Is 6 wins enough?

[OG Goat Holder]

you said that you're not talking about moral victories and then gave the textbook definition of moral victories. You being you.

Aww man, you didn't give me the frown emoji. I'm hurt.

From wikipedia:
A moral victory occurs when a person, team, army or other group loses a confrontation, and yet achieves some other moral gain. This gain might be unrelated to the confrontation in question, and the gain is often considerably less than what would have been accomplished if an actual victory had been achieved.

I'm not describing a moral gain you wannabe downvoting c0cksucker. I'm evaluating a coach's impact on a program by objectively looking at who we play vs. how we played against him. Nothing emotional there.

Get back in your hole.

 

[The Peeper]

How we lose some games is important as well. If you're simply non-competive in the losses then it's a red flag.

If "find a way to lose" like we did a few times last year and you feel coaching played a part, that has to be taken into consideration.

If you lose two games because their kicker kicks a 57 ard FG as time goes out or you miss a couple of 35 yard game winner attempts, then there is more grace.

If he goes 2-10 or 5-8 again or for me even just 6-6, it doesn't matter how he loses, he's got to go. You can't continue to let him sleepwalk through the years paying him $4.35Million for the results we're getting. AND, then you've got to hold Selmon's feet to the fire to find the legitimate replacement w/ his $1.25Million salary, that's his job!

 

[MagnoliaHunter]

Aww man, you didn't give me the frown emoji. I'm hurt.

From wikipedia:
A moral victory occurs when a person, team, army or other group loses a confrontation, and yet achieves some other moral gain. This gain might be unrelated to the confrontation in question, and the gain is often considerably less than what would have been accomplished if an actual victory had been achieved.

I'm not describing a moral gain you wannabe downvoting c0cksucker. I'm evaluating a coach's impact on a program by objectively looking at who we play vs. how we played against him. Nothing emotional there.

Get back in your hole.

oh no. I have offended goat-17er and he insulted me. LOL. what a loser. and yes what you posted is a moral victory. dubmass.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Rumor is he’s been told win at least 7 or you’re out.

I call bullsh*t on that rumor.

I think @Bulldawg77 started that one, or whatever paid board hero give him his info

Obviously if this is a leak from the AD, just more reasons Sappy Salmun needs to pack his bags and hit the road

 

[cadawg26]

Rumor is he’s been told win at least 7 or you’re out.

That’s what I’ve heard as well

 

[MSUDC11-2.0]

I would say it depends on how we get there at 6-6.

For example, last year we thought we had a brutal schedule but then Florida ended up sucking and Texas and Tennessee were completely beatable on our home field…. We really needed to win 1-2 of those games for fan morale reasons and lost all 3.

If we get to 6, that probably means we won at least 2-3 home SEC games, so that will help some. But I think he needs some good showings against the big boys, either close losses or an upset. And he can’t get run out of the building in Oxford on Black Friday. Kiffin owned us, well Kiffin is gone now and if we are supposedly improving, that game needs to get back to being a toss up like it was 2022 and earlier.

 

[DoggieDaddy13]

6 wins will be enough for me as a fan - depending on how competitive we look in those 6 losses - mainly because my expectations are pretty low as an MSU football fan.

But 6 wins should not be enough for Lebby to remain as Coach - unless the 6 teams we lose to all end up in the playoffs.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

I would say it depends on how we get there at 6-6.

For example, last year we thought we had a brutal schedule but then Florida ended up sucking and Texas and Tennessee were completely beatable on our home field…. We really needed to win 1-2 of those games for fan morale reasons and lost all 3.

If we get to 6, that probably means we won at least 2-3 home SEC games, so that will help some. But I think he needs some good showings against the big boys, either close losses or an upset. And he can’t get run out of the building in Oxford on Black Friday. Kiffin owned us, well Kiffin is gone now and if we are supposedly improving, that game needs to get back to being a toss up like it was 2022 and earlier.

You get it.

 

[MSUDC11-2.0]

I think there are two specific results that would 100% save his bacon at 6-6, and that is either he beats Bama in Week 5 or he wins the Egg.

 

[GloryDawg]

6 with win over OLe Miss or Bama he is safe.

 

[gtowndawg]

Bottom line, 6 wins and he keeps his job. If he does that and wins a bowl looking good, I'm looking forward to the next season.

 

[FormerBully]

Rumor is he’s been told win at least 7 or you’re out.

I was also told the first 4 games will make or break Lebby. If he is 2-2 going into the next four games, he will not make it to the end.

 

[lazlow]

I don't think we would move on from Lebby if we win 6 this season but does that give you the warm and fuzzies going into year 4 of a Lebby regime.

Regardless of how we finish, the question needs to be "do we have a better coaching option". If yes, then take the option.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

I was also told the first 4 games will make or break Lebby. If he is 2-2 going into the next four games, he will not make it to the end.

If he goes 2-2 it’s not going to be pretty because after that it’s murderers row.

 

[DoggieDaddy13]

 

[aTotal360]

No. 7 wins. Any less tells me he can't elevate the program. I don't expect us to compete for SEC championships any time soon. But I do want us to compete in the middle of the conference. Not just with the bottom 1/3.

If Lebby can't beat a down Auburn, Vandy, and SC, and upset a Missouri...then he never will.

 

[L4Dawg]

I don't think we would move on from Lebby if we win 6 this season but does that give you the warm and fuzzies going into year 4 of a Lebby regime.

Yes, because it will take a bloody miracle to get anywhere near that.

 

[golferdog]

I’m thinking 8…..loses that is. So 6 wins gives him another year.

I'm hoping they can find a way to win 6. That would be a pretty good year in my opinion. 7 would be outstanding. I don't think there is any way they fire him at 6 wins.

 

[RocketDawg]

I don't think we would move on from Lebby if we win 6 this season but does that give you the warm and fuzzies going into year 4 of a Lebby regime.

6 would mean, most likely, one B1G win, and 2 SEC wins, along with 3 cupcakes. Given our schedule, 6 would be a pretty good season, given what we've had under Lebby. 5 might be enough, if the one SEC win was OM since about half the fanbase considers that game to trump just about anything else.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

I think there are two specific results that would 100% save his bacon at 6-6, and that is either he beats Bama in Week 5 or he wins the Egg.

We will keep him at 3-9 if he does one of those two. My evidence? Sylvester H. Croominator. 3-8 in 2025 for second year, but we beat Ole Miss so all is good. 3-8 in 2006 for a third year, beat Bama, so fans got the warm and fuzzies. That's just how our fanbase rolls.

Of course, the likelihood of either of those happening is low, because they aren't coached by younger, rip-shirt-off-Brent-Shayfuh Eddie O or a lameduck Mike Shula.

Exhibit B is 100% change in fanbase attitude after Sand Pounder beats Ole Miss after the Piss and Miss. Even Keenum was all up in the locker room getting emotional.

 

[POTUS]

I think there are two specific results that would 100% save his bacon at 6-6, and that is either he beats Bama in Week 5 or he wins the Egg.

If he beats Bama and loses every other game, not only can he stay, but he should get a statue. Our last victory over Bama can vote in the elections this year.

 

[Trojanbulldog19]

Of course 6 wins is enough. 5 might be. Honestly, if he wins 6, even I say you can't fire him. I wouldn't exactly have the warm fuzzies, but I'd definitely say it's better to keep him than take our chances on a new hire. Unless we just have Dan Mullen or another proven good coach locked down ready to come here.

The last part is key, he wins 6, why would you fire him unless you had a pretty damn good sure thing. Hiring unproven guys is how we got here.

 

[Bulldawg77]

I think @Bulldawg77 started that one, or whatever paid board hero give him his info

Obviously if this is a leak from the AD, just more reasons Sappy Salmun needs to pack his bags and hit the road

I didn’t make the rumor up. It’s out there on multiple reports. I posted what I knew months ago and it hasn’t changed. It’s 7 and your back if it’s 6 with an egg win it gets complicated. If if 6 and another L in egg he’s for sure gone.

 

[MSUDC11-2.0]

We will keep him at 3-9 if he does one of those two. My evidence? Sylvester H. Croominator. 3-8 in 2025 for second year, but we beat Ole Miss so all is good. 3-8 in 2006 for a third year, beat Bama, so fans got the warm and fuzzies. That's just how our fanbase rolls.

Of course, the likelihood of either of those happening is low, because they aren't coached by younger, rip-shirt-off-Brent-Shayfuh Eddie O or a lameduck Mike Shula.

Exhibit B is 100% change in fanbase attitude after Sand Pounder beats Ole Miss after the Piss and Miss. Even Keenum was all up in the locker room getting emotional.

We probably won’t beat Bama but I don’t think it’s nearly the mountain to climb that it was 3-4 years ago. Deboer era Bama has some truly terrible losses on its ledger. One week they’ll look really good and then the next week they’ll lose to Vandy or a 5-7 ACC team.

 

[Called3rdstrikedawg]

What would a bland 6-6 do for recruiting? Currently State is 17th out of 16 SEC teams in recruiting. Would 6 wins with a possibility of losing a bowl game to go under .500 again. I just don’t think that is a good enough reason to keep him.

on the other hand, winning 6 and possibly 7 with a bowl win, might mean it is better to keep him knowing you are going to have to spend $10 mil or more for a P4 sitting coach and probably $7-8 mil for a sitting G6 coach. State CANNOT go the coordinator or Assistant Coach route again.

the bug a boo in all this keeping him at 6 wins: 2027 schedule!

what happens if South Carolina, Missouri and Vandy get replaced with Georgia, Florida, and A&M, and State keeps Texas, Oklahoma, Alabama, Auburn, LSU, and Ole Miss? So we keep a guy who probably goes 6-7 and has to face that schedule in year 4, likely regressing and setting State another year behind on the road to recovery.

 

[Duggar Hall Desk]

We will keep him at 3-9 if he does one of those two. My evidence? Sylvester H. Croominator. 3-8 in 2025 for second year, but we beat Ole Miss so all is good. 3-8 in 2006 for a third year, beat Bama, so fans got the warm and fuzzies. That's just how our fanbase rolls.

I would say that's how the fanbase rolled before Mullen. I don't think beating Ole Miss and/or Bama salvages a 3-win season in anyone's eyes anymore.

 

[Duggar Hall Desk]

what happens if South Carolina, Missouri and Vandy get replaced with Georgia, Florida, and A&M, and State keeps Texas, Oklahoma, Alabama, Auburn, LSU, and Ole Miss? So we keep a guy who probably goes 6-7 and has to face that schedule in year 4, likely regressing and setting State another year behind on the road to recovery.

Conversely, would you want to go out and try to hire a brand new coach if we're staring at that schedule in the 2027 season? I'd keep the 6-7 guy and let him deal with that gauntlet.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

I didn’t make the rumor up. It’s out there on multiple reports. I posted what I knew months ago and it hasn’t changed. It’s 7 and your back if it’s 6 with an egg win it gets complicated. If if 6 and another L in egg he’s for sure gone.

Salmon has to go

 

[golferdog]

With the state of the MSU football program 6-6, 7-5 could be our record for the next few years. Anyone thinking it's going to be 8-4 or 9-3 is wishful thinking. Since we started playing 10 game seasons in 1933, MSU has won 8 games or more only 19 times in 93 seasons, or 20% of the time. It's just not realistic to win that many games here, especially in this league.

We have a new head coach learning on the job. He has a good offense that most enjoy watching. We aren't winning the SEC any time soon, maybe ever again, so a winning season is the most we can hope for. Until more effort is put into the program, this is what we are.

 

[The Cooterpoot]

It's 7 or leave but could see 6 with an EB win being enough. Win 6 with a couple big wins & no bad losses could talk me into keeping him maybe

 

[OG Goat Holder]

I would say that's how the fanbase rolled before Mullen. I don't think beating Ole Miss and/or Bama salvages a 3-win season in anyone's eyes anymore.

Did you miss the part about Sand Pounder? Until the 60+ generation buys out, it's all about Ole Miss primarily and Bama secondarily.

 

[Theconnormead]

I don't think we would move on from Lebby if we win 6 this season but does that give you the warm and fuzzies going into year 4 of a Lebby regime.

I don't like paying unproven head coaches what we're paying them, but I understand why it happens.

I'm not the biggest Lebby fan. My biggest concern is that I don't think he's strong enough on the mental side of the game.

That said, before we fire him, we need to ask ourselves a few honest questions: How serious are we about NIL? Can we realistically compete in this environment? And what are our expectations?

If you fire Lebby and replace him with someone making even more money, but only improve by a game or two, is it really worth it? I don't want to throw good money after a bad investment.

Or we hire someone of similar caliber, keep NIL at the same level, and end up right back where we started? At some point, we have to decide whether the problem is the coach, the resources, or simply the reality of competing in today's college football landscape.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

No. 7 wins. Any less tells me he can't elevate the program. I don't expect us to compete for SEC championships any time soon. But I do want us to compete in the middle of the conference. Not just with the bottom 1/3.

If Lebby can't beat a down Auburn, Vandy, and SC, and upset a Missouri...then he never will.

Exactly.

If six wins and one of them being over Ole Miss weren’t enough for Joe Moorhead… **

 

[Bulldawg77]

Salmon has to go

You are the only person that has this take. Shows your lack of understanding what he walked into what he has done and where he wants this athletic department to go.

 

[RiverCityDawg]

If we win 6 and one of those is the egg bowl, and we look competently coached in the losses there's absolutely no way he's fired.

Lose to ole miss badly, blow games we had in hand (especially at home), and the schedule ends up being easier than originally thought, it could be questionable with 6 wins. I still would highly doubt he's fired.

 

[aTotal360]

You are the only person that has this take. Shows your lack of understanding what he walked into what he has done and where he wants this athletic department to go.

He's not alone. I'm apathetic toward him. He's covered his bases, but hasn't elevated the program. My observation is he's exactly who we hired. A fundraiser. Nothing more, nothing less. I'm not convinced he's a well-rounded athletic director. Not yet anyway.

Yes, money makes the world go round. So that is a HUGE plus for him, but it's not translating to the field.

If we continue to be in the bottom 1/3 in football and basketball, are you ok with that?

 

[Maroon Eagle]

He's not alone. I'm apathetic toward him. He's covered his bases, but hasn't elevated the program. My observation is he's exactly who we hired. A fundraiser. Nothing more, nothing less. I'm not convinced he's a well-rounded athletic director. Not yet anyway.

Agreed.

If he were well-rounded, Oklahoma would have hired him.

 

[Called3rdstrikedawg]

Why did Auburn want Cohen? What did they see that we couldn’t see?

Why did Florida want Loafers?

Athletics Directors are supposed to be top notch Managers . They hire guys and sometimes gals that get paid way more than they do. It is definitely a fundraising job. But the Institution has to have benefactors who are extremely wealthy and love to give back. State is never going to be successful depending on rank and file fans, friends and alumni who earn under $100k per year in today’s economy. The $100 per month donors are always needed but they aren’t going to keep the Boat afloat!

The Duffs are MSU grads but they aren’t loyal to the Athletics department. They are giving to multiple charities and they give some to all 3 universities.

The family of 4 has been priced out of attending games. That hurts more than people realize because what happens to those kids who grow up not loving to attend games at State? Some of them may grow up to be multi- millionaires and never give a dime of support.

when I was young all of my family were Ole Miss fans. Never attended college. Never set foot on campus. To them, State was like Southern Miss. Just another school in the State that didn’t play football.

I wanted to go to State so I did. I loved it. I still love it. But spent my life in retail and wholesale sales. That ain’t buying football player money.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

My observation is he's exactly who we hired. A fundraiser. Nothing more, nothing less.

100%. Fundraising with no plan. And it's on Keenum, it's what he wanted.

Why did Auburn want Cohen? What did they see that we couldn’t see?

It was a bad hire. The only program that Cohen possibly could have worked at was MSU, because we're unique and he understood that uniqueness. But he had to get the hires right, that was his job, that's why he was hired because he was involved in getting Mullen here. The idea was get the right coaches, and the rest takes care of itself. He got basketball and baseball right, and a lot of the smaller sports. He overthought football though, wanted to go with the pass-first approach, which was a good overall plan......but it should have happened AFTER 2018. Hard to come back from that, and he eventually got sideways with folks. And we all know he hasn't been good at Auburn.

The guy is a baseball coach, bottom line. He's got to live with that I suppose, operating out of your proper lane.

 

[Bulldawg77]

Why did Auburn want Cohen? What did they see that we couldn’t see?

Why did Florida want Loafers?

Athletics Directors are supposed to be top notch Managers . They hire guys and sometimes gals that get paid way more than they do. It is definitely a fundraising job. But the Institution has to have benefactors who are extremely wealthy and love to give back. State is never going to be successful depending on rank and file fans, friends and alumni who earn under $100k per year in today’s economy. The $100 per month donors are always needed but they aren’t going to keep the Boat afloat!

The Duffs are MSU grads but they aren’t loyal to the Athletics department. They are giving to multiple charities and they give some to all 3 universities.

The family of 4 has been priced out of attending games. That hurts more than people realize because what happens to those kids who grow up not loving to attend games at State? Some of them may grow up to be multi- millionaires and never give a dime of support.

when I was young all of my family were Ole Miss fans. Never attended college. Never set foot on campus. To them, State was like Southern Miss. Just another school in the State that didn’t play football.

I wanted to go to State so I did. I loved it. I still love it. But spent my life in retail and wholesale sales. That ain’t buying football player money.

Neither Duffs or thei father attended MSU