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Marvin Bagley III

M

MyDudeG_rivals

Senior
Mar 10, 2016
872
708
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The team with the best talent doesn't always win. The team with the best chemistry doesn't always win. There's no clear cut solution to winning a championship.

With that being said, give me the best talent every time if given the option. If Bagley is able to come in January I would welcome him with open arms.
 
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M

Mac9192

Heisman
Jan 25, 2017
9,551
13,813
107
timo0402 said:
There's a lot of things in your post but I'll just ask this simple question bc I'm curious to hear your thinking- you said K tries to mesh OAD talent hasn't worked out other than 2015. What is your definition of "working out"? Is it final four or bust? And truthfully you're talking about outside of this past season only a single player being a OAD recruit that he's had to mesh with veterans. Kyrie, Austin, none, Jabari, Jah, Brandon.
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The bar has been set so high because of K, but two years since 10 losing in the first round, one (16) where they barely made it out of the first weekend, to then lose the next game, and then this past roller coaster season, not getting out of the 1st weekend.
Personally, I think it has taken Coach K some time adapting with the one and done mindset player. I think he didn't have good luck with them meshing with returning guys until Okafor in 14-15, and had Sulaimon stayed, I don't think Duke wins it all that year. Hell he used to kick Laettner out of practice, yet it's in Sports Illustrated when he benched Parker in 13-14 season where his mother texts an assistant coach that she's coming to Durham to talk after her son was on bench during the end of the NC State? game.
The main disagreement that you and I have is the amount of stars to take in. I say 2-3 one and dones, you and some others are fine fielding as many of them as possible. Time will tell, I just am of the opinion give K a team where they all know their roles, and the chance of success is higher. Everyone can't be a chef in K's style, minutes won't allow that. Someone has to wash the dishes
 
H

hart2chesson

Heisman
Oct 13, 2012
14,303
16,574
0
Mac9192 said:
He was a cancer though. It was a nasty fight in the locker room after the ND game between him and Matt Jones. It escalated, and he ultimately got the boot. The team banded together, said "8 is enough" and won it all. Most would probably say, especially after knowing this, that losing him made the team closer, which made them better.
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No way we win the '15 natty with Sheed IMO, because of his issues of playing basically behind Matt Jones.We lost at Notre Dame w/Sheed, then won banded together w/o him in a never forget W at Virginia. That was a tone setter for the rest of the year! OFC
 
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timo0402

Heisman
Feb 24, 2009
13,868
13,709
57
Mac9192 said:
The bar has been set so high because of K, but two years since 10 losing in the first round, one (16) where they barely made it out of the first weekend, to then lose the next game, and then this past roller coaster season, not getting out of the 1st weekend.
Personally, I think it has taken Coach K some time adapting with the one and done mindset player. I think he didn't have good luck with them meshing with returning guys until Okafor in 14-15, and had Sulaimon stayed, I don't think Duke wins it all that year. Hell he used to kick Laettner out of practice, yet it's in Sports Illustrated when he benched Parker in 13-14 season where his mother texts an assistant coach that she's coming to Durham to talk after her son was on bench during the end of the NC State? game.
The main disagreement that you and I have is the amount of stars to take in. I say 2-3 one and dones, you and some others are fine fielding as many of them as possible. Time will tell, I just am of the opinion give K a team where they all know their roles, and the chance of success is higher. Everyone can't be a chef in K's style, minutes won't allow that. Someone has to wash the dishes
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Parents will be parents that's just part of youth sports even in college. That'll never change. But you are correct about Jabari, having said that there were no chemistry issues.

Getting back to our main difference of opinion here- you say that you want 2-3 OADs and I want a whole bunch of them. I think you are closer to labeling me accurately than yourself though. You might say you're cool with 2-3 but the reality is we've never had more than ONE, until last year.
2011- Kyrie
2012- Austin
2013- NONE
2014- Jabari
2015- Jah (I'm including the OAD as we recruited him and the players on the team knew he was gone after one season)
2016- Brandon

It wasn't until 2017 where we had multiple- Tatum and Giles (if you want to lump in Bolden and/or Frank) I'll allow it. I didn't see Frank but I did think Bolden had a slight chance- but that's still 2-3 OAD right? Right in the wheelhouse of what we want to mesh with vets.

I don't think the recruiting strategy is the problem, I think it's just as a poster said above really difficult to guess who each team will ultimately be like chemistry wise. I don't see it as a OAD problem, I see it as some alpha personalities just don't mesh well with certain other ones and in college especially in this era it's a one shot deal to get that season right.

As for our finishes- outside of 2013 and 2015 they haven't been up to expectations as a program I'll grant that. But two things- they weren't from 2005-2009 and we were not in the OAD game (as far as landing them) and 2. It is VERY HARD to win.
 
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Dattier

All-American
Sep 1, 2003
9,374
5,634
0
So help me catch up a little...

At the bottom of page 9 someone made a quip about Bagley coming in January and practically all of page 10 was a debate over it...

And while it's harsh to call someone a team cancer, the one and only player ever kicked off the team in K's entire time at Duke -- and who is not Taylor King -- is probably the leading candidate for being called that.

Did I miss anything?
 
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skysdad

Heisman
Mar 3, 2006
42,753
22,653
0
The only thing I'm worried about is if he does wait hof coach roy williams may make him a deal he can't refuse and that's 4 years of wanda's "nanner puddin " and an off campus mansion to live in during those 4 years. Now this may sound like it's a NCAA violation but nothing that unc does is a NCAA violation. OFC
 
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M

Mac9192

Heisman
Jan 25, 2017
9,551
13,813
107
timo0402 said:
Parents will be parents that's just part of youth sports even in college. That'll never change. But you are correct about Jabari, having said that there were no chemistry issues.

Getting back to our main difference of opinion here- you say that you want 2-3 OADs and I want a whole bunch of them. I think you are closer to labeling me accurately than yourself though. You might say you're cool with 2-3 but the reality is we've never had more than ONE, until last year.
2011- Kyrie
2012- Austin
2013- NONE
2014- Jabari
2015- Jah (I'm including the OAD as we recruited him and the players on the team knew he was gone after one season)
2016- Brandon

It wasn't until 2017 where we had multiple- Tatum and Giles (if you want to lump in Bolden and/or Frank) I'll allow it. I didn't see Frank but I did think Bolden had a slight chance- but that's still 2-3 OAD right? Right in the wheelhouse of what we want to mesh with vets.

I don't think the recruiting strategy is the problem, I think it's just as a poster said above really difficult to guess who each team will ultimately be like chemistry wise. I don't see it as a OAD problem, I see it as some alpha personalities just don't mesh well with certain other ones and in college especially in this era it's a one shot deal to get that season right.

As for our finishes- outside of 2013 and 2015 they haven't been up to expectations as a program I'll grant that. But two things- they weren't from 2005-2009 and we were not in the OAD game (as far as landing them) and 2. It is VERY HARD to win.
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It's not that I Want 2-3, maybe I wasn't clear enough. 2-3 is my prefer max. The game has changed in just the last few years, if Tyus and Justice were to come now, they might make it known public before the season starts that they are one and done. It may get to the point where he's getting 4-6 a year, unless the rules change.
I like the current makeup of this roster as it sits right now. If Bagley comes and Duke wins the title, I'll be a big enough man to say I was wrong. As of now, too many of a good thing can be bad, and like I said before, my take is off of how K coaches and I don't think it's a system set up for too many stars with the minutes the starters will probably log. I don't want to see guys play just for the hell of it, but the role players this season with this roster can develop, and they will be needed at some point down the road
 
S

SoCal_Dukie3

All-Conference
Jul 8, 2017
2,387
2,607
0
Laettner15 said:
I look into things way to much sometimes... but interesting a week after he visits he files the paperwork... like i said I look into things way to much sometimes but that has to be a good sign
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I like the way you look at things....
 
D

DukeDenver

All-American
Nov 21, 2010
8,249
8,451
0
timo0402 said:
Doesn't mean anything now
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pisgah101 said:
Hmmm
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df64

All-Conference
Feb 2, 2006
2,702
1,934
0
Maybe we should look at like baseball. Every contending team is lookin to add a piece or two-from big to small- for the second half of the year. Quite often, the WS winner is the team that added the most important piece. Obviously on court chemistry in hoops is a bit more important than on field chemistry is to most positions in baseball, but you never know until you try it.
 
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pisgah101

pisgah101

Heisman
Dec 26, 2005
15,646
13,543
113
df64 said:
Maybe we should look at like baseball. Every contending team is lookin to add a piece or two-from big to small- for the second half of the year. Quite often, the WS winner is the team that added the most important piece. Obviously on court chemistry in hoops is a bit more important than on field chemistry is to most positions in baseball, but you never know until you try it.
Click to expand...

A bit?
 
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christophero

Heisman
May 2, 2017
17,371
21,082
113
Bagley's an interesting case as whoever he commits to (with the exception of USC, who would be top 5) would shoot to the preseason number one spot. Ucla and Arizona would be scary with Bagley. I think we get him. I want to see him dunk over Kevin Knox for the game winning basket in the national championship. :)
 
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Y

youngman42

All-Conference
Jan 27, 2003
6,817
1,373
57
Willcampbell said:
RJ Barret also reclassifying. He and Bagley are now 1-2 in the class of '18.
OFC
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Are you referring to 1-2 on Duke's list or overall?

Because several reputable recruiting services (among them, Scout and ESPN) have Barrett at 3 after Zion Williamson at 2 and Bagley at 1. Bagley is pretty clearly consensus #1.
 
W

Willcampbell

All-Conference
Oct 20, 2004
2,480
2,137
0
youngman42 said:
Are you referring to 1-2 on Duke's list or overall?

Because several reputable recruiting services (among them, Scout and ESPN) have Barrett at 3 after Zion Williamson at 2 and Bagley at 1. Bagley is pretty clearly consensus #1.
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Reffering to overall. Rivals has them 1-2, with Barret #1 if I remember correctly (which is not a sure thing).
OFC
 
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Willcampbell

All-Conference
Oct 20, 2004
2,480
2,137
0
Just checked again. Rivals has Bagley 1, Barret 2, and Williamson 3. Far as I know we haven't formally offered either Bagley or Barret.
OFC
 
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dukedevilz

Heisman
Apr 3, 2002
15,637
19,600
0
DukeJim99 said:
I was hoping this was because he'd decided on Duke, but it looks like Arizona simply doesn't have a scholarship spot for him this year, so there's no point to him visiting there.

Still, excellent news.
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There's more to it than that. USC also doesn't have an open scholarship, and yet they are our biggest competition.
 
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