Tales from the Ash
- Thread starter Randal7
- Start date
My initial reaction was I don't want to listen. Why rehash a train wreck? But I listened, and it is good.
I met Ash early in his tenure at a donor event. He was dismissive and arrogant. I literally wanted to berate and/or slug the guy. As Vinny said, "He didn't know how to connect with people."
Not long after Ash started, I met one of the guys who used to work on the sidelines during the Schiano era who stayed on with Flood. I don't know the guy's name. But if you watch game videos when you would recognize him. He was an older guy. We sat next to his booth at Henry's diner, and I asked him if he was still working for the football team. The guy unloaded on me with a barrage about Ash.
These stories have to be told. Especially as something as spectacularly awful as the Chris Ash era
I get bad vibes just seeing his face. Can we do this after the season?
I promise I won’t bring him up during the season.
does make you appreciate what we’ve got though right?!?
Where Schiano gets IT, ash was the complete opposite.
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I had a similar interaction with Ash at 2 events. First time I took it as he was nervous and getting used to the environment. The next time I realized dismissive and arrogant were his better character traits. I can't imagine that this wasn't reported back to the powers that be.
I'll listen later because I love to hear stories.
Funny though, my one and only interaction with Ash was the fan fest his first year. I told him that I was impressed with all of the kids, they were polite and engaging with my young son.
He looked me in the eye, shook my hand, and thanked me for saying that.
Again, it was the one time I met him.
Funny though, my one and only interaction with Ash was the fan fest his first year. I told him that I was impressed with all of the kids, they were polite and engaging with my young son.
He looked me in the eye, shook my hand, and thanked me for saying that.
Again, it was the one time I met him.
Even casual observers could see this about Ash.
Pray tell- how was Hobbs sold on this dolt?
Pray tell- how was Hobbs sold on this dolt?
I don't know how any of his players could possibly have been inspired by his constipated looks on the sidelines during games.
If you listen to the podcast you would understand. He had a knack for engaging people he perceived to be useful to him. Also, if you remember, he was interviewd by Greg Brown and Ken Schmidt.
Greg Brown, chairman of the Board of Governors, and Ken Schmidt, chairman of the board's Committee on Intercollegiate Athletics, were part of the interview process along with new Athletic Director Pat Hobbs and an outside search firm.
Hobbs probably saw he may have been lacking in people skills, but he had other qualities:
"And I say that not because it was a polish or like an interview technique. He is the person that came to this with the most knowledge of Rutgers and where we are, with a plan in his head for how we were going to attack this and what we were going to do."
In the wake of the off the field issues and embarrassments Flood and Hermann brought, they thought he was the right guy:
"He's the right person for this job because he has an intense and passionate commitment to excellence and integrity on the field," Barchi said. "And he has that same level of commitment to see excellence and integrity in his players, both in their daily lives and in the classroom, and that's just what we need here at Rutgers."
In hindsight, they whiffed. They used the wrong reasons to pick the wrong guy for the job.
You summed up 2 points very nicely:
1. Why Ash could be a very good coordinator, but never a legit HC.
2. Just how bad Hobbs is at interviewing/evaluating football HC candidates.
Agree on point 1, but don't necessarily agree on point 2.
On point 2, Barchi and Greg Brown knew they were hiring an AD with no football experience. Ash was interviewed by multiple people. I put the quotes above. Ash impressed with his attention to detail and his plans to win, which were lacking under Flood. Also, Barchi seemed smitten that Ash was going to be a guy that was not going to let disciplinary issues slide like Flood did. While the latter point is an important point, it should be a given with any head football coach and not at the top of the list. As Hobbs was a brand new hire, it seemed like Hobbs, Brown and Barchi reached consensus that this was the best guy for the job.
To say that Hobbs is bad at interviewing/evaluating football HC candidates misses the mark, especially in the present tense. He must have learned from the Ash hire. And let's not get into the unclear/revisionist history on the hiring of Greg. Ultimately, he hired Greg, he is here, and that is all that matters. Hiring a head football coach is different than hiring other head coaches, but not tremendously different. Hobbs has done and extremely good job at hiring other coaches.
I hated Ash as our coach as much as any Rutgers fan, but I have given this podcast a shot and bailed at the Jugs machine story.
Somehow Ash is a dick because he yelled at the equipment people when a piece of equipment that continually had issues caused the special teams units to waste their time and effort at a practice? They have one job.
Somehow Ash is a dick because he yelled at the equipment people when a piece of equipment that continually had issues caused the special teams units to waste their time and effort at a practice? They have one job.
Agree with Knight Shift. This is more on Barchi, Brown and the search group than on Hobbs. He has some blame but the majority goes to others. Hobbs was on the job for mere hours when tasked with something he had no experience doing. Yes he has hired coaches in other sports but football is an animal unto itself. The mistake Hobbs made was hanging onto Ash too long and firing midseason without a gameplan.
The mistake this group made was hiring someone without head coaching experience. You can't have a disinterested president, an AD with no football experience and a coach with no head coaching experience. There was very little room for error on this hire, for a multitude of reasons, and they as a group made a huge mistake.
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So did the equipment guy, and wouldn’t it be the equipment guy’s job to get it fixed?
It seems like there was a lot more wrong with the way Rutgers was running things at the time than just Ash.
I agree with you on this. This is where Vinny was the problem. Don't try to cover something up and hope it works out. I can't tell you how many people I have had to reprimand over my career because of the cover up vs. the mistake.
I hated the results as much as anyone but I'll sit this out when it comes to placing blame. Assistants living off the recruiting dominance of schools like OSU can no doubt dazzle many easily in an interview setting with supposed evidence of the part they played in that team's success. I fell for his apparent love for and commitment to the job at his introduction, especially after the sappy thank you moment with his wife.
As stated, we got our guy now. Let's just pray we don't have easily-deceived suits picking any other deceivers for at least a decade.
As stated, we got our guy now. Let's just pray we don't have easily-deceived suits picking any other deceivers for at least a decade.
Okay, Ash was a group effort fail, but to say that "Hobbs/he hired Greg" is missing the forest from the trees. Hobbs was a hard no on GS. It took a legendary revolt by fans, alums, and even the NJ press to force Hobbs to hire GS. We hired GS, not Hobbs in anyway whatsoever. Even during the press conference Hobbs essentially admitted this. So Hobbs was yes on Ash and no on GS. 2 strikes.
Yes, Hobbs has done well on hiring for other sports, but in his 2 biggest moments, he made the wrong decisions.
FYI: equipment guys are responsible for a lot of things. For minor fixes on the jug machine, yes but from the sound of it, it was something bigger than a quick fix.
Agree with you here. And just because Ash yelled at the nearest guy, venting his frustrations does not make him a bad guy. We have all seen bosses do thing like that, and sometimes even apologize for directing their anger at the wrong person.
However, when you take the sum total of things that Vinny observed, there seemed to be a pattern of behavior that Ash did not care about the little people and treated them poorly. That guy I met at Henry's Diner was quite animated about Ash, and this was not some young kid. Now, Ash could have gotten away with being a dick if he won a few games and did not suffer so many embarrassing blowouts. After a while, there were probably multiple people in the organization actively wanting him to fail so that he would get fired.
You can go with your narrative, but that narrative has been dispelled by many others. Regardless of which narrative is correct, it's time to let it go for the sake of moving the organization forward. I will never understand the need for some to keep dredging up things that happened in the past.
Funny we are talking about a jugs machine. The average pop warner program has 2-3 of these things. How can there not be redundant jugs machines on the field. If one is broken repurpose one of the others. It is not hard to adjust the set up from passing, to punt trajectory to kick off (end over end).
I run into plenty of management types who are great people to those equal to or above them in the organization and total jackasses to their subordinates. And guys who became total tools following a big promotion. Ash seems like one of those types.
I agree Vinny was the problem in the juggs story. He knew it didn't work and wasted valuable practicing time because he didn't tell anyone the piece of sh*t is broken. Any coach in America would go ape sh*t. It's their job to make sure the stuff works. They only have a finite time to practice and he's got a whole team sitting there for punt or kickoff return
For those that want to take a trip down memory lane . Ash got us smashed !
As we all know, attorneys have a high jackass propensity. One of the things we do when we interview attorneys is we ask the staff if they noticed any red flags when the candidate came in, and was the candidate "nice." Not nice, no job offer.
What’s the old saying? Bad news isn’t like wine. It doesn’t get better with age. Got to acknowledge the problem ASAP and fix it.
If Ash's team started winning, we wouldn't care what flavor of gatorade Ash liked best. He did manage to get some talented players who may still stay in touch with him, he seemed like a good guy. The reason I am surprised he was hired was, he had no head coaching experience.