Bravery test for Leftists

[atlkvb]

Our debt problem is obviously two-pronged; too much spending and not enough tax revenue.

Well it stands to reason if we're spending too much money we're not paying for what we actually have in tax revenue therefore we have a deficit. Why isn't over 3 trillion dollars annually enough money? We collect more in tax revenue than we ever have in history and you're saying it's still not enough? Yet consistent with the purpose of this thread you refuse to say how much is enough? Then call me a name for suggesting that we already spend too much and are probably taxed too much as a result.

 

[atlkvb]

Somebody needs to fact check your BS

All right if you won't voluntarily leave let me force you to leave by shutting your filthy mouth up. Why isn't the amount of money we currently take in however much that is not enough? How much more should we be spending before we allow the people who earned the money to keep what's left, and how much of what they earn should we allow them to keep? Half, 1/3, most, none?

Run along now.

 

[Boomboom521]

All income should be offered up to Lenin’s and Marx’s memory......people should be left with only enough to eat potatoes, pirogies, drink vodka, and buy fur hats and scarfs.

 

[countryroads89_rivals]

Why isn't over 3 trillion dollars annually enough money?

Because we have an infatuation with military spending. We love war. We are scared to death that if we don’t spend enough on defense, someone may threaten us. We outspend the next 8 countries combined.

we already spend too much and are probably taxed too much as a result.

No, I’m saying we spend too much and we should increase the marginal tax rates to bring in more tax revenue.

Seriously, read the excerpt from the article in my last post. You will learn something.

 

[countryroads89_rivals]

All right if you won't voluntarily leave let me force you to leave by shutting your filthy mouth up.

Hahahahahaha.

You invite people to post in your thread and then get mad and want them to leave.

 

[atlkvb]

Hahahahahaha.

You invite people to post in your thread and then get mad and want them to leave.

What is the amount of income we should allow people who earn it to keep? Just give me a number.

For instance if you earned income in the United States of America you should keep 85% of what you earn no matter how you earn it... no matter how much you earn or how little. It is your money and you should keep 85% of it.

All I'm asking for from you or anyone else posting in this thread with the name calling and all the other subterfuge, is YOUR numbers? What are they?

 

[atlkvb]

I’m saying we spend too much and we should increase the marginal tax rates to bring in more tax revenue.

Actually this tells me all I need to know about where you stand. We're not taxed enough and we're spending beyond where we should be taxed.

 

[atlkvb]

Because we have an infatuation with military spending.

Our military spending isn't even close to half of that total 3 trillion dollar budget. You're delusional.

 

[countryroads89_rivals]

What is the amount of income we should allow people who earn it to keep? Just give me a number.

For instance if you earned income in the United States of America you should keep 85% of what you earn no matter how you earn it... no matter how much you earn or how little. It is your money and you should keep 85% of it.

All I'm asking for from you or anyone else posting in this thread with the name calling and all the other subterfuge, is YOUR numbers? What are they?

You are being too simple minded (not trying to insult you). We have a progressive tax system in this country. Read the links I provided. You will learn something. Educate yourself on marginal tax rates. I’m certainly not the expert in this area but I have a basic understanding of our tax history, our budget, our deficit and our debt.

 

[countryroads89_rivals]

Our military spending isn't even close to half of that total 3 trillion dollar budget. You're delusional.

Where did I ever say it was half?

 

[atlkvb]

You are being too simple minded (not trying to insult you). We have a progressive tax system in this country. Read the links I provided. You will learn something. Educate yourself on marginal tax rates. I’m certainly not the expert in this area but I have a basic understanding of our tax history, our budget, our deficit and our debt.

I am opposed to our "progressive" tax system and I'm trying to get you and the rest of the Left to defend it with hard numbers.

Your refusal to do so tells me more than you think you are not telling me.

 

[atlkvb]

Where did I ever say it was half?

I asked you why over 3 trillion dollars a year is not enough and you said it's because we have an infatuation with the military. So I responded that our military spending is not even half of what that 3 trillion dollar total represents. Matter of fact it's not even a 1/3.

So I ask you again why is 3 trillion dollars not enough money to spend?

 

[Boomboom521]

I asked you why over 3 trillion dollars a year is not enough and you said it's because we have an infatuation with the military. So I responded that our military spending is not even half of what that 3 trillion dollar total represents. Matter of fact it's not even a 1/3.

So I ask you again why is 3 trillion dollars not enough money to spend?

Ask the GOP Congress that just ran up a pile more debt

 

[atlkvb]

Ask the GOP Congress that just ran up a pile more debt

Better than that I'll ask Nancy how much less spending the House is proposing this year to begin to whittle down that deficit?

Trump put his spending cuts on the table now let's see what Nancy and the boyz do?

 

[countryroads89_rivals]

Ask the GOP Congress that just ran up a pile more debt

GOP controlled the WH and both Houses of Congress and they still ran up the debt.

 

[Boomboom521]

Better than that I'll ask Nancy how much less spending the House is proposing this year to begin to whittle down that deficit?

Trump put his spending cuts on the table now let's see what Nancy and the boyz do?

Let the GOP off the hook, and blame the Dem boogieman? I’ll agree that she looks like a boogieman, but until they pass a budget.....you ain’t got shiiiiiiiit.

She just got the Gephardt rule back in place.

 

[countryroads89_rivals]

I am opposed to our "progressive" tax system and I'm trying to get you and the rest of the Left to defend it with hard numbers.

This is from "The Balance."

A progressive tax imposes a higher rate on the wealthy than on the poor. It is based on the taxpayer's ability to pay. Why should the wealthy pay a greater portion of their income to the government? Poor families spend a larger share of their income on the cost of living. They need all the money they earn to afford basics like shelter, food, and transportation. A tax decreases their ability to afford a decent standard of living.

This is so obvious I shouldn't even have to explain it to you.

 

[atlkvb]

Let the GOP off the hook, and blame the Dem boogieman? I’ll agree that she looks like a boogieman, but until they pass a budget.....you ain’t got shiiiiiiiit.

She just got the Gephardt rule back in place.

I'll bet one of the first things they restore funding to is Planned Parenthood?

 

[atlkvb]

This is from "The Balance."

A progressive tax imposes a higher rate on the wealthy than on the poor. It is based on the taxpayer's ability to pay. Why should the wealthy pay a greater portion of their income to the government? Poor families spend a larger share of their income on the cost of living. They need all the money they earn to afford basics like shelter, food, and transportation. A tax decreases their ability to afford a decent standard of living.

This is so obvious I shouldn't even have to explain it to you.

I actually think the absolute poorest or lowest income groups shouldn't pay any taxes on their income. If what you posted here is true why should we force them to pay what little they earn in taxes?

However at the other end of the scale a "Progressive" tax system becomes confiscatory IMO when people who earn large incomes aren't allowed to keep even 60% of it!

To me that is just as immoral as taxing the very poorest for what little they earn. I posted in this thread what I think a legitimate amount is to pay regardless of your income down to $15,000 a year. I have yet to read your numbers or anyone else's on the Left.

 

[Boomboom521]

This is from "The Balance."

A progressive tax imposes a higher rate on the wealthy than on the poor. It is based on the taxpayer's ability to pay. Why should the wealthy pay a greater portion of their income to the government? Poor families spend a larger share of their income on the cost of living. They need all the money they earn to afford basics like shelter, food, and transportation. A tax decreases their ability to afford a decent standard of living.

This is so obvious I shouldn't even have to explain it to you.

I tried this convo with the mofo befo.....also add into that the benefits the wealthy receive by way to property value protection, better schools, less police harassment, business connections, investment opportunities, quality of life, healthier diet and lifestyle, etc.....

Point being: the wealthy have the opportunity to use wealth to become more wealthy. Lower middle class and working class Americans spend more to maintain a basic life. They receive less benefits and less opportunity. Progressive tax seeks to balance that, if only a little.

But it is all just Marxist propaganda to this nutjob blowhard. If only he spent his time doing what he actually wants to be doing.....which would be giving nutjobs and blowing hard.....we wouldn’t have to read so much of the nutjob blowhard.

 

[Boomboom521]

I'll bet one of the first things they restore funding to is Planned Parenthood?

Good

 

[countryroads89_rivals]

Trump put his spending cuts on the table now let's see what Nancy and the boyz do?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

In February 2018, President Trump released his budget proposal for fiscal year 2019. Under his proposal, the federal budget would be $4.407 trillion. The U.S. government estimates it will receive $3.422 trillion in revenue, creating a $985 billion deficit for October 1, 2018, through September 30, 2019.

The budget deficit for 2019 is estimated to be $985 billion (based on trump's budget proposal). The budget deficit for 2018 was $833 billion, for 2017 it was $665 billion and for 2016 it was $585 billion. So, under trump, the budget deficit has increased from $585 billion in 2016 to $985 billion for 2019, a 68% increase.

 

[D. Denzil Finney]

Let's see how many of you honestly answer this question:

When it comes to taxation of upper income earners, what is a 'fair share' to tax? In other words, at what income level are folks considered "wealthy" by you Leftists, and what percent of that income (whatever it is) should be confiscated...oops...or...uh..."taxed" as their 'fair share' to be turned into Democrat handouts for the poor?

I need a number for earnings and a percentage of that which gets taxed...say for instance 48% of anything above 250,000. Got it?

OK...let's hear it.

10% or a mutually agreed upon for all earnings for EVERYONE on either Total Income or Net Worth, whichever is greater -- no personal exemptions or writeoffs other than those that pertain to employee salaries and paid benefits.

 

[atlkvb]

I tried this convo with the mofo befo.....also add into that the benefits the wealthy receive by way to property value protection, better schools, less police harassment, business connections, investment opportunities, quality of life, healthier diet and lifestyle, etc.....

Point being: the wealthy have the opportunity to use wealth to become more wealthy. Lower middle class and working class Americans spend more to maintain a basic life. They receive less benefits and less opportunity. Progressive tax seeks to balance that, if only a little.

But it is all just Marxist propaganda to this nutjob blowhard. If only he spent his time doing what he actually wants to be doing.....which would be giving nutjobs and blowing hard.....we wouldn’t have to read so much of the nutjob blowhard.

The entire argument of the Left that you espouse is that the wealthy get their money off the backs of the poor. Therefore incomes need to be "redistributed" to rebalance that unequal equation.

If the wealthy have all these benefits you posted and the poor are so disadvantaged as a result, how is the Left's argument even sane to suggest the wealthy only get that way by taking the money from the poor therefore justifying income redistribution through progressive taxation?

The argument goes the wealthy steal their benefits from the poor therefore we on the Left must take back what the wealthy have stolen from the poor and give it back to who it really belongs to.

 

[atlkvb]

10% or a mutually agreed upon for all earnings for EVERYONE on either Total Income or Net Worth, whichever is greater -- no personal exemptions or writeoffs other than those that pertain to employee salaries and paid benefits.

That would actually be a lot better than what we have now.

 

[Keyser76]

The entire argument of the Left that you espouse is that the wealthy get their money off the backs of the poor. Therefore incomes need to be "redistributed" to rebalance that unequal equation.

If the wealthy have all these benefits you posted and the poor are so disadvantaged as a result how is the Left's argument even sane to suggest the wealthy only get that way by taking the money from the poor therefor justifying income redistribution through progressive taxation?

Lol, just cause you ask a question doesn't mean it makes enough sense to answer, I imagine the rich all get their money by working as hard as Ivanka, how would you rubes know what to rail against next without Fox? "infanticide" "wealth redistribution" "socialism" "Venezuela" anything to not have to comment on what your boy says or does or who he has employed in the past that become lying criminals only after they no longer are employed by Donnie. At least cadet bone spurs made it to Vietnam, maybe he can visit the Hanoi Hilton and tell us how McCain was a loser again. Some vets will never forget that.

 

[atlkvb]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

In February 2018, President Trump released his budget proposal for fiscal year 2019. Under his proposal, the federal budget would be $4.407 trillion. The U.S. government estimates it will receive $3.422 trillion in revenue, creating a $985 billion deficit for October 1, 2018, through September 30, 2019.

The budget deficit for 2019 is estimated to be $985 billion (based on trump's budget proposal). The budget deficit for 2018 was $833 billion, for 2017 it was $665 billion and for 2016 it was $585 billion. So, under trump, the budget deficit has increased from $585 billion in 2016 to $985 billion for 2019, a 68% increase.

All that is true using CBO static scoring analysis. However if you remember last year budgets were projected to be significantly less than what they have turned out to be yet we still spent the additional revenue.

The economy is growing as a result of tax cuts and with additional revenue we should be concentrating on spending instead of more taxing to close those deficits.

 

[atlkvb]

Lol, just cause you ask a question doesn't mean it makes enough sense to answer, I imagine the rich all get their money by working as hard as Ivanka, how would you rubes know what to rail against next without Fox? "infanticide" "wealth redistribution" "socialism" "Venezuela" anything to not have to comment on what your boy says or does or who he has employed in the past that become lying criminals only after they no longer are employed by Donnie. At least cadet bone spurs made it to Vietnam, maybe he can visit the Hanoi Hilton and tell us how McCain was a loser again. Some vets will never forget that.

Those are exactly the kind of numbers I've been looking for! Don't you feel so much better providing them?

 

[Snow Sled Baby]

I'm going to answer my own question just so you Leftists will get an idea of the type of numbers I'm asking for from you.

I think the top tax rate should be 15%. Non-deductible based on earned income either through savings or Investments or however you put dollars in your pocket. I think 15% across the board for everyone who earned income is both fair and will provide plenty of money to fund all the operations of Uncle Sam that are either needed or necessary.

If that's not enough money then we're spending too much.

So if you earn $15,000 in one year you pay 15% on that income. That's $2,250.

You earn 150,000...you pay 15% on that income. That's 22,500.

You earn 150 million you pay 15% on that income. That's 22,500,000.

See how easy that is?
(but not if you want it all or think it all belongs to the government)

fairest way to tax everyone and encourage capitalism and reinvestment of wealth and profits

 

[Shirley Knott]

I actually think if you were brave enough to be completely honest about it you don't think there should be any limits on anyone's income that is taxed. We'll just take what we need and maybe leave you with the rest which should be enough if we say it is. What is the philosophy or the basis behind taking more than 10 to 20% of anything anyone earns?

Socialist 1040 : Line one Income How much did you make
Line two Taxes Send line one amount to us.....

 

[atlkvb]

Socialist 1040 : Line one Income How much did you make
Line two Taxes Send line one amount to us.....

This is more poignant than even I think you realize Shirley Knott. I am convinced one of the reasons the Left refuses to put hard numbers to what I've asked is because they think all income is to be taxed! The more you make, the less of it you get the keep and the more of it they will tax.

Putting a hard number to that automatically limits how much the Left can take of what you earn. They refuse to do that because they want it all, just as you said!

 

[atlkvb]

To those of you on the Left who posted in this thread, Finney suggested a 10% flat rate and no deductions or exemptions and I suggested a 15% rate. (I could live with 10%)

Eliminate all incomes below $25,000 a year. Tax everyone else at that same 10 or 15% rate.

Those are hard numbers, how many of you on the Left agree with them or think that's still not enough to be taxing folks who earn significantly higher wages?

 

[WVU82_rivals]

 

[WVU82_rivals]

 

[Shirley Knott]

This is more poignant than even I think you realize Shirley Knott. I am convinced one of the reasons the Left refuses to put hard numbers to what I've asked is because they think all income is to be taxed! The more you make, the less of it you get the keep and the more of it they will tax.

Putting a hard number to that automatically limits how much the Left can take of what you earn. They refuse to do that because they want it all, just as you said!

They would love to put a hard number to the taxable amount. All is their ultimate goal. They think that government should do the job of redistributing taxable(all) income and don't recognize the fact that governments are terrible with monies and waste more than they spend efficiently. Thus the fact that socialists do good until they run out of our money...

 

[atlkvb]

They would love to put a hard number to the taxable amount. All is their ultimate goal. They think that government should do the job of redistributing taxable(all) income and don't recognize the fact that governments are terrible with monies and waste more than they spend efficiently. Thus the fact that socialists do good until they run out of our money...

It's even more sinister than that in my opinion.

They do not believe what you earn belongs to you and at a certain income level they sincerely believe you do not actually need or deserve to keep what you've earned!

They anoint themselves as the arbiters of what is "too much" or "enough" for someone to have, then insist that you give them your hard-earned money to "even out" the results for those who they think deserve as much as or more than what you worked so hard to achieve.

Nauseating arrogant bloodsucking leeches.

 

[Bulya]

All right if you won't voluntarily leave let me force you to leave by shutting your filthy mouth up. Why isn't the amount of money we currently take in however much that is not enough? How much more should we be spending before we allow the people who earned the money to keep what's left, and how much of what they earn should we allow them to keep? Half, 1/3, most, none?

Run along now.

LMAO yeah we take SO MUCH of Gates, Buffet, the Koch Brothers and even Trumpsters fortunes in taxes they can barely make it! They get this first class VOLUNTEER Military Machine protecting their riches and property you can't have it both ways big boy that protection and big earnings on the backs of the civilian grunts working for their companies making chump change while they get a sweet 15-20% Capital Gains Tax on all that loot they make. Whole thing is a f*cking joke and scam on the rest of America's Citizens. As King said in Platoon "The Rich have been f*cking over the Poor forever...always have and always will." Now in 2019 it's worse than ever thanks the bought and paid for US Congress and the Big 5 who own them and run America. Big Pharma, Big Insurance, Big Oil, Big Banks and Wall Street. Sure they all needed that Big Tax break just like the Billionaires I listed above just ask GM and the 15,000 employees they are cutting lose while pocketing that tax break and giving to the shareholders who are the guys listed above as well. One thing is clear you are clearly out of your mind with your thought process protecting those who don't need it.

 

[atlkvb]

LMAO yeah we take SO MUCH of Gates, Buffet, the Koch Brothers and even Trumpsters fortunes in taxes they can barely make it! They get this first class VOLUNTEER Military Machine protecting their riches and property you can't have it both ways big boy that protection and big earnings on the backs of the civilian grunts working for their companies making chump change while they get a sweet 15-20% Capital Gains Tax on all that loot they make. Whole thing is a f*cking joke and scam on the rest of America's Citizens. As King said in Platoon "The Rich have been f*cking over the Poor forever...always have and always will." Now in 2019 it's worse than ever thanks the bought and paid for US Congress and the Big 5 who own them and run America. Big Pharma, Big Insurance, Big Oil, Big Banks and Wall Street. Sure they all needed that Big Tax break just like the Billionaires I listed above just ask GM and the 15,000 employees they are cutting lose while pocketing that tax break and giving to the shareholders who are the guys listed above as well. One thing is clear you are clearly out of your mind with your thought process protecting those who don't need it.

How do you know what someone needs and doesn't need? 100% guaranteed YOU don't send in one dime extra. Yet you insist someobody else has "too much"?

Based on what your feelings? Run your compassion out of your own wallet. Stop judging your compassion by how much more you insist somebody else should pay!

 

[Bulya]

How do you know what someone needs and doesn't need? 100% guaranteed YOU don't send in one dime extra. Yet you insist someobody else has "too much"?

Based on what your feelings? Run your compassion out of your own wallet. Stop judging your compassion by how much more you insist somebody else should pay!

It's common sense not compassion. We've had a tax system in place for 100 years and it keeps getting skewed to favor the rich. Ike cut it first in 56, then Ronnie in 86 and Bush in 04 when he should have slapped a war tax on the Top 10% to pay for the 2 wars we were raging at the time WITH a Volunteer Armed Forces and now Dummy Trump shoved through the biggest scam in history for the rich.

For a car guy I'm shocked at your lack of understanding basic mathematics.

 

[atlkvb]

It's common sense not compassion. We've had a tax system in place for 100 years and it keeps getting skewed to favor the rich. Ike cut it first in 56, then Ronnie in 86 and Bush in 04 when he should have slapped a war tax on the Top 10% to pay for the 2 wars we were raging at the time WITH a Volunteer Armed Forces and now Dummy Trump shoved through the biggest scam in history for the rich.

For a car guy I'm shocked at your lack of understanding basic mathematics.

As a taxpayer I'm stunned at your insensitivity over what folks earn and deserve to keep. Not one of you posting in this thread ever answered my original question, none of you can explain why three Trillion dollars isn't enough money for ANY government to spend and I for damn sure know not a single one of you sends in a penny extra!

You take every legal deduction you are allowed, (and probably some you aren't) then parade around on your self righteous crusade demanding that "the rich" (however you define them) pay even more than the 87% load they're already carrying.

Go away Bulya you really irritate me.