Fundraising for the new baseball stadium has started.

[patdog]

Link2

Pat's Original Link - http://haildudynoble.com/

 

[drt7891]

check your pm

 

[af102]

You may way to edit that first link to just http://haildudynoble.com/ as it has your contact info saved in the form at the bottom.

Also, http://www.msubulldogclub.com/dnfmasterplan/ has the new renderings posted.

 

[00Dawg]

Hmmm.....
On the high side for some things, low for others.
The real important numbers, i.e. the annual commitment:
Chairbacks: $1,500 commitment for 10 years (works out to $150 annual, down from $200 currently)...really wondering if this is truly the only annual cost
Club Level: $1,100 annual cost
Loge Level: $6,000 annual cost for 4 seats
12-person suite: $30,000 annual cost
18-person suite: $45,000 annual cost
Left Field Lounge: $2,000 annual cost
Left Field Loft: $50,000 annual cost, possibly plus a $1,200 monthly maintenance charge

No mention of reseating details, but I assume since the lifetime holders only have to pay $900 for a 10-year commitment on chairbacks, it'll be fruit basket turnover.

 

[Xenomorph]

The light stanchions in right field still don't match the rest of the stadium and stick out like a 17ing sore thumb.

/yeah.. it bothers me

 

[aTotal360]

fwiw, if they do match, you just added another obstacle to block views for no other reason than aesthetics. I assume that's the only reason they don't match the stubby ones on the grandstands.

 

[dawgstudent]

Check your pm as well. I sent you a message last week.

 

[patdog]

Thanks. And thanks to DAA for fixing it.

 

[patdog]

They look fine. A perfectly symmetrical baseball stadium is boring.

 

[dawgstudent]

That video is well done on haildudynoble.com

 

[aTotal360]

Great video.

 

[randystewart]

Looks to me like they are in for a rude awakening on those Club/Loge/Suite prices. I was seriously considering club until I saw that price. That is more than my 200 level chairbacks for football!

 

[engie]

Hmmm.....
On the high side for some things, low for others.
The real important numbers, i.e. the annual commitment:
Chairbacks: $1,500 commitment for 10 years (works out to $150 annual, down from $200 currently)...really wondering if this is truly the only annual cost
Club Level: $1,100 annual cost
Loge Level: $6,000 annual cost for 4 seats
12-person suite: $30,000 annual cost
18-person suite: $45,000 annual cost
Left Field Lounge: $2,000 annual cost
Left Field Loft: $50,000 annual cost, possibly plus a $1,200 monthly maintenance charge

No mention of reseating details, but I assume since the lifetime holders only have to pay $900 for a 10-year commitment on chairbacks, it'll be fruit basket turnover.

So, do you still think we've been leaving "minimal" money on the table in the current stadium -- as you've consistently argued over the years?

 

[engie]

Looks to me like they are in for a rude awakening on those Club/Loge/Suite prices. I was seriously considering club until I saw that price. That is more than my 200 level chairbacks for football!

Almost 40 games vs 7 games...

We're still considerably cheaper than Alex Box on the Club/Loge prices. Those are about right IMO. We are quite a bit higher than I thought we would be on the skyboxes though. Which, IMO, is a byproduct of how underpriced/underbuilt we've always been in every sport in that regard...

 

[121Josey]

Looks to me like they are in for a rude awakening on those Club/Loge/Suite prices. I was seriously considering club until I saw that price. That is more than my 200 level chairbacks for football!

No doubt they get those prices the first couple of years. After that, it remains to be seen.

 

[00Dawg]

So, do you still think we've been leaving "minimal" money on the table in the current stadium -- as you've consistently argued over the years?

I think you misunderstood that particular part of the argument; I've been very much on board with needing more, better, and higher priced suites for a long time. My concern is how much seating the lower and middle tiers of our fans can buy, and at what price points.
If TPTB disagreed with me on the biggest part of that, they wouldn't have lowered the per seat fee for chairbacks. They realize we don't have enough people willing to pay $200 per seat per year (the current level for non-lifetime holders) to sell out the chairbacks. From my personal perspective, as long as I don't end up with total crap seats, this is great: I get a price break as a reward for being willing to pick up a phone when the program was down.

As for the rest of the pricing, we'll have to see how much capacity they've decided on for each section.

 

[engie]

I think you misunderstood that particular part of the argument; I've been very much on board with needing more, better, and higher priced suites for a long time. My concern is how much seating the lower and middle tiers of our fans can buy, and at what price points.
If TPTB disagreed with me on the biggest part of that, they wouldn't have lowered the per seat fee for chairbacks. They realize we don't have enough people willing to pay $200 per seat per year (the current level for non-lifetime holders) to sell out the chairbacks. From my personal perspective, as long as I don't end up with total crap seats, this is great: I get a price break as a reward for being willing to pick up a phone when the program was down.

As for the rest of the pricing, we'll have to see how much capacity they've decided on for each section.

Lowering the CGA doesn't mean they agree with you. If they had actually agreed with you -- they wouldn't have essentially doubled the number of chairback seats in the stadium(which says, emphatically, that they agree with me). The CGA price doesn't mean they are lowering the price of seats either. I suspect the tickets themselves will be on a tiered pricing structure in sections of the seating bowl. It certainly won't be one base price for every chairback in the stadium in the manner this early CGA agreement would imply. Overall, every chairback is still going to be more expensive in the new stadium than it is in the current one -- and we're going to sell closer to 8k season tickets than the 5500 we're currently tapped out at.

How do you get a price break? You've got to pay $500 up front of a total of $1500 that locks you in for a decade. You start actually doing economics with a basic interest accrual -- and there isn't actually a price break even though it appears to be one from the distance.

Here is what you actually said:

Not much.
Our fans are cheap, and before last year there weren't enough fans willing to pay even a small fee to sell out the grandstand.
I'm sure there are some extra skyboxes to be sold, but you can forget instant sell-outs of premium seating from the first.
Continuous winning on the national stage will increase that somewhat, but we can't even sell out our new football premium seating either (granted, some of that is poor planning vs pricing for the initial buy-in).

Let me state first that I speak from personal experience for both baseball and football.
Skyboxes, yes, we can sell more. Other premium seating is a weak maybe. We have not consistently sold out the grandstand seats since we added an annual seat charge. If you wanted grandstand seats prior to this season and were willing to pay the charge, some were available.
Similar deal in football. Skyboxes were almost instantly gone in 2001. We finally sold out the first Club Level around 2008, then later added some interior seats and a facility commitment, and didn't sell those out for several years, although admittedly we weren't trying very hard.
Note that the new end zone seats are the same way. Skyboxes gone, loge seating takes special efforts despite very limited numbers and wasn't sold out as of last month, and the end zone club still has hundreds available.
If we want to build more skyboxes, great. You can do that without a new baseball stadium. Other premium seating, which almost certainly does require a new stadium, is far less of a sure thing, and should not qualify as a reason for a new stadium.

We sold every premium seat in Davis Wade FYI. And have already sold 8 Clubs, a LFLoft, 4 Loge seats, and 43 chairbacks to the new Dudy Noble in the 3 hours since the announcement...

 

[00Dawg]

Lowering the CGA doesn't mean they agree with you. If they had actually agreed with you -- they wouldn't have essentially doubled the number of chairback seats in the stadium(which says, emphatically, that they agree with me). The CGA price doesn't mean they are lowering the price of seats either. I suspect the tickets themselves will be on a tiered pricing structure in sections of the seating bowl. It certainly won't be one base price for every chairback in the stadium in the manner this early CGA agreement would imply. Overall, every chairback is still going to be more expensive in the new stadium than it is in the current one -- and we're going to sell closer to 8k season tickets than the 5500 we're currently tapped out at.

Could be. Right now a chairback anywhere costs you $200 annually per seat plus the ticket, unless you're a lifetime seat holder.

How do you get a price break? You've got to pay $500 up front of a total of $1500 that locks you in for a decade. You start actually doing economics with a basic interest accrual -- and there isn't actually a price break even though it appears to be one from the distance.

Annual inflation for the last decade was 2.12%. Break even for $500 a year for 3 years versus $200 a year for 10 years is somewhere around 3.25%.
I'm sure with a little work I could find something no-risk to lock in the money and turn that into a small profit 8 or 9 years from now. Instead, I'm just going to smile, enjoy scoring internet points, and look forward to my new MSU Alabama car tag.

We sold every premium seat in Davis Wade FYI.

The east side CL was not sold out at the start of the season.

Time to put the proverbial internet money where your mouth is:
Engie, when will we sell out all our non-chairback premium seating for the new baseball stadium?
Also, will we get pre-commitments for all 8,000 chairback seats before the new stadium is complete?

 

[engie]

Could be. Right now a chairback anywhere costs you $200 annually per seat plus the ticket, unless you're a lifetime seat holder.

Annual inflation for the last decade was 2.12%. Break even for $500 a year for 3 years versus $200 a year for 10 years is somewhere around 3.25%.
I'm sure with a little work I could find something no-risk to lock in the money and turn that into a small profit 8 or 9 years from now. Instead, I'm just going to smile, enjoy scoring internet points, and look forward to my new MSU Alabama car tag.

Inflation doesn't cover interest. Interest earned investing money elsewhere for future $200 investments vs past $1500 investments. It's been a long time since I had engineering economics or bothered with all the P/A, etc stuff to compare money -- but I'd bet the numbers are pretty close. Which just tells me that they are going to get their additional $$ from the price of the tickets themselves in the stadium rather than the seating licenses.

The east side CL was not sold out at the start of the season.

Link?

Time to put the proverbial internet money where your mouth is:
Engie, when will we sell out all our non-chairback premium seating for the new baseball stadium?

Yes. With ease as currently projected. Being that we haven't broken ground or even got full structural plots yet -- the plans are still flexible on how much of what to add, and I imagine we'll adjust according to interest generated in this presale.

Also, will we get pre-commitments for all 8,000 chairback seats before the new stadium is complete?

Did I just say we'd sell 11,000 season tickets -- or did I say that we would sell 8,000? That bait was FAR too shiny....

We'll sell 6,000+ chairbacks. 1000 outfield/general admission. 1000 skybox/loge/club seats. = 8k number I already came up with and you ignored(probably another couple hundred in the lofts every game -- who will not actually be required to have tickets to the game). I've seen nothing saying there's going to actually be 8k chairbacks in the new stadium. That's a significantly greater capacity than the current stadium and bleachers combined. Along with the space and availability of standing room tickets(360* concourse), you'd be looking at a Dudy Noble that could hold 20k people.

The bottom line is -- you didn't think it needed to be torn down nor that the revenue potential could justify tearing it down -- and you are going to be way off on that...

We had our greatest revenue season in Dudy Noble history last year at $3.3million. We'll make more than that just on premium seating in the new venue before a grandstand seat pulls a dollar.

 

[Hammer Down]

Inflation doesn't cover interest. Interest earned investing money elsewhere for future $200 investments vs past $1500 investments. It's been a long time since I had engineering economics or bothered with all the P/A, etc stuff to compare money -- but I'd bet the numbers are pretty close. Which just tells me that they are going to get their additional $$ from the price of the tickets themselves in the stadium rather than the seating licenses.

I smell a challenge.

 

[00Dawg]

Inflation doesn't cover interest. Interest earned investing money elsewhere for future $200 investments vs past $1500 investments. It's been a long time since I had engineering economics or bothered with all the P/A, etc stuff to compare money -- but I'd bet the numbers are pretty close. Which just tells me that they are going to get their additional $$ from the price of the tickets themselves in the stadium rather than the seating licenses.

Yeah, you need an annual investment return of 1.25% for the break even mark. I did the numbers for you. You can find some risk-free investments pretty quickly to match that given the time window. If you want to pooh-pooh the price break idea, you've got plenty of ammo. I'm still happy about it.

Link?

I don't have an article. Just checked in with BC-affiliated folks near kickoff, and there were plenty left. Last hard number I had was well over 100 available when the mid-level BC rankings were picking. I would hope that we sold some during the season given our success, but I doubt we got them all, and I haven't bothered to ask.

.... the plans are still flexible on how much of what to add, and I imagine we'll adjust according to interest generated in this presale.

....well, there went any internet cred for that answer.

Did I just say we'd sell 11,000 season tickets -- or did I say that we would sell 8,000? That bait was FAR too shiny....

We'll sell 6,000+ chairbacks. 1000 outfield/general admission. 1000 skybox/loge/club seats. = 8k number I already came up with and you ignored(probably another couple hundred in the lofts every game -- who will not actually be required to have tickets to the game). I've seen nothing saying there's going to actually be 8k chairbacks in the new stadium. That's a significantly greater capacity than the current stadium and bleachers combined. Along with the space and availability of standing room tickets(360* concourse), you'd be looking at a Dudy Noble that could hold 20k people.

I wasn't ignoring you, although I now am wondering how we arrived at this point. With our run in 2013 and the administration's extremely reasonable approach to chairback costs (so far), I see no reason whatsoever to think we couldn't add another 1,500 seats for premium-paying folks and come close to selling out when the stadium opens. It's the the other 2,000 I don't see easily filled...and you weren't arguing for.

The bottom line is -- you didn't think it needed to be torn down nor that the revenue potential could justify tearing it down -- and you are going to be way off on that...

If you say so. There was nothing with the old version that kept us from building more chairbacks, lofts, lounges, or new suites. You get the extra revenue from the CL, loge, and backstop for your argument, and a heck of a lot of nice aesthetics with corresponding cost.

Look, I'm glad we did this. In the end, this route will almost certainly be better for the program.

 

[MedDawg]

Are the grandstands ALL chairbacks? Will there be general admission tickets

Link2

Pat's Original Link - http://haildudynoble.com/

other than for the left field lounge or sitting on the hill?

So the only way to sit in the stands is to buy chairbacks?

I've gone to too few games to buy season tickets, and the "cannot sellout" aspect made me feel like I never had to buy season tickets. I've always just bought day of game general admission tickets and moved to the grandstands when allowed.

I'll probably buy a couple chairbacks, which actually should spur me to attend more games--since I'll have season tickets, I might as well use them. I'm actually considering a couple in the club level, as I have club level at Davis Wade, but have reduced those from 5 to 4 to 3 seats, and now maybe just 2 in 2015.

Back to my original question, if the grandstands consist of only chairbacks costing $1500 each, then that will price a lot of people out of MSU baseball. Their only general admission choice will be the left field lounge or the hill. I'm mostly thinking of those fans who bought season tickets to sit in the metal bleachers.

On the other hand, if unsold chairbacks are sold as a limited number of general admission tickets, then those will be under huge demand (lines at the ticket booth).