Turning point for me
- Thread starter preacher_dawg
- Start date
Why are we still arguing as if firing Stans and hiring Ray were mutually inclusive decisions? Ray was obviously a bad hire, but it's been beat to death why Stans had to go.
The fact that no one with a half decent resume wanted our job is absolutely lumped in with the fact that we fired Stansbury. Sure, it didn't have to be Ray, but it would have just been some other blind dart throw of a hire.
Sherrill > Croom
Leach still has to prove it in the SEC. I'm excited and optimistic about the hire, but it's premature to say Leach will do better at State than Moorhead.
Polk > McMahon & Cohen
Cohen > Cannizaro
Lemonis had a great season last year, but he still couldn't get the big win in Omaha, so I hesitate to crown him better than Cohen or Polk.
Schaefer > Fanning... So you're 1 for 5.
I didn’t say there was. I just choose to not view our total program based on one game. We were certainly embarrassed.
For the record, I don’t believe howland is going to do anything great here. I think we have seen the best from him. But I also don’t believe he will let the program tank. I feel we will generally be competitive with him. I also feel like he’s probably within 2 to 3 years of retirement. Based on the respect he has around basketball, I think it’s a better decision to let him decide when to leave, provided the program does not take a severe negative trajectory.
Tyree single-handily beat us last night. When a guy is that hot and scores 40 points about all you can do is watch.
********. When we fired Stans, he had missed the tourney 3 straight years and failed to get an at large bid for 4 straight seasons. This was after making the tourney as an at large in 5 of the previous 7 seasons and adding an NIT in one of the two years we missed. There’s no way that is better than where we are now.
Our program was a dumpster fire of underachievement for 4 years, but you still have folks thinking Stans deserved a pass for a half a decade before we made our move.
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Kermit was available and would have crawled here from Murfreesboro. We screwed it up.
We had two fouls on Tyree early, and then never took the ball at him. Even my 13 year old said prior to tip off he would have a career night against us, and commented the whole game that we wouldn’t take the ball at him and at least try to get him in foul trouble.
^^^THIS^^^ I told the Ole Miss fan co-worker sitting beside me at the game when Tyree came back into the game with 6-8 minutes left in the half & us leading by about 10 that if we did not get a third foul on Tyree before halftime to punish Kermit for putting him back in the game that I thought they would come back & win.
Perry, Woodard and Weatherspoon is probably the highest rated trio of recruited players we've had on our basketball team in a long, long time. And some nights, when they are on, you can see why. Do you think we will be more or even equally talented next year when they are gone? Its not going to get any better.
Newman=Miss-used. He was pretty dang good at Kansas.
Hood=Unhappy. Pretty dang good at Duke.
Two of our top signees ever who were also legacies, transferred to Blue-bloods with HOF coaches and thrived.
I know there are others who transferred out that had pretty good seasons at their new school.
Our assistants may be good recruiters, but they are awful teachers.
Don't let it get to you. SAME people said the SAME thing about Moorhead, Croom, and other. Hopefully those type of fans are dwindling in number and expectations are being raised.
Hood wasnt a legacy. And he was part of Stansbury's tenure, not sure why complaining about assistants from 2 coaches ago would be valid.
...though Brooks was a coach back then too.
Sec records last 3 seasons:
Kentucky 34-13
Tenn 34-13
LSU 33-14
Auburn 33-14
Florida 27-20
State 25-22
South Carolina 25-22
So we're tied for 6th in the sec in wins over the last 3 years, but we feel we need to fire howland. I think it's ridiculous considering we (fans) give this basketball program 0 support. Someone compare the attendance figures for the above 7 teams
Kentucky 34-13
Tenn 34-13
LSU 33-14
Auburn 33-14
Florida 27-20
State 25-22
South Carolina 25-22
So we're tied for 6th in the sec in wins over the last 3 years, but we feel we need to fire howland. I think it's ridiculous considering we (fans) give this basketball program 0 support. Someone compare the attendance figures for the above 7 teams
We've been in the top 6 of the sec over a 3-year period. Who you got that will move us into the top 3-4?
Any younger, proven, mid-major coach with the balls to bench players when they suck. I've seen us look like a playground team under Howland enough. He doesn't bench anyone for it. Just let's them go. If the coach can't get the players to play, the coach needs to go.
His recruiting is the only thing good. One tournament appearance in 5 years isn't impressive. But, we pay the 2nd lowest salary in the SEC. Cohen going to save that money.
Your measure was "better than". Getting to the same place as your predecessor does not make you 'better than'. It makes you same as.
Football:
Mullen may have been a better coach than Jackie Sherrill, but even that is debatable. Even so, we went through 4 years of Croom hell and a losing season with Mullen before things got better after Jackie.
Leach was an offensive coordinator in the SEC for two years. His offense was 1-1 against Jackie Sherrill. Kentucky's teams were 5-6 and 7-5 in 1997 and 1998. We just fired a guy that went 6-7.
At least fact check your **** before you type it out.
Baseball:
You can argue that Cohen got closer than Polk, but he still walked away from Omaha after losing a game, just like Polk did. Cannizaro and Lemonis did the same.
Again... same as, not better than.
Basketball:
We could probably find a number of coaches to get us to the NIT. The question is about finding a coach that can get us into the Sweet 16 of the NCAA tournament. This March will mark 24 years since that has happened.
No idea. But people aren't watching this product and apathy is close to reaching just plain don't give a ****. There's nothing good about our basketball program, facilities, or fan experience. Something got to change.
Can't speak for everyone but as a former 20 year basketball season ticket holder, it is hard as hell to get motivated to drive to Starkville on a weeknight and watch a team that may or may not decide to show up and play hard.
I hate to compare our men's team to our women's team but you know without a doubt that win, lose, or draw the women are going to bust their asses every night. The men bust their asses for about 10-15 minutes each game. State fans just expect a certain level of effort and hate an underachiever as much as anything which is one of the reasons Moorhead is now gone.
Your measure was "better than". Getting to the same place as your predecessor does not make you 'better than'. It makes you same as.
Football:
Mullen may have been a better coach than Jackie Sherrill, but even that is debatable. Even so, we went through 4 years of Croom hell and a losing season with Mullen before things got better after Jackie.
WHAT??!! LMAO!!
Leach was an offensive coordinator in the SEC for two years. His offense was 1-1 against Jackie Sherrill. Kentucky's teams were 5-6 and 7-5 in 1997 and 1998. We just fired a guy that went 6-7.
Those two years were two of the most prolific years on offense that Kentucky has ever had. It got them back to a bowl game. Couch threw for a combined 8,159 yards those two years, threw 47 TD's, and was a Heisman finalist, SEC player of the year, and first-team All-American. How about YOU fact check your ****.
At least fact check your **** before you type it out.
Baseball:
You can argue that Cohen got closer than Polk, but he still walked away from Omaha after losing a game, just like Polk did. Cannizaro and Lemonis did the same.
Again... same as, not better than.
OK. Here we go. Polk coached here 29 years. In that time he went to the CWS 6 times with a record of 4-12 games. In the 15 years after/between Polk and with McMahon/Cohen/Cann/Henderson/Lemonis every single one of them made it to the CWS with a combined 4 appearances (3 in the past 7 years) with a record of 7-8. So...yeah...actually a better return than Polk. I'm not taking anything away from Polk either. He was great.
Basketball:
We could probably find a number of coaches to get us to the NIT. The question is about finding a coach that can get us into the Sweet 16 of the NCAA tournament. This March will mark 24 years since that has happened.
We need to find a coach that will regularly get us into the Dance and at least to round two. Maybe Howland turns it around and he can do that. Based on his past performance (much like Moorhead) I doubt that will happen.
Football:
Mullen may have been a better coach than Jackie Sherrill, but even that is debatable. Even so, we went through 4 years of Croom hell and a losing season with Mullen before things got better after Jackie.
WHAT??!! LMAO!!
Leach was an offensive coordinator in the SEC for two years. His offense was 1-1 against Jackie Sherrill. Kentucky's teams were 5-6 and 7-5 in 1997 and 1998. We just fired a guy that went 6-7.
Those two years were two of the most prolific years on offense that Kentucky has ever had. It got them back to a bowl game. Couch threw for a combined 8,159 yards those two years, threw 47 TD's, and was a Heisman finalist, SEC player of the year, and first-team All-American. How about YOU fact check your ****.
At least fact check your **** before you type it out.
Baseball:
You can argue that Cohen got closer than Polk, but he still walked away from Omaha after losing a game, just like Polk did. Cannizaro and Lemonis did the same.
Again... same as, not better than.
OK. Here we go. Polk coached here 29 years. In that time he went to the CWS 6 times with a record of 4-12 games. In the 15 years after/between Polk and with McMahon/Cohen/Cann/Henderson/Lemonis every single one of them made it to the CWS with a combined 4 appearances (3 in the past 7 years) with a record of 7-8. So...yeah...actually a better return than Polk. I'm not taking anything away from Polk either. He was great.
Basketball:
We could probably find a number of coaches to get us to the NIT. The question is about finding a coach that can get us into the Sweet 16 of the NCAA tournament. This March will mark 24 years since that has happened.
We need to find a coach that will regularly get us into the Dance and at least to round two. Maybe Howland turns it around and he can do that. Based on his past performance (much like Moorhead) I doubt that will happen.
sure
name the coaches that lined up last time when we hired Howland. we had $$ then and it didn't matter.
the reality is that getting rid of Stansbury was what most of the people here wanted to see(not me) and look where we are now. at least we were competitive, winning SEC tournaments every now and then and sporadically getting to the dance. some of y'all will never be content.
name the coaches that lined up last time when we hired Howland. we had $$ then and it didn't matter.
the reality is that getting rid of Stansbury was what most of the people here wanted to see(not me) and look where we are now. at least we were competitive, winning SEC tournaments every now and then and sporadically getting to the dance. some of y'all will never be content.
We're the same damn place we were with Stans minus the out of control recruiting and team fights. Minus the pathetic hiring of Rick Ray, everything has been virtually the same for a decade. Fans are tired of the same, underperforming, lack of give a **** with the program. There's no signs of life with it.
This tram has the talent to be in the NCAA. But we won't be.
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I'd hold off regretting Kermit until a season or two after all AK's players are gone. There's probably a reason he was stuck at the same mid-major for sixteen seasons.
I haven't been in the Hump for a while (had season tickets 15-20 years ago and have only been to a couple graduations since then), but I think it's pretty nice. Certainly better than what we had when I was in school in the Dark Ages. The only other two I've been to in the SEC are Vandy - the Hump is way better than theirs - and Georgia - the Hump is just as nice, but smaller.
But, Stans 'owned' OM and the SEC West back then. Had a winning percentage against EVERY West team. 72% win percentage against the sharks/bear turds. 21-8 record and only lost to them one time in the Hump in 14 years. Had a 7 game and a 6 game streak against them.
Geez, when I first wrote the first message on this thread, I was just trying to vent my frustration.
just go look at the stats: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mississippi_State_Bulldogs_men's_basketball_head_coaches
we went to the dance 6 times out of 14 years with Stansbury. in the modern era we had only been to the dance three times prior to that(all with Richard Williams). We have been once since Stansbury and that was last year under Howland who has won 23 and 25 games in the last two seasons so i'm not out of patience. I get the frustration but screaming impatiently on message boards is turning into an epidemic.
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