Wheeler 'loss' is addition by subtraction
- Thread starter UK till Death
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I think if, in that situation, Calipari were to put Thiero in to run the point, that would be the better course of action.
EXACTLY. Lay off the kid. He plays hard, and represents the University in a postitive manner. He is not a great player but doesn't deserve to be ridiculed by our fanbase either.
This is a very astute observation, IMHO. I had not thought of that myself, but ... I agree.
It's been pathetic and mean from the start. These people are first class jerks who know very little about basketball anyway. We don't need or want them as fans.
I said this a while back and got **** on pretty hard by deniers. But it’s true
Wheeler is the most hated Kentucky PG since Saul smith.
We suck total *** and still do not want him. He can go to Moorhead State.
And i disagreed with you then. I never hated Wheeler. I hated how Cow misused Wheeler.
Disagree, Cal will feel like he needs to play him and that means less Wallace. The team is firing on all cylinders now, feel like wheeler will mess it up.
I’ve never understood what’s pathetic or mean about recognizing that Wheeler shouldn’t get many (if any) minutes. It isn’t a charity league. We don’t expect Walker Horn to play.
I get that there’s a difference of opinion about Wheeler’s value. Some people love his counting stats and think when we lose it’s despite his best efforts.
It’s an interesting conversation, imo. I don’t think it’s mean, per se.
the pace and emotion only gets higher now. Every game is now huge. Everyone fighting for their lives now. Everyone.
I have always felt depth was what makes the difference in a deep tourney run.
we will need him if we want to go far. 10-15 minutes of Wheeler at his best will push us over the top. Have to play the matchups and not put him a place that he won’t be successful, but if we go deep, we will be posting positive things about Wheelers contributions afterwards.
either way I like the kid. He is far better than I ever was…and he plays hard all the time. But his role is backing up Wallace, and doing it well. If he does, one of my major question marks about this team will be checked off. That will matter.
I have always felt depth was what makes the difference in a deep tourney run.
we will need him if we want to go far. 10-15 minutes of Wheeler at his best will push us over the top. Have to play the matchups and not put him a place that he won’t be successful, but if we go deep, we will be posting positive things about Wheelers contributions afterwards.
either way I like the kid. He is far better than I ever was…and he plays hard all the time. But his role is backing up Wallace, and doing it well. If he does, one of my major question marks about this team will be checked off. That will matter.
He does not help us win.
I agree he plays hard. I agree he seems to be a good young man.
He does not help us win.
Maybe play him some cigar minutes when we play the rest of the scrubs?
But nothing other than that.
OUCH Germantown, tell us how you really feel, bro! J/k ! Love reading your take on stuff. I cant say I disagree, unfortunately. Here's to hoping the Dawgs can turn around the basketball program. But hey, HUGE congrats on the absolutely AWESOME back to back titles in football ! totally awesome !
I used to live in Stockbridge, so I got some Georgia roots. Always liked Georgia folk and the fans. Always liked you too. Keep your head held high!
And as for Wheeler, well ....
I do think we will definitely need him, but I am glad we have learned how to gel and come together and play much better without him in the lineup to make things harder on hardhead Cal in keeping with his theme to play his favorite players and sticking with them to the detriment of the team, and program, and have that LOSE GAMES which have definitely been winnable if he had gotten his coaching head out of the sand where playing his favorite players are concerned.
I want to see Wheeler come in fresh and burn his turbo jets when the other teams' players are starting to get gassed and winded a bit, and get his confidence going in subbing for Wallace, and Then make a favorable contribution to the team in games. THAT should be his role. And I think that's where most of us "basketball bennies" have been for a long time with Wheeler and Cal.
Let's hope they both have learned what the proper role should be moving forward and not fall back on the things which failed in the past and led to such a state of affairs as to have made everything FAR more difficult on everyone involved.
I have to disagree with a lot of you on this thread. I'm not trying to be a contrarian. To the contrary, I'm really happy with our current starting lineup.
But let's be real; Oscar, Toppin, Wallace, and Reeves are all playing much, much better now than when Wheeler was playing and it's just crazy to attribute all their improvement to Wheeler's absence. He was often in with Ware and a cold shooting Frederick and a then cold shooting Toppin.
If Wheeler comes back and 3 or 4 of those players are on the court with him and the other one is CJ or Livingston or Thiero, then Wheeler will look like a much better player than he did before.
We are obviously fine without him and I would not want him on the court much in a championship or Final Four game but we could use him until then to rest our starters and I really do think he will appear to be a better player because he will be playing with better players.
But let's be real; Oscar, Toppin, Wallace, and Reeves are all playing much, much better now than when Wheeler was playing and it's just crazy to attribute all their improvement to Wheeler's absence. He was often in with Ware and a cold shooting Frederick and a then cold shooting Toppin.
If Wheeler comes back and 3 or 4 of those players are on the court with him and the other one is CJ or Livingston or Thiero, then Wheeler will look like a much better player than he did before.
We are obviously fine without him and I would not want him on the court much in a championship or Final Four game but we could use him until then to rest our starters and I really do think he will appear to be a better player because he will be playing with better players.
Agree and so true.Cal can't help himself concerning Wheeler's PT, so taking him off the board altogether is best.
My question is Wheeler actually injured...
If Wheeler does return, the bad play will return. Simply can't endure him on the floor like last season.
A couple minutes for Wallace to rest or foul issue I can live with but that should be absolutely no more than 10 minutes MAX.
If Wheeler could play would Cal start him? The answer is yes and you know it. It’s not kicking him to say so. It’s a problem with Cal not with Wheeler. Cal has a pattern of playing favorites to the detriment of the team.
Wheeler is an absolute must to give Cason some rest. Short leash for sure but him not playing at all will be a killer
I hope Wheeler comes back and I hope Cal doesn’t try to start him. I’m not trying to bash the kid. Play him off the bench to give rest and switch the game up for a time. I think that is his role
The problem with Wheeler isn't how Cal/Staff would use him. He doesn't like the idea/concept of his potential role and this injury will just linger....as it kind of did last year when screwed over the team with TyTy down.
I'm rolling with who wants to play and DGAF what Wheeler does. If he comes back, hope he accepts a minimal role and helps the team. If not, the guys who earned the right to play in NCAA Tournament should get the playing time. CJ Fredrick gets it-he returned because he wants to be part of this. Everyone realizes that he's not reliable, but he's a good teammate and wants to be part of this. Hit some Wiltjer 3's in his run--helps a great deal.
Cow has created this Wheeler situation by making him a starter when he clearly wasn’t or isn’t. Anyone with a brain knew it and said it at the start of the season and the end of last season.
He’s needed to give Wallace a rest before media timeouts in the tournament. That’s it.
He’s needed to give Wallace a rest before media timeouts in the tournament. That’s it.
I would rather invest those minutes in Thiero to give him confidence to come back next year. These threads are weird though, people recognize now many were right that he was hurting us on both ends and playing too much but also mad at those people for being right.
I think we agree. Maybe this is like politicians from different parties agreeing on something, but afraid to admit they agree ; -)
I'm saying we need a PG to give Wallace 4-5 mins break per half. Plus, there will come a time in a game where Wallace gets in foul trouble or cannot play extended minutes for some other reason. Wheeler is our best option in those 2 instances. Teams will press/trap Thiero more and more because it's on tape that he doesn't handle that well.
I agree 110% with you that the team chemistry doesn't need to be messed with, and I don't know if Cal would overuse Wheeler. There have been many instance where I didn't think Wheeler was doing "bad." I just thought team would do better with whomever was sitting. 3-4 mins a half is a tough change for Wheeler to accept. Hope he can accept it. I'll applaud him after the season if he says "the team needed the other players to get my minutes." But, for now we just need spot duty off the bench. But ... I don't want to be without him if/when Wallace sits extended minutes for foul trouble, etc...
He does need to come back and we need him to play 10-12 mins a game to spell Wallace. The problem is Cal he’s going to want to play him for more than that and that’s where the problem will be!
I like Thiero but feel he’s more of a 3 than a PG.
I agree. I do like that it is giving him some in-game ballhandling experience. Maybe down the line if UK ever gets in a pinch it will come in handy. He just has to manage the game in that role.
Cal can't help himself concerning Wheeler's PT, so taking him off the board altogether is best.
My question is Wheeler actually injured...
If Wheeler does return, the bad play will return. Simply can't endure him on the floor like last season.
I didn’t even see this before I posted in Aike’s thread about “talent”.
All I posted was that we had had some addition by subtraction.
I don’t think many on this board hate wheeler. I think he’s a good kid! But, Cal should have given the keys to Wallace the second he got on campus. Wheeler should play 5-6mins in relief of Wallace and that’s about it.
That’s a poor analogy he can’t help it if he’s not 6’ or taller he can’t match up well again bigger guards probably need him for 5 to 8 minutes a game during sec tournament
No Cason needs to stay at point or rest on the bench when not at the point position
But Cason needs a rest at least once a half. I would take him out before the forced timeouts at either 12, 8 or 4 minutes. He loses a couple of minutes of playing time but gets a 5 minute break each half.
Fatigue may lead to a player taking off a play or two (can't have that in a tournament game) or committing silly fouls. We don't want him to be sitting on the bench in foul trouble. Sahvir is going to have to play, if he gets well. maybe 10 minutes a game. The short bench has resulted in better play but with the SEC tournament we will have to play 3 days in a row, the NCAA has a day's rest between games. I think fatigue could be our biggest stumbling block.
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