Duke's Mark Mitchell returning to School
- Thread starter MWes11
- Start date
But Chris Livingston would rather sleep with Roseanne Barr than come back to UK.
I honestly didn’t even know that guy was still at Duke this past season. No wonder he’s coming back.
He was a freshman and top 20 recruit. Looks like he averaged around 10 points and 5 boards a game. We have dudes leaving who essentially average half of that.
If I am an opposing coach who is recruiting against Duke for a one and done type kid I am pointing out the fact that Scheyer is talking these kids into staying.
Oh ok I was thinking of Mark Williams. Carry on.
Yeah...because having guys play poor to medioce in college for 1 year and then onto NBA no matter what is exactly a good plan!
What has it benefited BJ Boston, Diallo, Dakari, Terrance Clarke, EJ Montgomery, etc....?
Mitchell’s biggest asset is his defense. Best defender they had this season on a top 25 rated D. Very good slasher on offense as well. He’s a good player
I thought the word was CL wants to return to UK, but "his people" don't want that.
He actually plays a lot like Livingston, except a better defender.
If not purposely holding them back, then at least not developing them properly. To have 3 top5 guys in 2022 and not one of them be a lottery pick, is pretty bad.
Also, Duke has THREE 6-8 PFs coming in next year. Someone isn't going to get the playing time they envisioned, whether it's one of the 3, or Mitchell as he gets passed over.
I absolutely would use this as "knock" on Scheyer when it comes to 1AD recruiting.
I don't particularly like 1AD at this point. But I also think it's one of the only ways Cal can win, unfortunately.
Either way... the way you make the 1AD business model work is be showing your success with it, from the player standpoint. Cal was able to get Fox because of what he did for Wall. So I definitely think there's an argument to be made that Scheyer has NOT had good success with 1AD so far (and probably why he's already made comments about going away from it). It's not a good look that not a single one of those top5 recruits is even in the discussion for the lottery.. and 2 of them I'm seeing in the 2nd round in some places.
You could go with 2 PFs, and no C, and they each get 27min (if no one return at those 2 positions). Or maybe one of them plays some SF.
Although I think Whitehead could be a lottery pick. But if so, not because of what he did at Duke, but rather what he can show them in workouts from his natural skills (i.e. Sharpe).
I guess you COULD. But it's not ideal.
Mitchell isn't a huge deal anyways, I guess.. as he was a fringe 1AD type anyways. I think he was probably a 2-year player anyways. If anything, I think a transfer would be a better option for him.
As he should. He will be good. Wish our players had that mentality more often. CL, looking at you.
Wall was going to be Wall no matter where he went. It’s not like he was raw and Cal developed him. He could have went anywhere and he was still a lottery pick.
Scheyer failed at one and done in just one year? Wow….he sucks!! LOL
So he was a OAD and Jon failed him, or he was a two year player anyway? Which one was it again??
Doesn't matter if he was or wasn't. Cal was able to point to Wall as an example. We can use Brandon Knight or Marquis Teague if you'd prefer lol.
Scheyer "failed" Lively, Flip and Whitehead. Or at least didn't have a great showing for getting 1AD talent to the NBA in the manner they should. Mitchell, as I already adjusted my stance on, was more of a 2-year player it seems regardless. The other 3, were not.
I think to determine how much a coach hurts or helps recruits make it to the next level, you need to see:
- how many of those "can't miss OAD" players actually are OAD lottery picks.
- how many of those who were marginal at best OAD players turn into OAD lottery picks, or ever make it to the NBA.
For example I think we would consider Skal as a "fail" for Cal. Maybe Lively is a "fail" for Scheyer.
SGA is a success for Cal, and give him time Scheyer will probably have one as well.
Granted his passing away was tragic and sad.Adding Clarke to this is quite awkward
But he was either going undrafted or a flyer in 2nd round and then onto GLeauge if he didn't get into the car wreck. The narrative with Clarke is still the same......no matter how poorly you play at UK...it's off to NBA with Cal kids.
Not trying to demean his death just stating how the program is constructed by Cal and his recruits is a mess.
It's fascinating that we're the only program in America who has 18 and 19 year-olds making life altering decisions without their own direct input.
Boston. It wasn't his choice.
Vanderbilt. It wasn't his choice.
Sharpe. It wasn't his choice.
Whitney. It wasn't his choice.
Livingston. It wasn't his choice.
None of it is ever their fault or Cal's fault. It's always those shady handlers.
Such a silly narrative.
Can't say he failed Whitehead can you? Wasn't it injuries that sidetracked him? If so, can't blame that on coach.
Flip certainly got the chances, he led the team in shots. And he wasn't bad. I think he could go in the 1st round. Lottery is quite questionable, top 10 very unlikely. So probably not that different than his projection 9 months ago.
Either way.. it's 3 top5 guys who aren't going lottery, and maybe not particularly close. Are there excuses and reasons for that outside of Scheyer? I'm sure.
But the point was, originally, that you could use this as an example of why elite 1AD maybe should look elsewhere. I mean, heck, we know rival fans pointed to Kentucky in 2015 as for why elite recruits shouldn't come here.
I don't recall hearing that on Boston or Vanderbilt.It's fascinating that we're the only program in America who has 18 and 19 year-olds making life altering decisions without their own direct input.
Boston. It wasn't his choice.
Vanderbilt. It wasn't his choice.
Sharpe. It wasn't his choice.
Livingston. It wasn't his choice.
None of it is ever their fault or Cal's fault. It's always those shady handlers!
Such a silly narrative!
Honestly I was never a Boston fan though. I correctly called him overrated before he arrived, and did not mind seeing him go.
Sharpe I think it was said that while he was being directed what to do, leaving was NOT against his wishes.
In the CL case, it does sound like it is against his wishes. Same for Onyenso.
And I don't know if you can say we are the only place that happens at. We (BBN) don't pay as much attention to other schools as we do our own. But also, our players come here with higher expectations and aspirations/ambitions than most at other schools, so we could be different for that reason.
But Cal has a lot to be at fault for!!! And even with this, if the "people" have that much influence on a kid, then Cal needs to both have a talk with the player (telling him to grow a pair & stand up for himself) and "his people" (to be realistic).
LOL created an account, today, to pretend to be a Kentucky fan, while making your first post to defend Duke..
Nick Smith played how many games? and he's a top10 pick. What's his excuse?
Let's be real.. Whitehead and Lively just didn't play that well as freshman. It wasn't cause of injuries. They should have been much better.. and whether that's 100% on Scheyer or not at all, doesn't matter. He was the coach in charge.
I’m certain Scheyer wasn’t selling his 5 top 20 recruits for next year on being towel boys. Undoubtedly 1 or 2 of those recruits just won’t get much PT, especially if Roach/Flip come back too.
Well, we will see overtime how much recruiting falls off I guess. No point in arguing something nobody know the outcome of. Just have to wait and see. Thinking Duke is going away is likely going to be a disappointing hope in my opinion. We’ll see. I don’t believe Duke, Ky, Kansas, unc, ever become irrelevant
I never said their recruiting would fall of though. Honestly, it's Duke.. Scheyer could have absolutely nuked all 3 of their careers and they'd *$omehow* still draw attention.
Some won’t get as much as they want, but I think he can make it work. Basically makes them 9 deep, and Jon has said from day one thst part of his plan is to play a much deeper rotation than what they have in the past. That could help recruiting as much as other opinions of bringing people back can hurt it. It will all play out
As for whether Duke stays relevant. We will see. I have my own doubts about ALL the blue bloods, as I generally think college basketball is heading towards a trend where no one is really ever firmly on top again.
But it's worth noting that Kentucky is down bad with the end of Cal's tenure.. meanwhile Duke has it's apparent coach for the future.. and yet both finished the season about the same. Id' be at least a LITTLE concerned about the level to which Scheyer can keep Duke at. Kentucky is going to throw top dollar at it's next coach, we just have to worry about the right one. But we've won Final4s under several throughout the decades.
But it's worth noting that Kentucky is down bad with the end of Cal's tenure.. meanwhile Duke has it's apparent coach for the future.. and yet both finished the season about the same. Id' be at least a LITTLE concerned about the level to which Scheyer can keep Duke at. Kentucky is going to throw top dollar at it's next coach, we just have to worry about the right one. But we've won Final4s under several throughout the decades.
Oh ok. I misunderstood. I thought your statement below was that top recruits may look elsewhere
But the point was, originally, that you could use this as an example of why elite 1AD maybe should look elsewhere.