I get the fact he gives us great defense. But given he gives nothing else in the way of rebounding and offense - and lots of turnovers - is it a net benefit when he’s on the floor? I don’t know how to crunch the numbers to figure it out.
Jacob Young Question
- Thread starter RUSCFORMERLYRULOU
- Start date
It's essentially impossible for him to be good enough on defense to make up for how bad his offense has been. 74.1 ORtg has gotta be the worst in the Big Ten for anyone at 10+ minutes per game.
I don’t know what ORTG is but I agree.
I agree. However, in a tough conference game we need him ready to give us all he’s got on D. Despite his offensive woes, I do believe he can be a difference maker on a game by game basis.
Pike will have to keep Jacob focused on his one-fifth chop, to do his part and help us win. Meanwhile Jacob has to find it in himself, in a big game, to rise up to the challenge in those big moments, shut down his man, and let the TEAM flourish on the offensive end. When we absolutely need a stop, I want him in there.
Looked it up.
Jacob Young, Rutgers: 74.1
AJ Turner, Northwestern: 76.0
Tre Williams, Minnesota: 79.3
DaMonte Williams, Illinois: 78.0
Yvan Ouedrago, Nebraska: 81.6
Kipper Nichols, Illinois: 83.5
Makhi Mitchell, Maryland: 83.0
Rocket Watts, Michigan State: 82.5
Kyle Ahrens, Michigan State: 81.6
Bakari Evelyn, Iowa: 82.4
I won’t say which player it was but one guy on our team I can tell is getting quite frustrated with Jacob. In the first half, when Jacob hoisted an ill advised 3, he threw his hands up in disgust.
I don't care how good his defense is. He is totally out of control on offense.
If Young ever learns that passing should be his 1st option on offense he'll be a decent player for us. His quickness to drive drawing defenders and then kick it to open teammates would really help our offense flow. Alas he'd rather go one on three and throw some prayer at the basket. Kid just needs a little more we than me.
If it is the same person he needs to cool it. Can’t do that. I didn’t notice it today, but my son did. I noticed faces last game.
I wonder if we are talking about the same person.
He needs to sit until he figures out that this is a team game.
I think Pike knows that Young is a project to some extent. Above average ball handler with supreme confidence to go 1:1, good on the ball defender, and athletic. His development needs to be made between the ears and as a team ball player. I think it’ll come for Jacob with time.
I know now that layups with your left hand on the left sided isn't a thing any more....
Watching us in transition and seeing Jacob Young on the wing 5 feet away from the guy with the ball drives me crazy.....has this changed too, tell me being wide on the wing and waiting for the free throw line extension to make the 45 degree cut to the basket is still the way to do things.
Watching us in transition and seeing Jacob Young on the wing 5 feet away from the guy with the ball drives me crazy.....has this changed too, tell me being wide on the wing and waiting for the free throw line extension to make the 45 degree cut to the basket is still the way to do things.
Can’t stand watching Jacob on offense. It actually hurts. Enough already!
I would argue that he’s very quick (obviously) but not actually athletic. He regularly finishes his drives, when tightly defended, in a way I don’t recall seeing before at this level. He leans his upper body back away from the hoop, rather than leaning or moving forward, and his legs kick forward. If he were more athletic, specifically if he jumped better, he would take it to the hoop directly and challenge the defender. Or if he had better body control he could use his body to protect the ball when he drives. He doesn’t do either of these and that’s not going to change. I would be shocked if he becomes in any way effective on offense in the next 2 years. He should sit a lot more.
Last edited:
Ranking +/- Avg. thru 11 games(not included today)
1) Myles +9.9 2) Caleb +8.2 3) Geo +7.7
4) RHJ +7.0 5) Akwasi +6.7 6) Mathis +3.9
7) Mulcahy +2.9 8) Carter -0.8 9) Doucoure -1.0
10) Young -2.9 (-4.0 Offense +1.1 defense)
Myles was first by wide margin 8.1 to Doorson 2nd 4.9 last year too.
1) Myles +9.9 2) Caleb +8.2 3) Geo +7.7
4) RHJ +7.0 5) Akwasi +6.7 6) Mathis +3.9
7) Mulcahy +2.9 8) Carter -0.8 9) Doucoure -1.0
10) Young -2.9 (-4.0 Offense +1.1 defense)
Myles was first by wide margin 8.1 to Doorson 2nd 4.9 last year too.
At this point, it is fair to say that Jacob Young has naked pictures of Coach Pikiell canoodling with farm animals.
Was that player equally disgusted with everyone else who hoisted up a 3 and missed? The team was 1-9 from 3 today. We won this game easily due to D.
He’s shooting 13% from 3 and his shot looks even uglier than that. If he’s allowed to take them, then Myles Johnson might as well be hoisting them up also.
I saw him play more than a few times with Texas and didn’t think much of him. Now, I only wish he was as good as the player I saw with Texas. He definitely has regressed.
I saw him play more than a few times with Texas and didn’t think much of him. Now, I only wish he was as good as the player I saw with Texas. He definitely has regressed.
That’s the part that has me scratching my head. He wasn’t good at Texas, but certainly better than this. I wonder if he is being given too much reign on offense. At Texas it sounds like he was forced into a very specific role on offense. May have to do that here.
Seems Paul is always on the court with Jacob. Can’t be good for Paul’s +|-.
It's all mental with Jacob. That's why Coach is giving him such a long leash in these early games. Give him a chance to figure it out. He needs to start figuring it out soon though because there is definitely more on the line with these conference games coming up. I think he needs to work on a tear drop floater. (Far enough from the rim, but close enough to let go with one hand. He can have that look pretty often if he wanted it, but he hasn't found his go-to scoring move.)
You don’t just develop a floater midseason. That takes loads of practice in the offseason.
I think he gets too much credit for his defense too. He falls asleep more than most of our players.
Jacob Young’s value increases a ton when we play good teams. Against Lafayette all of our perimeter players can take someone off the dribble or stay in front of their man on the defensive end. That changes when the games get tougher.
Yes he is driving me absolutely crazy, but he must stay in the rotation. There will be a game (s) we don’t win without him.
Yes he is driving me absolutely crazy, but he must stay in the rotation. There will be a game (s) we don’t win without him.
Think that as time passes, Mulcahy will increasingly cut into Young's minutes. The Lafayette game may have been situational, but Young played 17 minutes compared to 25 for Mulcahy. Young shot 2-6 with a rebound, a steal and 4 TO's and 4 points. Against The Hall, he had 5 TO's. Mulcahy was 5-6, a rebound, 5 assists and 4 steals for 10 points.
Overall, Young is shooting 32% for the season, just 3 for 24 on 3's and a turnover about every seven minutes played. If you take away the 3's, he was 23 for 56, over 40%. Mulcahy has 10 turnovers, about one every 18 minutes. He seems to be finding his way. Shooting 45% for the season. We will need them both, but someone ought tell Young to not shoot 3's. Play D. This is not rocket science.
Overall, Young is shooting 32% for the season, just 3 for 24 on 3's and a turnover about every seven minutes played. If you take away the 3's, he was 23 for 56, over 40%. Mulcahy has 10 turnovers, about one every 18 minutes. He seems to be finding his way. Shooting 45% for the season. We will need them both, but someone ought tell Young to not shoot 3's. Play D. This is not rocket science.
I'm not a Young apologist, but this is simply not true. DVR the game and when RU is on D, don't watch the ball.....watch off the ball. What you will find is guys like Young and Matthis neutralizing the perimeter for much of the game against a Layfayette team that lives and dies from the arc.
He got beat on a backdoor cut for an easy basket in the first half against Lafayette, just one play but it was noticeable.
Stats cited by Scarlet Blind show Young at +1.1 on defense--but a whopping -4.0 on offense for a -2.9 +-. Mulcahy is + 2.9 overall. Certainly, +- stats don't tell the whole story, and lots can happen in garbage time, but they are telling. He, Carter and Doucore are the only guys in - figures for a 9-3 team. Carter and Doucore don't play much. Will Young, barring injuries, be a situational player to handle an opponent's guard that is hot?
Against Lafayette, you can live with the occasional backdoor cut if you are sealing off the perimeter. We held them to 1-15 from three point range over the first 30 min as we dug them a hole they couldn't get out of. By the time Jaworski hit his first at 9:51 left (which triggered a flurry to the finish where they shot 6/10), they were down 32 points.
The Avg. +/- through 11 games for each player when they are on the court and how much the score changes. Ex. You enter when the score is 12-12 and while you're on the court for 4 minutes the score becomes 20-14, you're a +6. Myles Johnson at +9.9, has averaged +10 every game for the first 11 games when he's on the court, the best on the team.
Are you sure these are actual + / - numbers and not numbers estimated based on stats?
https://www.basketball-reference.com/about/bpm.html
pretty sure it tries to use stats to guess at plus minus...
pretty sure it tries to use stats to guess at plus minus...
That's how it's calculated and that's why it should be taken with a huge grain of salt. Tough to evaluate an individual player when he is one of five. You could have a player play lousy individually and still have a + rating.
Real + / - has some relevance. 2 or 3 grains of pink Himalayan salt though