Conference affiliation might become extinct ??

[MADHAT1]

A radical thought , but the way the College Football landscape has changed over the tears, this might just become part of the future of college football

Something to think about if the TV Networks feel conference alignment isn't needed and all that is needed is to just place the top programs in it's own division, eventually conferenced alignment might be ended

Maybe have the programs that are consider blue bloods have performant places on that division and the other members (40? ) are based on how they were ranked in the past 5 years . With members being added and dropped based on their rankings for a 5 year period.

<"Times are changing, so you've got to adjust with the times," Drinkwitz told reporters. "But my question is why are we associated with conferences anymore if we're not playing for a conference championship?" >

Eli Drinkwitz wonders if there's no my conference title games, why have conferences?

The SEC will crown its last true champion in Atlanta on December 5, and Missouri's Eli Drinkwitz is already asking what the league is for after that.

www.footballscoop.com

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

I’ve seen banter on it but not seeing it.

There aren’t enough true blue bloods to sustain that model with interest. When games are played, someone always needs to lose.

 

[DJ Spanky]

Um, no.

The Big 10 is more than just an athletic conference.

 

[ScarletDave]

What the 14 year old Kalshi bros who come up with this stuff and make instagram reels about it don’t EVER realize though, is that someone always has to be at the bottom.
If you take the top 20 teams, so say 20th right now is Ohio State - guess what, 20th in a 20-team league is basically us and Purdue in the 18-team Big Ten. So Ohio State would be 2-8 or something like that. Them what, trim it to 10? Not everyone can be undefeated in a league.

fortunately, the top teams that hold conferences together do realize this. The media & influencers do not run things for a reason. And you can’t listen to Miami or anyone in the ACC who would do anything to get out

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

They don't need to play a conference championship game to crown a champion.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

Nope

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

They don't need to play a conference championship game to crown a champion.

I’m not seeing a universe where it appeals to Michigan or OSU not to have conferences. The comference set up allows them to maintain a gaudy record most years that keeps fans excited.

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

I’m not seeing a universe where it appeals to Michigan or OSU not to have conferences. The comference set up allows them to maintain a gaudy record most years that keeps fans excited.

It's why I don't buy the super conference idea. You get rid of Rutgers, Purdue, Maryland, Vandy, Miss. St., Arkansas types and these "blue bloods" suddenly start becoming 3-4-5 loss teams on a regular basis.

 

[rutgersguy2]

It's why I don't buy the super conference idea. You get rid of Rutgers, Purdue, Maryland, Vandy, Miss. St., Arkansas types and these "blue bloods" suddenly start becoming 3-4-5 loss teams on a regular basis.

I've said the same. Everyone can't be a winner and add in the fact the massive budgets they have all to become a bottom tier team.

I've also said some 30 whatever team super league would likely run into government involvement of some sort. Even though the PCSA probably will not pass look at how they try to limit the size of conferences in it. Also look at why the G6 has always been a part of the playoffs and the BCS before that. Bowlsby and Sankey said part of the reason is they didn't want outside interference from the government, so they want to give some opportunity to the G6. Can you imagine excluding a large swath of the largest public universities across a bunch of states and what that might bring.

The thing I think is possible in the future isn't a super conference but some sort of uneven performance based revenue sharing like the ACC and the old Big East for that matter. Some base level of revenue and then the rest based on performance and whatever other metrics.

 

[rutgersguy2]

I’ve seen banter on it but not seeing it.

There aren’t enough true blue bloods to sustain that model with interest. When games are played, someone always needs to lose.

The thing I've been hearing on pods is less about super conference and more about teams going independent like ND...partially because of some comments the Miami president made about their explorations on it because of the probation period needed to leave and join another conference that was written into the PCSA.

Big brands like Miami, OSU, Michigan etc...going independent and forming their own sort of collective for scheduling and each negotiating their own tv deals.

I don't see that either. First what about their other sports. Second, I don't think it's so easy to create schedules that are appealing for tv year after year. Third, what happens if you're in a down year, how appealing are you to tv then. There's leverage in negotiating within a larger group. If your down in one year you have others to carry the load and the networks can count on someone being good and appealing in a given year so you get the benefit of that. If you're on you're own then you're on your own with no one else to fall back on. Even ND was considered a little shaky for a bit when they were in a slump until Kelly came around. Not every big status program is a national brand like that.

 

[NickRU714]

It's why I don't buy the super conference idea. You get rid of Rutgers, Purdue, Maryland, Vandy, Miss. St., Arkansas types and these "blue bloods" suddenly start becoming 3-4-5 loss teams on a regular basis.

I think you (and others) are underestimating the greed of these programs.

None of them think they will be the team with 3-4-5 losses.
They would just see the extra money.

Did anyone hesitate adding USC or Oregon or Washington?
Ironically UCLA has been the most successful this year.

Would there be any hesitation if ND wanted to join the B1G?
Would Texas and Oklahoma have been turned away?

 

[Shelby65]

Um, no.

The Big 10 is more than just an athletic conference.

Debatable. Why was Rutgers admitted? And why admitted after Nebraska ? But nowadays money matters more. If there’s more money to be made with a different model, sooner or later that model will be adopted.

 

[Krup062]

The thing I've been hearing on pods is less about super conference and more about teams going independent like ND...partially because of some comments the Miami president made about their explorations on it because of the probation period needed to leave and join another conference that was written into the PCSA.

Big brands like Miami, OSU, Michigan etc...going independent and forming their own sort of collective for scheduling and each negotiating their own tv deals.

I don't see that either. First what about their other sports. Second, I don't think it's so easy to create schedules that are appealing for tv year after year. Third, what happens if you're in a down year, how appealing are you to tv then. There's leverage in negotiating within a larger group. If your down in one year you have others to carry the load and the networks can count on someone being good and appealing in a given year so you get the benefit of that. If you're on you're own then you're on your own with no one else to fall back on. Even ND was considered a little shaky for a bit when they were in a slump until Kelly came around. Not every big status program is a national brand like that.

There are several other problems with the independence idea people are talking about after the Miami comments.

Even if most non-football sports are not important, basketball still is, and the teams who would be the best candidates for football independence wouldn’t make a good group for basketball.

Scheduling would still be an issue. Their options would be the games playing each other, and the G5. As you mentioned, people are forgetting that scheduling is one of the big things that drove ND to the ACC.

 

[soundcrib]

Go back to regional and someone save Stanford and Cal from the ACC.

 

[M.Sherrane]

They don't need to play a conference championship game to crown a champion.

Exactly. The first Conference Championship Game was held by the SEC in 1992, when Alabama became the 60th SEC Champion that year. Ironically, they were also won the first SEC championship in 1933. What the Conference Championship Game eliminates is a potential tie, such as what happened in the SEC the following year when Alabama and Tulane went undefeated and shared the conference championship.

I remember in 2002 both Ohio State and Iowa went undefeated in conference play (B1G didn't have a Conference Championship Game until 2011). I remember some discussions where the B1G was considering crowning Iowa as the Champion to ensure that both Iowa and Ohio State would get BCS Bowls because #2 Ohio State would get into the BCS Championship Game, but 10-1 Iowa was ranked 8th in mid-November and was at risk of being left out of a BCS Bowl game.

It's why I don't buy the super conference idea. You get rid of Rutgers, Purdue, Maryland, Vandy, Miss. St., Arkansas types and these "blue bloods" suddenly start becoming 3-4-5 loss teams on a regular basis.

Exactly. Just last year we heard some SEC coaches complaining about the conference moving to a 9-game schedule. They'd rather play 4-5 Arkansas State (#118 Sagarin / #112 Colley) than 3-6 Arkansas (#57 Sagarin / #88 Colley). There isn't a single coach who wants to play a 12-game playoff during the regular season. That is the fantasy of delusional fans.

 

[bac2therac]

Don't dismiss this that quickly.

10 years ago no one could envision the **** show with NIL

$$$ is evrrything in sports

Academically the Big 10 brand can still exist but as an athletic conference it can easily turn to pixie dust

The tiered revenue share based on performance also looms

 

[RUChet]

Um, no.

The Big 10 is more than just an athletic conference.

How specifically has being in the B1G helped Rutgers?

we are running at the largest deficit never ever had for the AD

our sports teams have arguably performed worse overall than before the B1G

we were a good school before and we are a good school - we will never have a lack of applicants being in such high population area

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

How specifically has being in the B1G helped Rutgers?

we are running at the largest deficit never ever had for the AD

our sports teams have arguably performed worse overall than before the B1G

we were a good school before and we are a good school - we will never have a lack of applicants being in such high population area

Wrestling, women’s crew, both lacrosse & soccer programs, and field hockey have all had some or sustained success in the B1G. Were the”ode sports making final fours or producing national championships in the Big East?

 

[RUChet]

Wrestling, women’s crew, both lacrosse & soccer programs, and field hockey have all had some or sustained success in the B1G. Were the”ode sports making final fours or producing national championships in the Big East?

Lacrosse- had ncaa runs pre B1G and yes in B1G we had 1 F4 run and crap all other years so overall no more success

Soccer - made championship game and other ncaa runs pre B1G. Since B1G ZERO ncaa wins and only 1 invite i think. Should get a 2nd this year

wrestling - we were often a top 25 program pre BIG, but yes overall we are better wing usually too 15ish

Baseball - clearly more success pre B1G with multiple ncaa tourneys

Basketball - even taking out the F4 70’s team, we got to NCAA’s 3 times I think other years including 2 under Wenzel - pike has 2 in B1G with 1 win so overall I see
No improvement

Football - we are 100% worse as a program than pre B1G. We produced more pros pre B1G too.

don’t care about the fringe sports and sorry neither do 99% if

 

[50 yd line RR]

There’s more value in conference affiliation.
Even ND would be worth more!

 

[50 yd line RR]

Here’s another one from the same podcast.
I like this self proclaimed “Minnesota Moron”
He gets it.
I don’t think much of the country has much sympathy for us competing in a champagne league on a beer budget for the last 12 years , but that’s ok.

 

[AdventureHasAName]

How specifically has being in the B1G helped Rutgers?

we are running at the largest deficit never ever had for the AD

our sports teams have arguably performed worse overall than before the B1G

we were a good school before and we are a good school - we will never have a lack of applicants being in such high population area

$70 million/year and the best advertising the school has ever had (yes, even as a doormat).

 

[yesrutgers01]

How specifically has being in the B1G helped Rutgers?

we are running at the largest deficit never ever had for the AD

our sports teams have arguably performed worse overall than before the B1G

we were a good school before and we are a good school - we will never have a lack of applicants being in such high population area

It goes well beyond football - and that deficit is not because of the B1G.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

Don't dismiss this that quickly.

10 years ago no one could envision the **** show with NIL

$$$ is evrrything in sports

Academically the Big 10 brand can still exist but as an athletic conference it can easily turn to pixie dust

The tiered revenue share based on performance also looms

Tiered revenue model seems the much more likely direction in my opinion. Not great for RU of course - but theoretically fair.

The big dogs in the BIG have no interest in a 40 team super league when the run the show in the richest conference. Might appeal to Alabama and co but they won’t be in the drivers seat there.

An expanded ND model won’t happen because it would ultimately fail and the economists hired behind the scenes doing the math for individual team would run the numbers and see this. Other teams just don’t have the national followings to sustain it. OSU network TV just wouldn’t be worth anything close to what ND is worth to NBC. There isn’t national interest in OSU home games against cupcakes.

 

[NickRU714]

$70 million/year and the best advertising the school has ever had (yes, even as a doormat).

This is the big disconnect.

B1G membership has been great for the employees of the Athletic Department.
As you correctly point out - they are getting an extra $70m a year to spend on themselves.

As a fan, B1G membership has been a disaster.
That extra $70m has not translated into wins and frankly minimal enjoyment at best.

 

[Nyagentman]

How specifically has being in the B1G helped Rutgers?

we are running at the largest deficit never ever had for the AD

our sports teams have arguably performed worse overall than before the B1G

we were a good school before and we are a good school - we will never have a lack of applicants being in such high population area

School ranking has improved by 15 spots.

 

[RUChet]

It goes well beyond football - and that deficit is not because of the B1G.

Well we would be spending as much if not in the B1G so losses would be less. We have an atrocious ROI and it’s not sustainable

 

[yesrutgers01]

Well we would be spending as much if not in the B1G so losses would be less. We have an atrocious ROI and it’s not sustainable

We are still actually holding just over $50M in debt from the Stadium expansion. And our current largest expense is Greg's over inflated coaching and staff payroll.

And yes- costs have gone way up because of joining the B1G - but, if we had winning seasons- a large portion of our deficit would be covered by additional fans vs declining fans.

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

We are still actually holding just over $50M in debt from the Stadium expansion. And our current largest expense is Greg's over inflated coaching and staff payroll.

Damn, remember when they told everyone that a large chunk would be covered by donations, then barely any came in.

 

[RUChet]

We are still actually holding just over $50M in debt from the Stadium expansion. And our current largest expense is Greg's over inflated coaching and staff payroll.

And yes- costs have gone way up because of joining the B1G - but, if we had winning seasons- a large portion of our deficit would be covered by additional fans vs declining fans.

I am not confident we will ever win consistently in the B1G in football. Any coach that comes in and gets to a winning conf record which we’ve never had l, is going to get swooped up by a bigger performance and we will have w to start over. IU hit the jackpot with Cigs who wins everywhere but once he leaves we will see if IU can keep it up.

 

[rutgersguy2]

Damn, remember when they told everyone that a large chunk would be covered by donations, then barely any came in.

1M from Corzine and not sure much else.

My impression is that KZ and her team are trying to create the infrastructure and outreach that I’m not sure any prior AD here has done before. That takes time and would be aided by some decent level of meaningful performance (winning).

 

[rutgersguy2]

I am not confident we will ever win consistently in the B1G in football. Any coach that comes in and gets to a winning conf record which we’ve never had l, is going to get swooped up by a bigger performance and we will have w to start over. IU hit the jackpot with Cigs who wins everywhere but once he leaves we will see if IU can keep it up.

Every coach is different just like I’ve said with players. Also it’s not as if we’re in the G6.

Cignetti has stayed with IU but he’s not the only one. Bielema has been solid at Illinois and he’s still there. Dickert just re-signed with WF and Chesney is on the verge of re-signing at UCLA. Campbell was at ISU for like 10yrs.

Some coaches would love to go to the OSUs, Alabamas etc of the world but with that also comes the massive pressure cooker. Look at what Day is experiencing now at OSU and he’s been very successful there and has a national title. Same for Kiffin at LSU in year 1.

With the 24 team playoff and greater but not perfect parity because of NIL and portal, some coaches might like I’m happy where I am and can accomplish a lot right here without all the pressure of those other places.

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

I am not confident we will ever win consistently in the B1G in football. Any coach that comes in and gets to a winning conf record which we’ve never had l, is going to get swooped up by a bigger performance and we will have w to start over. IU hit the jackpot with Cigs who wins everywhere but once he leaves we will see if IU can keep it up.

So you're afraid of a coach making the program better and then leaving? You can't be serious.

Do you recognize how much better the candidate pool becomes when hiring the next coach after that?

 

[yesrutgers01]

Win at Rutgers while in the B1G - A great coach can make this his dream destination...Think about it- have a couple of years like Indiana just did- how much bigger of a stage could there be.

 

[50 yd line RR]

1M from Corzine and not sure much else.

My impression is that KZ and her team are trying to create the infrastructure and outreach that I’m not sure any prior AD here has done before. That takes time and would be aided by some decent level of meaningful performance (winning).

Corzine pledged money from the state , then reneged. They needed the money for infrastructure for Met Life stadium instead. Giants/Jets a private entity. NJ dosent even get the parking there ( like we did in the meadowlands).

 

[RUChet]

Every coach is different just like I’ve said with players. Also it’s not as if we’re in the G6.

Cignetti has stayed with IU but he’s not the only one. Bielema has been solid at Illinois and he’s still there. Dickert just re-signed with WF and Chesney is on the verge of re-signing at UCLA. Campbell was at ISU for like 10yrs.

Some coaches would love to go to the OSUs, Alabamas etc of the world but with that also comes the massive pressure cooker. Look at what Day is experiencing now at OSU and he’s been very successful there and has a national title. Same for Kiffin at LSU in year 1.

With the 24 team playoff and greater but not perfect parity because of NIL and portal, some coaches might like I’m happy where I am and can accomplish a lot right here without all the pressure of those other places.

Don’t think you can compare the astounding success Cigs has brining IU who had as miserable ale of a history as ours to a natty and 2 other great seasons to Billema at IL. Huge difference.

Cigs is special
Cheney looking really good so far

 

[rutgersguy2]

Don’t think you can compare the astounding success Cigs has brining IU who had as miserable ale of a history as ours to a natty and 2 other great seasons to Billema at IL. Huge difference.

Cigs is special
Cheney looking really good so far

He is special but my point is just because a someone does well, or astoundingly well in CC’s case, doesn’t mean they will automatically leave especially these days in the new CFB landscape where there is more parity.

 

[MADHAT1]

He is special but my point is just because a someone does well, or astoundingly well in CC’s case, doesn’t mean they will automatically leave especially these days in the new CFB landscape where there is more parity.

I think, for the present, offers from Ohio State, Michigan,Bama and LSU along with Texas will still cause a successful P-4 HC to jump ship if an offer is given.
If only because of being part of a program like they are and the type of respect programs like those bring to HCs that are successful there.
Even if being considered a success at one of those programs has a higher bar than the school they are at, the challenge a prestige programs like that bring to their HC is hard to pass up, maybe even for someone like C Cig.

 

[RUChet]

So you're afraid of a coach making the program better and then leaving? You can't be serious.

Do you recognize how much better the candidate pool becomes when hiring the next coach after that?

Who said afraid?
I’m being realistic

 

[Nycrusupporter]

I think, for the present, offers from Ohio State, Michigan,Bama and LSU along with Texas will still cause a successful P-4 HC to jump ship if an offer is given.
If only because of being part of a program like they are and the type of respect programs like those bring to HCs that are successful there.
Even if being considered a success at one of those programs has a higher bar than the school they are at, the challenge a prestige programs like that bring to their HC is hard to pass up, maybe even for someone like C Cig.

I completely disagree. Ignoring for the moment Cignetti’s age, why would he ever want to leave Indiana? He is a god there, and has proven he can compete with anyone. Why would Chesney leave UCLA to go somewhere else? He is probably living in Malibu and going out 2 or 3 times a week to some of the best restaurants in the world, and everyone is treating him like he is the king of the city. Why would he leave that to go somewhere else?