Have more players improved or not improved?

aTotal360

Heisman
Nov 12, 2009
22,665
16,679
113
Seems like there was a lot of hope that some guys would "take that next step" and very few have. I don't think it's fair to say some have gotten worse, but you can make that argument in some cases. With all the WRs it's hard to be fair, but many of them have gotten chances and simply haven't done much with the opportunity.

Has Improved:
AJ Jefferson
Nick James
Fred Ross
Brandon Holloway
Brandon Bryant

Has Not Improved (this does not mean "gotten worse", but it can in some instances):
Chris Jones
Ashton Shumpert
Taveze Calhoun
Tolando Cleveland
Nelson Adams
Beni Brown
Zach Jackson
Rufus Warren
Justin Senior
Kivon Coman
Dak Prescott
Derunnya Wilson
Fred Brown

Agree or disagree?
 

dawgstudent

Heisman
Apr 15, 2003
40,742
22,993
113
I think it just varies and is not necessarily a sign of our player development. Some players just have a ceiling and reach it earlier whereas others maybe didn't put in the effort in the beginning but towards the end of their career - they really started to put it together (i.e. Preston Smith).
 

aTotal360

Heisman
Nov 12, 2009
22,665
16,679
113
The star ranking system would certainly bear that out more times than not.
 
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thf24

Redshirt
Jan 28, 2011
1,334
3
38
What's your time frame here? I'd argue that Beni and Taveze are already pretty damn good and made their improvements earlier in their careers. I'd also argue that about half of your second list have improved, just not to the degree that we were hoping/expecting.
 

engie

Sophomore
May 29, 2011
10,764
106
63
Personally I don't expect big jumps in years 4 and 5. Improvements at that point are rare. How quickly guys improve in years 1-3 seems somewhat connected to game PT for us as well. That's why I would rather play the young guys if there is no visible drop off from the older guys even if that equates to a few more busted plays
 

57stratdawg

Heisman
Dec 1, 2004
148,782
24,668
113
I think Prescott has improved. I don't think there is anyway the 2014 version of Dak could run the 2015 offense.
 

57stratdawg

Heisman
Dec 1, 2004
148,782
24,668
113
Do I get the NFL RB and senior/experienced OL back?

It's probably a chicken/egg debate. Did we change the offense to fit the returning personnel or did the returning personnel cause us to switch the offense?
 

TheStateUofMS

All-Conference
Dec 26, 2009
10,500
2,503
113
I disagree with most. Had this convo with a buddy. A handful of guys havnen't

Seems like there was a lot of hope that some guys would "take that next step" and very few have. I don't think it's fair to say some have gotten worse, but you can make that argument in some cases. With all the WRs it's hard to be fair, but many of them have gotten chances and simply haven't done much with the opportunity.

Has Improved:
AJ Jefferson-Yes
Nick James-Biggest
Fred Ross-Yes
Brandon Holloway-Yes, alot
Brandon Bryant-RS FR but talented and good player, really excited about him

Has Not Improved (this does not mean "gotten worse", but it can in some instances):
Chris Jones-had one bad game, has improved overall
Ashton Shumpert-no
Taveze Calhoun-yes, I don't see him getting picked on
Tolando Cleveland-yes
Nelson Adams-yes
Beni Brown-no
Zach Jackson-no
Rufus Warren-no
Justin Senior-no
Kivon Coman-no
Dak Prescott-YES, a lot!
Derunnya Wilson-no
Fred Brown-yes

Agree or disagree?

Improved which is killing us. This is why I think we should play talent over "trust."
 

johnson86-1

All-American
Aug 22, 2012
15,275
5,813
113
Seems like there was a lot of hope that some guys would "take that next step" and very few have. I don't think it's fair to say some have gotten worse, but you can make that argument in some cases. With all the WRs it's hard to be fair, but many of them have gotten chances and simply haven't done much with the opportunity.

Has Improved:
AJ Jefferson
Nick James [late bloomer]
Fred Ross [To me he made a jump last year; he continued to improve but a lot of it is just stepping into a new, more important role in the offense]
Brandon Holloway [Guy has continually improved, and made a jump this year, but that makes sense as he had a lot to learn]
Brandon Bryant [RS freshman; you would expect his learning curve to be steep]

Has Not Improved (this does not mean "gotten worse", but it can in some instances):
Chris Jones [can't argue with this; maybe our scheme results in what he does not being as visible?]
Ashton Shumpert [he's just not a good runner; looks to me like he's not a natural]
Taveze Calhoun [he's been in the system a long time and gotten lots of playing time; I wouldn't expect a big improvement at this point; he's doing as well as I expected]
Tolando Cleveland [haven't paid attention to him, but we certainly needed him to improve this year]
Nelson Adams [haven't paid attention to him, but we certainly needed him to improve this year]
Beni Brown [Beni is a smart player that picked up the scheme early; he's also gotten lots of playing time; not surprised he hasn't made a jump]
Zach Jackson [seems like he's constantly been asked to do things he's not capable of the last two years]
Rufus Warren [no doubt hsi play has been disappointing, but I don't think it's surprising that somebody that has changed positions is struggling; granted TE to OT is probably not as big of a change as others, but he's still a first year player in a lot of ways]
Justin Senior [would have liked to see him continue to progress, but he's been in the system a while; OL is the one position where it's more reasonable to expect continued small jumps from the 3rd to 4th and 4th to 5th years in the program].
Kivon Coman [Was hoping he would make a jump after taking some lumps last year. Doesn't appear to have happened; he may just not be a football player, as his measurables seem to be good]
Dak Prescott [He's gotten much better at the things he worked on; only question is whether his running/scrambling has gotten worse because he's thinking about progrsesions or because of the players around him]
Derunnya Wilson [I think this is a result of us just not taking an approach where we focus on him but instead being willing to go to Ross if D's choose to give help on WIlson]
Fred Brown [He seems like Morrow to me. Steady improvement each year, even if he didn't have as far to go originally]

Agree or disagree?

I would agree we didn't have people step up that needed to step up. We needed a RB to step up. We needed Warren to be good. We needed Coman to improve and for Bryant, Peters, and McLaurin to be ready to contribute from the get go. We needed Richie to be able to take full time duties over from McKinney. We needed AJ and Brown to replace preston smith's production. Basically AJ has performed, Richie, Bryant, Peters, and McLaurin I think are going to get where we need them to be, they just are half a season behind where we need them to be. Then we have more or less struck out at RB and OT.

The only thing that's really shocking and that I blame the coaches for is sucking so bad at RB. It's the easiest position on the team for us to not suck at. Crazy to me that we are so bad there.
 

Digging dog

Sophomore
Aug 22, 2012
3,503
134
63
Been a nice suprise to watch N. James this year. Knowing that his attitude and ethic appeared to be terrible when he arrived. I think most thought he would leave with Quay.
He seems to be having fun this year.
 

aTotal360

Heisman
Nov 12, 2009
22,665
16,679
113
Secondly, he's missed 3 back breaking throws to wide open receivers. 2 pt conversion in the LSU game, Shump for the first down against ATM, and Myles against ATM.
 

kired

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2008
7,187
2,633
113
Not sure you can include Rufus Warren on this list - he never really played last year, so what do we compare him too? I guess if you're comparing him to Clausell it's not an improvement.

Zach Jackson was a major weakness last year. He's not what we want him to be (Matt Wells), but I think he's slightly improved over last year.

For a few you didn't mention:

Richie Brown - he's on pace to end up with similar stats to Chris White in 2010 (I know it's hard to compare LBs based on stats alone... but he has potential to have a very good year).

Gus Walley is one I never dreamed would become as big a part of our offense as he has. He's picked up right where Malcolm Johnson left off, at least in terms of receiving.

I'm probably most disappointed in some of our DL --- Ryan Brown, Nelson Adams. Those were two guys I was hoping we'd see take that next step, and I don't think they have. Brown seems to be just a step slow and ends up barely missing out on making huge TFL type plays.
 

aTotal360

Heisman
Nov 12, 2009
22,665
16,679
113
The only reason I had Warren on their was because many of premium writers said he improved a lot since the Spring game. That wouldn't take much though.
 

00Dawg

Senior
Nov 10, 2009
3,353
620
93
I'm not sure I can blame him for the Shump one versus TAMU....if Ashton rotates correctly, that pass helps route his momentum further upfield and increases the yardage gained.
 

horshack.sixpack

All-American
Oct 30, 2012
12,424
9,930
113
Secondly, he's missed 3 back breaking throws to wide open receivers. 2 pt conversion in the LSU game, Shump for the first down against ATM, and Myles against ATM.
Do we expect any QB to be perfect? There are thousands of pairs of eyes watching every play plus multiple cameras,etc. and Dak has exactly one pair of eyes to keep up with everyone on the field.

It is always disappointing to see game changing plays that could've been made but I think it's a little much to expect him to be perfect. Our QB position is in the best shape ever.
 

aTotal360

Heisman
Nov 12, 2009
22,665
16,679
113
Question was...has he gotten better since last year? No one is debating whether he is good or not.
 
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horshack.sixpack

All-American
Oct 30, 2012
12,424
9,930
113
Question was...has he gotten better since last year? No one is debating whether he is good or not.

Yes. 65.3 completion % up from 61.6 last season. rushing average is 4.5/carry about the same as his 4.7/carry from a year ago and he is spy'ed more often now because he is a known running threat and our offense with him in the game is better understood by opponents. He has no receiving yards this year, so there's that.
 

NCDawg.sixpack

Redshirt
Aug 23, 2012
1,125
1
38
I think AJ Jefferson, Fred Ross, Nick James, and Gus Walley are our most improved players. I don't see a whole lot of improvement in the rest.
 

BertleTheTurtle

Freshman
Nov 4, 2013
317
56
28
Dak has improved as a passer tremendously. To point out 2-3 missed throws a game isn't fair. He easily missed 6-8 in any game last year. The difference was, we had a running game last year to pick up some of that slack and of which defenses had to scheme for, in addition to Dak running. Not to mention the OL which was light years better than what we have this year. Dak is quite literally our only run threat at this point and defenses scheme for it. There is a spy on Dak nearly every offensive snap. The runs just aren't there for him, so he's doing what you expect a 5th yr QB to do, sit and take what the defense gives him. And to be fair, this year for whatever reason, our WRs are good for 3-4 blatant drops a game. Dak has made good decisions all year and continues to take care of the ball, much better than he ever did a year ago. The kid can't be expected to run it 20 times a game and throw another 40 times without another threat at RB.
 
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