the huge amounts of revenue lost by the University through TV and donations.

 

[engie]

Case trends are a pretty good predictor of where those two will head. We have a decent idea of the %s now. What deaths and hospitalizations give you is good picture of where the epidemic was a few weeks ago.

And the case trends are looking excellent across the southern vector that's been hit hard for the last 8ish weeks. Happy to post them all again slightly differently.

7 day new case count averages from August 2, then August 9. One Week. From highest per capita overall case load.
Louisiana - 1776, 1419. Down 20.1%
Arizona - 2350, 1208. Down 48.6%
Florida - 9040, 6525. Down 27.8%
Mississippi - 1178, 946. Down 19.7%
Alabama - 1735, 1413. Down 18.6%
Georgia - 3603, 3346. Down 7.1%
South Carolina - 1512, 1235. Down 18.3%
Tennessee - 2241, 1869. Down 16.6%
Texas - 8117, 7976. Down 1.8%
Arkansas - 735, 796. Up 8.3%
Missouri - 1229, 1019. Down 17.1%
Kentucky - 586, 543. Down 7.3%

In conclusion:
- Case counts are down very significantly in 7 SEC states.
- They are down notably in two more.
- Arizona might very well have hit the wall of herd immunity. No way these next 7 trend as positively as the last 7 or the virus will be totally gone there.
- They are flat in Texas. By the dates I chose it shows them up a tick in Arkansas, but the reality is that it's been plateaued there for about 10 days, the dates just fell out poorly. Both of those states are behind the majority in per capita cases overall though. Meaning they are probably a week or two away from being where the rest of us are.

7 more days that go as well as these last 7 days across the southeast and things will be looking so positive that the entire narrative will have to change. And I'm sure it will....

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

And the case trends are looking excellent across the southern vector that's been hit hard for the last 8ish weeks. Happy to post them all again slightly differently.

7 day new case count averages from August 2, then August 9. One Week. From highest per capita overall case load.
Louisiana - 1776, 1419. Down 20.1%
Arizona - 2350, 1208. Down 48.6%
Florida - 9040, 6525. Down 27.8%
Mississippi - 1178, 946. Down 19.7%
Alabama - 1735, 1413. Down 18.6%
Georgia - 3603, 3346. Down 7.1%
South Carolina - 1512, 1235. Down 18.3%
Tennessee - 2241, 1869. Down 16.6%
Texas - 8117, 7976. Down 1.8%
Arkansas - 735, 796. Up 8.3%
Missouri - 1229, 1019. Down 17.1%
Kentucky - 586, 543. Down 7.3%

In conclusion:
Case counts are down very significantly in 7 SEC states.
They are down notably in two more.
They are flat in Texas. By the dates I chose it shows them up in Arkansas, but the reality is that it's been plateaued there for about 10 days, the dates just fell out poorly. Both of those states are behind all but Missouri and Kentucky in per capita cases overall though. Meaning they are probably a couple weeks away from being where the rest of us are.

7 more days that go as well as these last 7 days across the southeast and things will be looking so positive that the entire narrative will have to change. And I'm sure it will....

This is what I am seeing as well. Pulling the plug in August is knee jerk ********. At least wait to see the numbers after school gets going and then decide if it is going back up or not.

 

[aTotal360]

IMO, this is less about player safety and more about job security. Let's say a kid with an unknown health risk gets the 'Rona and dies during the season. The AD and potentially president will be fired, then drawn and quartered. If the same kid gets sick and dies when there isn't a season, no one will care.

Most admins aren't willing to risk their jobs over this. Some will call is smart, some will call it chicken ****. I can see both sides.

 

[L4Dawg]

And the case trends are looking excellent across the southern vector that's been hit hard for the last 8ish weeks. Happy to post them all again slightly differently.

7 day new case count averages from August 2, then August 9. One Week. From highest per capita overall case load.
Louisiana - 1776, 1419. Down 20.1%
Arizona - 2350, 1208. Down 48.6%
Florida - 9040, 6525. Down 27.8%
Mississippi - 1178, 946. Down 19.7%
Alabama - 1735, 1413. Down 18.6%
Georgia - 3603, 3346. Down 7.1%
South Carolina - 1512, 1235. Down 18.3%
Tennessee - 2241, 1869. Down 16.6%
Texas - 8117, 7976. Down 1.8%
Arkansas - 735, 796. Up 8.3%
Missouri - 1229, 1019. Down 17.1%
Kentucky - 586, 543. Down 7.3%

In conclusion:
- Case counts are down very significantly in 7 SEC states.
- They are down notably in two more.
- Arizona might very well have hit the wall of herd immunity. No way these next 7 trend as positively as the last 7 or the virus will be totally gone there.
- They are flat in Texas. By the dates I chose it shows them up a tick in Arkansas, but the reality is that it's been plateaued there for about 10 days, the dates just fell out poorly. Both of those states are behind the majority in per capita cases overall though. Meaning they are probably a week or two away from being where the rest of us are.

7 more days that go as well as these last 7 days across the southeast and things will be looking so positive that the entire narrative will have to change. And I'm sure it will....

They are, but they always go up after big weekends or weeks. Can you think of anything happening this week in Mississippi? If it continues down through the next 4-6 weeks then that really would be good. You really need to give up on herd immunity. It's not ever going to happen. It will be like the flu at best.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

I'd hold off for two weeks before looking at numbers again since the school year is starting up and that's partly why I suspect the SEC chose to go with a late start.

 

[Dawgology]

Funny

It's also not essential. I hope they play but I have thought all along it was a forlorn hope.

I let the hundreds of businesses in the Okt, Lowndes, Clay area know that the revenue they depend on to survive is non-essential.

Don't worry...daddy government will print more money to help them through.

 

[engie]

It will be like the flu at best.

The thing that people carried 40+ years of immunity from last time a serious "new" flu strain hit? You keep saying that it's like the flu, when it's nothing at all like the flu.

How do you explain Arizona hitting a brick wall just as their death tolls come into line with Sweden's? Quite interesting huh. As are these curves all looking virtually identical all across the southeast.

It's almost like it's slowing down at around 2% positive tests(20% actual infection) EXACTLY like I thought it would on here over a month ago, which you fought me over.

 

[johnson86-1]

IMO, this is less about player safety and more about job security. Let's say a kid with an unknown health risk gets the 'Rona and dies during the season. The AD and potentially president will be fired, then drawn and quartered. If the same kid gets sick and dies when there isn't a season, no one will care.

Most admins aren't willing to risk their jobs over this. Some will call is smart, some will call it chicken ****. I can see both sides.

If they forego $40M in revenue from the ESPN contract because of fear of some PR flak, then they need to lose their jobs regardless. If they have a rock solid argument that ESPN has to pay them even if they don't have any games, then I guess it's a little more defensible. Hard to believe ESPN would sign a contract that doesn't make their payment obligation contingent on the SEC actually producing a product each year, but maybe they never considered the possibility that a season would be cancelled and some particular wording gives the SEC a strong argument that ESPN bears the risk of cancellation even if neither party really intended or contemplated that.

 

[L4Dawg]

I let the hundreds of businesses in the Okt, Lowndes, Clay area know that the revenue they depend on to survive is non-essential.

Don't worry...daddy government will print more money to help them through.

The students being on and staying on campus matters more, and to WAY more businesses. They aren't going to be any crowds to speak of even if we do play.

 

[L4Dawg]

The thing that people carried 40+ years of immunity from last time a serious "new" flu strain hit? You keep saying that it's like the flu, when it's nothing at all like the flu.

How do you explain Arizona hitting a brick wall just as their death tolls come into line with Sweden's? Quite interesting huh. As are these curves all looking virtually identical all across the southeast.

It's almost like it's slowing down at around 2% positive tests(20% actual infection) EXACTLY like I thought it would on here over a month ago, which you fought me over.

We will see. Do you think mask orders and the like MIGHT have helped? Keep watching Sweden. They get back from vacationing in the country in 2-3 weeks. I agree it's nothing like the flu.....its way worse and more contagious. What I was saying is that the mythical herd immunity will be like the flu. You aren't going to get lifelong immunity from this. At best it will last a year or so.

 

[johnson86-1]

It won’t be that simple. They will have recommendations from doctors and lawyers that it’s hard for a school president to ignore. They will also have consulted with their insurers to determine what kind of coverage they may have.

There is always the risk of ******** lawsuits, and I think the university counsel are giving them ****** advice. Unless we find out something new, you're not going to have a huge class action (and that probably doesn't paply at all for MSU and UM as state universities in Mississippi). It would be shocking to have a player die on any team. It would be shocking to have more than one player die in any conference. You might have some with some complications, but it will be a small number and at the end of the day, they will have a tough case to win. They will have to prove that they caught it b/c of football and not just because there is a pandemic. They will have to overcome an argument that they assumed the risk (which is a tough one to overcome if they are given the option to opt out with no repercussion to their scholarships or any other benefits they receive as an athlete while also giving them guidance form the CDC and similar organizations regarding risk and maybe offer to pay for them to consult with a doctor, take a physical etc. to get independent guidance). They will have to overcome sovereign immunity claims for state universities. Add it all together and it's a pretty low expected risk compared to presumably a certain $40M loss of TV revenues if they don't play.

 

[engie]

What I was saying is that the mythical herd immunity will be like the flu.

And that's what you keep saying that's stupid. Herd immunity happens for every bad novel flu strain. What do you think stopped the Spanish Flu? People in their 60s and older had a great deal of protection from the Swine Flu because of a previous H1N1 strain that hit in the 60s or 70s.

I agree that flu is not nearly as contagious as COVID. Meaning this should happen more quickly. You say herd immunity is a pipe dream, but a bunch of places sure seem to be experiencing it as we speak.

And, no, I don't really think the mask orders or any of the other lockdown bs is doing much in the overall scheme of things. Basically doing rain dances for our witch doctors so we can feel in control of a situation that is actually beyond our control. Just like the weather. Everywhere in the world, regardless of policy decisions, unless they caught it at the very beginning entering their countries, have followed the same curve on the same statistical trends..

 

[ckDOG]

Is the NCAA getting in the way?

There is always the risk of ******** lawsuits, and I think the university counsel are giving them ****** advice. Unless we find out something new, you're not going to have a huge class action (and that probably doesn't paply at all for MSU and UM as state universities in Mississippi). It would be shocking to have a player die on any team. It would be shocking to have more than one player die in any conference. You might have some with some complications, but it will be a small number and at the end of the day, they will have a tough case to win. They will have to prove that they caught it b/c of football and not just because there is a pandemic. They will have to overcome an argument that they assumed the risk (which is a tough one to overcome if they are given the option to opt out with no repercussion to their scholarships or any other benefits they receive as an athlete while also giving them guidance form the CDC and similar organizations regarding risk and maybe offer to pay for them to consult with a doctor, take a physical etc. to get independent guidance). They will have to overcome sovereign immunity claims for state universities. Add it all together and it's a pretty low expected risk compared to presumably a certain $40M loss of TV revenues if they don't play.

What you've outlined makes a lot of sense. If it were me, I think I get comfortable with the environment above, but to really make sure I'm covered, I'd prefer to throw in some good faith additional benefits for the players to cover the unknown - something like supplementary insurance that goes for longer periods of time than they would otherwise be covered. Or maybe just straight up cash. Win/win for most everyone. I could see schools wanting to do something like this only to have the NCAA say it's an improper benefit.

 

[SirBarksalot]

Be careful looking at # of cases trends. Seems like testing numbers have decreased as well. Percent of positive is probably a better thing to look at.
NC dipped below 7% positive for the first time in months yesterday which is a good trend. Hospitalizations are steady or declining slightly.

 

[L4Dawg]

And that's what you keep saying that's stupid. Herd immunity happens for every bad novel flu strain. What do you think stopped the Spanish Flu? People in their 60s and older had a great deal of protection from the Swine Flu because of a previous H1N1 strain that hit in the 60s or 70s.

I agree that flu is not nearly as contagious as COVID. Meaning this should happen more quickly. You say herd immunity is a pipe dream, but a bunch of places sure seem to be experiencing it as we speak.

And, no, I don't really think the mask orders or any of the other lockdown bs is doing much in the overall scheme of things. Basically doing rain dances for our witch doctors so we can feel in control of a situation that is actually beyond our control. Just like the weather. Everywhere in the world, regardless of policy decisions, unless they caught it at the very beginning entering their countries, have followed the same curve on the same statistical trends..

The US says not so fast.

 

[engie]

Arizona - 600 new cases today. Was 1030 last Monday. 1813 the Monday before that.
Florida - 4155 today. 4752 last Monday. 8892 the Monday before that.
Just the first two that have popped up so far.

 

[engie]

The US says not so fast.

Oh here you go with this bs again. I know -- it's totally infuriating for you that it seems to be coming to heel around much of the country.

 

[was21]

Cohen is not in a position to make decisions..only Keenum is

 

[thatsbaseball]

I doubt that poor bastard makes the decisions in his own home.