Isn't amazing how baby boomers got the benefit of winning world war 2 and the rise of the public sector with regards to public education and other government services, but now they don't want to pay for anything and have literally left their grandkids a pile of **** country ?
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And the Federal Government still has it listed as a schedule 1 controlled substance. In my view it's still illegal everywhere. And to try and legalize it for the sake of the tiller is pretty short sighted.
Granted, it MAY have some medicinal benefits. But we won't KNOW that until it is studied further in clinical trials. And I don't mean how many brownies it takes to pass out. But for those that experienced relief with it (from seizures for example) they should continue to get it. Otherwise, in my opinion, the Feds should enforce the law on the books and at least do away with recreational use for now. At the same time, they should release the patent so we can have drugs studies with it.
Look, this isn't your circa 1976 Columbian or Tye stick grade stuff. This is genetically selected, with the ratios of CBD, THC, and all the rest of the cannabinoids, carefully monitored and held as an industrial secret. This stuff is grown under the direction of PhD botanists, using pretty sophisticated technology. The dispensary I toured used an irrigation system imported from Israel, measuring drops per hour of water for seedlings and used specific fertilizer recipes for plant feelings. They moved the plant from room to room based on age and light needs. They had strict cleaning procedures for the rooms before another strain would be introduced to the room. And of course, all male plants were eliminated because of their seeds.
As soon as it's legalized it won't be long until the tobacco industry rolls in and takes this over. Then your tax benefits are going to be gone. And the one group of folks that shouldn't be smoking pot, that have decreased medical care available, are those that already suffer from mental illnesses. And we seem to have an increasing number of those folks around, everywhere.
Granted, it MAY have some medicinal benefits. But we won't KNOW that until it is studied further in clinical trials. And I don't mean how many brownies it takes to pass out. But for those that experienced relief with it (from seizures for example) they should continue to get it. Otherwise, in my opinion, the Feds should enforce the law on the books and at least do away with recreational use for now. At the same time, they should release the patent so we can have drugs studies with it.
Look, this isn't your circa 1976 Columbian or Tye stick grade stuff. This is genetically selected, with the ratios of CBD, THC, and all the rest of the cannabinoids, carefully monitored and held as an industrial secret. This stuff is grown under the direction of PhD botanists, using pretty sophisticated technology. The dispensary I toured used an irrigation system imported from Israel, measuring drops per hour of water for seedlings and used specific fertilizer recipes for plant feelings. They moved the plant from room to room based on age and light needs. They had strict cleaning procedures for the rooms before another strain would be introduced to the room. And of course, all male plants were eliminated because of their seeds.
As soon as it's legalized it won't be long until the tobacco industry rolls in and takes this over. Then your tax benefits are going to be gone. And the one group of folks that shouldn't be smoking pot, that have decreased medical care available, are those that already suffer from mental illnesses. And we seem to have an increasing number of those folks around, everywhere.
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That's a good question. Alcohol & Guns is a worse mix. Smoking pot is felonious according to federal and some state laws. If a card is required to purchase medical or recreational weed, current federal and some state laws may be interpreted such that gun purchases would be denied to felons. Someone could conceivably carry a card without being a smoker. Federal law would have to change to take weed off Schedule I, which defines the substance as having a high potential for abuse. Israel leads the world in marijuana research, which involves breaking the plant down into specific parts or combinations thereof. Certain types of pain and other maladies can be quelled by some of the chemicals involved. Certain areas of pain can be more specifically identified using these medicines.
Personal aside: I'm on a transplant list which doesn't allow marijuana, but it has nothing to do with medical concerns and everything to do with Big Insurance (F'em) looking for a way out of paying. Medically, I'm not allowed any pain meds except for a bare minimum of Tylenol. There's a slight risk I might not process narcotics correctly, putting me in a long or permanent state of goo goo. Besides, who wants to be on that **** anyhow? No Ibuprofen or aspirin because of blood thinning risks. I've smoked plenty of pot and never thought of it as pain relief, but I would love to have the option to use it as a psychotropic just for the distraction once in a while. F Big Insurance and their f'ing blood tests.
Gateway aside: I've given this a lot of thought. While only based on what I've seen/read/heard in the course of my lifetime and pure conjecture on my part, I think processed sugar is the gateway drug in our country. We are either born addicted or soon become so. So far as I know, It's not TERRIBLY bad for MOST people and an easy habit to break, but it starts us in life with an urge that is easy to satisfy. Gateway defined, imo.
Tobacco aside: I feared this one, having to quit 3 yrs ago (f'ing Insurance blood tests.) No sweat at all. Most of breaking addictions is Wanting to, imo. No doubt it's tougher for some than others, but I'd long expected that nicotine addiction was overblown just because such a huge industry arose from it. Same for alcohol.
#LowSodiumGluttenFreeDoritos4All.
It has health benefits (seizure reduction, appetite stimulation for cancer patients for ex.). It's legalized in several states and I'm not sure if the tobacco industry has anything to do with the well-funded grow operations that are supplying the stores that sell it. Sales are generating lots of tax revenues for the states where it is legalized. Anyone who wants it now can get it anywhere easily so access will not change. The big difference would be who profits from the sale and the generation of tax revenues from participating states not to mention all the jobs that would be created.
All everyone needs to know is the company that makes feytanyl is fighting legalization efforts in Arizona.
Don't forget the heiress, not the one who built the company, of Publix grocery stores also donated more than $800k to defeat marijuana initiatives in Florida. Why? Because that's going to eat into her prescription drug & alcohol sales.
The people lobbying against pot aren't doing it out of the goodness of their hearts - they're doing it to make sure they don't have any competition. Meanwhile, people are being locked up for simple possession. It's ridiculous.
Please don't do that. It's insulting to many of us at a certain age. You're going to put all this **** on people who are currently 52 - 70 years old? 18 - 51 are blameless? Many of us boomers have fought too hard against this BS to be lumped in such a way.
There is a job/wage hierarchy in every business/profession. Of course some (many) businesses will still drug test for weed. Good luck to your son.
Maybe tell him to stop smoking? That doesn't mean it should be illegal for the rest of us.
Okay, but pot isn't physically addictive like heroin/pain pills or alcohol so I'm not sure what you're talking about. It can be habit-forming, but that does not mean it's physically addictive like other legally-available drugs. A person can stop smoking marijuana today and not have any withdrawal symptoms tomorrow.
The benefit of local casinos and not to the individual person but to the local infrastructure and communities that benefit from jobs, tourism and community improvements due to additional tax revenues.
Yea there will be degenerates that lose money but I'm betting those people will find a way a to blow their money with or without a casino presence.
I do not know if people realize that you can not get a job in the coal,gas and construction business. IF you hire someone and they are in an accident and test positive your business is liable. They are the better paying jobs so there is a lot of down side to it. We have had to let our fair share of workers go.
I'm not trying to convince anyone on this subject. However, WV is and has been in the Top 5 for most of the negative (Unhealthiest, Most Obese, Under-educated, Poorest, etc.) categories they track for states. I would think at some point people would say ... lets try something different because the one thing we know is how well we've done or not done to-date.
Las Vegas has built a robust economy in the desert on gambling and hookers .... geeesh.
Las Vegas has built a robust economy in the desert on gambling and hookers .... geeesh.
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The" how do you know" aspect implies there's virtually no difference UNLIKE how you know someone is drinking at work or driving...nuff said!
That isn't what the latest information is saying. Are you saying tobacco isn't/wasn't addictive. There is a population base that should forever stay away from pot, and certainly until it is known what it does and how it works. All you know is what the Pot industry is pushing these days. And it would be amazing to trust it anymore than big Pharma or the federal government. It isn't an innocent drug and the potency of today's pot is nothing to be nonchalant about.
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-addictive
A little dated but
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-truth-about-pot/
IN THE CLASSIC 1936 cult film Reefer Madness, well-adjusted high school students who try marijuana suddenly sink into a life of addiction, promiscuity, aggression, academic failure, homicide and mental illness. The movie concludes with the ominous warning that “The dread marijuana may be reaching forth next for your son or daughter ... or yours ... or YOURS!” Newspaper headlines of the day often reflected a similar sentiment. On February 10, 1938, a headline in the Beloit (Wisc.) Daily News read, “Authorities Warn against Spread of Marijuana Habit—Insanity, Degeneracy and Violence Follow Use of Weed.”
Such a position on pot seems extreme. Yet just as people have since cast aside the notion that marijuana use inevitably culminates in the destruction of the mind, so have they also begun to question the concept that it is benign. In particular, some evidence suggests that marijuana can, in some cases, be addictive and that it may present other health problems as well, particularly in heavy users. That said, most people suffer no ill effects from a single or occasional use of the drug.
How Many Get Hooked?
Marijuana, which is also known as cannabis, is the most widely used illicit substance in the world, according to a United Nations report from 2002. Recreational use is widespread in the U.S., and medical use is on the rise. In a 2007 study psychologist Louisa Degenhardt of Michigan State University and her colleagues found that 43 percent of U.S. adults aged 18 or older have tried marijuana at least once. Many adolescents are drawn to the drug as well. In the large, ongoing Monitoring the Future study, researchers at the University of Michigan found that 14 percent of eighth graders had used marijuana at least once in the previous year with the number increasing to 35 percent for 12th graders. Marijuana use will undoubtedly grow in the near future because 16 states have already legalized it for medical use, and many more are considering legislation that would make it legal.
Given the drug’s growing popularity, many people have long been concerned about its potential dangers and, in particular, whether it can be addictive. People tend to use “addiction” and “dependence” interchangeably, although drug experts now favor the term “dependence.” In the current version of the mental health profession’s “bible,” theDiagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, a diagnosis of cannabis dependence (a type of substance dependence) requires a person to meet at least three of seven criteria.
A number of investigators have addressed this issue and found that only a relatively small percentage of those who try marijuana will become addicted. For example, in a large-scale survey published in 1994 epidemiologist James Anthony, then at the National Institute on Drug Abuse, and his colleagues asked more than 8,000 people between the ages of 15 and 64 about their use of marijuana and other drugs. The researchers found that of those who had tried marijuana at least once, about 9 percent eventually fit a diagnosis of cannabis dependence. The corresponding figure for alcohol was 15 percent; for cocaine, 17 percent; for heroin, 23 percent; and for nicotine, 32 percent. So although marijuana may be addictive for some, 91 percent of those who try it do not get hooked. Further, marijuana is less addictive than many other legal and illegal drugs.
Possible Perils
A hotly debated issue is whether marijuana is a “gateway” drug, leading to the use of more dangerous substances. Many studies have found that most people who used other illicit drugs had, in fact, used marijuana first. Although results such as these are consistent with the gateway hypothesis, they do not prove that using marijuana causes the use of other drugs. Those who are drawn to marijuana may simply be predisposed to drug use in general, regardless of their exposure to pot. In addition, individuals often smoke cigarettes or drink alcohol before they latch on to marijuana. Should we also be asking whether nicotine and alcohol are gateway drugs?
Researchers have also demonstrated that heavy marijuana use can lead to increased tolerance and withdrawal symptoms when trying to stop. In addition, heavy use can contribute to respiratory and cardiovascular problems as well as impairments in short-term memory. Marijuana may also trigger certain disorders, such as schizophrenia, in vulnerable persons [see “A Mind in Danger,” by Victoria Costello], although researchers continue to debate the evidence on this issue. Finally, because marijuana is still illegal in most states and under federal law, people who possess or sell marijuana may face legal consequences.
On the other hand, marijuana has significant upsides for individuals with certain illnesses. In glaucoma patients, it can reduce the dangerously high eye pressure that can lead to vision loss. In addition, pot can provide relief from chronic pain, reduce nausea and vomiting from cancer chemotherapy, and limit the severe weight loss that results from AIDS and other diseases.
When a person does become addicted, several types of psychotherapy can help him or her kick the habit. One of the more effective types is a form of cognitive-behavior therapy (CBT) tailored to the addictive mind-set. Using CBT, therapists teach patients practical coping skills that lead to a change in behavior. They also try to modify the thoughts that contribute to a person’s addiction. Two faster treatments are motivational interviewing and the closely related motivational-enhancement therapy. The goal of these methods is to boost a person’s drive to stop or reduce their use of pot.
Unfortunately, relapse rates remain high for all addiction psychotherapies. In a study published in 2003 psychologist Brent A. Moore, now at Yale University, and his colleagues found that 41 percent of successfully treated marijuana addicts had relapsed within six months. Scientists are searching for ways to bring about long-term abstinence more consistently.
The public needs to be aware of the facts about marijuana so that it can dismiss fictions about the drug’s effects. Only by knowing when marijuana presents a real threat and when the risk is minimal can people properly weigh its dangers and benefits in specific situations. Both our health and sound social policy depend on it.
This article was originally published with the title "Facts and Fictions in Mental Health: The Truth About Pot"
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-truth-about-pot/
IN THE CLASSIC 1936 cult film Reefer Madness, well-adjusted high school students who try marijuana suddenly sink into a life of addiction, promiscuity, aggression, academic failure, homicide and mental illness. The movie concludes with the ominous warning that “The dread marijuana may be reaching forth next for your son or daughter ... or yours ... or YOURS!” Newspaper headlines of the day often reflected a similar sentiment. On February 10, 1938, a headline in the Beloit (Wisc.) Daily News read, “Authorities Warn against Spread of Marijuana Habit—Insanity, Degeneracy and Violence Follow Use of Weed.”
Such a position on pot seems extreme. Yet just as people have since cast aside the notion that marijuana use inevitably culminates in the destruction of the mind, so have they also begun to question the concept that it is benign. In particular, some evidence suggests that marijuana can, in some cases, be addictive and that it may present other health problems as well, particularly in heavy users. That said, most people suffer no ill effects from a single or occasional use of the drug.
How Many Get Hooked?
Marijuana, which is also known as cannabis, is the most widely used illicit substance in the world, according to a United Nations report from 2002. Recreational use is widespread in the U.S., and medical use is on the rise. In a 2007 study psychologist Louisa Degenhardt of Michigan State University and her colleagues found that 43 percent of U.S. adults aged 18 or older have tried marijuana at least once. Many adolescents are drawn to the drug as well. In the large, ongoing Monitoring the Future study, researchers at the University of Michigan found that 14 percent of eighth graders had used marijuana at least once in the previous year with the number increasing to 35 percent for 12th graders. Marijuana use will undoubtedly grow in the near future because 16 states have already legalized it for medical use, and many more are considering legislation that would make it legal.
Given the drug’s growing popularity, many people have long been concerned about its potential dangers and, in particular, whether it can be addictive. People tend to use “addiction” and “dependence” interchangeably, although drug experts now favor the term “dependence.” In the current version of the mental health profession’s “bible,” theDiagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, a diagnosis of cannabis dependence (a type of substance dependence) requires a person to meet at least three of seven criteria.
A number of investigators have addressed this issue and found that only a relatively small percentage of those who try marijuana will become addicted. For example, in a large-scale survey published in 1994 epidemiologist James Anthony, then at the National Institute on Drug Abuse, and his colleagues asked more than 8,000 people between the ages of 15 and 64 about their use of marijuana and other drugs. The researchers found that of those who had tried marijuana at least once, about 9 percent eventually fit a diagnosis of cannabis dependence. The corresponding figure for alcohol was 15 percent; for cocaine, 17 percent; for heroin, 23 percent; and for nicotine, 32 percent. So although marijuana may be addictive for some, 91 percent of those who try it do not get hooked. Further, marijuana is less addictive than many other legal and illegal drugs.
Possible Perils
A hotly debated issue is whether marijuana is a “gateway” drug, leading to the use of more dangerous substances. Many studies have found that most people who used other illicit drugs had, in fact, used marijuana first. Although results such as these are consistent with the gateway hypothesis, they do not prove that using marijuana causes the use of other drugs. Those who are drawn to marijuana may simply be predisposed to drug use in general, regardless of their exposure to pot. In addition, individuals often smoke cigarettes or drink alcohol before they latch on to marijuana. Should we also be asking whether nicotine and alcohol are gateway drugs?
Researchers have also demonstrated that heavy marijuana use can lead to increased tolerance and withdrawal symptoms when trying to stop. In addition, heavy use can contribute to respiratory and cardiovascular problems as well as impairments in short-term memory. Marijuana may also trigger certain disorders, such as schizophrenia, in vulnerable persons [see “A Mind in Danger,” by Victoria Costello], although researchers continue to debate the evidence on this issue. Finally, because marijuana is still illegal in most states and under federal law, people who possess or sell marijuana may face legal consequences.
On the other hand, marijuana has significant upsides for individuals with certain illnesses. In glaucoma patients, it can reduce the dangerously high eye pressure that can lead to vision loss. In addition, pot can provide relief from chronic pain, reduce nausea and vomiting from cancer chemotherapy, and limit the severe weight loss that results from AIDS and other diseases.
When a person does become addicted, several types of psychotherapy can help him or her kick the habit. One of the more effective types is a form of cognitive-behavior therapy (CBT) tailored to the addictive mind-set. Using CBT, therapists teach patients practical coping skills that lead to a change in behavior. They also try to modify the thoughts that contribute to a person’s addiction. Two faster treatments are motivational interviewing and the closely related motivational-enhancement therapy. The goal of these methods is to boost a person’s drive to stop or reduce their use of pot.
Unfortunately, relapse rates remain high for all addiction psychotherapies. In a study published in 2003 psychologist Brent A. Moore, now at Yale University, and his colleagues found that 41 percent of successfully treated marijuana addicts had relapsed within six months. Scientists are searching for ways to bring about long-term abstinence more consistently.
The public needs to be aware of the facts about marijuana so that it can dismiss fictions about the drug’s effects. Only by knowing when marijuana presents a real threat and when the risk is minimal can people properly weigh its dangers and benefits in specific situations. Both our health and sound social policy depend on it.
This article was originally published with the title "Facts and Fictions in Mental Health: The Truth About Pot"
opcorn:Once-Secret "Nixon Tapes" Show Why the U.S. Outlawed Pot | Alternet
http://www.alternet.org/story/12666/once-secret_"nixon_tapes"_show_why_the_u.s._outlawed_pot
This is the last I'll say on this thread because it's getting exhaustive but I never said pot didn't come with any drawbacks. That doesn't necessarily mean we should keep a substance that is demonstrably safer than alcohol illegal. Here's Dr. Lester Grinspoon, MD at Harvard for many decades on the matter:
http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1969/7/18/harvard-doctor-says-pot-harms-less/
The status quo, and the war on drugs, have been an immense failure. It's time we change that.
Tobacco has nicotine which is highly addictive of course. As for the weed, we know what it does and how it works. I would think that there's a lot of clinical and most assuredly a lot of anecdotal info. In fact I've done some research myself along with millions of other Americans. Everything in moderation.
Top 5 post right here. The whole "debate" about legalization is one of the dumbest things I've ever encountered. I'm not talking about this thread - I'm talking about society in general. Of course, nothing is perfect or completely without risk, including that cheeseburger that some of us huffed down for lunch today, but there is no sane, truly informed argument against legalization at this point. Just a bunch of attempted rationalizing by people who are scared shitless of anything but the tired old status quo.
Guess who is fighting legalized pot.
Who's Really Fighting Legal Marijuana? Big Tobacco, Big Pharma and Big Booze | US News Opinion
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/artic...on-opponents-aim-to-protect-their-bottom-line
We don't try new things here.... It has been this way forever and we ain't changing for no damn hippies.
Change versus intense indoctrination is tough to overcome. The lack of intelligent thought here is pervasive due to 60 years of complete fear tactics and a smear campaign on par with nothing we have encountered. Think about the prison time alone for something along the lines of booze. It's not a gateway to harder drugs, it's a gateway to more crime due to the ******** criminal records generated that limits people from any comeback.
Anyway, I'll slam a cheeseburger every now and then but I have to limit my vices with the evil devil plant in play.
Incarceration and the entire legal process leading to it is a business in this country. Everyone has to wet their beaks. WV could always decriminalize it as well. OK, thats it for me. You guys fight it out. I want to watch Tavon Awesome tonight!
Tavon is having a tough night. I'm going to leave this here.
https://learnaboutsam.org/wp-conten...ATION-OF-MARIJUANA-IN-COLORADO-THE-IMPACT.pdf
Legalization seems like an outstanding idea to me...
https://learnaboutsam.org/wp-conten...ATION-OF-MARIJUANA-IN-COLORADO-THE-IMPACT.pdf
Legalization seems like an outstanding idea to me...
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Agriculture is by definition renewable. Extraction industries are by definition finite.
No industry that has as many social problems associated with it as pot, substance abuse, will lead to any realistic economic boom. The cost to treat and the loss of worker productivity from prolonged pot use will negate the tax dollars generated. It's not a real industry that benefits more than it hurts. Just another example of what happens in what was a great economy of capitalism when the govt starts to negatively effect growth by regulation.
Actually, you're incorrect. You have no data to back up anything you're saying. What social problems are you ascribing to pot, that are not equaled or even greatly exceeded by say alcohol or tobacco?
I originally corrected your mistaken comment that all things are finite, as you really can't find more of a contrast between extraction versus something that's renewable.
Unless consumption were to skyrocket (and there's no data to suggest that's happening), it's really business as usual.
Finally, tax revenue is tax revenue. Being first mover would be nice, but over the long term there's not much difference between taxing one crop or business activity or another.
It's clear you think pot is some kind of scourge. If we were talking about opiates, perhaps we could agree.
You never brought in tobacco or alcohol which both are bad, no arguing there. But to say, pot isn't bad is ludicrous. It's a gateway drug and I lost a son who started on pot like so many other people who ended up addicted to heavier stuff or dead. Your statement that I'm mistaken about pot is mistaken itself. There's plenty of data to support that all three are bad for you. If you want WV to grow pot and use it as a tax base, get it passed. It's just not going to produce massive tax revenues that are going to alleviate lost tax revenues from more prosperous businesses.