Odd baseball question

[MarkDallas]

So I saw this video on ESPN and it got me thinking:
http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=19481312
(basic synopsis: ball slips out of pitcher's have and dribbles toward foul line, batter takes a mocking swing, ump calls a strike for the out)

So let's say a batter had two strikes and no balls. The next pitch is wild. Couldn't he swing at it anyway and try to take first?

 

[Faustdog]

So let's say a batter had two strikes and no balls. The next pitch is wild. Couldn't he swing at it anyway and try to take first?

Yes.

 

[CochiseCowbell]

Yes.

But you can only take first on a swinging strike three in the dirt/passed ball if first is unoccupied. The odd thing here is if there's a runner on first & he steals. I've never known when or how they determine when it becomes open.

That said, you'd have to have some serious baseball IQ & insanely quick thinking to pull that off in a matter of seconds.

 

[8dog]

Kind of like if a guy breaks a big run in football and you see a hold 30 yds past the line of scrimmage--a really quick thinking defensive player would be best served to grab a face mask to negate the play

 

[johnson86-1]

Kind of like if a guy breaks a big run in football and you see a hold 30 yds past the line of scrimmage--a really quick thinking defensive player would be best served to grab a face mask to negate the play

You lost me. So if there is just a hold, it's ten yards from the spot of the hold (so a 20 yd gain), but if it's a hold and a facemask, the penalties are offsetting and the down is replayed from the original ilne of scrimmage? Is that right? I would have thought hte offsetting penalties meant the play stood.

 

[8dog]

Offsetting penalties replay the down. So the defense is rewarded for a penalty in that situation

 

[dawgstudent]

I'm sending this to Grantham.

 

[8dog]

Its part of a defensive scheme designed to stop all the offenses

 

[RedStickDawg]

It doesn't have to be a swinging strike three. The batter becomes a runner if the catcher drops/misses the third strike regardless if the batter swings. For this to happen, there must not be a runner occupying 1st with less than two outs. With two outs, you can take first as long as they don't throw you out. A runner occupies the bag he's on at the time of the pitch. Even if he is stealing 2nd, he started by occupying 1st at the time the pitch was thrown.

 

[MaroonNation]

Unless you are playing Bama, who never gets called for holding. Your face mask is the only penalty the refs will see.

 

[thekimmer]

There are a couple of ways to close such a loophole....

Offsetting penalties replay the down. So the defense is rewarded for a penalty in that situation

One is to just get rid of offsetting penalties. Assess each penalty independently within some kind of hierarchy. In the situation you cite, assess the holding penalty ten yards from where the infraction occurred then walk off fifteen from that spot against the defense. It has always seemed ridiculous to me when an off sides call can offset a personal foul.

The other way is before declaring offsetting fouls each team must be given the opportunity to accept or decline the penalty assessed on the other team. In this case, the offense would decline the face mask because accepting it hurts them worse than declining it.

 

[thekimmer]

A few comments. First of all that was a BS call by that ump. Sorry but that is just ridiculous showboating to make that call there. Secondly, I'd say the opportunity for a batter to initiate a swing ends once the ball gets to the catcher. You cannot legitimately initiate a swing with the ball half way to the backstop just to get first base on a dropped strike three, which incidentally I think is a ridiculous rule I don't care how old and venerated it is. Regarding when first base becomes open, that is easy. It is when the runner currently at first is retired or successfully occupies another base. A steal on a passed third strike would never count as freeing up first because the runner had not yet successfully occupied second.

 

[MarkDallas]

It doesn't have to be a swinging strike three. The batter becomes a runner if the catcher drops/misses the third strike regardless if the batter swings.

Yeah. I was thinking a wild pitch would be his only chance of reaching first. Which he would have to turn into a strike by swinging.

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

Unless you are playing Bama, who never gets called for holding. Your face mask is the only penalty the refs will see.

^^^Has been an MSU fan for a long time.