That's how Colin Cowherd classified Nebraska when talking with Joe Klatt on The Herd today. He thinks college programs are either a three year rebuild ( only thinks maybe a dozen schools fit this category,) or a six year build. USC is considered a three year build mainly because of location to recruits. Klatt brought up the fact that the current Husker team only has seven recruits from Texas vs 23 in 2010. Both thought because of the difficulty to attract Texas players that it will be very difficult to return to glory days. Huskers have wrong conference affiliation in order to attract Texas players. Both felt that Trev made the right decision to keep Frost. They agreed that progress has been made and correcting the special teams along OL improvement can get Nebraska to 7-8 wins next year.
Six year rebuild
- Thread starter 73 Red I
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He isn't wrong about Nebraska not being a quick fix, but you should be able to still make a ******* bowl game in 4 years.
A quick fix can happen at USC, Texas, Florida and the like and by that I am talking about bad team to immediate conference title contending since they can bring in a ton of elite talent in 2 classes.
At Nebraska it will take a good 6+ years becasue of how good the Big Ten is these days to go from 20 years of suck to winning a conference title. In the early 90's it was a 2 school conference. These days the conference is loaded with good coaches from top to bottom.
But it should not take 4 years to even become better. That is the frustrating part of all of this.
A quick fix can happen at USC, Texas, Florida and the like and by that I am talking about bad team to immediate conference title contending since they can bring in a ton of elite talent in 2 classes.
At Nebraska it will take a good 6+ years becasue of how good the Big Ten is these days to go from 20 years of suck to winning a conference title. In the early 90's it was a 2 school conference. These days the conference is loaded with good coaches from top to bottom.
But it should not take 4 years to even become better. That is the frustrating part of all of this.
That sounds about right that Nebraska needs 6 years to turnaround. Kirk Ferentz, Mark Dantonio, Art Briles, Matt Campbell are just a few that come to mind that turned their programs around in the first 3 years, but it’s not fair to compare those programs to Nebraska with their resources and tradition.
Yes. this is it!! I agree as it will take a little more time to adjust depending on the curve to learn. I remember on the radio, Steve Taylor former Husker Qback, said a 7 to 9 yr time period! Hey, Coach Frost has admitted the misses and wants a direction to solve the questions we have, which is more victories! I'm on board with the Coach now! One can sit around a ***** more, or you can circle the wagons in Huskerland and support in your own way! We will get NO sympathy on the national news, so don't expect sympathy or read it!!!
With competent coaches you start winning in years 2-3. Ferentz teams finished in the top 10 in years 4-5-6 for heavens sake.
we are now talking about years 5-6 - if the new staff are a big upgrade
it is quite an indictment when you are ordered to replace nearly the entire coaching staff on the side of the ball you are primarily in charge of
we are now talking about years 5-6 - if the new staff are a big upgrade
it is quite an indictment when you are ordered to replace nearly the entire coaching staff on the side of the ball you are primarily in charge of
Well you might be right but at least our new AD is seeing that it gets done now. The real question now that changes are being made is whether or not Frost can make this work with a new offensive staff. I think it is non-conventional to keep a head coach with a terrible W/L record but maybe people have been doing it wrong. IF it works it's going to save us a huge amount of money and make Trev look like a genius. The numbers on firing a losing head coach and replacing him with somebody else aren't great either. In most cases a coaching turntable leads to more losing. Hopefully trying a different path works.
I think what we also have to take I to account is how much work needed to be done when SF got here. We are a 6 year rebuild type program anyway and when frost came in it looked more like 6 was going to be pushing it. I’ll never forget his quote of “some of our kids just don’t look right.” That was his way of saying “holy sh!# our entire offensive and defensive lines are fat tubs of gew that are literally YEARS away.” Paraphrasing of course….
We should have been bowl eligible this year in year 4… In 4 years we do now look like a B1G physically but poor ST and a QB that never improved after 4 years is the disappointment…
They don't know a damn thing about Nebraska or rebuilds apparently. If the new coach is better than the old coach, improvement happens almost immediately, and that's the same regardless of which program it is.
You are implying that Nebraska when Frost took over was on the same level as Iowa when Ferentz took over. Apparently, Iowa at that low point still was still a superior program to Nebraska.
I do agree that leaving the Big 12 (as it existed when we left it) for the Big 10 most likely DID lower the ceiling of this program - from Oklahoma/Texas level to probably at or somewhat above Wisconsin level - but 3-9 in year 4 is an awful result no matter how you spin it.
If 6 years comes and nothing has improved then it's a 10 year rebuild. None of us knows what it takes, the stars either align or they don't..
Agreed, lack of development on offense you could argue was the difference in most of our losses, special teams the others.
I know, my comment is more directed towards expert opinion. I don't think there is some magic amount of time it takes to field a winning football team but at a place like Nebraska it shouldn't take 5 freaking years to become bowl eligible. That's worse than saying the only way we can win is by running the option.
Maybe he will win 8-9 next year or maybe 5 - in either case the decision regarding year 6 would appear to be easy
more interesting to me is what happens if he wins 6 or 7 and finishes 4th in the west?
he could potentially be retained for another 4-5 years if he wins 6 -7 -7 -7 -8 games the next 5 years and never wins the division.
it remains odd that going into year 5 the bar continues to be set at simply making a bowl - these last 4 years have set the table for 6-7-8 wins to be portrayed as great progress when in reality those seasons are at best very average
You could still win 10 games and still not win the division, ask Ioway..
I’m not applauding 6 or 7 win seasons, but I do remember all the complaining about only winning 9 games..
Right there shows you how spoiled our fan base was after Devaney and Osborne created the monster of winning that it once was..
Another thing that plays into all this is the absolute monster schedules we have had in SF's tenure. Haven't our SOS been in the top 3 the past couple years? I know that doesn't totally excuse losing to lesser opponents like we have, but getting beaten up by elite programs doesn't help, either. I remember coaches saying that they would often lose the week after they played us in our heyday because they were so physically beat up.
Frost isn’t going to turn into an “attention to detail” guy no matter if it’s 3, 6, or 15 years. You’re kinda a “gnat’s ***” coach or you’re not, and he definitely is not.
It’s weird too, because most young coaches are going to be heavily influenced by the guys they played for and the guys they originally coached for. Frost had two INCREDIBLE examples in Tom Osborne and Bill Snyder, but he really hasn’t taken much from what made them great coaches and leaders.
It’s weird too, because most young coaches are going to be heavily influenced by the guys they played for and the guys they originally coached for. Frost had two INCREDIBLE examples in Tom Osborne and Bill Snyder, but he really hasn’t taken much from what made them great coaches and leaders.
This is simply a ridiculous take. NO programs should be taking 6 years to rebuild not even close, good god what are you people smoking?
So if our kids were sooo weak and sickly like Frost said, then why were Frosts two BEST WINS since he took over the program his 1st season with all of Rileys sickly and weak kids? The wins over Minnesota, and Michigan State are Frosts two BEST wins to date. He also played Ohio State better in year 1 than he has in any other year. Explain it please. ITs a bunch of BS, that is the explanation.
Barry Alvarez took a complete and utter dumpster fire Wisconsin program, who had won 2, 1, 3, and 3 games the four previous years before he got there and, had lost to Drake in football before he got there..and he had them at 10 wins by year 4.
He had no transfer portals, he didnt have 4 game frosh being able to play, he didnt have the Nebraska name behind him to recruit, he didnt have some awesome fertile recruiting grounds to pick and choose studs from...he didnt have Nebrashas Cache, or being known as a good football school etc.. Yet he was able to rebuild a complete and utter dumpster fire program which was way way worse than what Frost inherited...and it took him 4 years.
This six year nonsense is utter crap for a rebuild. NO good coaches take more than 4 years to rebuild teams. NONE. And college football the last 50 years no really good coach has taken more than 4 years to have a winning season. If a coach starts off with 4 losing seasons..then the coach is not any good. 50 years of college football history tell us this..
I think Klatt is a good football guy, but both he and Cowherd were way off on this and it was ridiculous.
Klatt and Cowherds nonsensical take that we are not getting as many Texas kids and thats why we are not competing, was just mindless drivel. Klatt "Well NU had 20 TX kids in 2011 when they were competing for their conference"..
Joel, we only had 5 TX kids on the 1995 most dominant Natty title team in CFB history..So how on earth could we have possibly won a natty with only 5 TX kids and only 4 were actual contributors? Yeah doesnt make any sense.
Joel how did we win a natty in 1997 with only 6 TX kids on the roster and only 4 of them were contributors? LOL
Its a ridiculous joke of a take. They are barking up the wrong tree and are completely off base.
Also I have to add, if TX kids are the end all, then why has Texas who gets the pick of the litter every year of the best TX kids...why do they only have 1 national title in football in the last 51 years? They have 1..
If TX kids were sooooo great, they should have more than 1 Natty Champ trophy in that football case in the last 50 years.
The whole six year rebuild is a joke, no program that is serious about football takes 6 years to rebuild, the fact that Cowherd used UCLA as an example of a six year rebuild is one of the most asinine and uneducated things I have ever heard come out of a sports commentators mouth I have ever heard. UCLA gets top 15 or better recruiting classes every year, if they are a 6 year rebuild then my aunt has balls. UCLA has every advantage that you could think of to become a good foot ball program..they just havent found the right coach in many years.
They are located in a mega talent rich area, they have location advantage with the weather the beaches, etc. They are a top 20 academic institution so they also have that going for them. There is no way in the universe UCLA is a 6 year rebuild, and it has NEVER been a six year rebuild good god Cowherd lost all credibility when he said UCLA was a six year rebuild..lol
No program worth a sh^t that is serious about football takes six years before they start seeing winning records. Those places that dont see winning records by year 4 are called Vanderbilt, Kansas, Iowa State (pre Campbell) Kansas State (pre Snyder) Oregon State you know basically all of the garbage toilet programs..
I bet Cowherd couldnt name a single program that was football serious that took 6 years of a new coach before they started seeing winning records..why? CUz they dont exist..coaches get winning records well before year 6, or they dont win after a certain amount of years and is fired.
Just bad takes from both of them, not surprised from Cowherd but I am surprised by Klatt as he is usually a pretty good football guy.
bugeaters, couple big named coaches after they left NU, rose bowl stuff, bobby reynolds.
dark ages.
1. robert devany = gold
2. dr. tom = gold
3. franklin solich = had nowhere to go but down (see 3 out of 4 NC's/ponder) had lifers retiring, possible side chick, fumble and bumble dan and buck, makes crouch hypesmen & NU 1 dimensional, blowouts with whorn pen state scum and canes etc.....CANNED
4. defective callahan, only knows offence, ganz & porkchop good, defense terrible...CANNED
5. ohio state's missing link bo boy, only knows defense, uses callahan's suh good, martinez 1 terrible...CANNED
6. mr rogers, not sure bout defense or offense, hip hip hurray....CANNED
7. mr scott, supposed to know offense, we get a defense, martinez 2 turnover guru, 1 year away from CANNED if we don't find an offense pdq....
at this juncture it's good to ask what 1 & 2 did...
1. passed and ran....he had proper qb's and running backs/o (and d) held players and coaches accountable
2. dropped the pass for the run after a spell.....he had propery run/pass qb's, running backs/o (and d)
held players and coaches accountable
so, mr scott needs to do either 1 or 2 asap...if he wants to be gold and not CANNED.
the thing is frost is supposed to be good at offense, so he is kinda blessed to have someone covering him on d.
callahan and bo didn't have that......callahan knew offense (and it showed) but nobody covering him on d, bo knew defense (and it showed) but nobody covering him on o....
that's the strange part about all this, frost is supposed to be good at offense (and it's not really showing), I guess that's the reason for hope, that it might surface, he has some stats, but the penalties, turnovers, redzone, missed blocks/passes/receptions... kills all that.
dark ages.
1. robert devany = gold
2. dr. tom = gold
3. franklin solich = had nowhere to go but down (see 3 out of 4 NC's/ponder) had lifers retiring, possible side chick, fumble and bumble dan and buck, makes crouch hypesmen & NU 1 dimensional, blowouts with whorn pen state scum and canes etc.....CANNED
4. defective callahan, only knows offence, ganz & porkchop good, defense terrible...CANNED
5. ohio state's missing link bo boy, only knows defense, uses callahan's suh good, martinez 1 terrible...CANNED
6. mr rogers, not sure bout defense or offense, hip hip hurray....CANNED
7. mr scott, supposed to know offense, we get a defense, martinez 2 turnover guru, 1 year away from CANNED if we don't find an offense pdq....
at this juncture it's good to ask what 1 & 2 did...
1. passed and ran....he had proper qb's and running backs/o (and d) held players and coaches accountable
2. dropped the pass for the run after a spell.....he had propery run/pass qb's, running backs/o (and d)
held players and coaches accountable
so, mr scott needs to do either 1 or 2 asap...if he wants to be gold and not CANNED.
the thing is frost is supposed to be good at offense, so he is kinda blessed to have someone covering him on d.
callahan and bo didn't have that......callahan knew offense (and it showed) but nobody covering him on d, bo knew defense (and it showed) but nobody covering him on o....
that's the strange part about all this, frost is supposed to be good at offense (and it's not really showing), I guess that's the reason for hope, that it might surface, he has some stats, but the penalties, turnovers, redzone, missed blocks/passes/receptions... kills all that.
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MULTIPLE former Blackshirts and Pipeline alums stated that it was going to take 5 years for Frost to rebuild the program. Most of us refused to believe them. While I agree that some of the losses were inexcusable, I also see that our roster is getting there. When you look back at a season and see all of the games we could of or should have won if not for ONE freaking mistake by one guy, it tells you that you're close. We still need our OTs to grow up and we need better depth at QB.
While I agree our players didn't appear to be in shape when Frost took over, I see a lot of fat tubs of goo playing on Sunday. I agree that on game day our players didn't look like P5 players. It wasn't the linemen's bellies. Skinny arms and sucking wind by the 2nd quarter was a sign.
What year did Alvarez take over his program? Do you think maybe times have changed a little bit over the past 30 years? The number of close losses Nebraska has had by one score or less is mind blowing. Given the coaching pool available this season and the economics involved I think it's worth a shot to give Frost a chance to turn those close losses around with a new offensive staff. The odds of him turning it around with a new offensive staff are probably better than the odds of us having success by bringing in a new coach. At least we know we have a reasonably good defensive staff at this point already. Frost needs a different QB and for sure a different O line coach. IF he can fix those 2 areas that might be all it takes.
These 2 don't give a Rats *** wether Nebraska wins or loses. They're just talking heads telling people what they want to hear for ratings. RollingLaugh
I doubt highly that saying that Nebraska is a 6 year rebuild is going to do anything to help Cowherd's ratings. You're right that Cowherd doesn't give a rat's *** about Nebraska but Klatt is probably one of the brightest analysts in college football.
Don’t forget better special teams play which can make the difference from winning or losing the division..
Kind of goes along with the ONE mistake by one guy comment I made. That punt at MSU was just disastrous. Good Lord we've got to fix our punter and kicker. They've cost us multiple games.
Ok, I knew you would somehow use a "how long ago" excuse to defend Frost, so before I address that, I will make it VERY SIMPLE for you and the other Frost defenders to understand:
Indianas CURRENT coach Tom Allen, same conference, harder side of the conference, and at Indiana which is one of the biggest dumpster fire programs in history for college football. Indiana is never CLOSE to us recruiting, they fired their previous coach because he was making players play through injuries. So Indianas current coach inherited a MUCH MUCH bigger dumpster fire of a culture, roster and talent than what Frost did. He doestn have anywhere close to the Name or recruiting cache that Frost does. Yet he was able to have a winning season, (in the harder side of the conference) by year 3 he went 8-5, not only that, he then had a winning season in year 4 as well!!!
So all of the excuses coming from the Frost Davidians, are just excuses and bad ones at that.
Now lets address "when" did Alvarez take over, he took over in 1990. But he took over a complete dumpster fire of a program. You see he didnt go into a season and see 2-3 automatic wins on the non con schedul like a Scott Frost could. Remember Wisky lost to DRAKE in football before Alvarez got there. Drake..
Alvarez also didnt have the portal to be able to immediately fix roster issues, he had to do it all through recruiting. He also didnt have the 4 game frosh rule to help develop players quicker like Frost does.
Alvarez when he took over Wisconsin, they didnt have a name, or a good football history, they were T R A S H as a program. So which coach do YOU think between Alvarez and Frost had a recruiting advantage when they started? Frost by a mile.
Yet with ALL of these disadvantages that Alvarez had, he was still able to win 10 games by year four.
So you now have two great examples of lessor programs, who could easily whine and cry and say "We need more than 4 years to have a winning record" and I could actually make a case for those schools cuz they were complety gutted talent wise and complete trash..But they didnt need any excuses cuz they WON by year 4...
Waiting for more excuses from ya..or do you need even more examples of coaches who turn it around quicker?
Allen took over the program, won a few games and now is back in dumpster fire mode. HE shows you what the right or wrong OC can mean to your program. The margin between wins and losses is thin as we've seen this year the last 4 years. It's often one guy, one mistake or one play. The question is whether or not replacing underperforming assistants will be enough to change those losses in to wins. People a LOT more qualified to make the decision than us are willing to gamble that it is. I'll ride with that.
I didn't offer excuses BTW. Just facts and opinions from guys more qualified that us.
He is at INDIANA for Christmas sakes, did u expect him to reel off 5 straight winning seasons when no one else in their history has?lol
They are a dumpster fire program.
Yet the coach was able to get winning records by yr 3and 4. That's the point. No need to move the goal posts and add stuff.
The point is, if coaches can go to dumpster fires like Indiana and post winning records by or before yr 4..thrme. there really are no excuses for Frost that make sense..none..
It was all right in front of us years ago. Frost likes to hide in closets. I can see it now and admit it. He’s a coward.
I have a vision of you jumping up and down, waving your fists, screaming and crying "I want my candy and I WANT IT NOW!". Laughing There is no doubt that we were one play away multiple games from turning L's to W's. I understand completely the frustration. In each of these losing seasons we've been one play/game away from having winning seasons. When you're that close, do you start over or do you try to change those plays that cost you games? That is the 20 million dollar question that you and I won't know the answer to until next fall.
What are u talking about? This is an unprecedented move by NU.
No other blue blood in history ever in 700 plus years of football, nor any other really good non blue nloodbfootball schools have EVER given a coach with 4,straight losing seasons to start, a 5th year. NEVER once.
Thks is a huge thing, it's a huge negative thing.
This move is a hail Mary at best to replace ur O staff. It's a complete joke, and the joke is on the fans..