No sitting out for transfers gaining steam....

[Anon1751594821]

The ACC has joined the Big Ten in advocating that players can transfer once without sitting out. It seems to really be gaining steam with these 2 heavyweights wanting it to get done.

It probably is only a matter of time until it gets passed in the NCAA. It is only a case when it will be implemented. The grad transfer rule seems to have led the way and made this argument much more popular. I do feel sorry for the mid-majors, because most of their best players will be plucked away by the power conferences.

Best of Luck,
Groz

 

[DHajekRC84]

The ACC has joined the Big Ten in advocating that players can transfer once without sitting out. It seems to really be gaining steam with these 2 heavyweights wanting it to get done.

It probably is only a matter of time until it gets passed in the NCAA. It is only a case when it will be implemented. The grad transfer rule seems to have led the way and made this argument much more popular. I do feel sorry for the mid-majors, because most of their best players will be plucked away by the power conferences.

Best of Luck,
Groz

sorry to be lazy and not google it. Does this rule allow for 1 transfer PLUS also the Grad Transfer later? I don't see how it can't right? So that would be two?

 

[bac2therac]

this would be a terrible change and create free agency where players would sit out before the seasons even over to bolt to their new schools

this is to help the traditonal power schools hang onto their power, its not good for college basketball. The ACC is crying because they have slipped majorly in the last couple of years.

 

[RUPartisan]

This is bad imo outside of the perennial top 20ish teams who will not only pluck starters from mid majors but from P5 teams like us. We will lose starters and get back either question marks who haven't played much or guys who lost starting jobs.

 

[kcg88]

this would be a terrible change and create free agency where players would sit out before the seasons even over to bolt to their new schools

this is to help the traditonal power schools hang onto their power, its not good for college basketball. The ACC is crying because they have slipped majorly in the last couple of years.

The obvious common sense thing is to not allow it midseason.

 

[Mr_Twister]

This change will simply bolster the same teams every year. And it will be worse when endorsement money takes effect. Instead of “one and dones” there will be “one and gones”.

 

[blockm2]

good for college athletics. Almost every other sport in D1 does this. Making a kid sit out for a year to transfer is asinine when they can commit to a coach and that coach can up and leave before they even play a single game at the school.

While it let's kids at small schools transfer to a big school occasionally, is that a bad thing for that kid who may be trying to fulfill a life dream? You will also see kids transfer from big schools to smaller schools more often if they get stuck in a depth chart and want PT without having to skip a season.


also worth noting I am 99% sure this does not apply to transferring in season, once the season starts that counts as having been played. The no sitting out means a kid can play freshman season at one school and then transfer for the next year and play at the other school as a sophomore. Nobody is going to stop playing midseason to transfer because they still couldn't play until next season anyway.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

this would be a terrible change and create free agency where players would sit out before the seasons even over to bolt to their new schools

this is to help the traditonal power schools hang onto their power, its not good for college basketball. The ACC is crying because they have slipped majorly in the last couple of years.

Spot-on

 

[ScarletR30]

this would be a terrible change and create free agency where players would sit out before the seasons even over to bolt to their new schools

this is to help the traditonal power schools hang onto their power, its not good for college basketball. The ACC is crying because they have slipped majorly in the last couple of years.

No. This is to help the players.

1. You can't assume that a 17-18 year old kid is making educated and the right decisions. Coaches lie and sometimes these kids just make the wrong choice.

2. So coaches can leave a program with no penalty? Why should we let coaches have "free agency" like you said. What if you are recruited to a school by a coach and he leaves before you even arrive? That player should be allowed to leave with no penalty. Think about all the Colorado Football players that were told on Signing day by he coach he is staying. Now what if the new coach is running a completely different system? That's not fair to the athlete

3. WIll players abuse it a jump from mid majors to the power houses? Yes, but players from the blue bloods will also leave. Kids can make a mistake, give them one chance to not make it again seems fair

 

[MoobyCow]

good for college athletics. Almost every other sport in D1 does this. Making a kid sit out for a year to transfer is asinine when they can commit to a coach and that coach can up and leave before they even play a single game at the school.

This is how I see it as well. Everything about what a kid thought he was really signing up for can be gone at any time. And yes, 'pick the school not the coach', but that is a joke considering that about 95% of a kid's experience at a school will be dictated by how the staff run things.

It may be bad for competition, or teams (probably even RU) but it sure seems like it's good for the kids.

 

[NickKnight 1]

this would be a terrible change and create free agency where players would sit out before the seasons even over to bolt to their new schools

this is to help the traditonal power schools hang onto their power, its not good for college basketball. The ACC is crying because they have slipped majorly in the last couple of years.

Why would they transfer in the middle
Of a season?

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

This is gonna kill mid-majors and "struggling" programs that find the hidden gems.

Think of how when Duke wants Dahntay Jones he had to sit. Billet with UVA.. EO and Oregon. It will be much easier for "name" programs to tamper with other programs rosters.

 

[wheezer]

this would be a terrible change and create free agency where players would sit out before the seasons even over to bolt to their new schools

this is to help the traditonal power schools hang onto their power, its not good for college basketball. The ACC is crying because they have slipped majorly in the last couple of years.

agree 100%.... at first glance, some of our fans are thinking it would be a way of getting talent here more easily...

but, we could be really hurt if some of our best players pull up stakes and go to a contender for a national title.... for a program like ours it could be a net negative

I hope the powers that be resist this.... not too optimistic however if more conferences start to support

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

Why would they transfer in the middle
Of a season?

on instruction from the power team they are moving to... avoid injuries

 

[Sideline20]

good for college athletics. Almost every other sport in D1 does this. Making a kid sit out for a year to transfer is asinine when they can commit to a coach and that coach can up and leave before they even play a single game at the school.

While it let's kids at small schools transfer to a big school occasionally, is that a bad thing for that kid who may be trying to fulfill a life dream? You will also see kids transfer from big schools to smaller schools more often if they get stuck in a depth chart and want PT without having to skip a season.


also worth noting I am 99% sure this does not apply to transferring in season, once the season starts that counts as having been played. The no sitting out means a kid can play freshman season at one school and then transfer for the next year and play at the other school as a sophomore. Nobody is going to stop playing midseason to transfer because they still couldn't play until next season anyway.

This is a good rule for the student athlete and it's all about student athletes rights. However, this rule will hurt the mid -majors. Most mid-major first team all conference players will be on P5 teams the following season.

For example, when Gary Waters (former coach at Rutgers) was the HC at Cleveland State (Horizon League), he lost 3 all conference players in one season (basically ruined a NCAA team). He lost Bryn Forbes to Michigan State (didn't have to sit out / some hardship technicality that Izzo used), Trey Lewis to Louisville (grad transfer although the NCAA put Louisville on probation that year so he didn't play in the NCAA tourney) and Anton Grady (grad transfer) to Wichita State.

 

[G- RUnit]

Although what everyone above said is true, until they make coaches sit out a year, than players should have the right too.

 

[NickRU714]

Great. Need to make it a simple easy rule:

Every transfer has to sit out a year
or
Every transfer immediately eligible

Note - All grad transfers should be immediately eligible regardless of the rule.

 

[blockm2]

agree 100%.... at first glance, some of our fans are thinking it would be a way of getting talent here more easily...

but, we could be really hurt if some of our best players pull up stakes and go to a contender for a national title.... for a program like ours it could be a net negative

I hope the powers that be resist this.... not too optimistic however if more conferences start to support

Personally if it is in the kids' own best interests than I don't really care what certain programs think about it. Why should a D1 hoops player have to sit out to transfer to another school when a D1 gymnast does not have to?

I mean at some point, isn't it about the kids?

From a talent point of view I think it's net neutral across the board. Some kids will want to play for a better team, others will want to actually play instead of sit on the bench.

 

[blockm2]

This is a good rule for the student athlete and it's all about student athletes rights. However, this rule will hurt the mid -majors. Most mid-major first team all conference players will be on P5 teams the following season.

For example, when Gary Waters (former coach at Rutgers) was the HC at Cleveland State (Horizon League), he lost 3 all conference players in one season (basically ruined a NCAA team). He lost Bryn Forbes to Michigan State (didn't have to sit out / some hardship technicality that Izzo used), Trey Lewis to Louisville (grad transfer although the NCAA put Louisville on probation that year so he didn't play in the NCAA tourney) and Anton Grady to Wichita State.

Was Cleveland State going to lose 4 or 5 all conference players that year if this rule was in place? Seems those kids can already transfer easily. Let's be honest, most all conference players at small schools are not true freshmen and sophomores because the elite recruits are already going to big name schools. The small schools have more talent when it is older and the underrecruited kid develops for 3-4 years.

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

I think when a kid transfers to a better program.. at a higher level.. that program should have to pay for the costs that kid incurred to the other program... schollies and training costs. If a soph transferring for his junior year means the program has to pay $300-$400K maybe they might balk.

Moving down or lateral moves to be closer to home.. not so much.

 

[Sideline20]

Was Cleveland State going to lose 4 or 5 all conference players that year if this rule was in place? Seems those kids can already transfer easily. Let's be honest, most all conference players at small schools are not true freshmen and sophomores because the elite recruits are already going to big name schools. The small schools have more talent when it is older and the underrecruited kid develops for 3-4 years.

Forbes was a sophomore - Lewis and Grady were grad transfers so to your point, they were established.

Actually, Lewis transferred from Penn State to Cleveland State to Louisville. Both Lewis and Grady both stated they transferred in order to play in the NCAA tourney. Unfortunately for Lewis, that was the year that Louisville did not wait for the NCAA to put them on probation. Louisville put themselves on probation early in the season.

I think that the P5 teams will now have the capability of rounding out their rosters instantly with all league mid major players. Also, from the players' perspective they will now have the opportunity to increase their exposure on the major sports television networks instead of playing their games on ESPN3.

 

[koleszar]

Smaller schools and those of non-traditional powers will become the developmental league for the blue bloods. Spend a year or two in the developmental league then blue bloods will tamper and come calling. It also makes it easier for traditional powers to shed those not cutting the mustard.

This is merely going to perpetuate the status quo. There's a reason our Michigan fan is for this, it directly improves his schools chances. Now if UM craps out on QB recruiting simply scout the college ranks for one. They already did it and yes tampering will occur behind closed doors.

 

[wheezer]

Personally if it is in the kids' own best interests than I don't really care what certain programs think about it. Why should a D1 hoops player have to sit out to transfer to another school when a D1 gymnast does not have to?

I mean at some point, isn't it about the kids?

From a talent point of view I think it's net neutral across the board. Some kids will want to play for a better team, others will want to actually play instead of sit on the bench.

U

I worry about the elite raiding the weak

Aggressive head coaches being proactive in a bad way

 

[blockm2]

Smaller schools and those of non-traditional powers will become the developmental league for the blue bloods. Spend a year or two in the developmental league then blue bloods will tamper and come calling. It also makes it easier for traditional powers to shed those not cutting the mustard.

This is merely going to perpetuate the status quo. There's a reason our Michigan fan is for this, it directly improves his schools chances. Now if UM craps out on QB recruiting simply scout the college ranks for one. They already did it and yes tampering will occur behind closed doors.

give me a break. I could not care one iota about how this affects Michigan. They have lost far more players to grad transfers than they have taken in. The fun thing about a message board is that literally nothing any of us posts here is going to influence what the NCAA does and so you don't need a rooting interest to influence your opinion. Just be honest. We can all feel free to yell at the TV watching a game later tomorrow without worrying about how the NCAA is going to change a rule based on words we type into a computer.

I have kids. If they ever play D1 I hope they have the option to transfer without sitting out should they so desire.

If someone has a lifelong dream to play at Rutgers but isn't good enough to get a scholarship and has to attend NJIT but then after 2 years was good enough that Rutgers would give him a scholarship are you really arguing he should be forced to sit a year?

And if you do have that belief, what is your opinion about all the other NCAA sports that do not force players to sit out a year? Are you arguing they should all change too?

 

[koleszar]

And if you do have that belief, what is your opinion about all the other NCAA sports that do not force players to sit out a year? Are you arguing they should all change too?

The other sports you speak of are equivalency scholarship sports vs head count sports like this rule will impact. You do know there's a huge difference there as kids aren't getting full scholarships? Right. So I'm not sure what your point is on comparing apples to oranges.

If I have kids that are Div 1 athletes, I teach them long before they become Div 1 athletes to honor their commitments. It's what my parents taught me and what I teach my kids. They choose not to they suffer the consequences of that decision(sitting out a year). Kid's today the word "Commitment" doesn't mean what they think it means and that's a by product of their parenting. You make a mistake sure you get a second chance, but that 1st mistake still carries consequences.

 

[Knights 1212]

I hope that idea does not pass. I believe it would have a huge impact on the mid majors.

 

[blockm2]

The other sports you speak of are equivalency scholarship sports vs head count sports like this rule will impact. You do know there's a huge difference there as kids aren't getting full scholarships? Right. So I'm not sure what your point is on comparing apples to oranges.

If I have kids that are Div 1 athletes, I teach them long before they become Div 1 athletes to honor their commitments. It's what my parents taught me and what I teach my kids. They choose not to they suffer the consequences of that decision(sitting out a year). Kid's today the word "Commitment" doesn't mean what they think it means and that's a by product of their parenting. You make a mistake sure you get a second chance, but that 1st mistake still carries consequences.

I am well aware of the difference in various scholarship rules between sports in D1.

As mentioned in this thread, what do you say to those kids who committed to Colorado on signing day when Mel Tucker promised he wasn't going anywhere and then a week later he is in East Lansing? Should they honor their commitment to a coaching staff that doesn't exist any more?

So wrong.

It is literally all about the kids. The overwhelming majority of kids impacted by this potential rule change will never play in the NFL or NBA. But we should screw them over because there is a theoretical risk to the winning percentage of a random small school? Never mind the theoretical benefit to those same small schools by getting transfers from big schools they never would have before?

just nonsense. NCAA should be about supporting the student-athletes.

 

[NightKnight]

First, I think freedom is always a good thing,
Second, I think this will primarily benefit the kid that is recruited by a top tier school and then gets recruited over. It should help make sure top tiers don't stock pile talent.

Why would a player like Peter Kiss have to sit out a year? It's not fair to the players. I've often wondered if it doesn't have Equal Access (14th Amendment) impications for state schools. I don't think a kid having success at UNC-Charlotte is all that likely to trade up to UNC. If he is really that good he's going to the NBA.

Personal anecdote, a kid that I worked with a little made the tremendous mistake of going to Syracuse after he blew up a little in camp play. He did okay as a Frosh, but less PT every year after that. Easier transfer rules and a fresh start could have put him back on track. That same kid had a cousin who played for South Carolina State. He'd be in the NBA or at least D-league or Europe if he could have easily transferred up to a more visible team. His athelticism didn't catch up to his size until he was 20 and 3 to play 2 wasn't all that appealing to him or teams that would have been interested.

 

[koleszar]

I am well aware of the difference in various scholarship rules between sports in D1.

Then why make the comparison knowing full well there wasn't a comparison to make?

 

[rucoe89]

The ACC has joined the Big Ten in advocating that players can transfer once without sitting out. It seems to really be gaining steam with these 2 heavyweights wanting it to get done.

It probably is only a matter of time until it gets passed in the NCAA. It is only a case when it will be implemented. The grad transfer rule seems to have led the way and made this argument much more popular. I do feel sorry for the mid-majors, because most of their best players will be plucked away by the power conferences.

Best of Luck,
Groz

Free agency comes to the NCAA.

 

[blockm2]

Then why make the comparison knowing full well there wasn't a comparison to make?

If you want to pretend a kid getting scholarship money to play 1 sport compared to another sport should impact whether they have to sit out a year for transfer, well that says something about you and how you view student athletes. And if we treat them that differently, perhaps they should just be on salary then in addition to tuition.


The comparison is they are student athletes.

 

[bac2therac]

Why would they transfer in the middle
Of a season?

see Rutgers womens team

 

[bac2therac]

Personally if it is in the kids' own best interests than I don't really care what certain programs think about it. Why should a D1 hoops player have to sit out to transfer to another school when a D1 gymnast does not have to?

I mean at some point, isn't it about the kids?

From a talent point of view I think it's net neutral across the board. Some kids will want to play for a better team, others will want to actually play instead of sit on the bench.

its free agency...lol you bring up kids when the ones benefitting are the greedy legacy programs

 

[koleszar]

If you want to pretend a kid getting scholarship money to play 1 sport compared to another sport should impact whether they have to sit out a year for transfer, well that says something about you and how you view student athletes. And if we treat them that differently, perhaps they should just be on salary then in addition to tuition.


The comparison is they are student athletes.

You have to be sh*tting me. A kid getting a 30% scholarship compared to a full scholarship is completely different. That's the reason they can move around with impunity if you can't see that then you're beyond help. If they were treated equally wrestling wouldn't have 9.9 scholarships and basketball 13 where 10 start versus 5. You wanting a de facto developmental league says a lot about you. You cherish keeping the status quo while sacrificing competition for dynasties.

Don't act like this is some moral crusade you're on. You see the benefits your school can reap from the implementation of this new rule and hide it under the vail of I'm just thinking about the kids. You damn well know this will allow you to jettison recruiting mistakes easier while scouring the collegiate ranks to plug holes immediately. Hail to the Victors, right, you probably have it tattooed on your ***.

 

[bac2therac]

No. This is to help the players.

1. You can't assume that a 17-18 year old kid is making educated and the right decisions. Coaches lie and sometimes these kids just make the wrong choice.

2. So coaches can leave a program with no penalty? Why should we let coaches have "free agency" like you said. What if you are recruited to a school by a coach and he leaves before you even arrive? That player should be allowed to leave with no penalty. Think about all the Colorado Football players that were told on Signing day by he coach he is staying. Now what if the new coach is running a completely different system? That's not fair to the athlete

3. WIll players abuse it a jump from mid majors to the power houses? Yes, but players from the blue bloods will also leave. Kids can make a mistake, give them one chance to not make it again seems fair

i dont know but coaches are not gettng a free education and free board and tuition either

 

[NickKnight 1]

i dont know but coaches are not gettng a free education and free board and tuition either

And players don,t get fired. They keep
Their free education if they are 3rd string.
So what happens if another kid comes in and red shirts get a fee education that year and plays 3 years after.
A top team sees how good he is,
And offers him a chance to be a champion. Does he say screw you
Rutgers i have to do what is best tor me? Is it fair to that school (Rutgers)

 

[Scangg]

Eventually in the future everybody will look back and think how exploited players were when coaches can break rules get sanctioned and leave and coach somewhere the next year and punish 18 year olds who were tricked by full grown men. The current system is a disgrace

 

[satnom]

agree 100%.... at first glance, some of our fans are thinking it would be a way of getting talent here more easily...

but, we could be really hurt if some of our best players pull up stakes and go to a contender for a national title.... for a program like ours it could be a net negative

I hope the powers that be resist this.... not too optimistic however if more conferences start to support

I am fine with this proposed rule. Give kids more options and gives programs more options. Some say it will be the strong program preying on the weak program. If a program has a winning culture with institutional support, facilities, high competition, post season play and a solid coaching staff the school (i.e. Rutgers) will be fine. This rule works both ways. If a player is not happy because of playing time, comp level, change of coaching staff, etc they will have options just like a program will have options to fill the scholarship if the player wants to move on or wants them to move on. The stronger the program the more demand for the scholarship.

This proposed rule is good. Keeps everyone on their toes.

GO RU

 

[NBKnight]

And players don,t get fired. They keep
Their free education if they are 3rd string.
So what happens if another kid comes in and red shirts get a fee education that year and plays 3 years after.
A top team sees how good he is,
And offers him a chance to be a champion. Does he say screw you
Rutgers i have to do what is best tor me? Is it fair to that school (Rutgers)

Coaches still get paid if they are fired.

 

[MADHAT1]

i dont know but coaches are not gettng a free education and free board and tuition either

They do get other perks:
Coaches sometimes get the school to provide them with cars .
Also a bonus if they stay a certain number of years, sometimes 6 – 7 figures.
Then there’s the shoe and apparel deals they sign on to and have the school they coach become involved in using the brand they have a deal with.

Don’t forget the private Golf Club membership given to the HC just for coaching at the school.

Incentive bonuses added in contract, so much for wins, post season play and academic achievement of players.
Some get a piece of gate once attendance goes over a certain amount.

Some coaches can run basketball camps on school campuses without being charged or a minimal charge at most and keep 100%
of the profits.

Then you have private plane flights for personal use paid by the school, either commercial flight or a private jet hired for trip.

That said, student athletes should be able to transfer without sitting, but at a cost.
Loss of being able to redshirt without losing any eligibility , of if redshirt year already used: that redshirt year ( unless for medical reasons) is counted as an eligibility year and subtracted from the 4 years eligibility player has.
The 5 years to play 4 is lost once a player transfers without having to sit out a year for doing so.
Unless dropped down a level.

Once a player transfers, being a grad transfer in the future, is out at the FBS level

Now for the College HC that resigns to take another college HC position.
He can't accept any transfers his first year on the job. JUCO players are the exception.