Jay Wright using Cal's old formula for success

[jb1010]

The words dribble drive motion gets thrown around every year. The fact is, we really haven't seen the dribble drive since Cal has been here at Kentucky. He has used it a few times, but as a coach myself, I noticed he usually runs an "elbow/horns" type of set, that usually leads to pick n roll or one guy coming off a screen (into a dribble handoff).

I ran across this video of Cal's practice at Memphis and it reminds me of the way Villanova runs their 4 out 1 in motion offense:


Villanova gives the players the freedom to make the decisions (back cut, drive, handoff, shoot, screen away) using principals of the motion. It seems like Calipari has adopted more of a set play type of coach over the years.

After looking over it, I am surprised how Cal has gone away from recruiting players that fit into this mold and a lot of focus on bigs. Maybe it's the youth in the teams now and not trusting their decision making process, but I thought it was interesting to see Jay Wright use this approach and molding a very succesful offense with it.

Just an observation.

 

[Mojocat_rivals48469]

...I am surprised how Cal has gone away from recruiting players that fit into this mold...

My guess is that once he got to Kentucky, Calipari figured he could recruit the top kids in a way he couldn't at Memphis. He was right, and that's what he's done. And while he does seem to have a specific body type that he prefers, I don't think he thinks much beyond that, like recruiting to a specific style of offense.

There is also the possibility that all the talk about the dribble-drive offense wasn't much more than marketing.

 

[jb1010]

There is also the possibility that all the talk about the dribble-drive offense wasn't much more than marketing.

I agree. It's basically a 4 out 1 in motion offense - he just called it dribble drive for marketing purposes.

 

[KingOfBBN]

The play they won the title on was called “Nova” and left three possibilities that the point guard could do. Pretty neat. You got to read Dana O’Neil’s book about Wright and Nova called “Long Shots.”

It discusses when they lost sight of who they were when they brought in that destructive class that was highly ranked but they tanked. Talked about the importance of getting guys who want to be there and not just a stop to the NBA. Upperclassmen are vital to their system.

Throwing together little all star teams don’t always work. I think of Team USA in the 2004 Olympics that got the bronze. Just not a good mix.

Also, Nova’s system of playing so many guards was formed out of necessity due to injury. One thing is for certain though after that 2018 team, their bigs can shoot and do well facing the basket.

 

[Mike-D]

Cal recruited to his systems at UMASS and Memphis. His system here are 5 star kids. He adapts to them. Love it or hate it.

 

[MunyonMustGo]

The words dribble drive motion gets thrown around every year. The fact is, we really haven't seen the dribble drive since Cal has been here at Kentucky. He has used it a few times, but as a coach myself, I noticed he usually runs an "elbow/horns" type of set, that usually leads to pick n roll or one guy coming off a screen (into a dribble handoff).

I ran across this video of Cal's practice at Memphis and it reminds me of the way Villanova runs their 4 out 1 in motion offense:


Villanova gives the players the freedom to make the decisions (back cut, drive, handoff, shoot, screen away) using principals of the motion. It seems like Calipari has adopted more of a set play type of coach over the years.

After looking over it, I am surprised how Cal has gone away from recruiting players that fit into this mold and a lot of focus on bigs. Maybe it's the youth in the teams now and not trusting their decision making process, but I thought it was interesting to see Jay Wright use this approach and molding a very succesful offense with it.

Just an observation.

From a spacing standpoint its similar. Other than that Wright teaches more concepts than sets with pattern or actions or landmarks. Although DDM gives you a lot of freedom there are still some set actions that must happen based off the previous action. The Fox, Monk team ran Driibble Drive the majority of possessions in the tournament.Cal like any good coach adjusts based on personnel. The title team was the best I've ever seen run it. It was no mistake AD and Bam got all those dunks those seasons. Next year if Wenyen comes back and if they play KJ some at the 4 or PJ develops a jumper I can see them using it some because to me Hagans is a perfect fit for it.

 

[Bluegrassking]

He changes templates.

Used to be two interchangeable guards, two interchangeable forwards, and a shot blocker. With a utility guy to rotate.

Then it's dribble drive with a lead guard, 3 forwards (one a bit wingy), and a shot blocker who might be forward 4.

Then maybe it's gimme two bigs, 2 points, and whoever the hell else shows up and we are going to run or pound it down low.

Been trending traditional of late despite talking "positionless" more.

 

[CatfanMike47]

Cal adjusts to his personnel more than running a system. That’s why most of his teams peak in March

 

[Mojocat_rivals48469]

It discusses when they lost sight of who they were when they brought in that destructive class that was highly ranked but they tanked. Talked about the importance of getting guys who want to be there and not as just a stop to the NBA.

Yep, which also points out how difficult it is to negotiate the road that Cal chooses to take. I read the other day that Nova had 5 McDonald's All Americans on that team, and they were 21-12, and 13-19 the next year. Can you imagine this place if we had 5 Micky D kids and a losing record!

 

[Raptureme]

Whatever the case is with Cal, he now seems to see the advantage of having multiple threats from the outside and is recruiting accordingly

 

[morgousky]

When Cal was at Memphis he was not able to get top bigs. Cousins was really his first great big that would have signed.

He did sign Lorenzen Wright but he never played.

Dorsey and was a 3 star and Dozier was a 4 on his best Memphis team.

Once he was able to recruit top big men evaluations lessened and he went at the higher rated players.

That simple.

 

[SilentsAreGolden]

I was expecting you to say using NBA rumors to get a big raise. Of course winning a second ship in 3 yrs should be enough.

 

[LXA_chop]

I think the OP hit the nail on the head when he mentioned youth as well. Cal talks about the team relying on him too much because of youth in every interview he does. I also believe a lot of you are correct when it comes down to coaching to his strengths (i.e. the players he gets), but that is out of necessity simply because he has to spend so much time teaching fundamental defense to kids that didn't need to play defense in HS that he doesn't have time to teach his kids to run a motion offense and be trusted to make the right decisions.

 

[KingOfBBN]

When Cal was at Memphis he was not able to get top bigs. Cousins was really his first great big that would have signed.

He did sign Lorenzen Wright but he never played.

Dorsey and was a 3 star and Dozier was a 4 on his best Memphis team.

Once he was able to recruit top big men evaluations lessened and he went at the higher rated players.

That simple.

I’d love to have a Joey Dorsey on every roster. That 2008 Memphis team was fun and they only had one first round pick on that roster.

 

[kb22stang]

When Cal was at Memphis he was not able to get top bigs. Cousins was really his first great big that would have signed.

He did sign Lorenzen Wright but he never played.

Dorsey and was a 3 star and Dozier was a 4 on his best Memphis team.

Once he was able to recruit top big men evaluations lessened and he went at the higher rated players.

That simple.

I wish he'd keep focused on top guards and wings and go back to recruiting the types of bigs he had at Memphis. Gs & Ws that can shoot and bouncey athletic bigs.

 

[EliteBlue]

I’d love to have a Joey Dorsey on every roster. That 2008 Memphis team was fun and they only had one first round pick on that roster.

That really was a fun team to watch. I wish they wouldn't have choked away the title game and gave Kansas one.

 

[*Fox2Monk*]

The words dribble drive motion gets thrown around every year. The fact is, we really haven't seen the dribble drive since Cal has been here at Kentucky. He has used it a few times, but as a coach myself, I noticed he usually runs an "elbow/horns" type of set, that usually leads to pick n roll or one guy coming off a screen (into a dribble handoff).

I ran across this video of Cal's practice at Memphis and it reminds me of the way Villanova runs their 4 out 1 in motion offense:


Villanova gives the players the freedom to make the decisions (back cut, drive, handoff, shoot, screen away) using principals of the motion. It seems like Calipari has adopted more of a set play type of coach over the years.

After looking over it, I am surprised how Cal has gone away from recruiting players that fit into this mold and a lot of focus on bigs. Maybe it's the youth in the teams now and not trusting their decision making process, but I thought it was interesting to see Jay Wright use this approach and molding a very succesful offense with it.

Just an observation.

He can't rely on freshman to make those reads and they can't shoot as well.

 

[crpoore]

Cal may want to start copying what Wright is doing.

 

[bucsrule8872]

With Hagans (likely reclassifying), Quickley, Johnson, and Herro coming in, I think we will see more DDMO.

I'd like to see Green and Gabriel back and a healthy Vanderbilt.

That would be a good core to run that offense with. Hagans penetrating. He can kick it out to Green, Quickley, Herro, or Johnson to drive or shoot. He can kick it to Gabriel at the 4 for the 3. Vanderbilt plays off the block, opposite ball side for putbacks and lobs.

Montgomery is another guy that can play the 4 or 5 in that system. Richards doesn't fit very well in that system, but Cal can run some of the more traditional sets when he is in the game.

Hagans, Quickley, Green, Herro, Johnson, Gabriel, Vanderbilt, and Montgomery give us a solid 8 to play in the DDMO. Throw in Richards for stretches when we need a true Center. That's a great 9 man rotation.

Starters

G Hagans
G Green
G Johnson
F Gabriel
F Vanderbilt

Reserves

G Quickley- starter minutes, reserve at the 1/2
G Herro- sub at the 2/3.
F Montgomery- starter minutes, reserve at the 4/5.
F Richards- reserve at the 5 (might start, but gets less minutes than Vanderbilt and Montgomery).

I would be good with the makeup of that team. My worry would be Vanderbilt staying healthy, but Montgomery gives us a little insurance there.

Got to get Gabriel and Green back, IMHO for experience and shooting. Will be much easier to run the DDMO with shooters. Gabriel at the 4 spot is the one thing we really couldn't live without in this system. Need a shooter at that "stretch 4" spot.

 

[paspower]

When Cal was at Memphis he was not able to get top bigs. Cousins was really his first great big that would have signed.

He did sign Lorenzen Wright but he never played.

Dorsey and was a 3 star and Dozier was a 4 on his best Memphis team.

Once he was able to recruit top big men evaluations lessened and he went at the higher rated players.

That simple.

Lorenzen Wright played on the 1995 Sweet 16 team - 6 years before Cal came to Memphis.

 

[morgousky]

Lorenzen Wright played on the 1995 Sweet 16 team - 6 years before Cal came to Memphis.

meant Kendrick Perkins. If I cared enough I'd change it. He was also in on Amare stoudamire. Point was he had issues getting top quality big men at Memphis. You can't recruit Memphis the way you can Kentucky. Do you deny that? I know a lot of Memphis fans, very delusional bunch for a program with one final four.

Cal told the story when he came to UK about having to borrow planes to recruit to Memphis :joy:

We can meet at Gibsons this week and discuss it. You can sit in Cals favorite chair and tell me all about middle school sets that Memphis will be running this year with your new middle school coach.

You ready to watch Wiseman suit up for The cats?

 

[paspower]

I’d love to have a Joey Dorsey on every roster. That 2008 Memphis team was fun and they only had one first round pick on that roster.

Tigers killed OU in Blake Griffin’s freshman year. Griffin was quoted as being “scared” of Dorsey after the game. As big and bad as Dorsey was, Antonio Anderson was the player that kept everyone in line that all the Memphis players were afraid of.

 

[morgousky]

Tigers killed OU in Blake Griffin’s freshman year. Griffin was quoted as being “scared” of Dorsey after the game. As big and bad as Dorsey was, Antonio Anderson was the player that kept everyone in line that all the Memphis players were afraid of.

That had more to do with the criminal records.

Dorsey - inciting riots after curfew....Washington Jr soliciting prostitution. Just the tip.

Memphis players always find trouble in blood city.

Which is why Wisemans mother won't allow him to play there.

 

[KingOfBBN]

That had more to do with the criminal records.

Dorsey - inciting riots after curfew....Washington Jr soliciting prostitution. Just the tip.

Memphis players always find trouble in blood city.

Which is why Wisemans mother won't allow him to play there.

Probably one of the biggest knocks on Cal decisions was offering Tyreke Evans after he was in a drive-by shooting.

 

[morgousky]

Probably one of the biggest knocks on Cal decisions was offering Tyreke Evans after he was in a drive-by shooting.

Cal had to do what he had to do at Memphis. He was not able to land quality players at every position. He had thuggy teams at UM, a lot like Self at Kansas. But it's not easy to recruit to Memphis. You basically have to settle for uncle T's "God son" and South 4th street bloods.

 

[Mojocat_rivals48469]

I think the OP hit the nail on the head when he mentioned youth as well. Cal talks about the team relying on him too much because of youth in every interview he does. I also believe a lot of you are correct when it comes down to coaching to his strengths (i.e. the players he gets), but that is out of necessity simply because he has to spend so much time teaching fundamental defense to kids that didn't need to play defense in HS that he doesn't have time to teach his kids to run a motion offense and be trusted to make the right decisions.

Good point. People forget, out of necessity he has to keep things simple. I suspect those that make the tired “he just rolls the balls out there” claim willfully ignore that part. Pitino, most obvious example, was at the extreme other end. He always said players didn’t typically understand how to play defense like he demanded until they were juniors. No wonder he couldn’t recruit highlily rated kids....

 

[Side_Note]

Once he was able to recruit top big men evaluations lessened and he went at the higher rated players.

That simple.

I agree with this, and I don't think this practice is just with big men.

I've often wondered how much "evaluating" Cal did with some of these top recruits.

Hami is a great example; no doubt he wowed and impressed as an athlete at the high school level. Probably dunked everything in sight and swatted shots into the 8th row. But how does that project at the college level where the kid is going to run into bigger, stronger, and freakier athletes? What will he rely on when he can't "out athlete" everyone? Can Cal really not determine this?

I think Cal quit actually evaluating players a long time ago and simply recruited on ratings, and I'm not sure this can be disputed.

Take Green and SGA for instance. Green started over SGA up until he got hurt. How? SGA is projected as a lottery pick. If Cal really watched them both, how did he determine that Green was better? Green started over SGA, so one can only assume Cal thought he was better. I don't think Cal ever really evaluated their game and how it projects at the college level.

I think he started Green over SGA because Green was a 5 star and SGA a 4 star. Otherwise, how the hell would you choose Green over SGA?

 

[Floornail]

I think Wright has his own formula.

 

[katwest]

Jay Wright is a good coach who gets good players and most stay 3 or 4 years. Most of the time experience beats talent, not all of the time just most. There are still good players who will stay in school and enjoy their time in college that will play in the NBA. Villanova always has good shooters an experienced players, that's why they are so tough every year.

 

[MunyonMustGo]

Jay Wright is a good coach who gets good players and most stay 3 or 4 years. Most of the time experience beats talent, not all of the time just most. There are still good players who will stay in school and enjoy their time in college that will play in the NBA. Villanova always has good shooters an experienced players, that's why they are so tough every year.

False, false, false 100% false. Most of the time TALENT wins. Not every game Kentucky has the talent edge and pretty much always have the least experience and Calipari is 271-63. Ok lets just look at the tournament since that's where the best teams with the experience and skill are Cal with lots of talent and almost always having the least experienced players at UK is 28-7. Both schools who have the most OAD players both won titles in the last 6 years. That's 2 v. 325 and both managed to get one. Now, when the talent is equal experience can be a factor, but only when the talent is similar. Every coach including Jay Wright will take a roster of talented young guys over average talented experienced guys. In that same time with all that experience Jay Wright is 16-6 in the tournament.