RJ please pass the ball

dukehokie

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Jun 27, 2005
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Being mad and being critical are different things. Nobody bats an eye when people on here “bashed” ‘Ques that past 2 years but be critical of RJ and how he plays sometimes and all hell breaks loose lol.

This “bash” thing has gone way too far. It really has. Like two people have complained about the treatment RJ has gotten on here without actually backing it up with conversation.

I’ll gladly talk with you how I think you’re wrong about RJ and how I personally think you were wrong about Tatum. I’m not complaining. I’m stating a case. That’s what message boards are supposed to be about.

But every thread you post on there it is, and then you start calling out mods. Your point gets lost my man, that’s all I’m saying.
 

2 skerz 3_rivals208847

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I think so too. Like I said, I see it as he’s going about it the wrong way, but the motivation is pure. He wants to win.

He should be called on his ****, but when guys speculate that he’s jealous or doing it for draft stock, I can’t get down with that line of thinking. Not with this kid and this team.
RJ is really good, no denying that, and is needed for us to have a chance to win the title. But he’s not our best player. That spot rest solely on our 270+ pound athletic freak Zion.
He does it all, and he’s unselfish. The sooner the team realizes that, the better we will all be for it. I don’t think there’s a team out there that has any answer for him.
During the game today I thought to myself, I cannot remember a kid that has worn the Duke Uniform that plays as hard as Zion plays. Couple that with his unbelievable talent and you get a true superstar!
 
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topps coach

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Feb 6, 2008
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Those plays were drawn up for him to do that. The hope was for the refs to call the game. Can’t rely on that. There are 100 plays where Tre should have driven and created. Like Tyus, Tre should have the ball in tight situations, IMO.

Seriously, RJ need to learn when he can and can’t get a shot, but he’s not this team’s “problem.”

We can’t scapegoat this kid that’s just wrong. He’s a great player and will get it right. He was bad the last minute of the game, and he probably could have had at least one foul go his way. He still has some learning to do.
Reminds when people were saying that Tatum should be benched after the State game.RJ is a freshman in his sixth college game.Without him we would not have even had a chance to win that game.Alphas like him often make bad decisions trying to win .
 

2 skerz 3_rivals208847

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This “bash” thing has gone way too far. It really has. Like two people have complained about the treatment RJ has gotten on here without actually backing it up with conversation.

I’ll gladly talk with you how I think you’re wrong about RJ and how I personally think you were wrong about Tatum. I’m not complaining. I’m stating a case. That’s what message boards are supposed to be about.

But every thread you post on there it is, and then you start calling out mods. Your point gets lost my man, that’s all I’m saying.
1st off the mod thing was a joke. I don’t give a damn about a couple toothless trolls from a team we beat by 34 pts. I was being a smartass so for that I apologize.

2nd if you could show me where in jayson Tatum’s lone season here where I was ever critical of him or his game I’d like to see it cause I’m fairly certain it doesn’t exist.

Lastly, the only time I responded hastly to anyone is when I got called a douchebag and a troll. I’m been on this board for years, so yeah that got under my skin a bit. Look at my posting history here and you’ll find there aren’t many bigger Duke fans then myself, but I also think it’s okay to discuss “negative” things related to our team as well as positive things. That’s not unhealthy.
 
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timo0402

Heisman
Feb 24, 2009
13,868
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Reminds when people were saying that Tatum should be benched after the State game.RJ is a freshman in his sixth college game.Without him we would not have even had a chance to win that game.Alphas like him often make bad decisions trying to win .
Thought the same thing earlier. This is very similar to the State game. We are getting smoked, Tatum is one of the catalysts for the comeback. We don’t even have a chance to win it at the end without him and the heroics he employed, and then he has a bad last possession and is the reason we lost. It’s so ignorant that it’s sometimes not even worth the effort to respond.
 
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dukiejay

Heisman
Mar 2, 2005
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Duke has never, ever lost a game where it wasn’t one guy’s fault, according to most here.

R.J. was bad the last 90 seconds today, and to be honest, he wasn’t great all week...but we didn’t lose because of him. We lost for a myriad of reasons....but there’s always going to be a few that stand out more than others.

The truth is, this Duke team is really, really good. They were never going to go 40-0, though. Unfortunately, they’re going to lose more games, too. But, through six games (excluding maybe 2011 & 2015), can you recall a time you felt better about our end of year chances in the last 15 years?
 

dukehokie

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1st off the mod thing was a joke. I don’t give a damn about a couple toothless trolls from a team we beat by 34 pts. I was being a smartass so for that I apologize.

2nd if you could show me where in jayson Tatum’s lone season here where I was ever critical of him or his game I’d like to see it cause I’m fairly certain it doesn’t exist.

Lastly, the only time I responded hastly to anyone is when I got called a douchebag and a troll. I’m been on this board for years, so yeah that got under my skin a bit. Look at my posting history here and you’ll find there aren’t many bigger Duke fans then myself, but I also think it’s okay to discuss “negative” things related to our team as well as positive things. That’s not unhealthy.

It’s absolutely ok to discuss negative things. It just seems when the people who want to discuss negative things get push back, the bashing conversation gets started. Then we get where are right now.

I get the name calling sucks, and that too has to stop, but the people who want to actually talk about it aren’t complaining about anyone bashing anyone else.
 

Jakarii

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Nope they get crucified too, said before “Love RJ game but he shoots first second and third but I’ll still take him second behind Zion”. Some took that as straight hate instead of honest observation
 

chov1125

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Oct 15, 2008
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I’m fine with people being critical of players, as long as they do it in a way that sparks intelligent conversation, not playground “you suck” talk. I try to be loyal whenever possible but we haven’t won it all in a few years, it’s not all pink unicorns and rainbows either.

This team needed this loss bad. I hate losing, but we are not nearly as good as people say we are and there’s nothing wrong with that. Team defense is not developed overnight and we got exposed by a well executed team. We didn’t stay in front of the ball, we didn’t defend pick and roll, we didn’t rotate correctly and we didn’t double correctly. All of that made it an offensive clinic for Gonzaga, hats off to them.

This was a team loss, we looked tired and young. RJ gets the finger pointing because he takes the most shots and also the most important shots. Give him time to figure it out, he’s playing a new level of ball/competition too. Things that worked in high school/AAU may not work in college, like bullying through people at the rim. The last few plays called for a drive and kick, not a push through and hope for a whistle. He’ll learn that area like the rest of our team will make their own individual improvements. I’m much more confident in this group, both physically and mentally figuring this whole thing out come March.

Circling back to criticism, I’m all for it, it’s a discussion board. But there’s a big difference between criticizing and bashing. Criticizing breeds healthy conversation, bashing is low level talk that flows out with hate and an inability to control one’s emotions. I’m crushed that Duke lost, let me take it out on RJ by saying how much he sucks....
 
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hart2chesson

Heisman
Oct 13, 2012
14,303
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I have no will towards RJ in the least. Should he have passed to a wing? Probably so. However he truly helped put us in a POSITION to win. The main point is K can work with him and use tape to show him better decision making on the season. Hey, I'd much rather LOSE this game as a learning tool than drop an opening ACC season play w/ a loss to a BC like we did last year. The PK80 tourmament win was fools gold, And we built the big ego over winning it.Brighter days are ahead..

OFC
 

cropper2

Redshirt
Nov 21, 2018
6
1
0
my best advice: lube
IU is really banged up but healthy they’re a great team. Due to Coach K and Knight’s connection I’ve always rooted for Duke as well. I’m not here to troll I just call it as I see it. Duke is a great team but obviously not invincible. If IU can get healthy in time it will be a good game but I don’t think they’ll be anywhere near full strength. Hell IU may lose by 30 but how good would Duke be if they had 6 or 7 guys out injured?
 

Mac9192

Heisman
Jan 25, 2017
9,493
13,716
107
Just delete this thread . It makes our fan base look bad imo.
Some of it does. But most of your regular posters haven’t said anything too negative about the team. Someone is ignorant to not realize Barrett is special. Same goes for the other freshmen too. But he has to not force it at times. He and Cam didn’t play their best, but we focus on the last couple minutes, and it wasn’t his brightest moments.
Personally, I think he learns from this game.

We will be fine. I enjoyed it and think our team will grow from it more than had we won the tournament.
I keep saying it, and nothing against our other kids, but I love the way Zion plays. That kid is the real deal. Blocking shots, making passes, scoring...
I can’t see how anyone after watching this team doesn’t see that he’s the best player on the team.
 

IPSYCHOSIS

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Some of it does. But most of your regular posters haven’t said anything too negative about the team. Someone is ignorant to not realize Barrett is special. Same goes for the other freshmen too. But he has to not force it at times. He and Cam didn’t play their best, but we focus on the last couple minutes, and it wasn’t his brightest moments.
Personally, I think he learns from this game.

We will be fine. I enjoyed it and think our team will grow from it more than had we won the tournament.
I keep saying it, and nothing against our other kids, but I love the way Zion plays. That kid is the real deal. Blocking shots, making passes, scoring...
I can’t see how anyone after watching this team doesn’t see that he’s the best player on the team.
Well the rare posters get me stirred up man!! I’m trying to hold it together!! Especially the game day threads. Not just talking about the RJ criticism in them, it’s everything pretty much. Wooo :)
 

IPSYCHOSIS

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Anymeat I’m with you on Zion! Hey I’ll pat myself on the back and say I called that **** in Canada too! Hehe
 

df64

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Feb 2, 2006
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All 4 freshman forced things unnecessarily from start to finish. Not all the time. Not even most of the time. But, too often for this team to be anywhere as good as it could/should be. Even Tre forced a few drives. Fine line between being assertive and forcing. How well this team learns this determines their ultimate succes.
 

bullettoothtony

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Stephen A on First Take this morning said he's gotten texts from agents essentially saying the offense should go through Reddish more (I'm assuming more or less as a point forward).

Thoughts?
 

nets on nets on nets

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Jun 4, 2015
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The whole best player on the team debate is fairly stupid IMO. Through 6 games, Zion has probably done more things on the court that equates to winning. That probably does make Zion “better” than RJ I guess. However, I’d still rather have the ball in RJ’s hands with the game on the line, does that make RJ better??

I see RJ/Zion becoming like Jay/Shane on the 2001 team. Jay puts up more scoring numbers and is the #1 option, but he would occasionally make you pull your hair out. Whereas Shane was more like a steady rock who did much more of the little things and held the team together.
 
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IPSYCHOSIS

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I saw a video online where they all were interviewed and when asked who they would go to if they need a 3 for the win they all said Cam.
 

TomPawn

Redshirt
Nov 22, 2018
1
0
0
I hope everyone realizes that K chose to put RJ in those situations.. he drew up Kobe Bryant plays for RJ when clearly he is not ready yet. A better option would’ve been a Tre Jones drive and find open guy (def cam should’ve even in game) or give to Zion because at least he would have bern able to get a shot off even if he would’ve forced it or get fouled .. those are better odds then forcing a 1 on 3.. espwcially since defense knew RJ wouldn’t pass so all 3 defenders rose to block his shots and they did on all 4 or 5 attempts at the end. BTW, Even if RJ would’ve been fouled, he would’ve missed one and alternatively if he actually did pass that last ball to Delaurier, pretty sure Delaurier would’ve panicked and missed that chip shot.
 

bullcity gamer

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Would have loved to see Tre have the ball in his hands with that final possession in yesterday’s game. He was exploiting the Gonzaga zone and picking his spots with the floaters. Allow him to make the right decision since he is the point guard that runs the well oiled machine.
 
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IPSYCHOSIS

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I hope everyone realizes that K chose to put RJ in those situations.. he drew up Kobe Bryant plays for RJ when clearly he is not ready yet. A better option would’ve been a Tre Jones drive and find open guy (def cam should’ve even in game) or give to Zion because at least he would have bern able to get a shot off even if he would’ve forced it or get fouled .. those are better odds then forcing a 1 on 3.. espwcially since defense knew RJ wouldn’t pass so all 3 defenders rose to block his shots and they did on all 4 or 5 attempts at the end. BTW, Even if RJ would’ve been fouled, he would’ve missed one and alternatively if he actually did pass that last ball to Delaurier, pretty sure Delaurier would’ve panicked and missed that chip shot.
What’s a Kobe Bryant play?
 

IPSYCHOSIS

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I just don’t get the “K drew up” stuff man. It’s spread everybody out and iso....can anybody explain?
 

dukehokie

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I just don’t get the “K drew up” stuff man. It’s spread everybody out and iso....can anybody explain?

The coach will devise a play in the timeout huddle for the team to run after the timeout. It’s called “drawing a play up.” Typically the play is drawn on a white board to illustrate what is to be done.

In the huddle, K clearly devised a play for everyone to spread away from the ball and allow RJ to drive and hit a shot or draw a foul. Neither happened. We lost.
 
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IPSYCHOSIS

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The coach will devise a play in the timeout huddle for the team to run after the timeout. It’s called “drawing a play up.” Typically the play is drawn on a white board to illustrate what is to be done.

In the huddle, K clearly devised a play for everyone to spread away from the ball and allow RJ to drive and hit a shot or draw a foul. Neither happened. We lost.
I thought we were doing that all game anyway. Drawing up a play to spread out gotcha
 

Showenuff

Heisman
Nov 21, 2006
21,624
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I figured our first loss would draw a thread with a stupid title like this one. We have a great team and great players. Our top 4 are JUST LEARNING the college game. Before this season is done, the same people dogging RJ here today will be singing his praises after he pulls off an epic win. Seriously, if you're butt hurt we didn't go undefeated, you're not very wise in this game we're playing.
 

Friction.

Junior
Jan 23, 2008
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Stephen A on First Take this morning said he's gotten texts from agents essentially saying the offense should go through Reddish more (I'm assuming more or less as a point forward).

Thoughts?

Interesting. I think that’s a fair take if they mean he should initiate the offense more - but my take on it is that it’s a little more complicated than that. agents don’t care about the team just the player but to me it’s all situational.

When a team is running a 2-3, I think Cam is much better utilized on the wing off the ball...not as a point. He can shoot and slash. In fact, he may be even deadlier than Zion flashing to the free throw line with his unbelievable skill-set.

How about the mismatch he brings if a bigger (or even much smaller) defender matches up with him? No reason to have him as a point forward IMO. would want him moving around off the ball.

Being the point is being the most efficient decision-maker. Personally, I think the more Tre runs the offense, the better. It’s best for the team. If the agents were inferring that he needs more touches in each possession, then yeah that’s an awfully bold perspective from an agent. Nobody can disagree with that. The next agent probably shot a text saying Zion can really dunk the ball.
 

LouisiAaron

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Feb 15, 2017
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I stand corrected. We actually didn’t call a play on that final possession. We had a timeout but coach just let them go to see what they would do. Damnit Tre! U gotta keep the ball my dude. But it’s cool. Now we can relax and play.
 

Mpm277

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RJ drove for a layup 5 times in a row to end the game. Maybe K continued to draw up what wasn't working, I don't know. We were only down by 2 and had plenty of time to run plays instead of wrecklessly driving to the basket in hopes of a miracle, or at the very least, a foul. A big reason the game was close at the end was Gonzaga couldn't hit their free throws.

Zion did the same thing to end the second game of the tournament. He seemed set on getting a big play after getting that dunk blocked.

For some reason we stopped playing as a team during this tournament. I'm honestly not mad that we lost. Gonzaga is a #3 team and this was a good lesson for our freshman. We know that we can be beat now. We aren't going to go undefeated.
 
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Jakarii

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J.Giovany has a article basically saying the same thing this thread said. He talked to the scouts there and they all said RJ plays too much hero ball especially the last couple possessions and they wonder if he’s a player that can make his teammates better. They still like him but some have him 3rd of their board with Zion as a dead lock at one (all the scouts have him there are 6 games) and Cam two due to his skill level and jumper. The others are iffy on him due to the Gonzaga game, said this is what the knock has been on him before college how he is too skilled to disappear.

They all said Zion is way to unique to pass on at number one

Thread title is over the top but to the point. Let’s move on. Next play.