With Both Back...
- Thread starter mikebal9
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If you are a quant geek calculator head…..
Our rebounding suffered when we had different combinations on the floor. Caleb McConnell rebounded almost at a Yeboah level, but Paul did not.
Not quite that simple, but I don’t think far off.
I agree 100% with your premise though. I don’t expect a step backwards rebounding. I am worried about the 18 minutes of non Cliff time and rim protection. I also am not sure Cliff will be the shot blocker Myles was.
First, Ron and Geo returning was the MINIMUM we needed to even have a chance of dancing next year.
Second, comparing Hyatt to Yeboah right now is crazy. Yeboah was a proven commodity even at Stony Brook. Hyatt COULD be that or even better - but right now we have no idea what we are getting. It wouldn’t surprise me if he’s a star or if he’s a dud.
Third, I felt better with Myles and Shaq Carter in 2019-2020 than I do with Cliff and mystery person at 5 this year. No way anyone should feel otherwise.
The rest are a lot of assumptions about players that may or may not contribute. The only proven commodities for next year are Ron, Geo, Caleb and Paul. Speculation about the rest of the roster is just overblown. Could we dance? Yes. But I could also see a .500 or thereabouts year. And yes, I know about Covid year lack of development yada yada yada. Rieber et al are still not proven commodities
Second, comparing Hyatt to Yeboah right now is crazy. Yeboah was a proven commodity even at Stony Brook. Hyatt COULD be that or even better - but right now we have no idea what we are getting. It wouldn’t surprise me if he’s a star or if he’s a dud.
Third, I felt better with Myles and Shaq Carter in 2019-2020 than I do with Cliff and mystery person at 5 this year. No way anyone should feel otherwise.
The rest are a lot of assumptions about players that may or may not contribute. The only proven commodities for next year are Ron, Geo, Caleb and Paul. Speculation about the rest of the roster is just overblown. Could we dance? Yes. But I could also see a .500 or thereabouts year. And yes, I know about Covid year lack of development yada yada yada. Rieber et al are still not proven commodities
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Most valuable / irreplaceable and best are two different things. His value was obvious based on the impact on the team when he was off the floor or in foul trouble which was way too much. And in those situations we lost games and that is part of his report card as a player. Most valuable has as much to do with depth behind the player than anything. See: @ Ohio State.
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This is pretty much what anyone can say about any team around the country.....and there was a serious amount of anxiety and despair about Yeboah coming in, because lots of fans, thought losing your leading scorer and rebounder in Eugene, was not something RU would be able to do.....the media and lots of fans panicked and agreed and picked RU 12th in the preseason.
There's no reason to think that a player sitting out a transfer season at Texas with 1 or 2 big games (Jacob Young) and a player coming over from a smaller program at Stony Brook (Yeboah), was going to work in 2019-20. It just definitely felt like it had more options than years past, and 2021-22, looks the same way.
It is no different than asking Hyatt to come from LSU and the expected addition of a big man from San Jose.State (Agee). Both can have skeptical fans, but both do things, recent RU rosters did not offer on offense.
There were far more questions leading into the 2019-20 season than right now into 2021-22. Is that solely because RU has had 2 good years in a row, and they're getting the benefit of the doubt....?? Perhaps and that's fine to expect the worst.
Or is it because the roster and staff have a better idea on what items need to be corrected or fixed and this year's team could be the same as the last 2 years (NCAAS)?? I see a solid team with 6 players capable of double figures in any game. That is tough for opponents to stop.
This roster has a mix of seniors, experienced players and enough youth that have a chance to step up into bigger roles. It is not a perfect roster, but it's not too far off from most rosters that expect to be right in the mix to Dance.
Young was our 4th leading scorer behind Yeboah, Harper and Baker in the Purdue game in 2020. He also got caught sleeping and gave up an offensive rebound and then fouled Hunter which almost cost Rutgers the game had he not missed the second free throw. He was very good at times, but saying he put the team on his back in that game is a bit of revisionist history.
I’ll agree that he was definitely the difference in the Maryland game though.
He was the difference in overtime against purdue . Put the team on his back against Maryland.
In 2021, he had the greatest single game performance in the last 40 years of rutgers basketball considering what was on the line against minnesota.
We will certainly miss him
It won’t surprise me. He was in the rotation early last season and got hurt. In his limited games I said here he looked like a bigger version of Mathis. I think he can cover 2-4 and will give us good minutes. If someone else takes minutes from him that’s okay too. We want competition.
Agreed. Offensively he did things we likely will not see this year. He had his warts but don’t we all?
I feel there are more questions this year past the proven commodities, particularly in the front court. But we can agree to disagree.
Will miss him without question, he was a special player and we don’t dance without him last year. I think we will be okay in the long run though.
Good list, Shack. I think your bottom four is where most of the juggling will occur.
If we want to compare preseason thoughts this year vs. 2018-19 there is NO doubt the feeling and expectation are higher right now. What no one (or very few at least) counted on was that Myles would replace Eugene's effectiveness on defense and on the defensive glass. I thought the sky was falling because we would miss Eugene's "lead by example" on the defensive end. Myles shot blocking replaced Eugene taking charges
This year I expect our offense to be similar to last year. 2 big X factors are mystery new guys (Jones and/or Hyatt) AND Ron Harper. We saw all B1G in 1st 1/3 of the season and we saw brick laying in the last 2/3. I am going to guess somewhere down the middle.
Now I am pertrified about our defense. I could be overreacting. For us to stay the same on the defensive end we need a complete buy in from Ron and Geo on the defensive end. If we want to give a benefit of the doubt we can blame injuries.
This year I expect our offense to be similar to last year. 2 big X factors are mystery new guys (Jones and/or Hyatt) AND Ron Harper. We saw all B1G in 1st 1/3 of the season and we saw brick laying in the last 2/3. I am going to guess somewhere down the middle.
Now I am pertrified about our defense. I could be overreacting. For us to stay the same on the defensive end we need a complete buy in from Ron and Geo on the defensive end. If we want to give a benefit of the doubt we can blame injuries.
The big question mark of course is Cliff's backup. Although Reiber had limited playing time last year, I liked what I saw. If he added some strength, I think he might work out as the backup. He seemed to work hard, has a decent shot with some range, and has a good basketball IQ. Thoughts?
Ron was always a good defensive player, but I agree with Geo. I feel like his injury last year hurt his defense alot.
One note though is that Hyatt is widely known for his defensive intensity at LSU so we get a plus there.
Ron did take a lot of possessions off last year. I think his poor shooting made it over to the other side of the court.
If my memory is correct.....Ron did have the biggest stop of the year in the last possession of the Clemson game.
To me - I first ask who is the main driver behind RU's Defensive effectiveness....the players or coaching staff? I would agree that Myles, Young and Mathis excelled at the defensive end and may very well represent significant gaps. However, I would also stress that since Pike arrived, RU has been effective on the defensive side of the ball regardless of the turnover of his players during his tenure.
Given his overall team focus on hard-nosed defensive effort and hustle - not sure how you can be petrified. Concerned about the unknown - sure.
This is massively unscientific, since it's missing games and doesn't take into account RB% and just total RBs/minute..... but...
Among the lineups that saw at least 15 minutes together (note: I've looked at this data set before, and it's missing a handful of games), sorted by RB/min:
1.13 - Baker/Young/McConnell/Harper/Johnson
1.06 - Baker/Mulcahy/McConnell/Harper/Omoruyi
1.04 - Mulcahy/Young/McConnell/Harper/Johnson
0.97 - Baker/Young/Mathis/Mulcahy/Johnson
0.95 - Mulcahy/Young/Mathis/Harper/Omoruyi
0.93 - Baker/Young/McConnell/Harper/Omoruyi
0.92 - Mulcahy/Young/Mathis/Harper/Johnson
0.86 - Baker/Young/Mulcahy/Harper/Johnson
0.84 - Baker/Mulcahy/McConnell/Harper/Johnson
0.81 - Baker/Young/Mathis/Harper/Johnson
0.71 - Baker/Young/Mathis/McConnell/Omoruyi
0.63 - Baker/Young/Mulcahy/Harper/Omoruyi
0.55 - Mulcahy/Young/Mathis/McConnell/Johnson
0.55 - Baker/Young/Mathis/Harper/Omoruyi
I'm not just concerned about Cliff's backup, I'm concerned about Cliff. I just wasn't sold on his post defense or ability to stay out of foul trouble. And offensively, there really wasn't anything there except the rare athletic dunk. Tremendous athlete? Yes, but not someone that I know we can rely on. The drop off with Myles on the bench last year was precipitous.
I am making assumptions, maybe shouldn’t, that there is a big jump in a big from freshman to sophomore. Plus I think Cliff is more intelligent than most.
Freshman bigs always struggle with foul trouble and positioning - really hope he can pull that together for this season.
To his credit, his fouling was better as a true freshman than Johnson's was as a RS freshman, so that's something. From his RS Fr to RS So year, Johnson improved from 6.1 pf/40 min (in 17.6 min) to 4.3 pf/40 min (in 23.6 min). Omoruyi as a Fr was 5.2 pf/40 min (in 14.9 min).
He also had 1.9 blocks/40 min as a true freshman, to Johnson's 1.7 blocks/40 as a RS Fr (and Johnson's jumped up to 2.6 per 40 min as a RS So).
If Omoruyi can show the same growth (dropping his pf/40 by 29.5% and increasing his blocks/40 by 52.9%).... he'd end up next year at 3.7 pf/40 and 2.9 blks/40.
I think a lot of people are underestimating Reiber’s potential which is understandable considering his non-existent minutes last year.
Having Geo and Ron back is not just good it is great. I expect both to have monster years and we are definitely a top 30 team again . If Cliff takes the usual step up from freshman to sophomore year we are really in good shape. With Paul and Caleb and Jones and Hyatt that is a real good top 7. Last year our rebounding especially defensively was pathetic and I am more hopeful with these top 7 that we get back to Pike’s normal great rebounding teams. We lose Myles defense and shot blocking but Cliff has to make that leap defensively in the post as well as raise his shot blocking game. Not too worried losing Jacob’s offense as I think Geo and Ron’s offensive production and efficiency go way up plus Hyatt and Jaden Jones will be able to fill that point loss easily. Jaden will be the focus and major offensive force the following year but I expect big things out of him in this his true freshman year. Hyatt will give us a wing scoring option but also will hopeful
Ly fill the rebounding void caused by Ron’s subpar rebounding. I am much more optimistic that we a top tier Big 10 team this year , and I have not even factored in last years 3 other freshman that likely improved enough to contribute somewhere for a few minutes per game. Pike took a long time to get our lineup settled last year but I do not see him having that dilemma this year. Plus the RAC will be absolutely electric next year and if we go undefeated there , it will be no surprise.
Ly fill the rebounding void caused by Ron’s subpar rebounding. I am much more optimistic that we a top tier Big 10 team this year , and I have not even factored in last years 3 other freshman that likely improved enough to contribute somewhere for a few minutes per game. Pike took a long time to get our lineup settled last year but I do not see him having that dilemma this year. Plus the RAC will be absolutely electric next year and if we go undefeated there , it will be no surprise.
Similar comment as with Omoruyi, tbh - freshman bigs take time. Positioning, footwork, body control, S&C, fouling.
In Reiber's case, he spent about half his very limited minutes at the 4 (alongside Johnson, Omoruyi, Doucoure, or Nathan), and half at the 5 - next year I'd expect that to be much more heavily weighted to the 5.
I'd imagine an offseason of S&C and practice will do him a lot of good.
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By Far? Hardly. Miles offensive liabilities were never more in focus than in the NCAA, need I remind you
A normal offseason will be huge for him and the entire team.
Any chance Oskar can get some meaningful playing time this year? He is 6-8 and this is his third year with the program.
Seems like we go through this every year, wondering, ‘how will we ever replace (fill in the blank)’ but then the season starts and we see a new team chemistry and a new formula for winning.
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You are asking message board fans that are only guessing about playing time. With Oskar, You'll get more guesses. We will all find out when the season starts and we see how guys have developed this off-season.
I was just asking about thoughts. I did not expect to get concrete answers.
All of our big ? players will have an opportunity to show what they can do doing the OOC schedule. Pikiell seems to be pretty big on giving guys a chance early in the season.
You bring up an excellent point. I was thinking the same thing the other day. We almost assume that everyone will be stagnant in their development. Not everyone will get better but it only takes a few.
Said before that we shouldn't write Reiber off. And yes freshman to sophomore often results in significant growth &improvement.
I have a feeling we will see a lot of Oskar during the OOC cupcake games. He needs more minutes to really show if he can do it or not. Last year all but three games were against top flight competition and we couldn't afford to have patience.