OT: oh oh oh Ozempic !

[tom1944]

people need to just eat right and exercise but its too easy to eat unhealthy (and cheaper) and too many people would rather sit and look at their phones instead of even going for a walk.

My wife has never not eaten right or not exercised but at the age of 22 she was struck with an immune system disease. She has been on many drugs since some of which have had severe side effects. While side effects are bad most likely her alternative was death so you do what you have to do.

I do have a request it would be really interesting if both the pro pharma people and the anti pharma people could tell us their career or academic background for transparency.

I am pro pharma and my background is in tax and finance. My wife is an exercise physiologist.

 

[Jm0513]

So far into this thread, no one has posted anything about them or others having bad side effects on ozempic. Maybe it is a miracle drug

Someone very close to me is on it. The side effect he is experiencing is nausea. That is due to the delay in the emptying of the stomach.( don’t quote me lol)
The doctor prescribed him anti-nausea medicine.

He’s tried everything. He did Keto for a year and then the doctor decided this is the best route


I know a few people on the semaglutides. Wegovy gave my friend uncontrollable diarrhea and she went to the ER for dehydration.

I prefer a little Vyvanse. I’m never hungry and my home is really organized

Hahahahhahahahajahaj.

Obviously, the person needs to get to the root of what’s causing them to overeat with the help of a therapist. It may be a jump start to help shed some pounds, but it isn’t a miracle drug.
If the person has a food addiction it needs to addressed. I’ve seen people firsthand who had bariatric surgeries replace their food addiction with other vices.

 

[newell138]

My wife has never not eaten right or not exercised but at the age of 22 she was struck with an immune system disease. She has been on many drugs since some of which have had severe side effects. While side effects are bad most likely her alternative was death so you do what you have to do.

I do have a request it would be really interesting if both the pro pharma people and the anti pharma people could tell us their career or academic background for transparency.

I am pro pharma and my background is in tax and finance. My wife is an exercise physiologist.

i think some people know I work in pharma, 27 years, of which the last 14 have been in pediatric vaccine supply chain..

 

[newell138]

Someone very close to me is on it. The side effect he is experiencing is nausea. That is due to the delay in the emptying of the stomach.( don’t quote me lol)
The doctor prescribed him anti-nausea medicine.

He’s tried everything. He did Keto for a year and then the doctor decided this is the best route


I know a few people on the semaglutides. Wegovy gave my friend uncontrollable diarrhea and she went to the ER for dehydration.

I prefer a little Vyvanse. I’m never hungry and my home is really organized

Hahahahhahahahajahaj.

Obviously, the person needs to get to the root of what’s causing them to overeat with the help of a therapist. It may be a jump start to help shed some pounds, but it isn’t a miracle drug.
If the person has a food addiction it needs to addressed. I’ve seen people firsthand who had bariatric surgeries replace their food addiction with other vices.

i know an anti nausea medicine lol!

 

[RU Cheese]

i think some people know I work in pharma, 27 years, of which the last 14 have been in pediatric vaccine supply chain..

Prevnar manufacturing?

Edit: I think you posted you’re MRK which would negate my question

 

[tom1944]

i think some people know I work in pharma, 27 years, of which the last 14 have been in pediatric vaccine supply chain..

I was not aware.

 

[ru66]

Isn't this discussion about RU football refreshing.

 

[tom1944]

Isn't this discussion about RU football refreshing.

When they are done playing some of the linemen will need the drug to get their weight to a healthy level. We are doing the research for them.

 

[DJ Spanky]

That’s how it should work. But from what I see that’s not what is happening with ozempic. People telling doctors they tried everything bs. Docs happy to write the scrips . Or write it for the person that needs to lose “the last 20”

Same thing happened with fen-phen.

 

[RU Cheese]

Isn't this discussion about RU football refreshing.

Is that what Michael Kay told you to post? #NumbahTWO @superfan01

 

[DHajekRC84]

It’s definitely helped me. Been on it since April. Down 50 pounds. I had an issue with constant binge eating. Overeating. This has reduced the “food chatter” in my mind, and has helped me stop eating when I’m full. I’ll deal with issues if they happen, but this has helped me lose weight, control my cholesterol, high blood pressure, and sleep apnea.

good for you (seriously). My sister has lost 70 lbs. and hasn't complained of any significant SE either. (not sure exactly how she got on it but it wasn't for weight loss).

 

[DHajekRC84]

I just know 2 people that got the starting dose. That is part of why I made the original post. They are not diabetics and Not obese . Just fat and looking to lose weight as part of New Year’s resolutions

wow. That's a shame because I know there were shortages for folks who really needed it. Why would a Doctor write a script for them. SMH.

 

[DHajekRC84]

Ozempic is a promising drug but it is just an adjunct, You still have to do diet exercise and lifestyle changes. Most medical studies have shown that when people stop taking Ozempic, without the lifestyle changes, they do gain weight back. People who take these drugs should enroll in programs that in addition to the drug, give you nutritional experts, lifestyle coaches and exercise regimens. They charge monthly for this program it is it is worth it because these are the people who lose the most weight and then actually keep it off.
.

Some (perhaps many) people very overweight get so depressed and feel so unfit that they stop doing the exercise/activity and it becomes a downward spiral. IF getting them down in such weight puts them back into a position to succeed works then there's that.

I'm personally watching this one.

 

[Knight Shift]

Now you've done it, lol. C'mon, that link contains links to a number of primary scientific and small clinical studies done with berberine, so to call it "hot trash" is inaccurate. "Papers showing lipid lowering effectiveness" likely just means small pharmacokinetic studies, not RCTs assessing safety and efficacy. There are tons of molecules out there that are active on any number of clinical targets, but activity DOES NOT mean that molecule will be a safe and effective treatment - need the trials for that and as far as I can tell, they don't exist yet, but if you want to be a guinea pig, go for it. Not me. Especially with a supplement that is not regulated and of possibly dubious quality due to lack of regulatory oversight.

Just to support myself--this post on X says a lot if you are dialed into lipid management. I don't have time to elaborate, but Drs. Rumberger and Dayspring are two gurus in lipidology and cholesterol management. Dr. Rumberger nails it here.

As with other things we go back on, I think you might agree that RCTs or not, n=1 is the only "study" that matters for some people, PROVIDED, they are working with their medical team. In my case- 15-20% lowering of LDL with berberine, and no evidence of adverse impacts from blood markers, including liver blood markers. I can't put my hands on the monograph, but a prominent cardiology or lipidology association (or at least group of doctors in Europe) have berberine listed as a treatment for high LDL. Why is that? Because big Pharma is kept at bay in Europe and Asia, but in the US they get away with murder and step on the throats of efficacious and less expensive remedies, usually herbal remedies.

 

[Knight Shift]

I've always been on the slim side my whole life so never had issues with weight but I have tried to eat healthier and exercise more as I've gotten older. I'm not a trainer or psychologist or whatever but my thinking is you have to know your own psychology and figure out how to make things a habit. What makes you tick and what works for you and fits in your life. Once it's habit, it's hard to stop it, good habits are hard to break not just bad ones.

IMO one thing would be start small, however small, for exercise or food choices. Say 10 min walk a couple times a week or a vegetarian meal once a week to get more healthy stuff in your body. Do that for a couple months and then once its a habit (imo it takes 2-3 months for some thing to become a habit that's harder to break) build on it with another step or baby step. Once you get a sort of cycle going you can build with more steps and it's harder to break that habit even though the things you're doing might be "harder" than when you first started.

Another thing for me with regards to food is I don't ever feel I'm restricting myself or denying myself. I eat tons of healthy foods (fruits, veggies, nuts, grains etc..) daily and exercise daily so my thinking is I have a lot of check marks in the positive column on a daily basis so when I feel like eating something that might not be healthy or whatever, I eat it. This doesn't happen all the time but it does at times. I don't consider them cheat days or whatever, it's just I feel like eating that so I do lol. So I never feel like I've denied myself anything or restricted myself and so then it's easy to stick with all the other healthy things I do since I don't feel limited. That's my psychology and it makes it easier to make the positive habits a way of life. When it's a habit and a way of life, it will probably stick for the long haul.

Last suggestion is do these things with family or friends for camaraderie/support but not competition (unless that is part the participants psychology/motivation). The buddy system can be a helpful thing.

Just my 2 cents.

I always thought you were a brother from another mother. Nailed it.
For many (probably majority) of other folks--it's not so easy. I found the path late in life, and it changed my life. I feel better now than I did 25 years ago because my diet is on point, I regularly strength train, and mountain bike at least 30 miles per week on average with lots of hills to the point of being gassed.

 

[MADHAT1]

I always thought you were a brother from another mother. Nailed it.
For many (probably majority) of other folks--it's not so easy. I found the path late in life, and it changed my life. I feel better now than I did 25 years ago because my diet is on point, I regularly strength train, and mountain bike at least 30 miles per week on average with lots of hills to the point of being gassed.

there are many that if they did what you're doing "miracle" cures that seem to work great aren't needed for them
But for a lot of people this might be a good way to lose the pounds because no matter what they try it's ineffective for them

My only complaint might be about the people that look for the easy way out and don't give the type of effort you seem to have given before they go the drug cure route or weight loss surgery .
I feel drug treatment and surgical procedures are necessary in some cases , but not for all that go those routes . Some might have wound up having good results doing it your way rather than drug treatments or surgical procedures

 

[Southern Gentleman]

Just do Keto, carnivore etc. Lose the weight and lose the diabetes.
Sugars, carbs, seed oils will do more than create diabetes (dementia, macular degeneration etc).
Drug makers look to reduce symptoms for years and years and give you something else

You don’t lose diabetes. You try to manage it.

 

[LeapinLou]

A friend of mine that was overweight and diabetic went on Ozempic. It damaged his gall bladder and he had to have surgery to have it removed. Ozempic does warn that gall bladder issues are a potential side effect so this is a known risk.

 

[RU Cheese]

It's pretty straight-forward to me. People should exercise and stop eating ****. They don't need Ozempic to drop a few pounds.

But from a global health perspective and a practical / pragmatic standpoint, there is a huge population of very very fat people, and for them, in many cases the benefit / risk profile of adding Ozempic is off the charts (ie wonder drug territory)

 

[ashokan]

You don’t lose diabetes. You try to manage it.

The way I look at it, is that if people keep eating sugar, pasta garbage, sugary fruits etc then as they age they will be on track for problems. If they give-up or modify their diet they will be on track for reversing problems. So its like a continuous movement in one direction or another. Right now a young person with fab sugar metabolism who is living on sugars and carbs is working at acquiring problems. Many problems aren't even strictly diabetes related.

When I first did keto I was surprised at the mental clarity after a few weeks. It felt like being in HS again. I think people acclimate to a certain degree of perception fuzz unaware. It can be hidden by the amount of information people can handle as they get older. A head stuffed like a sausage with "stuff" can seem like a high performance state but clarity is an easy state to lose and its dangerous. Unfettered wondering, intuition and realization can do things knowledge and analysis cant. Those "aha" experiences washing dishes do things study cant. I can see why people can move towards dementia eating too many sugars etc

In any case, Dt Bernstein's Diabetes Solution is a great book to have. He was a Type 1 and became a doctor to focus on diet. I also like Dr Berry on Youtube because he was also a diabetic country boy in TN who weighed over 400lbs. Now he's a lean keto expert who used a lot of studied while debunking the marketing disguised as science



Also lots of good stuff online

https://scitechdaily.com/intermittent-fasting-completely-reverses-type-2-diabetes-in-study/

 

[T2Kplus20]

You don’t lose diabetes. You try to manage it.

Small correction, you can't lose type-1 diabetes, but you can definitely "lose" type 2.

 

[MADHAT1]

Small correction, you can't lose type-1 diabetes, but you can definitely "lose" type 2.

This sounds like type 2 diabetes can be made a non factor, but still needed to be controlled so it doesn’t return

>According to recent research cannot be cured, but individuals can have glucose levels that return to non-diabetes range, (complete remission) or pre-diabetes glucose level (partial remission) The primary means by which people with type 2 diabetes achieve remission is by losing significant amounts of weight.<



https://www.joslin.org/patient-care...arning-center/can-type-2-diabetes-be-reversed

 

[Plum Street]

So far in this thread no real bad reports of ozempic. Except from mild nausea
That was original question. Why can’t people “weigh in” on that . Instead of getting on their soap boxes

 

[T2Kplus20]

This sounds like type 2 diabetes can be made a non factor, but still needed to be controlled so it doesn’t return

>According to recent research cannot be cured, but individuals can have glucose levels that return to non-diabetes range, (complete remission) or pre-diabetes glucose level (partial remission) The primary means by which people with type 2 diabetes achieve remission is by losing significant amounts of weight.<



https://www.joslin.org/patient-care...arning-center/can-type-2-diabetes-be-reversed

It can be "cured" for many people. Just lose enough weight. It's literally that simple.

 

[okieKnight908]

I do have a request it would be really interesting if both the pro pharma people and the anti pharma people could tell us their career or academic background for transparency.

I am pro pharma. My wife works for Novo Nordisk

 

[MADHAT1]

So far in this thread no real bad reports of ozempic. Except from mild nausea
That was original question. Why can’t people “weigh in” on that . Instead of getting on their soap boxes

Lou posted : "A friend of mine that was overweight and diabetic went on Ozempic. It damaged his gall bladder and he had to have surgery to have it removed. Ozempic does warn that gall bladder issues are a potential side effect so this is a known risk. "

I imagine that freend knew there was a chance if problems for him but felt the reward was worth the risk.
Agree no one should be knocking this treatment without knowing everything about ir,
but we shouldn't be praising it unless we look into it enough to have a good idea of it's pros and cons.

My only suggestion is start off with your family doctor and see what he/she thinks about you taking it and have your doctor refer you to a specialist that handles weight problems

 

[AZBlues]

As you can imagine, the high cost of these drugs, coupled with the high demand, is causing some concerns and ethical dilemmas for the prescription benefit/insurance companies. When to pay for the drugs and when not to pay for the drugs, and what's fair, etc...

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2024-01-ozempic-mania-billions-bills-taxpayers.html

 

[Knight Shift]

So far in this thread no real bad reports of ozempic. Except from mild nausea
That was original question. Why can’t people “weigh in” on that . Instead of getting on their soap boxes

Losing a gall bladder?

 

[T2Kplus20]

So far in this thread no real bad reports of ozempic. Except from mild nausea
That was original question. Why can’t people “weigh in” on that . Instead of getting on their soap boxes

The vast majority of people taking ozempic have no or just very mild side effects, in return for massive benefits regarding all the devastating consequences of diabetes. Excellent risk/benefit profile.

 

[Plum Street]

Losing a gall bladder?

Yes !! Missed that one !

 

[Knight Shift]

1780, the way to avoid diabetes was known. Thanks to Ancel Keys, the FDA and govermental authorities, this changed. The organizations that push the crap diet recommendations like Harvard and Brown are funded by big food companies. Brown is touting Lucky Charms cereal as healthier than ground beef. Bill Gates and his funded organizations are working to demonize beef. We have politicians doing the same because cow farting is an issue.

 

[tom1944]

I eat what I like and just try to keep my calories at a level that is lower than my current weight needs if I want to lose weight and equal to the calories I need if I am trying to maintain.


Right now, for the next 90 days I need to be below my daily need. It has been a rough holiday and birthday period.

When I am heavy, I did not get there because I ate too much fruit.

 

[T2Kplus20]

I eat what I like and just try to keep my calories at a level that is lower than my current weight needs if I want to lose weight and equal to the calories I need if I am trying to maintain.


Right now, for the next 90 days I need to be below my daily need. It has been a rough holiday and birthday period.

When I am heavy, I did not get there because I ate too much fruit.

+1
If you want to lose weight, eat less. Or to be more exact, consume less calories. Pretty simple!

 

[RU Cheese]

I am pro pharma. My wife works for Novo Nordisk

Excellent! 3 words for ya - stock options NIL

 

[tom1944]

+1
If you want to lose weight, eat less. Or to be more exact, consume less calories. Pretty simple!

I used to be able to outwork excessive eating but age tends to end that ability.

Drink excess beer, eat all day with a great diner meal at 2 or 3 am. But run 30 miles a week at a pretty good clip and all was good. Add in 5 days at the gym and never gained a pound.

 

[T2Kplus20]

I used to be able to outwork excessive eating but age tends to end that ability.

Drink excess beer, eat all day with a great diner meal at 2 or 3 am. But run 30 miles a week at a pretty good clip and all was good. Add in 5 days at the gym and never gained a pound.

Father time is a MF'er.

 

[tom1944]

Father time is a MF'er.

Undefeated

 

[angmo]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/...lawsuits-gastroparesis-stomach-paralysis.html

 

[newell138]

It's pretty straight-forward to me. People should exercise and stop eating ****. They don't need Ozempic to drop a few pounds.

But from a global health perspective and a practical / pragmatic standpoint, there is a huge population of very very fat people, and for them, in many cases the benefit / risk profile of adding Ozempic is off the charts (ie wonder drug territory)

Globally not nearly as bad as the US population which gets fatter and fatter every year

 

[RU Cheese]

Globally not nearly as bad as the US population which gets fatter and fatter every year

Agreed.