What I’ve learned is that Frost is learning on the job as is his whole staff. Add that to not having a lot of talent to work with, plus facing well coached teams is a recipe for disaster, which we are on the brink if we don’t go bowling. And I agree with what you said, the honeymoon is over and now it’s time to get it done.
Dirk takes the program for a walk
- Thread starter regoratsginrom
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What I’ve learned is that Frost is learning on the job as is his whole staff. Add that to not having a lot of talent to work with, plus facing well coached teams is a recipe for disaster, which we are on the brink if we don’t go bowling. And I agree with what you said, the honeymoon is over and now it’s time to get it done.
I don't "dwell" on the past results of a football coach but you can't hide from it either. Everyone wants to see this program regain its success of the 90's, the standard for this program. No one has pushed the needle of success to even approach that goal for 20 freaking years! Using your own example of your company, you measure success by winning contracts or serving customers. When it doesn't happen, you look back to find out why, right?
I would argue it is not just Frost - it is an entire coaching staff and all the support people behind him. Since you want to live in the current - consider the results - they didn't win many contracts (whatever your industry is) the last two years - they have won 8 games so far. Results do not lie, player development does not lie, recruiting does not lie - the record does not lie. Put whatever label you want on it but you want to mix the changes in all the position rooms with the current lack of success - that is in the past - live in the present.
Frost and his staff have been given EVERYTHING. He has his staff, his walk on program, his nutrition guy, his S&C guy, his support people, proposed new facilities, recruiting budget and more so there is investment in a much better product. No one doubts that Frost is a winner but you can't claim the 12 win season and dismiss a 4 win season.
Have a successful day in your business. Seriously.
Who said anything about hiding from it? Your posting in this thread has gone into crazy land.
What a silly, pointless article. It reads like a depressed message board post. I'm surprised it got so much run...
Penn State and Baylor are both 8-0 after going through huge scandals a few years ago. Minnesota is 8-0 after decades of sucking.
Good coaches almost always turn things around pretty quickly, regardless of what mess they inherited. If you don't see significant improvement by Year 2 or 3, it's probably not going to happen. In large part, because recruits want to see results on the field. You can only sell hope for so long.
Good coaches almost always turn things around pretty quickly, regardless of what mess they inherited. If you don't see significant improvement by Year 2 or 3, it's probably not going to happen. In large part, because recruits want to see results on the field. You can only sell hope for so long.
Dirk is trying to be edgy and the voice of Husker fans. This reads like a fan post after Wisconsin beat Nebraska 70 -31. History is not a burden. It is a lesson.
I don’t know if your assertion about two or three years is accurate but no one can deny that there isn’t a recruit who was alive the last time we were the big dogs. So recruiting to NU has probably never been this hard since Devaney.
Devaney probably did take over a dumpster fire as bad as what Frost inherited and totally flipped it within your three year timeframe so I guess we better hope Frost is the next Devaney.
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I was extremely confident at the finish of last season he could do it. This season has sucked every bit of hope I had completely out of me. Check out the next 2 years of schedules. Frost legitimately could go four years without a bowl game.
Devaney flipped it in one season. They were 3-6-1 the year before he took over and 9-2 his first season. That is what a good staff does! According to some on here it takes 5 seasons for most every staff! The squad had not had a winning season for years prior to Devaney!
Amen. You either have it or don’t. By the end of year three we’ll have it pretty clear.
The reason why it's gotten so much run is because no other Nebraska writer has the cojones to be critical and write about it. They all tend to write summaries of the game/the future will be better/Riley left us with nothing articles. KState beat OU last week. When was the last time we beat anyone of that caliber? Well, it happens to be OU but in 2001. And that's just one recent example. It's inexcusable how low our administration let our program slip. The kool-aid hangover has worn off and I want to start seeing some wins, espicially against some decent competition (Wisconsin/Iowa).
Bro, I have been saying this for the last year. I was kind of okay with what happened last year. When you are flipping a program and making a pretty big change in the offense you are probably going to get about the same, or a little worse record than the year before.
Now like you said, year 2 is were you should start to see some major strides. What is scary about what is happening so far this year is this stuff should have hashed out in the previous 18 months. You are supposedly having issues with players not buying in and you are having your own recruits transfer out already.
I don't like how things are shaking out so far. There is still time this year for Frost to at least get to a bowl and maybe get a big rivalry win, but they have left some chances on the table this year.
We've blown two clear chances where I believe that just great coaching alone would have gotten us a W and that is against Colorado (mainly on FROST for his playcalling in the 2nd half/OT) and Indiana (On Chinander for not making adjustments). Maybe the light switch will turn on starting this week but I'm not as sold now that Frost will get it done.
And please note, I'm not calling for Frost to leave. We have no option but to give him his due time to clean this mess.
Some of you are absolutely clueless. Prime examples of why you can't say it all comes down to year 2 and year 3:
It's funny that certain posters ignore year 2 of Frost's coaching career as a head coach since it doesn't fit their agenda. So let's ignore an undefeated season so it fits certain agendas that some posters have.
So you either have it or you don't by year 2 or year 3. Thus, the coaches below have no business coaching:
Nick Saban
6–5–1
6–6
7–5
Frank Beamer
2-9
3-8
6-4
Barry Alvarez
1-10
5-6
5-6
Dabo
4–3
9–5
6–7
Some of you guys don't have a damn clue what you are talking about.
It's funny that certain posters ignore year 2 of Frost's coaching career as a head coach since it doesn't fit their agenda. So let's ignore an undefeated season so it fits certain agendas that some posters have.
So you either have it or you don't by year 2 or year 3. Thus, the coaches below have no business coaching:
Nick Saban
6–5–1
6–6
7–5
Frank Beamer
2-9
3-8
6-4
Barry Alvarez
1-10
5-6
5-6
Dabo
4–3
9–5
6–7
Some of you guys don't have a damn clue what you are talking about.
Frank Beamer averaged 4 wins per year in his 1st 6 seasons - including a 2 win season in year 6 - Frost won't last to year 7 if this is the case
Barry Alvarez - Rose Bowl win in year 4
Dabo - after 2 full seasons of coaching has averaged more than 12 wins per year every year since (2 NCs) - 15 combined wins his first 2 full season of coaching
Saban - took over an 0-11 team at MSU. When he took over a program with any semblance of history and tradition he won the SEC in year 2
some who know football believe Frost took over a 6 or 7 win team (not a 4-8 team) - we've gone backwards at present
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I see noticeable improvement by Year 2-3 in all of these coaches listed, especially when you consider what they inherited.
Saban took over MSU after they had been hit hard by NCAA sanctions and hadn't had a winning season in years, and took them to bowls in each of their first 3 years.
Beamer also took over VT right after they got hit hard by NCAA sanctions. They were limited to 17 scholarships his first few seasons there, and were in major debt.
Alvarez going from 1 win to 5, and then a Rose Bowl in Year 4, looks like noticeable improvement. Wisconsin hadn't had a winning season in 6 years before he took over, and had only won 1 conference game each of the previous 3 years.
Counting Dabo's interim half-season isn't really fair. He won the division his first full season and won the ACC Conference his third full season. He also fired many of his assistants after a bad 2nd season.
Frost took over a program with an unlimited budget and resources, that had won at least 9 games in 8 of the last 10 years before he took over, and plays in one of the easier divisions in Power 5 college football.
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KState upset Oklahoma, 2015 Nebraska upset MSU, upsets happen... It takes zero "cojones" to write an article that is basically an over dramatic message board post.
Let's see your tone if we lose tomorrow. I'd argue that last year we were better than a 4-8 team. This year I'd argue we are worse than a 4-4 team. Progress has not been made. The whole "It's all up from here" speach was used last year, we need to start winning some games. 6-6 year with the easiest schedule in our history is not enough to convince me.
We are statistically improving on defense (yes, better than last year) and our drop on O is only 16% and that will drastically rise next year with everything that is returning.
The problem this year is that we are too much 50/50 on 3rd down plays....us converting 3rd downs and us not stoping 3rd downs on D. A simple 10% improvement on 3rd down play puts us at 6-2.
But you don't want to know the real reality since you want to pretend the world is ending like some dumbos are doing on the 247 website.
Moos himself said at the press conference, it only takes 2-3 years to turn a program around with the right coach.
Frost said "you better get us in Year 1, because by Year 2 we'll be competing for the division and then it's all up from there"
And you know that the reality is that we're going to lose our biggest playmakers on D after this year, you know that right? That whole Defensive line is GONE. And our linebackers, we're going to have to throw the young freshmen out there. As for third downs, that has been an issue for the past 15 years. That's a mix of mental and scheme issues that hasn't been resolved by any of our head men.
We gave Bo 7 years, but I could have told you after we lost to Washington in the Holiday Bowl that this guy was not going to be elite.
Lol. The freshman linebackers are a lot more talented that what is playing now. Ty will be more disruptive than the fatty twins. Lamar will be replaced with Fishers player development.
Hyperbolic is the word you're looking for.
I was listening to Danny Woodhead on Bahe's podcast and he was very blunt about saying that there aren't a whole lot of NU's starters who could start for just the other teams around the conference period, let alone the best teams in the B1G. After 10 years in the NFL I kinda trust his opinion on whether football players are good or not.
Not guys who are NFL talents, he said guys who could even win a job at other schools. That's dire.
Now part of that is coaching. It's their job to teach these guys to play better. But I cannot think of any time in the last 50 years of NU football that they've had worse talent than they do right now.
To be sure they're playing below that talent level and that's culture and coaching, but I dare anyone to name for me a less talented Nebraska roster Since the late 60s, and I dare anyone to say the Big 10 isn't a tougher conference top to bottom than the Big 12.
The reason they're worse this year is that roster had a big hole shot through the middle of it. They got younger this year and the absence of very many talented, experienced upperclassmen is staring us all right in the face. Especially at RB, WR and OLB.
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Correct, I should have caught the autocorrect. Did you mean to respond to my post? Everything you said I agree with.
Dude you forgot Gary Pinkel. I see what you are saying, and I understand, but you went back to 1990 for Alvarez, 1995 for Saban and 1987 for Beemer. The college football landscape has changed vastly since the 80's and 90's.
I think if you look at just the last 10 years and find programs similar to Nebraska that may fit your argument there ARE a some:.
Washington with Petersen
Washington State with Leach
Mullen at Miss State
Franklin at Vandy
Clawson at Wake Forest
Fedora at UNC
Campbell at Iowa State
Holgorsen at West Virginia
USC with Kiffin, Sark and Helton
Arizona State with Graham
Mora at UCLA
Rich Rod at Arizona
MacIntyre at Colorado
Tedford, Dykes and Wilcox at Cal
Pretty impressive list, and in most cases pretty similar to Nebraska, (ie Power 5 schools where football is king) but only 2 of those won a conference championship, Helton and Petersen, and Helton is skating on thin ice this year. I don't know what constitutes a complete turnaround, but I would say the winning a conference championship box has to be checked for that to happen.
Now you throw in schools like Arkansas with Bulimia, Florida with Muschamp, Muschamp again at South Carolina, Tennessee with Dooley and Butch Jones, Rich Rod and Brady Hoke at Michigan, Hazell at Purdue, Illinois last 4 coaches, BC's last 2 coaches, the last 4 coaches at Pitt and a couple more. These are schools where coaches couldn't stop the slide and it ended in a bad way. You add this list to the list above and that is a lot of coaches who couldn't get the train back on the tracks for their program.
I think all Husker fans and people on this board want it to work for Frost, and want it to work big, but longer a team flounders and struggles the steeper the hill is to climb to get to the top.
Frost has a long way to go before he should be mentioned in the same breath at Saban, Alvarez, Dabo and Beemer. For a little perspective, Frost will need to win his next 22 games in a row to get even with Bo's win % at Nebraska.
So in light of all that, what's hyperbole about Dirk saying the program isn't very good and hasn't been in many years?
OK you're still drunk on the kool aid. Maybe you're right but you should see the product on the field first before declaring that they are better. The only freshman playing this year is Nelson and he had his dozen errors in the last game. If you think the guys who aren't on Nelson's level are going to step in and kill it, I think you're delusional!
The entire theme of the article is an attempt to get fans and the program to lower standards. Because Dirk didn't care about losing to Indiana, fans shouldn't? Silly nonsense, the standard is the standard, meet it!
Maybe give the staff a full 2-3 years then before crying that the sky is falling...chicken little. We are just over 1/2 way through Season 2. Take a breathe.
That's what I said. We'll know by Year 2-3. Frost and Moos agree (see below). But if we're .500 again next year, I guarantee we'll see excuses that Frost needs at least 4-5 years. But let's look at their own words:
“Year 2 is when it’s gonna take off around here. And taking off doesn’t mean we’re gonna go undefeated, but we’ll be a really good team in two years.”
— Scott Frost
“We’ll be competing for our side in Year 2. I don’t know if we’ll win it. Then it just goes up from there.”
— Scott Frost
"We'll see how this first year goes, but people better get us now because we're going to keep getting better and better."
— Scott Frost
"The usual rule of thumb is year three. The places I’ve been before, we had to build and create everything that we already have here, so even three was a little bit early. It was four and sometimes five. But at Nebraska, depending on what the offense is, the defensive scheme, two and probably more realistically three."
— Bill Moos
Season 3’s last 5 games are Ohio State, Penn State, Iowa, Wisconsin, and Minnesota. On top of that, they have Cincinatti and South Dakota State. The season after that is more brutal. We are being abused with a cupcake schedule.
This ... the fans aren’t crazy coming up with unrealistic expectations. These are expectations set out by the coaching staff and AD - on more than one occasion.
If coaches said team not going to be good, we will lose lot's of games, blah blah blah some of you would be going ballistic and making doctors lots of money with medication subscriptions.
Since coaches are trying to put expectations together for a program they are working to rebuild, you are so strung tight that if things do not go perfect to the timeline you think they are idiots and all should be fired.
The issue isn't the coaches, it's the nimrods that fail to understand what leadership is and how expectations need to be put in place and work to those expectations. Not everything is going to go perfectly to a timeline. If you can't understand that then it is obvious you have never done anything in life that isn't easy.
Since coaches are trying to put expectations together for a program they are working to rebuild, you are so strung tight that if things do not go perfect to the timeline you think they are idiots and all should be fired.
The issue isn't the coaches, it's the nimrods that fail to understand what leadership is and how expectations need to be put in place and work to those expectations. Not everything is going to go perfectly to a timeline. If you can't understand that then it is obvious you have never done anything in life that isn't easy.