Gary Waters in the news

[BigEastPhil]

Per Rothstein, Gary Waters was appointed by the NCAA to be a commissioner for the College Basketball Academy Sites for the Midwest later this month. Other appointees are Al Skinner, Tim Miles and Steve Lavin in other geographical regions. I don’t know exactly what this is.

 

[Sideline20]

https://www.ncaa.com/collegebasketballacademy

 

[Mr_Twister]

I’m guessing that Kevin Bannon and Mike Rice and Fred Hill Jr. were not under consideration for this golden parachute/soft landing assignment.

 

[kcg88]

Cleveland State basically just had a mutiny under the coach who came in after Gary Waters. So that's two programs that should at least respect the stability he was able to bring.

 

[RUBigFrank]

Losing Gary at RU was a big mistake

 

[ajwsc1987]

Losing Gary at RU was a big mistake

EDIT: my mistake I thought he was fired. Did he walk on his own or was he forced to resign?

 

[MADHAT1]

EDIT: my mistake I thought he was fired. Did he walk on his own or was he forced to resign?

forced to resign after a rumored Mulcahy'attempt to fire him failed.

>Snowgate
In the summer of 2005, Fred Hill was hired away from Villanova to be Gary Waters' lead recruiting assistant, and-rumors said-head coach in waiting. It was a move that was mostly celebrated by the Rutgers community, and appeared to be a move that would help recruiting going forward. This was the season of Quincy Douby and Rutgers kept flirting with being a bubble team. Douby was incredible and the team was over .500. Late in the season, head coach Gary Waters was invited back to his former school, Kent State, to be inducted into their athletic Hall of Fame. He decided to go, and if memory serves me, he was given permission to go by then Athletic Director Bob Mulcahy, despite the fact that Rutgers had a big game against Marquette the next day. Waters would go to the induction and fly by to New Jersey in time for the game.

And then a blizzard hit.

Airports were closed and Waters couldn't make it back. Fred Hill was the head coach for the game, an impressive one that Rutgers won 91-84. But the head coach had missed a game. And it incensed the fans. Three days later, in a game against St. John's the student section unfurled a Fire Gary Waters banner. The team never imploded, but rumors of Waters' firing was the storyline. Gary Waters was bought out after an NIT appearance, which led to Fred Hill being hired without a national search.

A small thing--a snow storm--led to this firing.<
https://www.onthebanks.com/2015/8/29/9224641/rutgers-football-a-history-of-scandal-at-rutgers

 

[RUinFla]

Madhat. Mulcahy brought in FHJ to be a stoolie. To report stuff on Waters to Mulcahy as a pretext for firing him. After RU's run to the NIT finals, and the huge publicity surrounding RU and its fans at MSG, there were rumors of a mid western school wanting to sign GW. Mulcahy panicked and signed Waters to an extension. Then got buyer's remorse and wanted out of the contract without paying GW. So he hired Fred Hill as coach-in-waiting to secretly gather info on his boss to support firing for cause. Mulcahy was--what he was. FHJ turned out to be a bad coach and a bad person. It happens. Gary is 68 now, and fully deserves a soft landing.
TL

 

[DHajekRC84]

Good for Gary. Classy Guy thru it all.

 

[MADHAT1]

Madhat. Mulcahy brought in FHJ to be a stoolie. To report stuff on Waters to Mulcahy as a pretext for firing him. After RU's run to the NIT finals, and the huge publicity surrounding RU and its fans at MSG, there were rumors of a mid western school wanting to sign GW. Mulcahy panicked and signed Waters to an extension. Then got buyer's remorse and wanted out of the contract without paying GW. So he hired Fred Hill as coach-in-waiting to secretly gather info on his boss to support firing for cause. Mulcahy was--what he was. FHJ turned out to be a bad coach and a bad person. It happens. Gary is 68 now, and fully deserves a soft landing.
TL

When Freddie was hired, I think most RU MBB fans thought Gary would be pushed out..
No matter how we look at Waters leaving, the day Junior was hired GW's days were numbered.
Freddie was supposedly being looked at by Seton Hall and you can bet Mulcahy promised him the job because of Freddie being considered a top recruiter.
As for spy, can't say if he was or wasn't, but will say coach in waiting is accurate in my book.

I always wondered if Freddie would have stayed an assistant to Waters how RU would have done.
Between Waters' coaching and Hill's recruiting I believe it would have been a very good program.

 

[ScarletDave]

I’ll never forget the Garden state classic last time at the RAC when SHU was #15 and we knocked them off, Fred Hill was an assistant on SHU and as he was walking off the court surrounded by students storming the court me and a bunch of other students were yelling at him like “welcome back to the real jersey school” or something like that and he flipped us off as he walked out to the locker room. Good times

 

[Seton75]

Losing Gary at RU was a big mistake

Imo Gary had broken into the local recruiting scene and it was a big mistake to let him go. You ditch him for fred, we ditch orr for f'ing gonzo...2 geniuses

 

[Plum Street]

Madhat. Mulcahy brought in FHJ to be a stoolie. To report stuff on Waters to Mulcahy as a pretext for firing him. After RU's run to the NIT finals, and the huge publicity surrounding RU and its fans at MSG, there were rumors of a mid western school wanting to sign GW. Mulcahy panicked and signed Waters to an extension. Then got buyer's remorse and wanted out of the contract without paying GW. So he hired Fred Hill as coach-in-waiting to secretly gather info on his boss to support firing for cause. Mulcahy was--what he was. FHJ turned out to be a bad coach and a bad person. It happens. Gary is 68 now, and fully deserves a soft landing.
TL

Just not true. Gary wanted hill on staff according to all reports . I could not find one news article saying otherwise. I don’t think the media stunk that much

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Losing Gary at RU was a big mistake

Then we wouldn't have had Fred Hill Junior

 

[Seton75]

Just not true. Gary wanted hill on staff according to all reports . I could not find one news article saying otherwise. I don’t think the media stunk that much

The media knew about the nude free throw shooting and no one reported it till The Maven started talking it up on redman.com. Writers know alot more than they write but hold back for various reasons. I dont write this to imply you are wrong, just to say the media knows alot they dont tell us.

 

[Lawboy]

Gary was given Hill. The staff he had in his final year was Jim Carr and Larry Semplare and Fearless Fred. All three good recruiters. Gary had a falling out with Mulcahy before the much criticized trip to Cleveland and his fate had been sealed long before the snow storm. Some things just are not worth rehashing. Gary would have won here and elevated the program. His firing had nothing to do with Fred. Mulcahy made several bad choices for coaches but Gary was not one of them. His name was given to Mulcahy by the late Abe Suydam as were Belein, Martelli and the former Temple head coach. Mulcahy did not use the resource of a search firm but he used the grandfather of Rutgers Hoops and a good friend, Abe Suydam. I never write on sites but this crew is really off base on this topic.

 

[BIGTENITCH]

Gary was given Hill. The staff he had in his final year was Jim Carr and Larry Semplare and Fearless Fred. All three good recruiters. Gary had a falling out with Mulcahy before the much criticized trip to Cleveland and his fate had been sealed long before the snow storm. Some things just are not worth rehashing. Gary would have won here and elevated the program. His firing had nothing to do with Fred. Mulcahy made several bad choices for coaches but Gary was not one of them. His name was given to Mulcahy by the late Abe Suydam as were Belein, Martelli and the former Temple head coach. Mulcahy did not use the resource of a search firm but he used the grandfather of Rutgers Hoops and a good friend, Abe Suydam. I never write on sites but this crew is really off base on this topic.

Waters was a class act as a person, perhaps the best dressed coach in NCAA sports and as great coach. However he was like a fish out of water in NJ and didn't have any NJ based coaches on staff (what people were complaining about them). I remember after a court club meeting with Waters he and the Mrs. several of us were explaining about great NJ beach towns to the clueless (and seemingly homesick) couple. Waters remade the injured psyche of the team after Bannon and we got better but Waters hadnt gotten us over the hump after all the Bannon cr*p. It was debatable he could and from that I remember couldnt land many top recruits or big men. Hill Jr was seen as the heir apparent to Jesus and there was a paranoia that if Seton Hall landed Hill Jr. that Rutgers would forever be #2 in NJ. Unlike his father that I felt blessed to spend time with (tailgate a few years back) JR was a bad coach h-and PR*ck.

 

[BIGTENITCH]

The media knew about the nude free throw shooting and no one reported it till The Maven started talking it up we redman.com. Writers know alot more than they write but hold back for various reasons. I dont write this to imply you are wrong, just to say the media knows alot they dont tell us.

Seton I think you need to go back to South Orange though perhaps your general quote

The media knew about the nude free throw shooting and no one reported it till The Maven started talking it up on redman.com. Writers know alot more than they write but hold back for various reasons. I dont write this to imply you are wrong, just to say the media knows alot they dont tell us.

Seton I think you need to go back to South orange though your general quote on the media may be correct. First as for Waters dismissal the posts here including my own cover it well. However unless it had continued the naked free throw shooting incident was under BANNON
As for BANNONS firing I sincerely believe I was the ONLY one or one of the few who who may have known what went down- by sheer luck as I was out of work-and I sincerely believe the firing was DIRECTLY related to horrendous press the RU program ON THE FIRST DAY OF THE NCAA tourney based on great play by RU transfers Sankes and Brown?(who led the nation in scoring at LIU? That year).

What went down is as follows to the best of my memory. First the season was over and there seemed to be no noise out of Piscataway on a Bannon firing. Yes there had been the naked free throw contest whenever, celebrity bartender incident and whatever else (Seton perhaps insert the press quote here). Now I may not have been in touch say with top court club donors I had served with such as Pat Morris or the Lawrence's (s
Shiela had also been a prof of mine in the MBA program). However a former professor neighbor who had ties from the top of the RAA down-and was on campus most days-hadnt heard a thing.
IN ESSENCE IT WAS BAD PUBLICITY FROM THE NCAA TELECAST DUE TO JOHN FEINSTEINS BOOK ON THE PATRIOT LEAGUE (out near the end if that season) that quickly prompted AD Mulcahy? to fire Bannon.

Anyways I think first was the Wednesday? Court Club meeting that week. At the meeting Bannon was a no show. Yes it could have been because his fate had been determined. However is was just as or even MORE likely Bannon wanted to avoid a grilling from the FEINSTEIN book (that had come out some days before) THAT DISCUSSED Josh Sankes'transfer to Holy Cr oss after the naked free throw incident-and how bad he was messed up in the head. The book discussed FOR 8 pages Sankes poor treatment by Bannon and the RU sports administration. The book discussed how Sankes wound up hurt and in the hospital but nobody came to visit or check up on him. The book also noted Sankes was so damaged and nervous due to all that he puked during his first practice at Holy Cross.

Now looking back-if Bannon, staff and the RU sports administration? Was trying to avoid bad publicity they made another classic choice to rep the team at the Court Club meeting-Todd Billet (I believe). I say this as Todd (or whomever repoed the team) was discussed in Feinsteins book as having a nice little track habit and the book noted how he and Sankes used to hit the ponies (Monmouth I believe) quite often (skipping class?).

It seemed as if Bannon et Al had gambled that nobody had read the book yet. However all it took was one person and bless me father for I have sinned it was me -though perhaps I had (I forget) heard of the 8 pages of content ( I don't remember reading the book-esoecially that fast). Anyways when the floor was opened up to questions I immediately raised my hand. Eventually Court Club VP? Elliott Sachs made his way over to me with the mic. I asked Elliott ( on top of rules hops as much as anyone) if he had read the book and he indicated he had-and asked "you're not gonna ask about that incident are you? I replied "yes I am!". When I did-Billet hesitated-and rebuffed my question saying he hadn't read about himself and Sankes.

Anyways the prior may or may not have gotten the "ball rolling". However Bannon (and Rutgers') luck immediately worsened the next day at noon-the start of the NCAA tourney. First up was HOLY CROSS vs Kentucky. Starting at Center for Holy Cross "is" transfer Josh Sankes!!! And for 75 percent of the game Sankes holds his own vs the Kentucky center and I believe Holy Cross only loses by 6-8. Long before the end of the game the CBS announcers rave and rave about Sankes and then start discussing the FEINSTEIN book-note the 8 pages of Rutgers misgivings-and proceed to make Rutgers look like Rahway State prison after a breakout!

To make matters worse either the next game or a game (potential upset) of notes is LIU. Well LIU has the nation's leading scorer-Charles Brown?-a transfer from Rutgers. Brown has a good game, some of the Sankes stuff was rehashed again and Rutgers looked really bad again. Coincidentally Bannon was let go within the next 24-48 hours- with many (obviously those who worked) surprised.

This "incident" and Schianos house sale (the KEY realtor blew off a scheduled appointment with me-then lied to me that he was sick-to close with Schianos) were the 2 times I believe I have first had the Rutgers "scoop".

 

[CourtClub]

Wow- long time ago -20 years - not sure I can validate your specifics - I did read the Feinstein book pretty soon after it was published - actually I read all of Feinstein's books on college hoops including A Season on the Brink, Forever's Team (Wenzel signed his chapter in my book), and the book you reference on the Patriot League.

I do not recall any Court Club meeting with Todd Billet being present without any of the coaches in attendance. Actually, I don't think any coaching staff would allow a player to speak without one of the coaches being present. Maybe Geoff Billet was there subbing for Coach Bannon? Geoff was an assistant coach on our staff at the time - just speculation on my part here. I guess I have been running around with the microphone a lot longer than I remember. With BK running around with the mic from 2010-2018 I forgot about those days of yore....lol.

Changing topics back to Coach Waters - I have never met a classier person in my entire life. In my first term as President of the Court Club, we had a meeting scheduled in mid February 2006 on the day that the Star Ledger published that Coach would be let go at the conclusion of the season. I immediately called the basketball office to ask if Coach would be speaking at our meeting that evening, as planned. I was told that he would. As usual, Coach walked in at 6:58pm for a 7pm meeting. I introduced Coach Waters and he started out by saying "I might not be able to answer all of your questions but if you have any questions about the team, the players or the games I will be able to address those." You will never meet a classier person.

Unfortunately, the Waters administration's recruiting was doomed on day 1. The coaching staff followed the protocol that they had while at Kent State recruiting through the HS and AAU coaches. They never really got traction with the NJ HS coaches. Prior to the season of our run to the NIT championship game, they changed the approach and recruited through the families of each player. That's when they were able to get players like JR Inman, Anthony Farmer, Jaron Griffin, Quincy Douby, etc. You can't lose 2 entire recruiting classes in that Big East Conference and survive. Unfortunately, that's what happened.

It might have been interesting to see if we had kept Coach Waters for one more season with Coach Hill as the recruiting assistant. Deshawn Butler was set to come in and he could have made a huge impact. After Coach Waters left, Butler decided to go to WVU and the rest is history.

The best news of all is that our current Rutgers Men's Basketball Program leadership is as solid and professional as it has ever been. Great times are ahead. Enjoy the ride!

Go RU!!

Elliott