A miraculous turnaround at MSU

[615dawg]

In the very early days of this board, we used to trash Brenda Bowlin for the horrible coach she was. Our volleyball team was garbage despite having some decent talent. Volleyball hasn't really been a great sport at MSU. After soccer went to the NCAA Tournament a couple years ago, it remains the only sport that our beloved Bulldogs have never been to the Dance in.

In State's first eight seasons of Volleyball, they were 3-50 in conference play. In 2017 and 2018, they had back to back 1-17 SEC seasons and a 2-16 season in 2019. In 2012, they went 0-20. The school record for SEC wins is 8, they went 8-12 in 2006. They have NEVER had a winning SEC season and have only had six winning seasons (three of which were just 1 game above .500)

We're about midway through the conference slate, and that appears to have changed.

Volleydawgs are 13-5 (4-2 SEC). Last night, they defeated No. 25 South Carolina. They have wins over Florida, two wins over LSU, Indiana and Oklahoma. They played well at defending national champion Kentucky, who is atop the SEC. Florida and LSU were picked to finish 2nd and 3rd in the SEC, respectively. Their five losses are to highly ranked Kentucky, Florida and Georgia Tech, a Houston squad that is 15-3 and will win the American, and a 14-4 Syracuse that will be an NCAA Tourney team.

Their next seven SEC opponents - all but one have a losing SEC record (Texas A&M is 4-3 and has feasted on the bottom of the conference). They play Ole Miss Sunday, who is decent, but is 2-4 in the SEC. A win over the Lady Yancys would be huge for momentum.

This next stretch of seven SEC games is huge. If State can go 5-2 or better, it would probably lock up a NCAA bid, as well as their first winning SEC season ever. It also comes as the junior class in Mississippi high school volleyball is easily the best ever - several nationally ranked prospects - some with MSU ties in their families. Madkin. Hazelwood.

 

[Shmuley]

What does this have to do with US News rankings?

 

[Smoked Toag]

Julie doing work

 

[o_fredgarvin]

This is quite an accomplishment given how shallow the talent pool is in Mississippi.

 

[Cooterpoot]

Do they wear those tight shorts?

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

I looked at the roster yesterday and I don’t think there’s a single player from Mississippi. Probably 75 percent of them are from Florida.

 

[8dog]

Minshews sister is on the team but yeah MS has just now gotten really into VB at the HS level. And the player of the year last year went to LSU to play Beach VB.

 

[Dawgg]

I looked at the roster yesterday and I don’t think there’s a single player from Mississippi. Probably 75 percent of them are from Florida.

How late at night were you looking at our volleyball roster?***

 

[dawgstudent]

Isn't there about to be a volleyball training facility built in the Jackson metro?

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

Yeah those headshots are super hawt.

 

[vhdawg]

Isn't there about to be a volleyball training facility built in the Jackson metro?

Yes, it's Jenny Hazlewood's facility. It's going up behind the Bulldog Burger and Slim Chickens on that cut-through road between Old Canton and Lake Harbour in Ridgeland.

 

[047Dog]

People bag on travel baseball all the time but club volleyball is RIDICULOUSLY expensive for much much less of a chance at a college playing career for most of the girls.

I had to pass on one for my kid that had a travel schedule of Foley Al 4 times and then Atlanta and Orlando in the span of 2 weeks. That’s crazy pricey and I’m not letting her miss that much school.

 

[Faustdog]

People bag on travel baseball all the time but club volleyball is RIDICULOUSLY expensive for much much less of a chance at a college playing career for most of the girls.

I had to pass on one for my kid that had a travel schedule of Foley Al 4 times and then Atlanta and Orlando in the span of 2 weeks. That’s crazy pricey and I’m not letting her miss that much school.

This kind of thing is just terrible for sports. Some of the most talented kids are priced out by the time they're in junior high.

 

[Uncle Ruckus]

Living in an area where soccer is huge, club soccer is the most absolute worst thing in the entire universe. Club/travel anything is mostly a joke, but soccer takes it to another level. The coaching is actually decent from what I understand, but the kids go year-round and it wears their bodies out if they are multi-sport athletes.

 

[8dog]

Club soccer in MS is a significantly better balance than baseball or VB. I get its not the highest level but its a good experience and kids dont burn out.

 

[Maroonthirteen]

This kind of thing is just terrible for sports. Some of the most talented kids are priced out by the time they're in junior high.

not really. Kids play what they want to play. I've experienced soccer and volleyball travel clubs. I can guarantee you a soccer club and volleyball club will find a way if a real special athlete wants to play and their family PUTS FORTH the EFFORT.

baskeball has a crazy travel scene. Doesn't seem to affect that sport.

 

[047Dog]

The problem is a lot of school vb programs won’t bother with a kid that isn’t playing club. And that’s a shame. Not every club team can be good. In fact some are downright mediocre. So a girl playing on a club team with 8 players from Hartfield or MRA is just automatically better than a non club girl that wants to play for Northwest Rankin, Pearl, Clinton etc? Nah

It’s a shame that the only focus is on $$ clubs. I experienced the same thing with my son playing baseball. And I can flat out tell you that 3/4 of those “travel” baseball teams each year are garbage. But somehow in the minds of most, playing on a travel team equates to actually having talent.

 

[615dawg]

The problem is a lot of school vb programs won’t bother with a kid that isn’t playing club. And that’s a shame. Not every club team can be good. In fact some are downright mediocre. So a girl playing on a club team with 8 players from Hartfield or MRA is just automatically better than a non club girl that wants to play for Northwest Rankin, Pearl, Clinton etc? Nah

It’s a shame that the only focus is on $$ clubs. I experienced the same thing with my son playing baseball. And I can flat out tell you that 3/4 of those “travel” baseball teams each year are garbage. But somehow in the minds of most, playing on a travel team equates to actually having talent.

At Germantown, there are girls that play club that can't make the high school team. Germantown is a slightly above average team (they lost to Oxford in the quarterfinals last night). I can't imagine what its like at Brandon or Madison Central or Oxford or one of the DeSoto schools where volleyball is huge.

I get that this has always been a problem in baseball and boys soccer - but now its making its way to the girls' sports. Like Ive always told my daughters - there are great opportunities when you go to a 6A school (AP classes, clubs, etc.) but its very competitive. Something like 80 girls go out for cheer in middle school. All but a handful have been competitive cheering since they were 5.

 

[Smoked Toag]

Club soccer in MS is a significantly better balance than baseball or VB. I get its not the highest level but its a good experience and kids dont burn out.

Disagree. Soccer is the worst offender by far. They play year round, which at the minimum, makes playing other sports a pain in the ***. Then they have never-ending 'training' and it ropes the parents in. We just gave it up. Baseball is the second worst, but for the most part, most travel coaches are parents so it's at least controllable. But many, many parents just settle on the soccer/baseball year round deal.

There's just no way that playing both sports year-round is good for a kid's body. I'm glad I abandoned that rat race.

 

[Smoked Toag]

The problem is a lot of school vb programs won’t bother with a kid that isn’t playing club. And that’s a shame. Not every club team can be good. In fact some are downright mediocre. So a girl playing on a club team with 8 players from Hartfield or MRA is just automatically better than a non club girl that wants to play for Northwest Rankin, Pearl, Clinton etc? Nah

It’s a shame that the only focus is on $$ clubs. I experienced the same thing with my son playing baseball. And I can flat out tell you that 3/4 of those “travel” baseball teams each year are garbage. But somehow in the minds of most, playing on a travel team equates to actually having talent.

Yeah, and it's just laziness and most coaches' part. But let's be real, most of the kids that are decent will likely find their way onto a club team somewhere, so it's a good bang for the buck. And people are sheep, so once a team gets the 'rep' as a good team, other good players flock to it.

But every now and again you'll find a coach like that Michigan baseball guy who will go out and find the raw guys. Problem is, those guys still have to pay tuition on that partial scholarship.....THAT is the big kicker in sports other than football and basketball. Coaches know those travel/club parents are willing to PAY.

 

[8dog]

Soccer isnt close to year round. Ive done both. Baseball is miserable unless you dont play in the fall. And playing in the fall is becoming more common. Baseball is committing anywhere from 15 to 25 weekends a year to tourneys for the competitive teams. Soccer is usually about 10.

Then you talk about the actual tournaments where you dont even know when you will play sometimes in baseball.

 

[Smoked Toag]

Soccer isnt close to year round. Ive done both. Baseball is miserable unless you dont play in the fall. And playing in the fall is becoming more common. Baseball is committing anywhere from 15 to 25 weekends a year to tourneys for the competitive teams. Soccer is usually about 10.

Then you talk about the actual tournaments where you dont even know when you will play sometimes in baseball.

It's not just about tournaments. It's about practice time too. Overall cost is worse for soccer too.

I haven't seen many travel baseball teams play more than 11-12 tournaments over a year, Feb.-June and then Sept.-Oct. Let's not be crazy here. 25 weekends? Legit LOL, not even the most hardcare daddy baller from Sumrall will do that. And I'm no fan of travel ball either, but here you have me defending it (which is easy to do vs. soccer).

 

[horshack.sixpack]

Around here, travel baseball is the worst. Seemingly endless "league" affiliations to start a team under meant that every parent who was unhappy about little Timmy not making the travel baseball team of choice would just create/join a team under another affiliation. Basically you end up with 1 or 2 legit good travel teams(the ones little Timmy couldn't make) and a bunch of other "rec" level players playing on the rest. Rec league play is unimaginably bad as a result.

 

[cfree3434]

This is quite an accomplishment given how shallow the talent pool is in Mississippi.

I think MS talent is going to start to come around. Alot of our area teams were big into slow-pitch when it was still a sanctioned sport by MHSAA. We didn't even have a volleyball team until the state dropped slow-pitch. There's was huge interest in it from the start and it looks like the sport is really on an upward trend.

 

[8dog]

Soccer costs more for most teams but practice is the same. Twice a week. Plus in soccer you get the whole summer off. Thats huge and far more important to me in lifestyle

 

[mstateglfr]

The problem is a lot of school vb programs won’t bother with a kid that isn’t playing club. And that’s a shame. Not every club team can be good. In fact some are downright mediocre. So a girl playing on a club team with 8 players from Hartfield or MRA is just automatically better than a non club girl that wants to play for Northwest Rankin, Pearl, Clinton etc? Nah

It’s a shame that the only focus is on $$ clubs. I experienced the same thing with my son playing baseball. And I can flat out tell you that 3/4 of those “travel” baseball teams each year are garbage. But somehow in the minds of most, playing on a travel team equates to actually having talent.

Its odd that HS teams wont bother with a kid that isnt playing club. Thats a separate situation to the HS sport, so why do they care? If a player is good enough to play and can pick up on whatever offense the HS team runs even though they dont play in a club that runs a similar scheme, then it would be foolish to not play the kid on the HS team.

Around me, once girls get to 7th grade they better be on a competitive club team vs a recreational house league if they want to roll into HS with any chance of playing time. Private club teams that are regional and national cost $3000 for the season. Then a lot of the high schools have feeder club programs that cost $350-500. Coaches for the HS club teams are volunteer, but the ones we have worked with are just as knowledgeable as the private programs(since we lesson with a couple programs too).
My oldest is finishing up freshman volleyball now, her last tournament is tomorrow, and she absolutely wishes she had gotten serious and played AAU club before 8th grade. But the time commitment is a lot for a middle schooler that also does other activities. 2 practices per week for 2 hours each plus a half dozen Saturday tournaments is a lot with other stuff on the schedule. You have to be pretty committed at that point, which is tough since thats an age when many are still discovering what they even like.

For us though, the adage that practice makes perfect is certainly true. More practicing = more touches = more success. More practicing = better understanding of rotation placement = better communication and results.

 

[mstateglfr]

At Germantown, there are girls that play club that can't make the high school team. Germantown is a slightly above average team (they lost to Oxford in the quarterfinals last night). I can't imagine what its like at Brandon or Madison Central or Oxford or one of the DeSoto schools where volleyball is huge.

I get that this has always been a problem in baseball and boys soccer - but now its making its way to the girls' sports. Like Ive always told my daughters - there are great opportunities when you go to a 6A school (AP classes, clubs, etc.) but its very competitive. Something like 80 girls go out for cheer in middle school. All but a handful have been competitive cheering since they were 5.

The large school discussion is so damn true. I have had more conversations that I can count over the last year about how the 10th girl in a 9 player rotation may be better than anyone on the other team, yet they dont play. The 2nd best outside hitter may be stuck and barely play in HS while they dominate on their club team. etc etc. The 2nd best setter on a team may be better than the starting setter on any other team in a conference, yet they will sit on the bench for entire matches because the starting setter is going to play the whole time.

Its a tough concept to accept at that age.

 

[mstateglfr]

People bag on travel baseball all the time but club volleyball is RIDICULOUSLY expensive for much much less of a chance at a college playing career for most of the girls.

I had to pass on one for my kid that had a travel schedule of Foley Al 4 times and then Atlanta and Orlando in the span of 2 weeks. That’s crazy pricey and I’m not letting her miss that much school.

That is an absolutely insane schedule during the school year. 6 trips in 2 weeks, spanning the length of the southeast US? Yeah that is tough to be OK with.
Someone who is on this sort of schedule though probably has some damn good ability and potential, compared to the average HS volleyball player.

 

[615dawg]

The large school discussion is so damn true. I have had more conversations that I can count over the last year about how the 10th girl in a 9 player rotation may be better than anyone on the other team, yet they dont play. The 2nd best outside hitter may be stuck and barely play in HS while they dominate on their club team. etc etc. The 2nd best setter on a team may be better than the starting setter on any other team in a conference, yet they will sit on the bench for entire matches because the starting setter is going to play the whole time.

Its a tough concept to accept at that age.

We're doing our best to prepare our youngest. She will be in the starting rotation for her club team, but will have to fight for playing time on her high school team. She's got a good attitude about the theory - we'll see what happens next year when it actually happens.

 

[FQDawg]

That is an absolutely insane schedule during the school year. 6 trips in 2 weeks, spanning the length of the southeast US? Yeah that is tough to be OK with.
Someone who is on this sort of schedule though probably has some damn good ability and potential, compared to the average HS volleyball player.

Or has parents who are in a state of delusion and/or trying to live vicariously through their kid.

 

[johnson86-1]

Disagree. Soccer is the worst offender by far. They play year round, which at the minimum, makes playing other sports a pain in the ***. Then they have never-ending 'training' and it ropes the parents in. We just gave it up. Baseball is the second worst, but for the most part, most travel coaches are parents so it's at least controllable. But many, many parents just settle on the soccer/baseball year round deal.

There's just no way that playing both sports year-round is good for a kid's body. I'm glad I abandoned that rat race.

That's going to be location dependent. It's baseball that is the worst offender here. Depending on the team, they will take a break starting sometime from the middle of July to the end of July and be off through August, and then pick up fall ball in September. Then they have some sort of break in the winter before picking up practices again in late winter.

 

[WrapItDog]

MS has just now gotten really into VB at the HS level. And the player of the year last year went to LSU to play Beach VB.

The Baton Rouge beach is much nicer than the Starkville beach**

 

[johnson86-1]

This kind of thing is just terrible for sports. Some of the most talented kids are priced out by the time they're in junior high.

The most talented kids will still be able to come in with virtually no experience and crush the dreams of a lot of crazy parents that somehow think even though they were no where near a college athlete, that somehow spending fifteen thousand dollars on travel ball is somehow going to turn their kids into athletes.

Certainly there are a lot of reasonably talented athletes that get passed because they don't have the money to get the experience and training, but the ones that are DI athletes (and probably even DII athletes) are going to get picked up regardless.

I agree with you that it's terrible, but it's terrible because it's an arms race that ruins the experience for a lot of people and only marginally impacts who ends up playing at the next level for sports where athleticism is most important.

 

[Smoked Toag]

That's going to be location dependent. It's baseball that is the worst offender here. Depending on the team, they will take a break starting sometime from the middle of July to the end of July and be off through August, and then pick up fall ball in September. Then they have some sort of break in the winter before picking up practices again in late winter.

Not trying to split hairs here but I take it from other posts that you are in Jackson? And if so that makes soccer the worst. It literally never stops. Sure the tournaments are only in fall and spring but the 'training' never stops. It's also about $150 a month, and no baseball team is close to that.

I think you guys are a little off on this one. You can choose the tournaments you play in, and the teams you play on, in travel baseball. Some like to take vacations together, others don't. Some like to play more, others play only in spring. Soccer is all about your local clubs, they are the only choices you have.

And again, soccer nearly eliminates you from being a multi-sport athlete, unless you do the year round travel baseball thing and juggle that (which is incredibly hard, but many do it just....because they feel they have to). Difficult to squeeze in football or basketball for sure. Not to mention golf or tennis.

 

[o_fredgarvin]

I looked at the roster yesterday and I don’t think there’s a single player from Mississippi. Probably 75 percent of them are from Florida.

That's my point. She's done a great job getting and developing talent into Starkville despite a lack of homegrown talent.

 

[mstateglfr]

Or has parents who are in a state of delusion and/or trying to live vicariously through their kid.

Well, yeah that is certainly a possibility too. A kid who wants the experience without having the potential, and parents with the means to do so is also a possibility.

 

[mstateglfr]

We're doing our best to prepare our youngest. She will be in the starting rotation for her club team, but will have to fight for playing time on her high school team. She's got a good attitude about the theory - we'll see what happens next year when it actually happens.

Thats a good approach- introducing them to the concept that what happens on one team wont necessarily happen on another team. That awareness is something that probably comes to most thru experience only, so many kids arent even thinking about it.

Just last night I pointed out to my daughter that the setter on her freshman team, who is a very good player, likely wont see a minute of playing time at setter next year on JV. There is a sophomore who is better that will likely be on JV next season too since she is stuck behind the two setters on varsity now that are both juniors. That scenario blew her mind. She hadnt thought that much about whats coming up and had just sort of assumed that the setter she has now is who she will always have.

You dont want to **** on their dreams, but its good to expose them to possible outcomes that are largely outside their control.

 

[mstateglfr]

That's my point. She's done a great job getting and developing talent into Starkville despite a lack of homegrown talent.

I looked up MSU and OM vball rosters a month ago- only 3 out of 36 roster spots are filled by girls from MS. That is crazy barren. It can only go up from there.

 

[8dog]

You should have found a new club because nothing you are saying describes our experience.

 

[wrapit]

Yeah, it might go up A LITTLE, but

I'm in Texas and both my girls played club and HS here in DFW area. My younger daughter is now playing D1 college volleyball in East Tennessee.
There are SO MANY more qualified girls looking to play college volleyball in Texas and Florida than in MS, and these payers WILL go to MS to play on a scholarship. Just look at MSU and Alabama's roster of Texas girls.
MS is on the rise in prep volleyball but still SO FAR behind.

I looked up MSU and OM vball rosters a month ago- only 3 out of 36 roster spots are filled by girls from MS. That is crazy barren. It can only go up from there.