Can’t make up the difference without Mag

[PSAL_Hoops]

Mag only 15 minutes each in both wins at Purdue and at NW. The overreaction to his loss is amazing. I guess when you can’t blame the refs you have to blame something. Oh well.

You realize we gave up 12 points in like 3 minutes with Wolf in the Indiana game with Oskar right? Those 15 minutes allowed for poor defenders to remain on the bench. Hyatt is hot and cold on defense. It’s match up dependent. Which is why some days he played more than Mag. But the the rest of our front court bench is a huge drop off on defense. Massive. 15 minutes is a huge deal.

 

[Scangg]

Mag played in 4 road conference games. Against Michigan state and Iowa we lost by double digits in and the wins against Purdue and NW he only played 15 minutes each and didn’t play key stretches of the game. Stop overrating him. It’s weird.

Replace his 15 min with Dean Oskar Simpson and do we win?

How can you not see what a drop-off it is from Mag to these bench guys?

 

[bethlehemfan]

We will be ok.

 

[Shelby65]

Replace his 15 min with Dean Oskar Simpson and do we win?

How can you not see what a drop-off it is from Mag to these bench guys?

agree a dropoff, but not as much as you think because Reiber isnt taking his minutes. also as stated, big runs sometimes happen unrelated to the lineup. further, on rare occasions the bench outplays the starters.

 

[Scangg]

agree a dropoff, but not as much as you think because Reiber isnt taking his minutes. also as stated, big runs sometimes happen unrelated to the lineup. further, on rare occasions the bench outplays the starters.

It's seems like it's more than you think and yes Dean did play some minutes at the 4 today

It also means more small lineups with Simpson getting more minutes who wasn't good today and that impacts our size and rebounding advantage

 

[Shelby65]

yes, all good points. the team is better with Mag generally. Not disputable. but he has off games too. am mainly still rebutting that Illinois would not have had the big run with Mag playing. is not a legit assertion.

 

[ru66]

Nonsense about all teams having injuries, as if they don't matter. By the way do all teams lose a player who the coach and it's players call the team's " anchor". Belittling the significance of his loss is just kidding oneself. I'm sure we'd prefer to play teams that have loss a key player. The odds of winning increase significantly.

 

[wheezer]

If you think we win this game with mag then you think he’s a first team big ten player. Not sure what you’re watching.

With mag maybe we go into the half up 12

No one knows if this would be true or not, and opinions against that statement hold no water either

I personally think both recent losses would have been games that went down to final shots and final plays and no one knows either any better than that or worse than that

 

[Mr. Magoo1]

The bench was 3-16 today. Without Mag the bench plays more minutes. It matters

That’s exactly right. It’s not that Mag is so good, it’s that the bench is so bad.

 

[Shelby65]

Nonsense about all teams having injuries, as if they don't matter. By the way do all teams lose a player who the coach and it's players call the team's " anchor". Belittling the significance of his loss is just kidding oneself. I'm sure we'd prefer to play teams that have loss a key player. The odds of winning increase significantly.

no one is disputing that injuries affect the liklihood of winning. what I am saying is, and I think some others are saying, is that offensive futility in the second half of game is primarily why they lost.

 

[rob kight]

One final Mag point.
The shame of the situation was Mag performance was progressing more than anyone on the team game by game.
In the MSU game before the injury he had 7 points and 3 rebounds in 12 minutes. The entire bench (6 players) played 46 minutes and had 6 points and 4 rebounds.

 

[RUChoppin]

no one is disputing that injuries affect the liklihood of winning. what I am saying is, and I think some others are saying, is that offensive futility in the second half of game is primarily why they lost.

For long stretch of the second half, we had no back to the basket offensive threat, which completely changed how we were able to put pressure on their defense. Our offense struggles at times even at full strength, but removing our interior threat entirely led to futility.

On top of that, we had no one in the post who could match up with either Hawkins or Dainja during those stretches.

It was the combination of both Mag and Omoruyi being on the bench that let this game slip away in the second half.

 

[Shelby65]

One final Mag point.
The shame of the situation was Mag performance was progressing more than anyone on the team game by game.
In the MSU game before the injury he had 7 points and 3 rebounds in 12 minutes. The entire bench (6 players) played 46 minutes and had 6 points and 4 rebounds.

one game doesn't make a trend.

 

[RUChoppin]

one game doesn't make a trend.

Over his prior 6 games, he'd been averaging 10.1/5.7 per game in 29.7 min. It was more than a single game.

 

[G- RUnit]

one game doesn't make a trend.

Yes we will miss him. And he did seem to be improving.
But stop making him to be Michael Jordan.
We also won MSU in the 2nd half without him.
SHU game he had the worst plus/minus in the game.
We have already made up the rebounding. Scoring by Oskar and Hyatt kept us in the Indiana game and we hit some free throws, who knows….
We can win with out him. We would be better with him for sure and will miss him but we can and will win without him.
Biggest concern is Paul’s appearance and disappearance often in the same game.

 

[RUChoppin]

Yes we will miss him. And he did seem to be improving.
But stop making him to be Michael Jordan.
We also won MSU in the 2nd half without him.
SHU game he had the worst plus/minus in the game.
We have already made up the rebounding. Scoring by Oskar and Hyatt kept us in the Indiana game and we hit some free throws, who knows….
We can win with out him. We would be better with him for sure and will miss him but we can and will win without him.
Biggest concern is Paul’s appearance and disappearance often in the same game.

For someone who thinks playing at MSG had such a huge negative impact, you are really downplaying the loss of a 25+ mpg starter.

 

[G- RUnit]

For someone who thinks playing at MSG had such a huge negative impact, you are really downplaying the loss of a 25+ mpg starter.

I think MSG and three away games in a week was a huge factor. Both emotionally and travel wise. Bad mojo too in light of Mag’s injury. No other B1G school has to jump through hoops at the B1G’s whim and ridiculous answer that “logistics” fit. Indy, MSU and Illinois all benefitted from RU travel escapades and logistics. What a bunch of proverbial crap.

We sorely miss Mags but do believe we can and will win without him. We have to.

We did beat MSU in the 2nd half, came awfully close to beating Indiana on the road and were beating Illinois at the half.

I am not ready to throw in the towel, although the loss is massive, still believe we can win. Don’t put words in my mouth and not downplaying anything.

 

[ru66]

one game doesn't make a trend.

Huh? That's how many of the " expert " posters think, not only when the game is ongoing but immediately after ( check out Bac' recap after every game).

 

[RUChoppin]

I think MSG and three away games in a week was a huge factor. Both emotionally and travel wise. Bad mojo too in light of Mag’s injury. No other B1G school has to jump through hoops at the B1G’s whim and ridiculous answer that “logistics” fit. Indy, MSU and Illinois all benefitted from RU travel escapades and logistics. What a bunch of proverbial crap.

We sorely miss Mags but do believe we can and will win without him. We have to.

We did beat MSU in the 2nd half, came awfully close to beating Indiana on the road and were beating Illinois at the half.

I am not ready to throw in the towel, although the loss is massive, still believe we can win. Don’t put words in my mouth and not downplaying anything.

I think we'll do well enough in these last games to make the tournament. I just feel our tournament run is going to be very limited without Mag unless Pike can find a way to rebuild the concept of this team to function as well as it did when Mag was on the floor.

 

[anon1753890747]

One final Mag point.
The shame of the situation was Mag performance was progressing more than anyone on the team game by game.
In the MSU game before the injury he had 7 points and 3 rebounds in 12 minutes. The entire bench (6 players) played 46 minutes and had 6 points and 4 rebounds.

This.
He was trending up! he was also called the glue. His team intangibles are off the chart.
If he continued playing like he did the last few games including the first half of the MSU
Game, MVP!
I can’t ever remember a player at RU breaking out the way MAG was

 

[G- RUnit]

Can’t give up. That’s all. Oskar has played better than most ever thought possible.
Hyatt when good can score.
Rebounding hasn’t seen a significant drop off.
Maybe something clicks and Simpson gets better.
Still firmly believe we can win.
Look at it all as icing and bonus now.

And if we somehow fall short of previous expectations still valuable experience for next year and year after. We are a program now.

 

[Scangg]

That’s exactly right. It’s not that Mag is so good, it’s that the bench is so bad.

It's both

Plus Mag's intangibles are off the charts

 

[RUDead]

they have no choice, you either make up for Mag or you end up in the NIT

That's everything going forward. Take this easy stretch and learn how to play without Mag or it's going to be an early exit this year.

 

[BillyC80]

The thing about Mag is that with him in the lineup, our defense goes from good to WEAPONIZED.

His improving offense and clutch shooting was an added bonus that made him ultra valuable and along with his defense, completely irreplaceable.

That said , we can still win the next 6 (I think we go 4-2).

 

[fluoxetine]

Bigger factor is ridiculous palming call which took Paul out of game.

if a single palming call took Paul out of the game, then Paul is a ******* loser and we should pull his scholarship.

Luckily that’s complete nonsense and it was one play in a 40 minute game

 

[fluoxetine]

Guys, I hate to go down this road because it sounds like I’m being negative about Mag and that is not my intent. But..

If Mag is somehow a ******* superstar who makes us 10ppg better why was he playing the fewest minutes of all our starters?

I love Mag. I love what he did for the team. He is not the sole difference maker in games we lost by 9 points.

 

[RUbacker]

Guys, I hate to go down this road because it sounds like I’m being negative about Mag and that is not my intent. But..

If Mag is somehow a ******* superstar who makes us 10ppg better why was he playing the fewest minutes of all our starters?

I love Mag. I love what he did for the team. He is not the sole difference maker in games we lost by 9 points.

You still don’t get it.

 

[fluoxetine]

You still don’t get it.

I do get it. We don’t have a player, including Mag, that is worth nearly 10ppg. If you think we do, you are just wrong and don’t really understand how many points that is.

 

[Scangg]

Guys, I hate to go down this road because it sounds like I’m being negative about Mag and that is not my intent. But..

If Mag is somehow a ******* superstar who makes us 10ppg better why was he playing the fewest minutes of all our starters?

I love Mag. I love what he did for the team. He is not the sole difference maker in games we lost by 9 points.

Before when Mag was out Hyatt was in. That's not an insanely horrible drop off

We saw an Oskar Dean 4/5 lineup bc Mag is out. That's the worst 4/5 combo in the league

The players who are forced to take extra minutes now are a very significant drop off. Dean Oskar Wolf Simpson minutes up and they mostly play pretty poor. Oskar hit some 3's but if he doesn't do that he brings nothing. Simpson will show a flash then revert to looking like a freshman. Dean and Wolf have not played well in forever