OT: Making a Murderer on Netflix

[Walter White.sixpack]

I keep hearing some folks buzzing about this. But I'm skeptical that it can really be that good for double digit episodes.

Has anyone see it? If so what made it so compelling?

 

[goindhoo]

I've watched 2 episodes. Very good so far. It's good cause is non fiction.

 

[TSUNBearHunter]

I'm on episode 6. It's one of the best documentaries I've ever watched.

After the first episode you'll wonder how they can stretch the story to 10 episodes, but you'll be hooked.

 

[missouridawg]

Anyone watch the Jinx? How does it compare to that? I thought the Jinx was excellent.

 

[hatfieldms]

I have watched the first four and love it

....

 

[MSUDAWGFAN]

I've seen all of it.

I keep hearing some folks buzzing about this. But I'm skeptical that it can really be that good for double digit episodes.

Has anyone see it? If so what made it so compelling?

It is very good. I feel very sorry for him. I know I wasn't in the jury so I've only heard what they wanted me to, but I feel as though there should be at least a reasonable doubt. And the nephew. Wow. I feel very sorry for him too. They picked on guys that were not very smart and very poor.

I felt, and still feel, that the justice system is right more often than it isn't and that most police officers are good people but that there are some that are corrupt. I'm not sure that evidence was planted but I would have to say that it seems that way. Very good show and worth the watch. After our game, of course.

 

[121Josey]

Anyone watch the Jinx? How does it compare to that? I thought the Jinx was excellent.

This is the new standard for murder documentaries. I want to hear from somebody who has seen them both.

 

[bulldogcountry1]

Watched the first two episodes, and had to google the story to see where it was going. I guess I've watched too many true crime/falsely accused documentaries lately, and ten episodes is a big investment to not now how it ends.

By the end of the first episode, there was foreshadowing of where it was going. I couldn't help but wonder what this guy did (assuming he's innocent) to catch so much hell from the local law enforcement.

 

[Walter White.sixpack]

Watched the first two episodes, and had to google the story to see where it was going. I guess I've watched too many true crime/falsely accused documentaries lately, and ten episodes is a big investment to not now how it ends.

Do you google how other tv series will finish each season too?

 

[121Josey]

Watched the first two episodes, and had to google the story to see where it was going.

Do you google how other tv series will finish each season too?

Whatever you do, don't google Breaking Bad. Walter White would not like that (because he really didn't die).

 

[bulldogcountry1]

Do you google how other tv series will finish each season too?

No. It's a bit different when real people are involved, and even documentaries can play favorites and be selective about what facts they present. More than anything, I wanted to know it was done accurately, given the time and emotional investment.

 

[Vice]

This is the new standard for murder documentaries. I want to hear from somebody who has seen them both.

I've seen both. The Jinx was something I had never seen before. Really incredible stuff. I started watching Making a Murderer the day it came out and absolutely could not stop watching. The difference is that MAM has the same suspense and courtroom drama, but WAY more interesting characters. It also gets more in depth into our justice system. The Jinx just showed us that a billionaire can get away with murder. Is that something we haven't sent before? No. It was interesting but nothing really new. MAM shows that if you are poor as dirt and the state has it out for you, you are completely effed. It also shows us how police officers' interrogation tactics should be examined. By reading a 16 year old his Miranda rights, are you REALLY CERTAIN that child understands his/her rights. REALLY? Not to mention that EVERYONE surrounding that child failed him to include his mother, the cops, the state, etc....

The thing that struck me the most is the glaring conflict of interest of our justice system. THE STATE(police officers) investigate crimes. THE STATE prosecutes those crimes. Who resides over the court? THE STATE. Oh, and who investigates the police and DA of any wrongdoing? The Attorney General(a.k.a THE STATE).

Sorry so long.

 

[Pocketdogs]

Petition linked

After reading this thread I decided to watch to see what the fuss was about. Today Im browsing the interwebs and come across this petition. Even if the documentary showed me only what they wanted me to see I believe there was enough reasonable doubt in both instances to warrant action.

https://www.change.org/p/president-of-the-united-states-free-steven-avery

 

[esplanade91]

Whether you believe he committed the second crime or not, the fact that he was in jail for 18 years in the first place for nothing and now there is reasonable doubt he didn't commit murder is enough to convince anyone, in my opinion, that the death penalty shouldn't be on the table. Executing even 1 innocent man out of a 1,000 by the hands of a state is some Saudi Arabian ******** (I say all this because Wisconsin considered bringing back the death penalty because of this individual case).

I'm on the 5th episode. Jinx was great, but I thought it had a wider appeal as it didn't get into maticulous details. MAM probably has more fans who enjoy legal dramas/novels. Both were great, but MAM is more involved.

I still can't get over how the police coerced his nephew and a judge never thought any part of the investigation was compromised.

 

[11thEagleFan]

Read this, you'll feel better. One thing to remember is that many "documentaries" have an axe to grind, and that a jury of 12 people rejected the defendant's "conspiracy theory" defense. The evidence was there. There will always be inconsistencies with any criminal investigation, that's just the nature of the beast. Also, the prosecution is not required to prove a crime beyond all doubt, just beyond a reasonable doubt. One based on logic and common sense. He killed that girl.

http://www.people.com/article/steve...kratz-says-netflix-series-forgot-key-evidence

 

[MSUDAWGFAN]

One thing to consider is that when the jury started deliberation, the vote was 7 innocent, 3 guilty, and 2 undecided. The one that left said he doesn't know how they found him guilty and still thinks about locking an innocent man up.

I'm not on the innocent side after watching it, but I think there should be doubt. And I absolutely think at least some evidence was planted.

 

[hatfieldms]

I am definitely on the innocent side

He did not kill that girl. There was no reason to. And where is all of the blood in the house where she as killed? Like they said he wasn't smart enough to completely get rid of all of the blood

 

[Uncle Ruckus]

Exactly. She was raped, chained, throat cut and shot and there's not one hair, one drop of bodily fluid, and no blood? Seriously? The poor guy is as simple as it gets and they think he can clean a murder scene better than Dexter Morgan? Give me a break. If Lenk and that other shady cop didn't kill her then they know who did. At least Kratz what was coming to him. Piece of ****.

 

[DoctorDawg]

I am sure there are details that we did not see, so I am not saying he is innocent. However, the nephews case was a cluster from day 1 and shoyld have been thrown out. The key evidence was found by the same officers who were supposed to stay clear of the crime scene. When they shey showed up evidence pops up in places that have already been searched. I feel like he probably did it, but the cops tried so hard to get even that they blew the case.

 

[The Fatboy]

It was his nephew's statements that hurt the most. The entire jury pool was tainted because of the coercion of that boy. It's the biggest travesty of this entire ordeal.

 

[The Fatboy]

Every single piece of evidence found other than the car was found by the cops that were supposed to be recused from the investigation. And it could be understood that the person who found the car was pointed to it.

 

[dawgatUSM]

I'm not fully on the innocent side

but there is DEFINITLEY more evidence pointing to not guilty rather than guilty. The investigation was handled horribly. And There is no way on Gods green earth that you can claim guilty for Brendan.

Reminded me of the first season of Serial only I think he was guilty.

 

[Walter White.sixpack]

After watching and poking around the internet I think he's more than likely innocent.

But the documentary makers tried to get Katz and the victim's family to be a part. But all parties refused. So they were only able to show the Avery side of things.

 

[Walter White.sixpack]

Five alternate theories:

http://www.techinsider.io/making-a-murderer-who-killed-teresa-halbach-theories-2015-12

 

[MSU124]

I also think he's innocent. The sketchiest part to me was the fact that one of the offices called in the plate number BEFORE they found the car in the lot. Doesn't make sense at all.

 

[JungRebel]

I'm sorry to dig this thread up but this is what really gets me. Colborn appeared to be caught in a lie on the stand, but then you never hear anything about it after that (or if there is something I missed it, lots of details n' ****). I think Avery might be innocent, but I can't get over the blood in the car without a test proving EDTA is in it. If that happens he gets a new trial. If it doesn't, its hard to explain away the blood — maybe someone here has a theory.

Now, Dassey I think is for sure innocent. There is NO evidence placing him at the crime, and I can't believe they didn't have a special needs expert testify that he was incapable of handling that interrogation. It is insanely obvious to me that the kid was caught up in a language game he was not capable of playing and had no idea of the potential consequences.

 

[PBRME]

It's so many things wrong and so many unanswered questions. I do know one thing, the Avery family tree is pretty ****** up. Google told me more than I wanted to know.

 

[messageboardsuperhero]

So they expect people to believe that a man capable of fully cleaning and bleaching his entire house Dexter style is also dumb enough to leave his own blood on Halbach's car... Also odd how said supposed criminal genius is dumb enough to leave the car in his own lot without crushing it with the key sitting on his bedroom floor- not to mention that they searched the house about seven times before the keys was finally found by the very people who were supposed to be excluded from the case.

 

[ronpolk]

After watching it, my gut tells me Avery probably did it. However, I do believe that id have enough doubt to not convict him. I would have voted not guilty.

Like others have mentioned, I feel bad for the kid. He had no clue what he was doing and it's really a shame the judge let that happen. It almost felt like the stated treated him as collateral damage and just disregarded his mental capacity.

 

[missouridawg]

I'm sorry to dig this thread up but this is what really gets me. Colborn appeared to be caught in a lie on the stand, but then you never hear anything about it after that (or if there is something I missed it, lots of details n' ****). I think Avery might be innocent, but I can't get over the blood in the car without a test proving EDTA is in it. If that happens he gets a new trial. If it doesn't, its hard to explain away the blood — maybe someone here has a theory.

Now, Dassey I think is for sure innocent. There is NO evidence placing him at the crime, and I can't believe they didn't have a special needs expert testify that he was incapable of handling that interrogation. It is insanely obvious to me that the kid was caught up in a language game he was not capable of playing and had no idea of the potential consequences.

i believe the EDTA was explained away, right? It would be possible to place that blood there and NOT find EDTA even if it came from that vial. Or maybe I missed something. And wasn't there some samples that weren't tested too. Didn't that science lady kind of clear that whole EDTA charade up with her testimony?

Im of the opinion that Avery did it. But I'm certain I would've voted not guilty cause the evidence isn't there and the law enforcement clowns completely Charlie fox trotted that investigation.

 

[JungRebel]

The lady the defense had testify may have been right but wasn't very "convincing." Used too many words. Good point on the fact not all samples were tested. If those could be obtained, and a trace of EDTA was found in just ONE, then that's enough "new" evidence. I worry that they'll have put EDTA in those samples to preserve them, making them useless. I'm with you that I think he did it but would've voted not guilty. I would have never voted guilty on Dassey.

 

[was21]

Hope they're both guilty as hell since they will probably never be released. Regardless, it's a real tragedy for the nephew since his bread ain't quite baked

 

[johnson86-1]

Every single piece of evidence found other than the car was found by the cops that were supposed to be recused from the investigation. And it could be understood that the person who found the car was pointed to it.

Not that Avery asked for the girl by name and not that she had asked not to be sent back to his place. Obviously not direct evidence but doesn't look good for him.

 

[Hankp22]

The Staircase

For fans of Making a Murderer and The Jinx, I encourage you to watch The Staircase.

It is awesome and you can binge watch it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n061fS38_GA

The Staircase

Academy Award-winning documentary filmmaker, Jean-Xavier de Lestrade, presents a gripping courtroom thriller, offering a rare and revealing inside look at a high-profile murder trial. In 2001, author Michael Peterson was arraigned for the murder of his wife Kathleen, whose body was discovered lying in a pool of blood on the stairway of their home. Granted unusual access to Peterson's lawyers, home and immediate family, de Lestrade's cameras capture the defense team as it considers its strategic options. "The staircase" is an engrossing look at contemporary American justice that features more twists than a legal bestseller.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0388644/

 

[Tin Cup Cowboy]

I found here to be very convincing. She was an analytical chemist and she said that the test did not detect EDTA. Then she explained that the test could not detect it, it could also not prove that it was present. In other words it could not prove that it was there or not.

 

[Walter White.sixpack]

Did you hear who Avery's wife is now married to? You know, the one who had three kids with him and they exchanged really nasty/hateful mail while he was in prison?

She is married to Brendan Dassey's dad!!

http://www.bustle.com/articles/1306...-making-a-murderer-has-moved-on-with-her-life

 

[Uncle Ruckus]

His dna was found underneath her hood as well, and it wasn't his blood. I guess they had viles of his sweat too **

 

[DawgAudit]

Dean Strang recalled that one of the investigators involved in finding DNA under the hood of Halbach’s car admitted to not changing gloves after handling evidence inside her car.

http://www.avclub.com/article/read-pro-steven-avery-list-what-was-left-out-makin-230634

 

[amcdan2000]

What happened to Dessy is horrible. Low IQ (70). It was clear that most of his interviews with the cops and his lawyer he didnt understand what was going on. After the detectives interviewed, without his parent's permission, and feeding him his confession, then he asked to leave to get back to school. I don't know what happened to make him confess but something about it is sadistic. I know they have left out some clips, but there is no way he should have been treated like that.