OT: Rutgers faculty union calls strike

[MADHAT1]

Nope. Regular trips to a doctor would save so many lives and so much money.

You're absolutely right as this article points out.
>Regular health checkups help eliminate the risk of major health problems developing that can both be very dangerous and very costly. In some cases, having a regular checkup with your family doctor can help you avoid surgery, medication, and other costly expenses.<

https://jeffreyrothsteindo.com/benefits-of-seeing-doctor-regularly.html

 

[T2Kplus20]

Of course how many times I go to the doctor isn't tied to who pays for it. I'm not poor.
There are loads of people who avoid going to the doctor unless it's something serious because of their finances...or lack thereof. In fact I grew up in such an environment. Until my father got into the Teamsters union.

High deductible plans = lower premiums
Lower premiums = extra money for doc visits as needed
Just managed your money. Not complicated.

 

[bac2therac]

Not surprised

 

[Knightmoves]

Not surprised

So embarrassing. The RU proles demand a bigger piece of the pie.

 

[SkilletHead2]

I was not in the union when I was at RU (for 29 years) because at the time, all the negotiating was focused on faculty at the higher levels, and to hell with the assistant profs. But that was a long time ago.

There's a lot of misinformation in this thread, the worst being equating TAs and GAs with adjunct (course at a time) lecturers. The GAs and TAs generally do OK. Maybe they are behind inflation right now, but they basically get free tuition and a decent stipend. Just barely enough to live on, but if they team up with another GA or two, they can get by. But not by much. Now, how much they work varies hugely by department, and there are a number of departments that historically abuse GAs and TAs. So, if they are upset, then they may well have a case.

Regular faculty have pretty good salaries at RU. Again, they may have fallen behind in recent years, but nobody on a tenure track line is really hurting, and the top folks are doing fine.

But adjunct faculty are, and have always been, getting screwed. When I was there, they were getting around $2500 per course, and I think that's up to close to $6000 now. If you are going to teach a garden variety, stand up course for about 40 students or so, you are going to put in a ton of hours to do it right. This is where the University balances its books. Co-ads (co-adjunctant faculty) cover the courses nobody else wants, almost never know what the next semester or next year will hold, often do not get decent office space, and if they are making a living doing this, have to teach about 5 courses a semester to get by. It's a very tough life. It was never intended for someone to make a living out of doing this, but hiring has gotten so tight, that many people are.

If you have any sympathy for the strikers, it should be for this group.

 

[RU Cheese]

I was not in the union when I was at RU (for 29 years) because at the time, all the negotiating was focused on faculty at the higher levels, and to hell with the assistant profs. But that was a long time ago.

There's a lot of misinformation in this thread, the worst being equating TAs and GAs with adjunct (course at a time) lecturers. The GAs and TAs generally do OK. Maybe they are behind inflation right now, but they basically get free tuition and a decent stipend. Just barely enough to live on, but if they team up with another GA or two, they can get by. But not by much. Now, how much they work varies hugely by department, and there are a number of departments that historically abuse GAs and TAs. So, if they are upset, then they may well have a case.

Regular faculty have pretty good salaries at RU. Again, they may have fallen behind in recent years, but nobody on a tenure track line is really hurting, and the top folks are doing fine.

But adjunct faculty are, and have always been, getting screwed. When I was there, they were getting around $2500 per course, and I think that's up to close to $6000 now. If you are going to teach a garden variety, stand up course for about 40 students or so, you are going to put in a ton of hours to do it right. This is where the University balances its books. Co-ads (co-adjunctant faculty) cover the courses nobody else wants, almost never know what the next semester or next year will hold, often do not get decent office space, and if they are making a living doing this, have to teach about 5 courses a semester to get by. It's a very tough life. It was never intended for someone to make a living out of doing this, but hiring has gotten so tight, that many people are.

If you have any sympathy for the strikers, it should be for this group.

Great post. And I was going to comment on TAGA not being same as Adjunct. I just always thought adjunct was for people who have a job and teach a course on the side. If those positions were never designed to be FT, why aren't there a larger number of them doing less work?

 

[RU Cheese]

You're absolutely right as this article points out.
>Regular health checkups help eliminate the risk of major health problems developing that can both be very dangerous and very costly. In some cases, having a regular checkup with your family doctor can help you avoid surgery, medication, and other costly expenses.<

https://jeffreyrothsteindo.com/benefits-of-seeing-doctor-regularly.html

He's partially right. Yes, preventive medicine is super important and can save costs downstream substantially. However, the bottleneck to everyone doing this isn't the insurance (literally every plan covers and promoted this) - it's laziness and not taking care of themselves.

 

[Kbee3]

High deductible plans = lower premiums
Lower premiums = extra money for doc visits as needed
Just managed your money. Not complicated.

I'm doing fine.
The people I was talking about mostly don't have any money to manage.
The greatest country in the world needs to provide health care for ALL of its citizens...especially the children.

 

[T2Kplus20]

Not surprised

Another embarrassing day for Red Rutgers.

 

[brgRC90]

He's partially right. Yes, preventive medicine is super important and can save costs downstream substantially. However, the bottleneck to everyone doing this isn't the insurance (literally every plan covers and promoted this) - it's laziness and not taking care of themselves.

Well, I take care of myself better than probably anybody you will ever meet, I have my entire life, and I have a chronic disease, Crohn's disease, which has caused me problems for years, including a year of surgeries after my large intestine was removed. Last year I spent $27,000 between health insurance, co-pays and other expenses--just in one year. I'm fortunate in that I can afford it, though it hurts, but I can't imagine what it must be like for people with less money. A system that inflicts that on innocent people with a disease of unknown origin which you can only influence a little through lifestyle is not even close to the best system in the world. I didn't even have anything particularly intense done. A CT scan of the abdomen, about 10 minutes, was $18k ffs. Other countries have figured out better ways.

 

[T2Kplus20]

Well, I take care of myself better than probably anybody you will ever meet, I have my entire life, and I have a chronic disease, Crohn's disease, which has caused me problems for years, including a year of surgeries after my large intestine was removed. Last year I spent $27,000 between health insurance, co-pays and other expenses--just in one year. I'm fortunate in that I can afford it, though it hurts, but I can't imagine what it must be like for people with less money. A system that inflicts that on innocent people with a disease of unknown origin which you can only influence a little through lifestyle is not even close to the best system in the world. I didn't even have anything particularly intense done. A CT scan of the abdomen, about 10 minutes, was $18k ffs. Other countries have figured out better ways.

You really need better insurance. Quality plans cap annual out of pocket costs to $10k'ish at most. Regardless, Crohn's can be rough. I have a few friends and colleagues with CD. A couple years ago, I worked on a biosim for Humira which will drastically cut costs of this important therapy. Actually, these biosims started launching this year.

 

[Knight Shift]

Not surprised

WTAF was that song?

https://www.app.com/story/news/educ...-continue-no-classes-for-2nd-day/70103277007/

 

[brgRC90]

You really need better insurance. Quality plans cap annual out of pocket costs to $10k'ish at most. Regardless, Crohn's can be rough. I have a few friends and colleagues with CD. A couple years ago, I worked on a biosim for Humira which will drastically cut costs of this important therapy. Actually, these biosims started launching this year.

I have a silver plan from California's biggest insurer. But insurance doesn't cover a lot of other expenses related to being sick.

 

[T2Kplus20]

WTAF was that song?

https://www.app.com/story/news/educ...-continue-no-classes-for-2nd-day/70103277007/

Hopefully Hollowoke doesn't cave to these malcontents, but he probably will.

 

[T2Kplus20]

I have a silver plan from California's biggest insurer. But insurance doesn't cover a lot of other expenses related to being sick.

Good point on the ancillary costs.

 

[dconifer0]

I know I keep bringing this up, but what about the growing number of people, including college graduates, who have no "plan" at all offered to them?

 

[manfrizzle]

And people who saw someone not wearing a mask or refusing to get a shot called for them to lose their jobs and become homeless.

People who lost elections put together a now factually proven conspiracy theory that the winner colluded with russia to win and harped on it for now 7 straight years.

And a governor who got disagreement from businesses shut their water and electricity off, stripped them of their business license and fined hundreds of thousands of dollars.

How are interest rates treating you

 

[rurichdog]

One thing I'll say about cops & firemen retiring out at 25 years and "the outrage" - if your house is on fire, do you want your wife or kid's only chance at getting rescued being a 60 year old fireman with a billion miles on the odometer and bad knees who should have retired 10 years ago?

 

[rurichdog]

How are interest rates treating you

First post in 27 months was that?

 

[RUTGERS95]

One thing I'll say about cops & firemen retiring out at 25 years and "the outrage" - if your house is on fire, do you want your wife or kid's only chance at getting rescued being a 60 year old fireman with a billion miles on the odometer and bad knees who should have retired 10 years ago?

never put cops and firemen in the same category as they are worlds apart

 

[RUTGERS95]

WTAF was that song?

https://www.app.com/story/news/educ...-continue-no-classes-for-2nd-day/70103277007/

fire every single one if I could

 

[rudad02]

I was not in the union when I was at RU (for 29 years) because at the time, all the negotiating was focused on faculty at the higher levels, and to hell with the assistant profs. But that was a long time ago.

There's a lot of misinformation in this thread, the worst being equating TAs and GAs with adjunct (course at a time) lecturers. The GAs and TAs generally do OK. Maybe they are behind inflation right now, but they basically get free tuition and a decent stipend. Just barely enough to live on, but if they team up with another GA or two, they can get by. But not by much. Now, how much they work varies hugely by department, and there are a number of departments that historically abuse GAs and TAs. So, if they are upset, then they may well have a case.

Regular faculty have pretty good salaries at RU. Again, they may have fallen behind in recent years, but nobody on a tenure track line is really hurting, and the top folks are doing fine.

But adjunct faculty are, and have always been, getting screwed. When I was there, they were getting around $2500 per course, and I think that's up to close to $6000 now. If you are going to teach a garden variety, stand up course for about 40 students or so, you are going to put in a ton of hours to do it right. This is where the University balances its books. Co-ads (co-adjunctant faculty) cover the courses nobody else wants, almost never know what the next semester or next year will hold, often do not get decent office space, and if they are making a living doing this, have to teach about 5 courses a semester to get by. It's a very tough life. It was never intended for someone to make a living out of doing this, but hiring has gotten so tight, that many people are.

If you have any sympathy for the strikers, it should be for this group.

Good & informative post. Thanks.

 

[SkilletHead2]

BTW, yes, it used to be that people would teach these courses because they had a full time job elsewhere and did this because they loved doing it. And some are still that way. But a lot are trying to make a living out of it. And also, btw, some people make a ton more than $6k doing this as they are specialists who teach specialist courses (think med/law/business) where their expertise is critical.

 

[rurichdog]

never put cops and firemen in the same category as they are worlds apart

Settle down champ. Didn't mean to bruise your delicate sensibilities. I'll have a real paid professional fireman stop by and tend to your bruised ego.

 

[RU Cheese]

Well, I take care of myself better than probably anybody you will ever meet, I have my entire life, and I have a chronic disease, Crohn's disease, which has caused me problems for years, including a year of surgeries after my large intestine was removed. Last year I spent $27,000 between health insurance, co-pays and other expenses--just in one year. I'm fortunate in that I can afford it, though it hurts, but I can't imagine what it must be like for people with less money. A system that inflicts that on innocent people with a disease of unknown origin which you can only influence a little through lifestyle is not even close to the best system in the world. I didn't even have anything particularly intense done. A CT scan of the abdomen, about 10 minutes, was $18k ffs. Other countries have figured out better ways.

Sorry buddy - I've had some GI issues but nothing like that.

My response wasn't related to your situation though - it was on the merits of preventative care.

 

[brgRC90]

Sorry buddy - I've had some GI issues but nothing like that.

My response wasn't related to your situation though - it was on the merits of preventative care.

There are many merits to preventive care and people actually taking care of themselves. But health problems are different from other situations and so market forces don't really work, and the idea of health insurance as only being intended for acute crises is not valid. Some health problems would bleed you dry from small but constant complications. Sometimes even with preventive care problems develop. And it's not like a car where you can save money by buying a smaller car with fewer luxuries. You often need something or you die or suffer permanent problems.

It's a false choice to say you have health insurance that is either 100% government-run or 100% private. There are hybrid systems all over the world. But they mostly prioritize that nobody suffers for lack of money and nobody gets financially destroyed by illness. The left makes a big mistake by not making this a priority, instead always focusing on government taking over more of the job of insuring. The right seems to not care much.

 

[RU Cheese]

There are many merits to preventive care and people actually taking care of themselves. But health problems are different from other situations and so market forces don't really work, and the idea of health insurance as only being intended for acute crises is not valid. Some health problems would bleed you dry from small but constant complications. Sometimes even with preventive care problems develop. And it's not like a car where you can save money by buying a smaller car with fewer luxuries. You often need something or you die or suffer permanent problems.

It's a false choice to say you have health insurance that is either 100% government-run or 100% private. There are hybrid systems all over the world. But they mostly prioritize that nobody suffers for lack of money and nobody gets financially destroyed by illness. The left makes a big mistake by not making this a priority, instead always focusing on government taking over more of the job of insuring. The right seems to not care much.

I work in the space - totally get it.

The problem, like anything else, is the extreme positions the L and R take on the issue. I think there needs to be some creativity because obviously the status quo / situations like yours need to be addressed.

 

[Scarlet Jerry]

I was not in the union when I was at RU (for 29 years) because at the time, all the negotiating was focused on faculty at the higher levels, and to hell with the assistant profs. But that was a long time ago.

There's a lot of misinformation in this thread, the worst being equating TAs and GAs with adjunct (course at a time) lecturers. The GAs and TAs generally do OK. Maybe they are behind inflation right now, but they basically get free tuition and a decent stipend. Just barely enough to live on, but if they team up with another GA or two, they can get by. But not by much. Now, how much they work varies hugely by department, and there are a number of departments that historically abuse GAs and TAs. So, if they are upset, then they may well have a case.

Regular faculty have pretty good salaries at RU. Again, they may have fallen behind in recent years, but nobody on a tenure track line is really hurting, and the top folks are doing fine.

But adjunct faculty are, and have always been, getting screwed. When I was there, they were getting around $2500 per course, and I think that's up to close to $6000 now. If you are going to teach a garden variety, stand up course for about 40 students or so, you are going to put in a ton of hours to do it right. This is where the University balances its books. Co-ads (co-adjunctant faculty) cover the courses nobody else wants, almost never know what the next semester or next year will hold, often do not get decent office space, and if they are making a living doing this, have to teach about 5 courses a semester to get by. It's a very tough life. It was never intended for someone to make a living out of doing this, but hiring has gotten so tight, that many people are.

If you have any sympathy for the strikers, it should be for this group.

Good post and with a nice summary of compensation for the various groups. The only thing that I would add is that adjuncts generally are poorly paid everywhere. I know - I did adjunct work several years ago. However, in my opinion, those jobs are not suited for full-time career. Most people taught a singleton night course like I did, while still working a full time job. I looked at it as a way to practice my craft while also giving back to the profession. You cannot be a career adjunct and expect that to give you a decent salary

I think that the solution is to develop a kind of hybrid adjunct/professor role, where the focus could be on teaching classes (like an adjunct) but would also have better pay because your contract would cover multiple classes. These individuals would not have tenure, and earn a lower salary than a full professor, but their course load would provide them with a wage and health benefits that would be similar to the salary for a high school teacher. That would allow individuals to do this work and have a decent salary while they seek a full-time tenured professorship. Plus, it would provide for a better student experience because you could hire people who focus on being good teachers rather than research. If you think about it, the current model of higher ed is based on a structure that has been in place for centuries. I think that it's time to look at alternative models (at the national level, not just at Rutgers).


Scarlet Jerry

 

[Fat Koko]

The protestors are violating university policy on usage of Greg's Block R. Look at all those Block Rs on the protestors' placards. Greg only allows it be used for sports, not protests.

"Its use on stationery or for official communications is limited to Rutgers intercollegiate athletics...The Block R is a more controlled mark and is only released to vendors upon request to ensure that it is used appropriately on spirit merchandise."

Anybody know how to get a few of the Block R placards, specifically the "WE R ON STRIKE FOR A BETTER RUTGERS" versions? Might come in handy this fall if Greg doesn't show progress on the football field. I checked the stadium policies and while sticks are the not-permitted list, signs aren't.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Settle down champ. Didn't mean to bruise your delicate sensibilities. I'll have a real paid professional fireman stop by and tend to your bruised ego.

you must be stupid or have trouble reading. No one in their right mind would put a cop on par with a fireman. Sorry if that had to be spelled out for you

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

How are interest rates treating you

Has slowed activity and listing volume in real estate for sure. How about you

 

[gman500]

Maybe they can get NIL deals

 

[AdventureHasAName]

you must be stupid or have trouble reading. No one in their right mind would put a cop on par with a fireman. Sorry if that had to be spelled out for you

When I was a cop, I made (on average) two or three high risk tactical entries a week. Full tactical gear, 8 to 10 man stack, usually no-knock warrants (because a firearm was believed to be in the dwelling or because someone inside had a violent criminal record), typically at 4 AM, in the worst areas of Los Angeles. For an average sized house, if the location wasn't secured within 45 seconds, it meant something went seriously wrong. You don't want someone in their 60s making split second life-or-death decisions for those 45 seconds. And you definitely don't want them wrestling on the floor with an ex-convict over a handgun.

Law enforcement is not a job for old men; they cannot do it in a manner that is safest for everyone involved (themselves, their fellow officers, the suspected criminals, and the innocent bystanders).

 

[cyrock3]

Hopefully Hollowoke doesn't cave to these malcontents, but he probably will.

He hasn’t yet but the narrative isn’t good. They’ve outflanked him hard on the media, especially with getting a lot of student support. It has gone viral and the coverage is horrible for him.

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

Employees have rights that they can fight for and some of those rights have restrictions placed on them.
Americans have the right to bear arms, but that right also comes with restrictions.
No one is coming to take away guns, that's a tried and true tacit used against the fight to keep guns out of the wrong hands and make weapons of mass murder harder to obtain . Making it harder for nuts to get an AR15 use it to mow down people for any nutty reason.
The gun getting in the hands of the wrong person is the problem and laws to prevent that are fought against for the wrong reason.

And yet the left always points to Australia as an example and Australia came for their guns.

 

[RUTGERS95]

And yet the left always points to Australia as an example and Australia came for their guns.

he's just a fking moron, truly

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

he's just a fking moron, truly

wouldn't say that... because he says teh "right" thing. The idea that he actually believes it.. would speak poorly for him. That he spits out the talking points.. like the WH Press Secretary.. will say ANYTHING and pretend to believe it... that is expected.

 

[toby83]

Funny how these protestors look EXACTLY as you think they would look

 

[AdventureHasAName]

Not surprised

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

Not surprised

These people believe money is infinite. Truly, they genuinely believe that. The same people protesting to pay professors and assistants more will then protest that tuition gets raised haha. Cant make it up