OT: Happy Columbus Day

[Kbee3]

The first thing every kid in school should be taught is that America was not discovered but was invaded.

So true.
And raped and pillaged.

 

[RUTGERS95]

so many of you clearly don't know the history of the Americas. Sad to see such ignorance and buying in of false narratives. Anyone thinking the natives were not blood thirsty savages that conquered, killed, raped and pillaged on their own is beyond fking stupid. beyond

 

[RUtrumpet92_rivals498139]

Many people can go many ways in how Americas is defined, sort of like NJ. Even if you go to some respected places like Britannica, it defines it many ways. Is NA from the top half of Panama or is it the dividing line of Mexico.
Most people in Modern time and in most realities- now split it as everything above Mexico but by historical definition, it very well could include Mexico or you may just get rid of Central America all together and just have North/South

Regardless- Columbus has zero- zip - Nada to do with discovering our country.

And everywhere he went- he was about as evil a man as there has been in history. Even Isabella was horrified by the slaves he sent to her as a gift.

I am not getting involved in the conversation of Columbus himself, just talking about the board game. South America has four territories. Central America is part of North America in the game. That's all.

 

[RUChoppin]

Many people can go many ways in how Americas is defined, sort of like NJ. Even if you go to some respected places like Britannica, it defines it many ways. Is NA from the top half of Panama or is it the dividing line of Mexico.
Most people in Modern time and in most realities- now split it as everything above Mexico but by historical definition, it very well could include Mexico or you may just get rid of Central America all together and just have North/South

Regardless- Columbus has zero- zip - Nada to do with discovering our country.

And everywhere he went- he was about as evil a man as there has been in history. Even Isabella was horrified by the slaves he sent to her as a gift.

Geographically speaking, the US currently recognizes 7 continents, and "Central America" isn't one of them. Central America is a sociopolitical construct, like "Latin America" or the "Middle East". Many countries (like most in Latin America, and several in Europe) do not make a distinction between North/South America and only recognize "America" as one of 6 continents. US atlases didn't begin to make a distinction of two separate continents until after WWII.

When Columbus landed, it was just "America" - it wasn't until much later that the idea of "Central America" ever became a socially defined thing (as it's defined by the borders of countries, not geographic boundaries).

 

[RUBOB72]

“ making good slaves”… interesting quote but it does seem eerily similar to what the control group is looking to accomplish before the 2022 mid terms. Happy Columbus Day to all my Italian friends and relatives.

 

[RUevolution36]

so many of you clearly don't know the history of the Americas. Sad to see such ignorance and buying in of false narratives. Anyone thinking the natives were not blood thirsty savages that conquered, killed, raped and pillaged on their own is beyond fking stupid. beyond

So it's ok if other blood thirsty savages come from a different continent to conquer, kill, rape, and pillage them?

 

[Kbee3]

So it's ok if other blood thirsty savages come from a different continent to conquer, kill, rape, and pillage them?

Yeah...let's have a holiday in their honor.
I'm wondering why there's no Hernan Cortez Day.

 

[RU85inFla]

Geographically speaking, the US currently recognizes 7 continents, and "Central America" isn't one of them. Central America is a sociopolitical construct, like "Latin America" or the "Middle East". Many countries (like most in Latin America, and several in Europe) do not make a distinction between North/South America and only recognize "America" as one of 6 continents. US atlases didn't begin to make a distinction of two separate continents until after WWII.

When Columbus landed, it was just "America" - it wasn't until much later that the idea of "Central America" ever became a socially defined thing (as it's defined by the borders of countries, not geographic boundaries).

Whether or not Mexico is in Central America or North America the fact remains that yesterday was Columbus Day in Mexico, a day that is celebrated in most latin countries. It is interesting that it was a national holiday in Mexico 4 years prior to being one in the US.

Columbus Day is celebrated in almost every Latin American country, but the name of this holiday varies. For example, in Argentina it’s called “Día del Respeto a la Diversidad Cultural” (Respect for Cultural Diversity Day). In the Dominican Republic it’s called “Día del Encuentro entre dos Culturas” (Encounter Day between two Cultures).

In our opinion, this day represents the evolution of the human race and the connection among all the cultures around the world. However, the methods they used were really disastrous. And who knows, maybe this was meant to be after all.

https://www.expatsinmexico.com/celebrating-columbus-day-in-mexico/

 

[Phi_1055]

Whether or not Mexico is in Central America or North America the fact remains that yesterday was Columbus Day in Mexico, a day that is celebrated in most latin countries. It is interesting that it was a national holiday in Mexico 4 years prior to being one in the US.

Columbus Day is celebrated in almost every Latin American country, but the name of this holiday varies. For example, in Argentina it’s called “Día del Respeto a la Diversidad Cultural” (Respect for Cultural Diversity Day). In the Dominican Republic it’s called “Día del Encuentro entre dos Culturas” (Encounter Day between two Cultures).

In our opinion, this day represents the evolution of the human race and the connection among all the cultures around the world. However, the methods they used were really disastrous. And who knows, maybe this was meant to be after all.

https://www.expatsinmexico.com/celebrating-columbus-day-in-mexico/

”Day of the Race”in Argentina long ago had become a counter to Columbus Day and is a celebration of diverse cultures. It never was “Columbus Day”. FWIW, his statue near the executive mansion was removed in 2010.

 

[RUChoppin]

Whether or not Mexico is in Central America or North America the fact remains that yesterday was Columbus Day in Mexico, a day that is celebrated in most latin countries. It is interesting that it was a national holiday in Mexico 4 years prior to being one in the US.

Columbus Day is celebrated in almost every Latin American country, but the name of this holiday varies. For example, in Argentina it’s called “Día del Respeto a la Diversidad Cultural” (Respect for Cultural Diversity Day). In the Dominican Republic it’s called “Día del Encuentro entre dos Culturas” (Encounter Day between two Cultures).

In our opinion, this day represents the evolution of the human race and the connection among all the cultures around the world. However, the methods they used were really disastrous. And who knows, maybe this was meant to be after all.

https://www.expatsinmexico.com/celebrating-columbus-day-in-mexico/

Yes, Mexico celebrates Dia de la Raza on the same date, marking the anniversary of the landing of Europeans in the Americas, but it's a different concept than what we have traditionally celebrated in the US (up until the last 10-20 years or so).

It's not a celebration of Christopher Columbus (his voyage and "discovery"), but instead of the long lasting impacts his arrival had on the people who met him when he landed. That's more in line with the concept of an "Indigenous Peoples Day" that many states have adopted, focusing more on what happened as a result of the landing rather than memorializing the person responsible for the landing.

That makes sense to me - it's a massively important historical date that changed the world dramatically, and it should be remembered for its cultural impact rather than for the man who made first contact. If Columbus had gone down in a storm, someone else would have followed - the contact between peoples on opposite sides of the Atlantic was inevitable. The "who" isn't as important as "what", imo.

 

[hoquat63]

There’s also a book that claims the Chinese came to America in the early 1400’s - forget the exact name, but it has a year in the title, something like 1433
(give or take a few years).

Looked it up - book title is 1421 The Year the Chinese Discovered America. Also claims Chinese fleet circumnavigated the world.

 

[RUChoppin]

Looked it up - book title is 1421 The Year the Chinese Discovered America. Also claims Chinese fleet circumnavigated the world.

China had been sailing to the east coast of Africa in the late 14th century and had an impressive fleet of treasure ships by the start of the 15th. But the Emperor put a halt to all expeditions in 1433 and either destroyed the fleet or let it rot.

Had that decision gone differently, it's possible that China could have spread across to the west coast of the Americas while Europeans were spreading to the east coast... and history would have played out very differently.

 

[hoquat63]

When Columbus landed, it was just "America" - it wasn't until much later that the idea of "Central America" ever became a socially defined thing (as it's defined by the borders of countries, not geographic boundaries).

Actually it wasn’t America when Columbus landed. Columbus referred to it as the Indies (hence Indisns). It did not get the name America until 1507 when a now obscure map maker Martin Waldseemuller used the term in a book of maps he had published. Amerigo Vespucci made several trips to the “New World” mapping the coastline. First was in 1499 (after the third voyage of CC for Spain. Sailed again in 1501 for Portugal.

 

[RUChoppin]

Actually it wasn’t America when Columbus landed. Columbus referred to it as the Indies (hence Indisns). It did not get the name America until 1507 when a now obscure map maker Martin Waldseemuller used the term in a book of maps he had published. Amerigo Vespucci made several trips to the “New World” mapping the coastline. First was in 1499 (after the third voyage of CC for Spain. Sailed again in 1501 for Portugal.

Good point. When he landed, he had no idea the scope and size of the landmass, or that it was even farther from "Indies" than it was from Europe.

 

[RU85inFla]

Yes, Mexico celebrates Dia de la Raza on the same date, marking the anniversary of the landing of Europeans in the Americas, but it's a different concept than what we have traditionally celebrated in the US (up until the last 10-20 years or so).

It's not a celebration of Christopher Columbus (his voyage and "discovery"), but instead of the long lasting impacts his arrival had on the people who met him when he landed. That's more in line with the concept of an "Indigenous Peoples Day" that many states have adopted, focusing more on what happened as a result of the landing rather than memorializing the person responsible for the landing.

That makes sense to me - it's a massively important historical date that changed the world dramatically, and it should be remembered for its cultural impact rather than for the man who made first contact. If Columbus had gone down in a storm, someone else would have followed - the contact between peoples on opposite sides of the Atlantic was inevitable. The "who" isn't as important as "what", imo.

While the concept is different, if you are ever in Mexico and ask someone who discovered Mexico they will say Christopher Columbus.

What I find interesting is that the crux of the holiday was to celebrate the mixing of the races - European and Indian. Two races that remain relatively unmixed in Mexico today.

 

[T2Kplus20]

China had been sailing to the east coast of Africa in the late 14th century and had an impressive fleet of treasure ships by the start of the 15th. But the Emperor put a halt to all expeditions in 1433 and either destroyed the fleet or let it rot.

Had that decision gone differently, it's possible that China could have spread across to the west coast of the Americas while Europeans were spreading to the east coast... and history would have played out very differently.

And that's how Firefly would have been born!!!!! Great TV show, BS it was cancelled without giving it a chance.

 

[Blitz8RU]

And that's how Firefly would have been born!!!!! Great TV show, BS it was cancelled without giving it a chance.

Yes it was a gorrram shame. But at least the Serenity movie came out of it.

Farscape, Dark Matter and Killjoys were similar as well.

The Expanse fills that niche now though especially with the Belter Creole that is spoken by Belters and space pirates, so there is a bet of the space western vibe there too.

And we have space colonization now with the opening of Abaddon's Gate (tying it back into Christopher Columbus).

 

[RUInsanityToo]

I vote we change it to Vespucci day. Long overdue.

 

[graystork]

Try learning some geography. And Columbus' later voyages. Sorry history doesn't fit into your political diatribe. But then it never does.