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Chris Ash - underrated recruiter??

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NickRU714

Heisman
Aug 18, 2009
14,244
13,040
113
With so many people expecting/predicting 5-6 win season and a bowl appearance - is Chris Ash's recruiting now underrated?

Especially when we don't even have an OC yet or know if we are getting the mythical "portal QB".

If all this roster needed was better coaching (again we don't even have an OC yet) that means Ash recruited at least a decent team?

Guess all those people claiming "nobody could win with this roster, can't expect the OC to make chicken salad out of chicken sh@t" were wrong.


@Knight Shift - the little OC dig is just for you :WideSmile:
 
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RUSK97

All-American
Dec 28, 2007
10,460
6,551
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I don't have a reply, but rather a question. None of Ash's recruiting classes, except for perhaps his first (when he had a short cycle and mostly inherited Flood's last class) were that poorly ranked. I mean they mostly weren't great, but based purely on ratings, the on-the-field performance certainly shouldn't have been chickensh1+.
 
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RUChoppin

Heisman
Dec 1, 2006
19,270
13,695
0
Ash was a bad recruiter not because he didn't bring in any good players... but because his approach was so scattershot that the players he brought in didn't form a cohesive team, and there were massive gaps that needed to be filled.

He started off recruiting to Mehringer's spread.... then scrapped that to recruit to Kill's more conservative pro style... then scrapped that to recruit to whatever the hell McNulty was trying to do...

Ended up with a lot of disparate odds and ends pieces, some of which are really good (e.g. Pacheco)... but not enough to put together a solid two deep that could compete in this conference, especially given the difficulties the outgoing staff had with "coaching them up" or being creative in leveraging the pieces they had.

This team already looked more competitive with Nunzio as HC/OC than with Ash/McNulty... and it wasn't because he suddenly had better players.
 
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2

24Babybull

Senior
Oct 15, 2006
1,056
449
83
Urban Meyer called him a great recruiter but he didn't know the Bergen Mafia ...so he had no shot in NJ.

 
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RUChoppin

Heisman
Dec 1, 2006
19,270
13,695
0
angmo said:
His last class was ranked 98th until Schiano came along. Seriously Chris Ash was an epic fail in every aspect of coaching. You have to really try to suck as bad as he did at everything.

He made Terry Shea look like Bear Bryant.
Click to expand...

Don't get me wrong, his recruiting was definitely headed in the wrong direction, and was never going to rebound given the product he put on the field - I was just talking about the guys he got on the roster heading into this season.
 
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angmo

All-Conference
Jul 24, 2017
2,142
2,321
113
Well I don't want to talk bad about the recruits. Schiano managed to put a decent class together and some of them were Ash recruits. Schiano can definitely coach these kids up. Ash made good players bad.

So glad he's gonna make Texas suck worse.
 
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DJ Spanky

DJ Spanky

Heisman
Jul 25, 2001
49,524
60,841
113
Ash took Hobbs direction about not recruiting Florida until this year: still not sure what the hell the logic was behind that, but he should have stood up for himself and done the right thing.
 
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Scarlet Blind_rivals

All-Conference
Aug 5, 2001
4,660
4,721
62
An example of Ash's recruiting-- LB one strength on the team...

2016 (Pollock and Manning never played/Flood recruits)
Battle 0.8346 8 FBS offers
Maddox-Williams 0.8099 4 FBS offers
2017
Fogg 0.894 about 20 FBS offers
Fatukasi 0.8487 9 FBS offers
Onyechi 0.8240 4 FBS offers
2018
Jennings 08158 2 FBS offers
Anderson 0.8539 9 FBS offers
2019(why take 5 LBs in one year is one example of Ash's good recruiting and poor roster management of positions)
Igwenagu 0.8646 6 FBS offers
Toure 0.8532 14 FBS offers
Ugwu 0.8466 13 FBS offers
Conti 0.8234 3 FBS offers
Singleton(2016) 0.9626 23 FBS offers

We have quite a few quality LBs at the expense of other positions, why do we need 4 deep at LB? Position by position recruiting there will be examples of this for four years. Too many one position nothing at another. This is just 1 of 7 position groups that get scholarships, P and K usually don't.
 
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A

angmo

All-Conference
Jul 24, 2017
2,142
2,321
113
I would take a stocking. Fill it with coal and smack that runt elf Ash around the head and neck with it. Who has a head coach that's 5'2"?
 
S

Scarlet_Monster

All-Conference
Jan 8, 2011
6,164
4,234
0
Scarlet Blind said:
An example of Ash's recruiting-- LB one strength on the team...

2016 (Pollock and Manning never played/Flood recruits)
Battle 0.8346 8 FBS offers
Maddox-Williams 0.8099 4 FBS offers
2017
Fogg 0.894 about 20 FBS offers
Fatukasi 0.8487 9 FBS offers
Onyechi 0.8240 4 FBS offers
2018
Jennings 08158 2 FBS offers
Anderson 0.8539 9 FBS offers
2019(why take 5 LBs in one year is one example of Ash's good recruiting and poor roster management of positions)
Igwenagu 0.8646 6 FBS offers
Toure 0.8532 14 FBS offers
Ugwu 0.8466 13 FBS offers
Conti 0.8234 3 FBS offers
Singleton(2016) 0.9626 23 FBS offers

We have quite a few quality LBs at the expense of other positions, why do we need 4 deep at LB? Position by position recruiting there will be examples of this for four years. Too many one position nothing at another. This is just 1 of 7 position groups that get scholarships, P and K usually don't.
Click to expand...

So what you're telling me is that Ash can only recruit on the level of a hot shot LB Coach, not a HC?
 
Q

Queztastic

Senior
Nov 1, 2013
831
499
63
Scarlet Blind said:
An example of Ash's recruiting-- LB one strength on the team...

2016 (Pollock and Manning never played/Flood recruits)
Battle 0.8346 8 FBS offers
Maddox-Williams 0.8099 4 FBS offers
2017
Fogg 0.894 about 20 FBS offers
Fatukasi 0.8487 9 FBS offers
Onyechi 0.8240 4 FBS offers
2018
Jennings 08158 2 FBS offers
Anderson 0.8539 9 FBS offers
2019(why take 5 LBs in one year is one example of Ash's good recruiting and poor roster management of positions)
Igwenagu 0.8646 6 FBS offers
Toure 0.8532 14 FBS offers
Ugwu 0.8466 13 FBS offers
Conti 0.8234 3 FBS offers
Singleton(2016) 0.9626 23 FBS offers

We have quite a few quality LBs at the expense of other positions, why do we need 4 deep at LB? Position by position recruiting there will be examples of this for four years. Too many one position nothing at another. This is just 1 of 7 position groups that get scholarships, P and K usually don't.
Click to expand...
WR is the same way. I know that Flood did not recruit enough WRs but Ash over recruited the position at the expense of the lines.

I believe we had zero senior WRs this year. Then we have 10 bunched together with 5 seniors next year and 5 the year after that. What was the plan? For the offense to be 11 receivers and a QB? At most 4 WRs play at once so having 10 bunched together like that seems to be wasting some of the 85 spots.

On this note, does anyone know the 'ideal' distribution for the 85 scholarships?
 
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A

angmo

All-Conference
Jul 24, 2017
2,142
2,321
113
DJ Spanky said:
Ash took Hobbs direction about not recruiting Florida until this year: still not sure what the hell the logic was behind that, but he should have stood up for himself and done the right thing.
Click to expand...
That's just nuts.
 
R

RU19931

All-Conference
May 3, 2004
2,887
2,679
0
Ash's recruiting we fair at best, but he also left us some talent, that with better coaching could be much more competitive until Greg can get a couple of his classes in.
 
K

kapyoche

All-Conference
Sep 11, 2010
5,151
1,509
0
Ash would have been a great recruiter and even a great coach if he had gotten just one QB in four years who could complete a short pass.

The difference between Bleichick and Ash is a QB who can complete a short pass.
 
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Scarlet Blind_rivals

All-Conference
Aug 5, 2001
4,660
4,721
62
Well the distribution should be 43 Offense/ 42 Defense or vice versa, you don't usually use a scholarship on P, K, or LS. There can be 5 OL, upto 4 WRs, upto 3 TE, 2 RBs, and 1 QB on field on Offense so 15, 3 deep 45, realistically you don't need 9 TEs, so a couple can go elsewhere. There can be with maximum 4 DL and 3 LB, I don't buy a 3/4D in college and 4 DBs on passing downs up to 6 DBs, 13 3 deep 39, again don't need 18 DBs but at least 12 few go elsewhere, That's 84, having a QB in each class is necessary so at least 4 on roster. Would make 85 ideally, but not exact.
 
R

rubaseball78_rivals

Heisman
Sep 29, 2005
14,051
16,131
0
kapyoche said:
Ash would have been a great recruiter and even a great coach if he had gotten just one QB in four years who could complete a short pass.

The difference between Bleichick and Ash is a QB who can complete a short pass.
Click to expand...
If you truly believe that then you haven't been watching the Patriots for the past 20 years.
 
LotusAggressor_rivals

LotusAggressor_rivals

All-American
Oct 11, 2003
16,315
8,155
113
kapyoche said:
Ash would have been a great recruiter and even a great coach if he had gotten just one QB in four years who could complete a short pass.

The difference between Bleichick and Ash is a QB who can complete a short pass.
Click to expand...
That's one out of about 10,000 differences between Ash and Belichick.
 
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rutgersal_rivals139582

Heisman
Jun 7, 2001
36,432
43,791
113
Ash went through a recruiting learning curve and his 2019 class was his best, thankfully, and there are an ample amount of kids who redshirted. Ignoring Florida was the biggest mistake of his tenure, because it deprived the team of speed and talent. His first staff was trash and his last staff was the best, imo, though Jerry Kill was his best assistant hire. If his last staff was his first, he might have had a chance to succeed. In fact, had he kept Panagos and Campanile his odds would have been much better. Panagos would have recruited DLs. as others pointed out, OL and DL recruiting was virtually nonexistent. If you can’t recruit them, you’ve got to develop them, which means taking tight ends and developing them into offensive tackles or recruiting defensive ends and developing them into defensive tackles. We did take LBers with the intention of developing them into DEs, so I like the depth at DE and LB. Just not enough DTs, which is why we’ll need Barrow to contribute right away.
 
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RU#1fan

RU#1fan

Heisman
Mar 7, 2003
23,733
12,416
113
RUSK97 said:
I don't have a reply, but rather a question. None of Ash's recruiting classes, except for perhaps his first (when he had a short cycle and mostly inherited Flood's last class) were that poorly ranked. I mean they mostly weren't great, but based purely on ratings, the on-the-field performance certainly shouldn't have been chickensh1+.
Click to expand...

huh ????
2020 Pre Schiano # 90
2019 Ranked #65
2018 Ranked #56
2017: Rutgers #42

Every Class except for 2017 was at the bottom of the B1G . Epic failure for Ash as an Recruiter.
 
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RUSK97

All-American
Dec 28, 2007
10,460
6,551
0
RU#1fan said:
huh ????
2020 Pre Schiano # 90
2019 Ranked #65
2018 Ranked #56
2017: Rutgers #42

Every Class except for 2017 was at the bottom of the B1G . Epic failure for Ash as an Recruiter.
Click to expand...
Forget class of 2020. Ash was let go early in the season. Can’t expect him to close on commitments when he’s no longer coach. The other three classes were poor for the B1G but on-the-field performance was far worse than classes ranked 45-65 would indicate. The only way you can explain the OOC losses to EMU and Buffalo. Whose rankings are these anyhow? Rivals or TOS?
 
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