Least we forget

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
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Ok. But as someone who has a lot more experience in leading large groups of diverse people. You come across as someone attacking religion more than anything else. I think the rubes are much smarter than you give them credit. Some probably think you don't actually care about gay marriage or gays being treated with respect. That you might just be using it as a tool to attack their religion. Just something to consider as you are learning from them.

Personally I look forward to sharing more of Andy's work with you. I think it will open your eyes to a lot of things.
I certainly don't intend to attack religion, if I come across that way then my apologies. I have attacked the idea that our legal system and gov't should be based on religious law, but is that really controversial?

For the record, I come from a very religious family background. My grandfather was a Church of God pentecostal preacher in southern WV (Logan).. I was raised in that environment and respect it and people who choose to believe.. That said, I would probably classify as agnostic...meaning, who really knows?.. I had a very good discussion recently with Cajuneer on this board about this topic, his perspective was enlightening and certainly kept my mind open to the possibility that Jesus was not just a historical figure but also a divine being sent from God.

And, on gay marriage and whether I actually care about it or am just using it to attack religion.. well, truth is this is a personal topic for me.. My brother is gay, has been in a committed, loving relationship for 30+ years with my now brother-in-law.. and I got ordained 7 or 8 years ago in order to conduct the legal ceremony of marrying them. So yeah, these issues have been real to me for a long time (religion vs. gay marriage) and I am very clear in my own beliefs and very supportive of gay marriage as a basic human right.
 

WVUALLEN

All-American
Aug 4, 2009
72,689
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I say Jesus would allow gay marriage. And that's the problem here , organized religion

Romans 1:18–32
God’s Wrath on Unrighteousness

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. 19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.

24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; 27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. 29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Though they know God’s righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.

Marriage is ordained by God as the lifetime union of a man and a woman (Genesis 2:21–24; Matthew 19:4–6). Gay marriage/same-sex marriage is a perversion of the institution of marriage and an offense to the God who created marriage. As Christians, we do not condone or ignore sin. Rather, we share the love of God and act as ministers of reconciliation (2 Corinthians 5:18). We point to the forgiveness of sins that is available to all, including homosexuals, through Jesus Christ. We speak the truth in love (Ephesians 4:15) and contend for truth with “gentleness and respect” (1 Peter 3:15).
 

sammyk

All-Conference
Oct 26, 2001
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You are a blasphemer and a heathen.

Matthew 19:4-6, “And He answered and said, ‘Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? 6 “So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.’”
Who wrote that ???? It was man not god so calm down Joan of Arc or Ned Flanders. And don't preach to me I pay someone to do that
 

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
23
23
I'm telling you once again marriage was a religious institution, and government overstepped their bounds. The government has an institution to recognize relationships, it's called civil unions, and they need to stick to it.

I voted against NC 1, and openly discussed my view with my church at the time. I didn't make any friends.

Government overstepping their bounds has already caused minor issues in certain aspects of our civilization. It will only get worse in the future. There will come a time in the near future when Christians are arrested.
a quick google search (yes, I get the danger of that in terms of accurate info) would say that:

"It is widely agreed that the origin of marriage dates well before recorded history, but the earliest recorded evidence of marriage ceremonies uniting one woman and one man dates from about 2350 B.C. in the Far East."

Marriage is not just a Christian thing, or a US thing.. it exists all over the world in many different religions as well as with atheists and agnostics..

Perhaps your views on marriage are rooted in your religion? Which I would say to that "Great, you have every right to have those views".. But we live in a multicultural, multi religious world, including secular beliefs.. so again, why should gay people be denied the opportunity to participate in marriage in terms of legal rights, etc?
 

Gunny46

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Jul 2, 2018
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I say Jesus would allow gay marriage. And that's the problem here , organized religion.


Bud I think most agree that they should be allowed to have civil unions recognized by the state. That doesn't make it marriage recognized by religious groups. Now read what Specialk posted and you can better understand why people get irritated.

then Christians should not be in a gay marriage.. The government is not mandating that Christians marry someone of the same sex. Who is infringing on their rights? IMO, Christians shouldn't get abortions either if it doesn't jive with their beliefs.. But what about people who have other beliefs? In a secular based system of government and laws, should their rights be protected as well?

EDIT: and, marriage is not a Christian institution to my knowledge.. even if it is, then ok call it something else but give the same legal rights.

Otherwise we are saying we want a theocratic based gov't and laws, which is basically aligned with ISIS/Al-Quaeda philosophy at that point isn't it?
 

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
23
23
Romans 1:18–32
God’s Wrath on Unrighteousness

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. 19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.

24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; 27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. 29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Though they know God’s righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.

Marriage is ordained by God as the lifetime union of a man and a woman (Genesis 2:21–24; Matthew 19:4–6). Gay marriage/same-sex marriage is a perversion of the institution of marriage and an offense to the God who created marriage. As Christians, we do not condone or ignore sin. Rather, we share the love of God and act as ministers of reconciliation (2 Corinthians 5:18). We point to the forgiveness of sins that is available to all, including homosexuals, through Jesus Christ. We speak the truth in love (Ephesians 4:15) and contend for truth with “gentleness and respect” (1 Peter 3:15).
If those are your religious beliefs, then great, don't marry another person of the same sex so that you are being faithful to your religion.. But why should those particular religious beliefs be the governing law that others who may not share those beliefs be subjected to? Or.. are you suggesting our laws should be guided by the Bible?
 

WVUALLEN

All-American
Aug 4, 2009
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If those are your religious beliefs, then great, don't marry another person of the same sex so that you are being faithful to your religion.. But why should those particular religious beliefs be the governing law that others who may not share those beliefs be subjected to? Or.. are you suggesting our laws should be guided by the Bible?
I don't care if a man marries a man it's not my concern. So quit pushing it on everyone.
Did I say they should be governing you? You can accept Christ or deny that is your choice. But you claiming I am suggesting the country follow God's law is not up to me. I answered the sammyk question (or response) on him saying christ would accept gay marriage when it is clear he would not. You are attempting to turn it into something completely different.
 

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
23
23
Bud I think most agree that they should be allowed to have civil unions recognized by the state. That doesn't make it marriage recognized by religious groups. Now read what Specialk posted and you can better understand why people get irritated.
IMO, gay marriage should not have to be recognized by religious groups if it is against their beliefs. Perhaps that's where we are getting hung up, on the semantics of that.. or perhaps we are disconnecting on whether "marriage" is a religious thing or a legal thing? I am discussing it in the legal context, not in the context that it has to be forced on or recognized by a particular religion.

I guess my basic point is.... in our system of gov't and laws, I don't see how a particular religion should dictate whether gay people have the legal right to marry and be protected by the same laws that heterosexual married couples have.
 

roadtrasheer

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Sep 9, 2016
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then Christians should not be in a gay marriage.. The government is not mandating that Christians marry someone of the same sex. Who is infringing on their rights? IMO, Christians shouldn't get abortions either if it doesn't jive with their beliefs.. But what about people who have other beliefs? In a secular based system of government and laws, should their rights be protected as well?

EDIT: and, marriage is not a Christian institution to my knowledge.. even if it is, then ok call it something else but give the same legal rights.

Otherwise we are saying we want a theocratic based gov't and laws, which is basically aligned with ISIS/Al-Quaeda philosophy at that point isn't it?
Marriage is in the Bible, that's why I say it should be called a union so they can reap whatever the government gives for it ...
Abortion is murder the unborn child should not have to pay for what some incompetent person did or didn't do . I understand Abortion in certain cases.
 

TarHeelEer

Freshman
Dec 15, 2002
89,304
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48
If those are your religious beliefs, then great, don't marry another person of the same sex so that you are being faithful to your religion.. But why should those particular religious beliefs be the governing law that others who may not share those beliefs be subjected to? Or.. are you suggesting our laws should be guided by the Bible?

The institution of marriage is not the government's to redefine.
 

WVUALLEN

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Who wrote that ???? It was man not god so calm down Joan of Arc or Ned Flanders. And don't preach to me I pay someone to do that
The man wrote the the words who was with Christ and followed him wrote down the words he spoke.
 

sammyk

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This just shows your ignorance Homer.
whatever and there are so many things, books passages left out of the bible or misinterpreted from Latin to Greek to English who knows what the hell was in the bible, or what the Romans wanted to hide or show when they created the bible. It shows your ignorance for not knowing that but par for the course on here
 

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
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23
The institution of marriage is not the government's to redefine.
are the legal rights related to it part of the gov't/legal systems role? If not gov't, who is in charge of defining the institution of marriage? The Christian religion? Muslim religion? Buddhists? Atheists or Agnostics?

Again, not trying to infringe on the rights of any particular religions beliefs here..
 

TarHeelEer

Freshman
Dec 15, 2002
89,304
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48
are the legal rights related to it part of the gov't/legal systems role? If not gov't, who is in charge of defining the institution of marriage? The Christian religion? Muslim religion? Buddhists? Atheists or Agnostics?

Again, not trying to infringe on the rights of any particular religions beliefs here..

Government oversteps everyone else. Everyone else mentioned has a right to define it as they desire. Not the government.
 

WVUALLEN

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IMO, gay marriage should not have to be recognized by religious groups if it is against their beliefs. Perhaps that's where we are getting hung up, on the semantics of that.. or perhaps we are disconnecting on whether "marriage" is a religious thing or a legal thing? I am discussing it in the legal context, not in the context that it has to be forced on or recognized by a particular religion.

I guess my basic point is.... in our system of gov't and laws, I don't see how a particular religion should dictate whether gay people have the legal right to marry and be protected by the same laws that heterosexual married couples have.
Gay marriage is not accept by religion nor is it accepted by Christ. But the government should not be allowed to force their belief of gays being married or not married. The only one doing the dictating is the government.
 

sammyk

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Gay marriage is not accept by religion nor is it accepted by Christ. But the government should not be allowed to force their belief of gays being married or not married. The only one doing the dictating is the government.
Wow looks like you knew Jesus . NOT so stop speaking for him. You don't know **** from Shinola on what he accepted or not , nobody does. And pssssstttt there were homosexuals before there were governments.
 

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
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I don't care if a man marries a man it's not my concern. So quit pushing it on everyone.
Did I say they should be governing you? You can accept Christ or deny that is your choice. But you claiming I am suggesting the country follow God's law is not up to me. I answered the sammyk question (or response) on him saying christ would accept gay marriage when it is clear he would not. You are attempting to turn it into something completely different.
lol.. I am not pushing gay marriage on anyone.. I am defending our system of laws as a secular gov't and nation and the rights afforded to all citizens as a result, regardless of their race, religion, sex, etc. Isn't that a true American agenda to defend the rights in the constitution?

I get that maybe I am pushing on a nerve to try to make my point.. but you've said yourself you "don't care if a man marries a man it's not my concern".. so I'm really not sure what the controversy is about
 

Gunny46

All-Conference
Jul 2, 2018
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IMO, gay marriage should not have to be recognized by religious groups if it is against their beliefs. Perhaps that's where we are getting hung up, on the semantics of that.. or perhaps we are disconnecting on whether "marriage" is a religious thing or a legal thing? I am discussing it in the legal context, not in the context that it has to be forced on or recognized by a particular religion.

I guess my basic point is.... in our system of gov't and laws, I don't see how a particular religion should dictate whether gay people have the legal right to marry and be protected by the same laws that heterosexual married couples have.

If your straight and got hitched at the Justice of Peace you entered a civil union. If you did it at a Church you got married. I believe that's what people are trying to say. The government has screwed up the definition is what I think they are telling you. Which comes across as attaching religion and not wanting government officials using religion as guidance.

Something a lot of Marxist and Communist push. It's in there 45 goals to destroy our country.
 

roadtrasheer

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Sep 9, 2016
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a quick google search (yes, I get the danger of that in terms of accurate info) would say that:

"It is widely agreed that the origin of marriage dates well before recorded history, but the earliest recorded evidence of marriage ceremonies uniting one woman and one man dates from about 2350 B.C. in the Far East."

Marriage is not just a Christian thing, or a US thing.. it exists all over the world in many different religions as well as with atheists and agnostics..

Perhaps your views on marriage are rooted in your religion? Which I would say to that "Great, you have every right to have those views".. But we live in a multicultural, multi religious world, including secular beliefs.. so again, why should gay people be denied the opportunity to participate in marriage in terms of legal rights, etc?
I have a novel idea.
Get government out it all together....what makes who I live with any of governments business? If I want to get married under a religious ceremony so be it ,if Billy and Bob want to get married under a rainbow so be it . None of this would be a topic had government not overstepped its boundaries. Just a idea ... a small government protecting our borders and making commerce easy and safe ....
 

sammyk

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Oct 26, 2001
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I have a novel idea.
Get government out it all together....what makes who I live with any of governments business? If I want to get married under a religious ceremony so be it ,if Billy and Bob want to get married under a rainbow so be it . None of this would be a topic had government not overstepped its boundaries. Just a idea ... a small government protecting our borders and making commerce easy and safe ....
I have a better idea remove tax exemptions form churches if they want into politics
 

WVUALLEN

All-American
Aug 4, 2009
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Says who ?????? Some roman 4oo years later hahahahaha.
Says those who wrote it. Learn to read and you might understand.

The lack of evidence does not mean a person at the time didn’t exist. It means that they, like 99.99% of the rest of the world at the time, made no impact on the archaeological record.

It's still being spoken about and has survived all of these years. That in itself is amazing.

To explain the Bible’s contradictions, repetitions and general idiosyncrasies, most scholars today agree that the stories and laws it contains were communicated orally, through prose and poetry, over centuries. Starting around the 7th century B.C., different groups, or schools, of authors wrote them down at different times, before they were at some point (probably during the first centur B.C.) combined into the single, multi-layered work we know today.

The stories that form the basis of Christianity and the new testament were first communicated orally, and passed down from generation to generation, before they were collected and written down.
 

sammyk

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Says those who wrote it. Learn to read and you might understand.

The lack of evidence does not mean a person at the time didn’t exist. It means that they, like 99.99% of the rest of the world at the time, made no impact on the archaeological record.

It's still being spoken about and has survived all of these years. That in itself is amazing.

To explain the Bible’s contradictions, repetitions and general idiosyncrasies, most scholars today agree that the stories and laws it contains were communicated orally, through prose and poetry, over centuries. Starting around the 7th century B.C., different groups, or schools, of authors wrote them down at different times, before they were at some point (probably during the first centur B.C.) combined into the single, multi-layered work we know today.

The stories that form the basis of Christianity and the new testament were first communicated orally, and passed down from generation to generation, before they were collected and written down.
anyone could have wrote that anyone.
 

WVUALLEN

All-American
Aug 4, 2009
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Wow looks like you knew Jesus . NOT so stop speaking for him. You don't know **** from Shinola on what he accepted or not , nobody does. And pssssstttt there were homosexuals before there were governments.
Did I say there wasn't? Typical of a liberal they like to bend the words and speak a false truth.

I guarantee the way you speak along with your thought process with actions of attacks and name calling that you are no teacher, scholar or football coach.
 

roadtrasheer

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Sep 9, 2016
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I have a better idea remove tax exemptions form churches if they want into politics
I can agree with this .
Go another step and remove tax exemptions from any charity or foundation that does not give at least 80% of donations to the charity. Make all foundation and charities show how much is going to the charity in the commercials.
 

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
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Marriage is in the Bible, that's why I say it should be called a union so they can reap whatever the government gives for it ...
Abortion is murder the unborn child should not have to pay for what some incompetent person did or didn't do . I understand Abortion in certain cases.
I think our difference of opinion is you are defining "marriage" as a Christian thing (i.e., Bible reference).. whereas I am not since "marriage" or the concept of marriage exists in many religions, and non-religions, and purportedly pre-dates Christianity
 

Gunny46

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Jul 2, 2018
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anyone could have wrote that anyone.

You know who wrote this? It was collected from Marxist and it best explains your squealing right now.



CURRENT COMMUNIST GOALS

1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.

2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.

3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament [by] the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.

4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.

5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.

6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.

7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.

8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev's promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N.

9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress.

10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N.

11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.)

12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party.

13. Do away with all loyalty oaths.

14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office.

15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States.

16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.

17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers' associations. Put the party line in textbooks.

18. Gain control of all student newspapers.

19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack.

20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policymaking positions.

21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.

22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to "eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms."

23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. "Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art."

24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them "censorship" and a violation of free speech and free press.

25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.

26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy."

27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch."

28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state."

29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.

30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man."

31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the "big picture." Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.

32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture--education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.

33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.

34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.

35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.

36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.

37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.

38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].

39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.

40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.

41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.

42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use ["]united force["] to solve economic, political or social problems.

43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self-government.

44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.

45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.


Children's Literature Resources
 

sammyk

All-Conference
Oct 26, 2001
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Says those who wrote it. Learn to read and you might understand.

The lack of evidence does not mean a person at the time didn’t exist. It means that they, like 99.99% of the rest of the world at the time, made no impact on the archaeological record.

It's still being spoken about and has survived all of these years. That in itself is amazing.

To explain the Bible’s contradictions, repetitions and general idiosyncrasies, most scholars today agree that the stories and laws it contains were communicated orally, through prose and poetry, over centuries. Starting around the 7th century B.C., different groups, or schools, of authors wrote them down at different times, before they were at some point (probably during the first centur B.C.) combined into the single, multi-layered work we know today.

The stories that form the basis of Christianity and the new testament were first communicated orally, and passed down from generation to generation, before they were collected and written down.
So the stories of Zues, Thor, Hurakan were all not just passed down orally but written in stone in many cases. The Babylonians have a history that is older than any. Should we just accept that because it was passed down??????
 

roadtrasheer

All-Conference
Sep 9, 2016
18,154
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I think our difference of opinion is you are defining "marriage" as a Christian thing (i.e., Bible reference).. whereas I am not since "marriage" or the concept of marriage exists in many religions, and non-religions, and purportedly pre-dates Christianity
Yes you are correct.
Religiously I believe it's wrong
Constitution I believe it's OK
Gay or straight means nothing to me . According to the Bible I firmly believe in and the God I should worship I'm going to burn in the same fire for whoring around as Billy for swallowing baby batter. Government has no place in it .
 
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Gunny46

All-Conference
Jul 2, 2018
59,912
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You know who wrote this? It was collected from Marxist and it best explains your squealing right now.



CURRENT COMMUNIST GOALS

1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.

2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.

3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament [by] the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.

4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.

5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.

6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.

7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.

8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev's promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N.

9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress.

10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N.

11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.)

12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party.

13. Do away with all loyalty oaths.

14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office.

15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States.

16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.

17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers' associations. Put the party line in textbooks.

18. Gain control of all student newspapers.

19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack.

20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policymaking positions.

21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.

22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to "eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms."

23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. "Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art."

24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them "censorship" and a violation of free speech and free press.

25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.

26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy."

27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch."

28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state."

29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.

30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man."

31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the "big picture." Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.

32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture--education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.

33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.

34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.

35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.

36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.

37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.

38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].

39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.

40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.

41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.

42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use ["]united force["] to solve economic, political or social problems.

43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self-government.

44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.

45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.


Children's Literature Resources


78% of the State of West Virginia identities as Christians. Special K thinks that's holding you back. So if he can convince you otherwise he thinks he can save you. Personally I think he's a Marxist moron.



 

WVUALLEN

All-American
Aug 4, 2009
72,689
5,484
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lol.. I am not pushing gay marriage on anyone.. I am defending our system of laws as a secular gov't and nation and the rights afforded to all citizens as a result, regardless of their race, religion, sex, etc. Isn't that a true American agenda to defend the rights in the constitution?

I get that maybe I am pushing on a nerve to try to make my point.. but you've said yourself you "don't care if a man marries a man it's not my concern".. so I'm really not sure what the controversy is about
Your Government party is forcing the issue on people. Where is the constitution for religion and free speech? Or did you forget that. I'm against being gay but it's not my right or place to judge anyone for it.

Matthew 7:1-5
“Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.

Romans 12:1
Therefore you have no excuse, O man, every one of you who judges. For in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself, because you, the judge, practice the very same things.

James 4:11-12
Do not speak evil against one another, brothers. The one who speaks against a brother or judges his brother, speaks evil against the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge. There is only one lawgiver and judge, he who is able to save and to destroy. But who are you to judge your neighbor?

Romans 14:13
Therefore let us not pass judgment on one another any longer, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother.

I am not forcing my belief on you or anyone else. I do not agree with homosexuality or gay marriage. It's not my place to judge individuals. I should be allowed to comment on such but not force my judgement. Just as the government should not be allowed to force their beliefs upon me.
 

BUDmountain

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2001
4,345
23
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Government oversteps everyone else. Everyone else mentioned has a right to define it as they desire. Not the government.
but we are talking about legal rights here, not religious beliefs or acceptance.. shouldn't the gov't have a role in defining the legal rights afforded to its citizens, regardless of race, religion, sex, etc?