Fair point. I should have been clearer. They are not a sanctioned UK sport or under UK Athletics. UK Athletics and UK athletes. Thanks for helping me clear that up.
UK Cheerleading Cleaning House
- Thread starter WGtripod69
- Start date
Fair point. I should have been clearer. They are not a sanctioned UK sport or under UK Athletics. UK Athletics and UK athletes. Thanks for helping me clear that up.
Was this cheer retreat sponsored by UK? Check
Were coaches present for the event? Check
Was there alcohol present at the retreat? Check
Was there a hazing event that occurred and has been occurring since the 70s at UK? Check
Were the coaches aware that hazing occured?
Check....It's a long standing tradition.
Mix alcohol with an injury or hospitalization during a hazing at a university sponsored event not being properly monitored by the coaches.....good luck in court.
"Several cheerleaders became intoxicated and required medical treatment during that retreat, where the coaches allowed the program’s alumni to bring alcoholic beverages, the university of Kentucky spokesman said."
Here's your legal precedent.....
https://www.corywatson.com/blog/industry-news/fraternity-hazing-university-liability/
lol, well, you would have just been laughed out of the courtroom and lost your case when it was brought up that the hazing incident occured during the cheer camp hosted by UCA in TN that was not a UK sponsored event. Also, the hazing involved reciting a lewd cheer from the 1970's individually. It was alleged they had to remove an article of clothing if they messed up, that has been denied and even UK admitted they could not corroborate that claim. How would they be endangered by that? Choke on their tongue perhaps? Or maybe a sprain from excessive jazz hands? [laughing]
The coaches can't allow or stop private citizens from bringing their boats and alcohol on a public lake. I'm sure many boats on the lake that weekend had booz, UK isn't responsible for them either. It's a public lake. If the coaches were openly allowing it, why were the players having to hide it in Gatorade bottles and water bottled and have to sneak it in?
Your linked case involves a fraternity forcing a student of non-drinking age to consume alcohol, then him falling down a flight of stairs with no one seeking medical attention for over 24 hours. They observed him excessively vomiting, twitching around on the floor and clutching his abdomen. They proceeded to punch him in the abdomen and carried him around the house while filming it on Snapchat. He was also on drugs as well. In this instance the fraternity was also on probation for previous incidents related to alcohol violations. Before medical assistance was called, the frat brothers made attempts to clean the victim up and the crime scene, as was recorded on cameras.
You seem to have left this part out, so here are the outcomes from this case, and you will notice the school was never held liable. Instead, the courts found the fraternity brothers who actually broke the rules responsible.
The Piazza case resulted in one of the largest hazing prosecutions in US history.[4] On May 5, 2017, following a grand jury investigation, eighteen members of the fraternity were charged in connection with Piazza's death: eight were charged with involuntary manslaughter and the rest with other offenses, including hazing.
Also, The Indiana Supreme Court held that a local university could not be held responsible for the injuries sustained by a pledge because the university was merely the landlord of the fraternity property. The university gave up control of the property in favor of the fraternity and the university’s responsibilities did not include oversight of the fraternity house. In this case in Indiana, there was no recovery for the injured student.
Sounds good, as you seem to lack the legal understanding to handle it yourself!
Yes. When people that were members of the squad for years tell me they were never interviewed or even called about it, I believe them. I'm weird that way about direct testimony
Lol, she (Karen Oldham) was allegedly suing UK for 28 million for emotional distress for her daughter (Tylee Oldham) who was set to transfer to Clemson after she didn't make the Blue squad. Which is evidently the highest level. Now that the coaches are fired and new tryouts are taking place, Tylee has decided not to transfer. Evidently this was the universities way of settling with Karen to avoid the lawsuit.
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It’s a contact sport where players don’t wear pads. Typical, “football players are tough,” idiocy.
They weren’t involved. Cite evidence or examples where they were please.
Acrobats or tightrope walkers also require great, elite athleticism. Are their events sports?
Not necessarily, those are more about balance and awareness. It just so happens that it's easier to catch a lighter person as they fly through the air as an acrobat than it would be a chubby person. They also fly higher and further the less they weigh. (However, it's much funnier to see the chubby person try to do it.) The less a tightrope walker has to balance the easier it is. If they are larger horizontally than vertically, they likely won't have a lot of luck. Neither really requires the abilty to run, jump or cut as a traditional athlete would. Nor are they really in the competitive sense to be a sport either.
Possibly this, what if that. Is 18 an adult, yes. Rules were set and broken by adults. But think of the children, oh heaven forbid. What, these coaches should have slept outside the doors of these adults to make sure of what exactly? That they didn’t do what most college kids do?
I love the what ifs the most. Next would be the statement about liability, a mindset of blaming others for someone else’s decision. I did this but I’m looking to sue someone else for the outcome.
What male person uses the word luncheon? Only someone trying to sound important and inflate the significance of the said event. That explains your response on its own. Luncheon, hilarious. Please don’t make an effort to try to explain how it does...for...Really, luncheon? Too funny. I’m embarrassed for you.
Let's just hope this is all there is to the story.
I think most understand the "college kids will be college kids" angle. But the Advisor and Coaches weren't kids. They knew better.
And in today's climate you can't pretend the rules aren't different from days gone by (and rightly so) regarding any form of hazing, underage drinking, or behavior that puts the program at risk. They were there to protect both the students and the schools best interests. They failed in that charge. Period.
I just dont want UK dirty laundry aired in public.
I think most understand the "college kids will be college kids" angle. But the Advisor and Coaches weren't kids. They knew better.
And in today's climate you can't pretend the rules aren't different from days gone by (and rightly so) regarding any form of hazing, underage drinking, or behavior that puts the program at risk. They were there to protect both the students and the schools best interests. They failed in that charge. Period.
I just dont want UK dirty laundry aired in public.
I understand UK investigated the issue but after 2 days I have yet to see any former student athletes corroborate the story but have witnessed dozens refute it. It just seems that if it was bad enough to clean house there would be current and former members coming out and saying it happened to them but the opposite is happening.
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]Wow. That is amazing information. Always appears to be an over reaction by UK. Why not say mistakes were made and are being corrected internally. Why cost everyone jobs and the humiliation particularly if Creed is correct that there is not much corroboration.
I am not saying some haven't corroborated things happened but if they have I haven't saw anything of it on social media like I have the ones refuting it.
This is all over a pissed off mom who's daughter didn't make the blue squad. The mom, (Karen Oldham) was suing UK for 28 million for emotional distress for her daughter (Tylee Oldham) who was set to transfer to Clemson after she didn't make the Blue squad. Which is evidently the highest level. Now that the coaches are fired and new tryouts are taking place, Tylee has decided not to transfer. Evidently this was the universities way of settling with Karen to avoid the lawsuit.
UK did a very poor investigation. They didn't even interview most of the current or former members. They also evidently didn't investigate into Karen Oldham's past, as she has pulled this same lawsuit game in her past. She once sued a school board and was awarded some damages. UK hasn't corroborated many of the claims because they are flat out false, but it was a matter of letting coaches go or being at risk for 28 million or whatever they may have to settle for.
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Because this crazy ***** has pulled the lawsuit card before in the past and won or settled with other groups. It's easier to fire a few coaches of a non revenue generating sport that probably doesn't pay all that much, than it would be to deal with the costs of a potential lawsuit.
Lead Belly-
Not saying your wrong or right. What’s your source for the $28 million lawsuit? Any links that talk about where the mom has done the lawsuits at other places?
Not saying your wrong or right. What’s your source for the $28 million lawsuit? Any links that talk about where the mom has done the lawsuits at other places?
The 28 million hasn't been publicly reported because as of now, there is no case, but that was the threat made by Karen and her attorney to UK if actions were not taken.
As far as the lawsuits, the information I have is in PDF, so I can't post it, but you can google Karen Oldham vs Cabell Co. Board of education, and then look up Theresa Grant vs Cabell co. BOE. In the first one she sued a school board for not giving her a position she felt she was most qualified for. In the 2nd, she was accused of using her position to seek revenge on a teacher whom she wasn't freinds with and that didn't vote for her for a position she was seeking.
There is also some interesting information about it all circulating on social media, but obviously I can't verify the accuracy of some of that.
Makes me want to rethink my opinions of our Pres and AD if they were willing to sacrifice long term dedicated and successful employees rather than resolve this differently. Admit mistakes were made. Nobody injured. Making immediate corrections.
Well, I took your advice. And, yeah, I'll concede that in links I saw Mrs. Oldham does come across as a meddlesome and vindictive sort who reacts extremely harshly to not getting her way.
But, you know, in a way that just further illustrates how the coaches fumbled the ball here. An event like this is not like a normal college party where those who don't approve can simply choose not to attend. Instead, all cheerleaders are forced to attend whether they want to or not, thus the coaches need to be vigilant to rein in the illegal stuff and activities that might offend someone forced to attend. After all, it only takes one disapproving cheerleader with the wrong parent to cause a mess of problems.
Fail to show such vigilance and just one meddlesome parent can end up wrecking the top cheerleading program in the country.
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I'll agree mistakes were made, but we are talking very mild stuff and no one has corroborated that anyone was forced to do any of the activities. Even Karen is admitting her daughter wasn't involved in any topless or nude activities, or being flipped off then docks. She did participate in the alleged "hazing" cheer, but that is a crazy thing to put up such a fuss over. And it was incredibly excessive to fire the staff over it. This could have been handled much better in my opinion.
The article I read when it first came out said Kentucky Lake, since then every one I have seen said Lake Cumberland, no wonder I saw nothing.
The article I read when it first came out said Kentucky Lake, since then every one I have seen said Lake Cumberland, no wonder I saw nothing.
They could go to Harmon Hollow or 76 Falls on Lake Cumberland about any weekend during the summer and find the same things. I would bet there are millions of beaded necklaces on the bottom of Cumberland.
I thought it was so gay men would have eye candy to look at during games too.
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