LES Planned Outages
- Thread starter HuskerLove
- Start date
I drive a Ford Expedition EL and I'm sticking with the older model made from steel. I took college physics and I understand that F=MA. I also understand that people are dependant on energy for their health and well being. They can't go back to the wood lot in most cases and cut a few branches to throw in the stove when the electricity goes out. The turn our energy policy took during Obama's reign of terror has set us back literally to the dark ages. Literally 2 days ago thousands of wind turbines couldn't turn because it was too cold, too windy, not windy enough or they had ice on them. F'n stupid. They're a NET ENERGY LOSER, contribute mightily to world pollution and yet we keep building the damned things.
One of my sons is an electrical engineer in Austin TX. He went out and bought the biggest damned generator he could find, set it up on his apartment deck and hotwired it into his panel. Then the water went out.... At least he can run the lights and charge his tech stuff. I joked that he should have taken his boy scout camping stuff down to Texas with him when he moved down there.
The bottomline for the energy providers is that they get squeezed by environmental regs AND rate controls. Then some governmental entities FORCE them to buy a certain percentage of their energy from "renewable (should be called unreliable) sources" regardless of price. We are an EXTREMELY foolish country.
He's not wrong. Way too many whiny little Karen's in the world. Texans, you're better than this.
I have a feeling that guy was talking to the tens of thousands of Caliunicornians who have fled to Texas from the utopia they created on the West Coast. It's a bad deal all the way around for them down there. This "global warming" thing really bit them in the *** this week.
When roughly 50% of the population is on some sort of government assistance and many of them live in government subsidized apartment buildings, this isn't surprising. Our country is so screwed.
I'm a pretty fair minded and logical guy. What we've done over the past decade plus was neither sound environmentally or fiscally. Do you understand where the materials for the generators in those wind towers comes from? Do you understand how much toxic waste the manufacture of the components produces? Do you realize how many gallons of oil it takes to lubricate those damned things and then how often you have to change it? My sons are engineers. One of them at a level I can't even comprehend and they both think wind towers are nothing more than a financial boondoggle. They make absolutely no sense. I visited with a theoretical physicist who did nothing but material failure analysis a while back and he said IF you want to make a LOT of money in the next 10-15 years, invest in a company that tears down wind towers. There's already HUGE piles of damaged blades stacking up in places as they have to replace them.
Haven’t seen any of those issues beyond environmental, renewables are happening, nobody disputes that. Diverse fleets are key and that includes renewables. Wind has remained pretty consistent and reliable overall. Yes, poor maintenance planning and cost cutting winterization are biting a lot of people hard, but it costs a ton to engineer for the once every ten year event.
If Texas had never built a single wind tower, failure to winterize their coal and gas fueled plants would have still screwed them in this situation - even Greg Abbott finally admitted as much. And while it may in fact have been a logical business decision not to make that investment, the decision was made by the companies operating those plants - not by the LIBS! hiding under your bed.
Obama did very little to change our energy policies
It's just a freak cold/storm that the equipment wasn't prepared for. The cost analysis and customer feedback led them to those decisions. Right or wrong, that was their call. Now man up and accept the responsibility. Johnny Lawrence wants you to quit being a ***** and blaming others.
dinglefraud is having a hard time with this one for sure. No one has had a bigger influence on this nation's energy policies over the last 50+ years than the Texas Republicans. And that includes those pesky environmental regs that he often complains about. And all of those windmills in Texas? That was a Republican initiative and source of pride for them. It really requires a lot of bending of facts (and straight out misinformation) to blame this one on the Democrats. But that won't stop him. No sir!
It's just a freak cold/storm that the equipment wasn't prepared for. The cost analysis and customer feedback led them to those decisions. Right or wrong, that was their call. Now man up and accept the responsibility. Johnny Lawrence wants you to quit being a ***** and blaming others.
Somebody who has to tell you first he's going to ignore you forever on a MB instead of just doing it??? Weird....and a great example of todays intolerant bratty cancel culture.
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lol, indeed...
The Pickens Plan is an energy policy proposal announced July 8, 2008, by American businessman T. Boone Pickens. Pickens wanted to reduce American dependence on imported oil by investing approximately $1 trillion in new wind turbine farms for power generation, which he believed would allow the natural gas used for power generation to be shifted to fuel trucks and other heavy vehicles with compressed natural gas. Wind power had been experiencing exponential growth in the United States for several years when Pickens announced his plan. Wind power in Texas grew very rapidly, 2400% from 1999 to 2007. In another large state, California, wind generation increased by 48% in the same period.
T. Boone was looking to feed at the wind energy trough, which was already handing out billions by 2008 and especially in Texas. Not a fan by any means, I just find the timetable to be fascinating.
Nice. Name calling from the intellectual cop of the board. Here's the problem with YOUR logic. In the 150 miles surrounding me we have I'm guessing several thousand wind towers. Texas is tied in to OUR wind towers via the grid up here to supposedly give them a robust diverse source of power that can be transferred from one area of the power grid to another in case of some disaster. Well guess what. When they needed power in Texas we couldn't supply it because WE had a HUGE demand in our own area due to the cold and our f'ing wind generators weren't turning. Why? Because it was too cold, too windy in some areas, not enough wind in others, etc. You can NOT depend on wind power for any significant amount of your energy source. Sure Texas screwed the pooch BUT WE we were screwed in our area as well because we're dependent on them as well.
A board member of a rural electrical cooperative from southwest Minnesota told me that Minnesota had MANDATED that 25% of their energy come from renewables. They were buying energy that cost TWICE as much as coal or natural gas generated electricity. Makes a lot of sense. When it's 35 below and still as a dead man in a coffin wind energy is really smart....not. This really is not a democrat versus republican issue. The green movement is but one faction of the democrat party and their "science" is often misguided and illogical regardless of the party their faction decided to join.
Who crammed it down our throats? The wind revolution was carried out by Obama. BTW, you understand that the likes of T. Boone Pickens have made billions off of the tax credits from wind power development right? That said, I'm not totally against wind. What I'm against is unreliable energy policy that is illogical and driven by massive tax credits. IMO the old saying that "the path to hell is paved with good intentions" applies here. You want to rely on wind power in the heartland? Good luck with that.
If Barack Obama had an R behind his name, he would be hailed by conservatives as the president who fossil-fueled his way to a level of energy independence the U.S. had not seen in decades. And, he would be absolutely despised by progressives for exactly the same reason. But don't ever let facts get in the way of tribal politics.
I'm really not a big fan of wind energy. But the idea that wind energy was crammed down Texans' throats by liberal bogeymen, or that it's the main reason they're sitting in the dark this week, are figments of your very vivid imagination.
TAX CREDITS. That's how they were crammed down our throats. Texas and really national energy policy was driven by illogical federal policy which provided HUGE financial rewards. That kind of policy is illogical and harmful to our competitiveness on the world stage and as we've seen can lead to a national security crisis. As I said, my problem with it has NOTHING to do with which party Obama was in. BOTH parties to some degree participated in the passage of the legislation. The insane "Green New Deal" however is clearly part of the Democrat's coalition. Obviously I am not a fan of President Obama but I pride myself on being able to look logically and honestly at the actions of each office holder.
I wasn't aware that Obama was the governor of Minnesota back then too. I can tell you a dirty little secret from behind the scenes. Nothing like this ever gets passed unless the power companies, etc weren't already going to be doing this by themselves anyway. Minnesota's mandate passed near unanimously. And with the power industry's blessings. There is a reason for that. It isn't being forced down anyone's throats.
President Obama had a remarkable ability to talk about renewable energy while the country was drilling for oil and gas like there was no tomorrow. And that's not a criticism - Hell I'm glad we are far, far less dependent on Middle Eastern and Venezuelan oil than we were back in the day. I just find it entertaining that zealots from both political tribes are still fooled to this day.
finding the average active rig count during obama vs. trump era might be an interesting dive.
They didn't ask the directors of their rural power coops when they mandated the use of renewable energy sources. There were federal "incentives" for state governments to pass renewable energy mandates and interstate power providers reaped HUGE tax benefits to participate. Again, it's the tax credit incentives that forced this on the public. Now we get to huddle in our damned houses with no electricity or water because the grid is failing.
Probably so, although I think the upward trend in energy independence continued under Trump. The key word being continued.
quick google search:
alberta (i chose this because i kinda knew the lay of the land here), which is a heavy oil & gas province, gets ~30% of its power from wind.
texas = ~15%.
tax credits or not, wind energy doesn't seem to have made as much a dent in the overall grid in tx, as is being touted.
its far colder in ab and they never miss a beat in the winter with water or energy.
we'd be remiss not to remember tx uses a lot of water, especially in the fracking/drilling biz - i would be surprised if this hasn't exacerbated delivery (pumping) of water utilities.
at the beginning of the week, our local news indicated the gas industry had agreed to reduce production this past summer to raise prices.
collusion? perhaps.
perfect storm - uh huh.
its my understanding natural gas isn't as good at electrical generation as coal, but all the new plants have been gas.
connection? probably.
i think wind energy is somewhat of a pig in a poke, but there's more this story than one, single facet.
alberta (i chose this because i kinda knew the lay of the land here), which is a heavy oil & gas province, gets ~30% of its power from wind.
texas = ~15%.
tax credits or not, wind energy doesn't seem to have made as much a dent in the overall grid in tx, as is being touted.
its far colder in ab and they never miss a beat in the winter with water or energy.
we'd be remiss not to remember tx uses a lot of water, especially in the fracking/drilling biz - i would be surprised if this hasn't exacerbated delivery (pumping) of water utilities.
at the beginning of the week, our local news indicated the gas industry had agreed to reduce production this past summer to raise prices.
collusion? perhaps.
perfect storm - uh huh.
its my understanding natural gas isn't as good at electrical generation as coal, but all the new plants have been gas.
connection? probably.
i think wind energy is somewhat of a pig in a poke, but there's more this story than one, single facet.
And he did his best to stop pipeline construction and fracking. He was not in absolute control or he would have completely stopped fracking. Why do you suppose that oil companies stocked up on 10 years worth of federal drilling permits before this past election? As long as the Republicans held the Senate, the left had a problem trying to dictate a green energy policy. Now? Not so much.
Carbon credits are a scam. They made Gore millions.
Obama could only do so much with a Republican Senate. That said, there were many Republicans who went along with wind incentives because some of their donors were going to line their pockets with federal tax credits. Our goverment is corrupt. Period. Legislators and Presidents all accumulate massive wealth for themselves and their cronies by virtue of their office.
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Did his best to stop fracking? What planet were you living on from 2009 through 2016?
Like I said, President Obama's ability to fool goobs from both political extremes about his energy policy was remarkable. And normal people benefited from it, while wingnuts' heads exploded and progressives panted breathlessly in admiration.
I have a shoestring relative who runs a huge business dependent on the fracking industry in Texas. The Obama administration TRIED via the courts, the EPA and other government agencies to slow down or kill fracking. Obama's administration threw up barriers to try to stop the Keystone pipeline as well. The problem for them though was that they didn't control the Senate and they knew they couldn't get anything through to stop fracking. That said, privately I'm not a big fan of fracking. I'm not sure that widespread cracking of the earth's crust is a wise long term decision.
Directors of rural power coops certainly would have been asked. What influence their feedback would have on the decision might be a different story. If the fat cats want it, then they most likely get it. You might ask those people what they do with all those incentives they received anyway. That would be a more interesting issue.
By the way, South Dakota is in attainment with the air quality standards, so putting in a few more natural gas peaking stations is easy-peasy. They chose not to. Why? No one forced them not to. Accountability should also extend to the local levels.
Obama did almost zero to help the environment unless he was forced to. Lot of good meaningless PR stuff like the Paris agreements though.
He and Hillary were perfectly happy to rubber stamp the Keystone XL project. Nebraska farmers and ranchers are the ones who held it up. They weren't even opposed to it, they just wanted it rerouted away from the sandhills and aquifer. TransCanada said 'nope, impossible, can't be done' and that's when all the pushback started.
He and Hillary were perfectly happy to rubber stamp the Keystone XL project. Nebraska farmers and ranchers are the ones who held it up. They weren't even opposed to it, they just wanted it rerouted away from the sandhills and aquifer. TransCanada said 'nope, impossible, can't be done' and that's when all the pushback started.
I've dun a fair anount of mtn biking in Moab and once asked a local I was riding with what all the little 4" holes were in the ground...I have zero issues with grabbing every drop of oil from anywhere on earth you can get it...and we will do just that before we are dun with this planet...but man fracking leaves some ugly permament holes behind. Made me wonder if small animals ever fall in, as I was picturing Bob Fett falling into the sarlacc....
I know the Yankton South Dakota area in fact has a fairly large recently renovated natural gas peaking station. Friends told me though and I heard on the radio that they were asked to limit natural gas consumption to try to supply gas to the south. To some degree those natural gas power plants are limited by how much gas you can get through the lines.
When you become dependent on wind power, you limit the development of more dependable sources of power. THAT is the problem. Wind is NOT reliable. If we're going to continue down this rabbit hole everybody needs to buy backup generators for crucial private infrastructure and figure out ways to store water. I've debated buying backup generators to supply electricity to my farm place wells and livestock waterers. This may make my decision easier. Just another layer of cost inefficiency created by government policy.
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South Dakota should also have plenty of diesel fired turbines lying around ready to go just in case. They would have to scrutinize their power board members if they didn't.