Shotgun

jozimmer

Redshirt
Sep 3, 2005
176
13
0
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.
 
Aug 18, 2016
16,645
10,920
113
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.


I won’t blast, I’m just going to tell you that it isn’t going to change.
 

SoFL Husker

All-Conference
Sep 16, 2017
8,101
3,691
0
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.

I don't see Oregon or UCF taking snaps under center. It's the offense.
 

SoFL Husker

All-Conference
Sep 16, 2017
8,101
3,691
0
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.

Study the offense as well. Do some research. Find out the schemes he advocates in these situations, then post.

Do us a favor, and bring some value to the board, instead of the typical "***** and moan" thread OP. Thanks.

P.S. I'm lazy as phuck sometimes.
 
Dec 1, 2002
14,643
18,392
113
It will drive you crazy, as it seems logical to get downhill faster. That has been the knock on the spread offense that you don't get downhill like out of the I formation as everything is sideways not front to back like the I formation
 
  • Like
Reactions: jeans15

SoFL Husker

All-Conference
Sep 16, 2017
8,101
3,691
0
It will drive you crazy, as it seems logical to get downhill faster. That has been the knock on the spread offense that you don't get downhill like out of the I formation as everything is sideways not front to back like the I formation

The Pats ran some I formation yesterday. Another masterful performance by Bill and Co. They had the Texans flummoxed, then hung-on to win.
 

HuskerLLM

All-Conference
Aug 1, 2004
45,801
1,671
0
Curious what you expected on offense?

This was Frost/Oregon/UCF offense lite. This isn't going to be NU of old

Oh, and I always get a laugh out of people scolding to start their post, appreciated the chuckle.
 

Stormthecourt?

All-American
Jan 19, 2012
8,095
8,207
0
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.
https://fishduck.com/playbook/the-c...nse/first-fish-tutorial-the-inside-zone-read/

This is a good link to start learning about your new offense. After you finish inside zone read, click on outside zone read
 
Nov 29, 2014
12,626
29,730
0
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.
Great first post, OP...really greatWinking
 

barney44

All-American
Oct 2, 2005
185,597
5,623
0

Hastings_Husker

Redshirt
Sep 1, 2007
243
36
28
As others have said that in the spread they almost never run under center. That being said, they also then never practice under center and as simple as it might seem to take a snap under center you can watch a lot of games where they try it and often it ends up as a bobbled snap or a fumble. Even teams that run under center most of the time, if the center or qb goes down you'll see center-qb exchange problems just when the new person comes in.
 

F5Tornado

All-Conference
Jul 19, 2018
2,157
1,468
0
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.

OK, so-so, mediocre first post. How's that?
 

mgbreeze

All-Conference
Dec 16, 2004
10,115
3,575
113
So you're the guy in the watch group that wants to wow everyone with your razor sharp game analysis, huh? It's weird how my watch group (wife) never responds to my analysis ("why the F did they do that??") either. I think she probably thinks Scott Frost knows a hell of a lot more than I do. It's insulting.
 

DaddyBoi

Junior
Sep 1, 2018
285
379
0
Under center...unless you sneak...you are still handing off to a guy that is either 3 or 5 yards away.

True, but the hope is there is a fullback that will be clearing the LOS by the time the guy gets the handoff.

I was surprised by the lack of jet sweep type plays, but I also suspect Frost isn’t showing his full hand on offense yet.
 
  • Like
Reactions: thall___

JohnRossEwing

All-American
Jul 4, 2013
11,899
5,284
0
True, but the hope is there is a fullback that will be clearing the LOS by the time the guy gets the handoff.

I was surprised by the lack of jet sweep type plays, but I also suspect Frost isn’t showing his full hand on offense yet.

There is not FB

Jet Sweep is lame AF...there is not a team in the nation that doesn't know how to defend that now.
 
Nov 29, 2014
12,626
29,730
0
It's weird how my watch group (wife) never responds to my analysis ("why the F did they do that??") either. I think she probably thinks Scott Frost knows a hell of a lot more than I do. It's insulting.
Your wife wants to do things to Scott Frost that she only did with you on Honeymoon.
 

Stormthecourt?

All-American
Jan 19, 2012
8,095
8,207
0
True, but the hope is there is a fullback that will be clearing the LOS by the time the guy gets the handoff.

I was surprised by the lack of jet sweep type plays, but I also suspect Frost isn’t showing his full hand on offense yet.
There is not FB.
Are there a bunch of people on here that have never seen a SF offense before? John is correct. You will not see a FB in this offense. The zone read is designed to avoid the free rusher and or make them miss
 

DaddyBoi

Junior
Sep 1, 2018
285
379
0
Are there a bunch of people on here that have never seen a SF offense before? John is correct. You will not see a FB in this offense. The zone read is designed to avoid the free rusher and or make them miss

I’m not talking SF specifically, I was pointing out that it isn’t necessarily the truth that handing off from center and in shotgun are putting the carrier in the same position. Not to mention the obvious fact that under center also means a running start for the carrier

Jet Sweep is lame AF...there is not a team in the nation that doesn't know how to defend that now.

lmao wtf are you talking about? If it works against NFL teams I think it’ll probably work against Purdue too
 
  • Like
Reactions: thall___

Hoosker Du

All-American
Dec 11, 2001
44,018
5,171
0
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.

First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

The shotgun allows the QB a better vantage point than being under center to not only assess where a potential threat is coming from, but it also takes the pressure off of making a handoff when the QB is moving and the RB is moving at a higher rate of speed. How often do you see a fumbled handoff from the shotgun? The QB is always assessing the defense from a better vantage point, and the QB only needs to become comfortable with receiving the ball one way.

The shotgun also allows the RB to be able to easier assess where a hole is opening up and adjust to it (they aren't worrying about receiving the handoff and adjusting to the hole at the same time; they more easily receive the ball, then have time to assess the opening hole).

Think about it...the RB can take off in any direction with little adjustment required, because they aren't sprinting toward the line. Sure, there is more momentum from the RB moving towards the line, but there is less time to adjust to where a hole may be opening up. In many ways it simplifies receiving the ball for the RB, and allows them more time to assess the opening hole.

I think this has been the complaint of NFL coordinators...that college RBs coming out of spread systems have problems of adjusting to receiving the ball from under center, because they are given less time to adjust to where the hole opens up. They don't have to think as quickly in a spread system,

There is also a quad-threat in essence...based on the stance of the QB always facing forward...of throwing the ball, handing it off to the receiver in jet motion, handing it off to the RB or running himself. I guess coordinators think that the multiple options outweigh the defense knowing that receiving the ball under center generally indicates the ball being run to a certain hole in short yardage. Especially when the I-formation is being implemented. With zone blocking, holes can open up all over the place, and the shotgun allows RBs to adjust more easily than receiving a handoff from a QB under center.


Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1?

That's the point... it's just as easy to pass or run out of the shotgun, and it gives the QB a much better vantage point to make that determination for audibles too. He can assess if the box is stacked, and make changes accordingly. Is it better to try running an Isolation play to the 1 or 2 hole against an 8 or 9-man front than throwing a 1- yard slant? Maybe not.

If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers?

A fake to a RB doesn't try to fool the LBs, but it does indeed hold them in their position in the box for a split second, which is all that is needed to open up a throwing lane to the WRs.

Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

You're thinking with an old-school mindset coming from watching I-formation with a FB and I-Back in the backfield...instead of thinking that multiple options out of the shotgun may actually pose more of a threat to a defense than taking the ball from under center. I get it; it would make sense that running the ball with momentum would increase the chances of picking up a yard, but I think spread coordinators think the multiple options from the shotgun pose as much of a threat to a defense.

I always wanted us to run the Oklahoma offense under Stoops, because they ran out of spread formations with the shotgun, and out of I-formation with the QB under center. It was truly a multiple offense.


Please, now feel free to blast away at me.
 
Last edited:

dand84

All-Conference
Oct 28, 2017
3,429
1,844
0
Really not sure why you are asking this question. Do some research, read about this offense. Study some film. Watch some interviews.

@Tuco Salamanca gets a cookie for predicting these kinds of questions when HCSF was hired :p
 

JohnRossEwing

All-American
Jul 4, 2013
11,899
5,284
0
I’m not talking SF specifically, I was pointing out that it isn’t necessarily the truth that handing off from center and in shotgun are putting the carrier in the same position. Not to mention the obvious fact that under center also means a running start for the carrier



lmao wtf are you talking about? If it works against NFL teams I think it’ll probably work against Purdue too

It works at times...it is a play that teams might run 2 or 3 times a game...people act like it is some sort of amazing play that can't be stopped. Seriously, some people bought into the Riley garbage about the jet sweet...like it is the ******* Crane Kick of plays and can't be defended. For every long *** run from the jet sweep you have 10 jet sweeps that get 2 yards.

It is like the WR tunnel screens...9 times out of 10 it gets nothing.
 
Aug 18, 2016
16,645
10,920
113
It works at times...it is a play that teams might run 2 or 3 times a game...people act like it is some sort of amazing play that can't be stopped. Seriously, some people bought into the Riley garbage about the jet sweet...like it is the ****ing Crane Kick of plays and can't be defended. For every long *** run from the jet sweep you have 10 jet sweeps that get 2 yards.

It is like the WR tunnel screens...9 times out of 10 it gets nothing.

Sounds like most plays. The threat of the big play is what makes other plays more successful. The threat of the jet sweep, makes defenses react to stopping it, which opens up other plays.
 
  • Like
Reactions: HuskerLLM

ZJSARENOTFREE

All-Conference
Oct 16, 2017
1,718
1,986
113
Sounds like most plays. The threat of the big play is what makes other plays more successful. The threat of the jet sweep, makes defenses react to stopping it, which opens up other plays.

Yep. Now we just need to get it timed right, and actually have guys that can run it. Our jet game has been pathetic more due to how poorly executed it was.
 

mgbreeze

All-Conference
Dec 16, 2004
10,115
3,575
113
Our problem with the jet sweep is we have been forever scarred by watching Wisconsin run it against us. So when we run it and it only gets 5-7 yards, it seems like a failure. "We thought you were supposed to get a TD every time?"
 
May 29, 2001
625
252
63
I have to admit though, that I felt a lot better about Nebraska's chances of stopping the 4th and inches when CU lined up in the shotgun instead of under center and running a sneak. At least it gave NU a chance for penetration and making a negative play. Of course, throwing a pick on the next play kind of nullified the defensive stop anyway.
 

JohnRossEwing

All-American
Jul 4, 2013
11,899
5,284
0
I have to admit though, that I felt a lot better about Nebraska's chances of stopping the 4th and inches when CU lined up in the shotgun instead of under center and running a sneak. At least it gave NU a chance for penetration and making a negative play. Of course, throwing a pick on the next play kind of nullified the defensive stop anyway.
Ha! No kidding!
 

Solana Beach Husker

All-Conference
Aug 7, 2008
14,102
1,245
0
The
First: None of this, "Nice first post" type responses from anyone. I'm a long time listener, first-time caller in a sense.

When watching the game with the Nebraska Alumni group out here, I openly questioned why NU was running shotgun on 3rd and 1 in the first half. Nobody said a word to me. I then asked later in the half why on 3rd and 14, in the shotgun once again, a play-action pass was called. Nobody responded.

Martinez thew the ball 20 times. I get that you want the defense to think pass when they see shotgun, then maybe do a draw or something, but 3rd and 1? If Mike Riley or Bo Pelini would've called this, this board would have lit up. Play-action on 3rd and 14 out of shotgun to try and fool the linebackers? Again, I didn't see anyone on this board say anything about it. Advanced apologies if I missed it.

Not being a negative-nancy or throwing any coaches under the bus; just sound fundamental football says these aren't high-efficiency plays.

Please, now feel free to blast away at me.


The issue with your response has to do with packages. Frost will have to install an under center package just for short yardage. So they would have to install 20+ plays for qbs who aren't used to being under center anyway, just to use it 2-3 times a game.. They have packages that can have 2-3-4 guys run the ball. Frost admitted that his short yardage plays were unimaginative...a jet sweep or play-action to TE probably goes for a td on both of those stuffs, but a team that runs for 300+ yards should be able to get 1.
 
Aug 18, 2016
16,645
10,920
113
The



The issue with your response has to do with packages. Frost will have to install an under center package just for short yardage. So they would have to install 20+ plays for qbs who aren't used to being under center anyway, just to use it 2-3 times a game.. They have packages that can have 2-3-4 guys run the ball. Frost admitted that his short yardage plays were unimaginative...a jet sweep or play-action to TE probably goes for a td on both of those stuffs, but a team that runs for 300+ yards should be able to get 1.

The issue with getting one yard when you've rushed for 300 is also problematic. On 1st and 10 or 2nd and 7 the defense is going to be forced to defend a whole lot more formations and plays than they will on 4th and 1. The formation on the 4th and 1 with 7 minutes left, had 2 TE, 1 back and 2 WR. The Buffs lined up man to man on the 2 WR on the right and dared Nebraska to throw the ball. They were 100% committed to stopping the run.
 
  • Like
Reactions: saluno22

saluno22

All-Conference
Mar 1, 2006
8,043
2,379
0
The issue with getting one yard when you've rushed for 300 is also problematic. On 1st and 10 or 2nd and 7 the defense is going to be forced to defend a whole lot more formations and plays than they will on 4th and 1. The formation on the 4th and 1 with 7 minutes left, had 2 TE, 1 back and 2 WR. The Buffs lined up man to man on the 2 WR on the right and dared Nebraska to throw the ball. They were 100% committed to stopping the run.
Wholeheartedly agree. Similar to pass-happy teams struggling to score from inside the red zone: less space to maneuver and the field boundaries act as an extra defender(s).
 

Solana Beach Husker

All-Conference
Aug 7, 2008
14,102
1,245
0
Wholeheartedly agree. Similar to pass-happy teams struggling to score from inside the red zone: less space to maneuver and the field boundaries act as an extra defender(s).

4th and 1 is a great opportunity for a big play...if you have any qb other than a true freshman in his first game in two years you throw, zone read, wide option, PA to TE and you have a huge gain. CU was smart...they planned for vanilla play calls in tense situations and they were right...even the pick occurred because their LB was prepared to bait Adrian on the most vanilla and simple pass play in the play book. I think the early fumbles really bothered frost and he was pretty vanilla the rest of the game, didn't want the turnovers to start to snowball...the worst nightmare for a coach is to see new players lose confidence in front of 91k...all of our turnovers happened because of that newness for Bell and Martinez.
 
  • Like
Reactions: saluno22